DNA Saves An Innocent Man. Aren't You Ashamed?

Psychoblues

Senior Member
Nov 30, 2003
2,701
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North Missisippi
It seems to be happening everyday now. DNA saves innocent people. How many other innocents must suffer for the over zealousness and misguided judgements of District Attorneys, Sheriffs, Deputy's and Policemen where DNA is not a factor? Think about it, children.

By JEFF CARLTON, Associated Press Writer
Thu Jan 3, 6:25 PM ET



DALLAS - Three times during his nearly 27 years in prison, Charles Chatman went before a parole board and refused to admit he was a rapist. His steadfastness was vindicated Thursday, when a judge released him because of new DNA evidence showing he indeed wasn't. The release of Chatman, 47, added to Dallas County's nationally unmatched number of wrongfully convicted inmates.

"Every time I'd go to parole, they'd want a description of the crime or my version of the crime," Chatman said. "I don't have a version of the crime. I never committed the crime. I never will admit to doing this crime that I know I didn't do."

District Judge John Creuzot, whom defense lawyers credited with shepherding Chatman's case for exoneration through the legal system, recommended that Texas' Court of Criminal Appeals find Chatman not guilty. With several relatives dabbing at their eyes with tissues and cheering, Chatman was released.

"I really can't tell you how I feel," said his aunt, Ethel Barley. "But I can tell you it is a different feeling than I have had in a long time, just to be holding his own hand."

Before the crime is officially cleared from Chatman's record, the appeals court must accept the recommendation or the governor must grant a pardon. Either step is considered a formality after Creuzot's ruling.

Chatman became the 15th inmate from Dallas County since 2001 to be freed by DNA testing. He served more time than any of the other inmates, four of whom were in court Thursday to show their support.

Dallas has freed more inmates after DNA testing than any other county nationwide, said Natalie Roetzel of the Innocence Project of Texas. Texas leads the country in prisoners freed by DNA testing, releasing at least 30 wrongfully convicted inmates since 2001, according to the Innocence Project.

One of the biggest reasons for the large number of exonerations is the crime lab used by Dallas County, which accounts for about half the state's DNA cases. Unlike many jurisdictions, the lab used by police and prosecutors retains biological evidence, meaning DNA testing is a viable option for decades-old crimes.

District Attorney Craig Watkins also attributes the exonerations to a past culture of overly aggressive prosecutors seeking convictions at any cost. Watkins has started a program in which law students, supervised by the Innocence Project of Texas, are reviewing about 450 cases in which convicts have requested DNA testing to prove their innocence.

"It is time we stop kidding ourselves in believing that what happened in Dallas is somehow unique," said Jeff Blackburn, the founder of the Innocence Project of Texas. "What happened in Dallas is common. This is Texas."

The hearing attracted a standing-room-only crowd that included Watkins, who was greeted warmly by two wrongly convicted Dallas men who have since won their freedom. Also there was state Rep. Terri Hodge, a member of the criminal jurisprudence committee, who promised unspecified reforms when the Legislature convenes in 2009.

Chatman was 20 when the victim, a young woman in her 20s, picked him from a lineup. Chatman said he lived five houses down from the victim for 13 years but never knew her.

She identified him in court as the attacker, and serology tests showed that the type of blood found at the crime scene matched that of Chatman — along with 40 percent of other black males.

Chatman said he was working at the time of the assault, an alibi supported by his sister, who was also his employer. Nevertheless, Chatman was convicted of aggravated sexual assault in 1981 and sentenced to 99 years in prison.

Chatman said he believes his race led to his arrest and conviction. The jury, he said, had one black member.

"I was convicted because a black man committed a crime against a white woman," Chatman said. "And I was available."

Chatman said he wants to work with the Innocence Project of Texas to support other people exonerated or wrongly convicted.

"I believe that there are hundreds, and I know of two or three personally that very well could be sitting in this seat if they had the support and they had the backing that I have," Chatman said. "My No. 1 interest is trying to help people who have been in the situation I am ,,,,,,,,,

More: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080103/ap_on_re_us/dna_exoneration;_ylt=Ah715fu6T8qMnk4loEwp_WoDW7oF

I know that life ain't fair, but is this justified in any way?
 
It seems to be happening everyday now. DNA saves innocent people. How many other innocents must suffer for the over zealousness and misguided judgements of District Attorneys, Sheriffs, Deputy's and Policemen where DNA is not a factor? Think about it, children.

Everyday now? DNA not only saves innocent people, it puts the guilty ones in jail. As for 'overzealous' prosecutors, we have juries that have to be convinced before the person is found guilty. Think Duke Lacrosse. Think about it.
 
OK. I thought about it.


Everyday now? DNA not only saves innocent people, it puts the guilty ones in jail. As for 'overzealous' prosecutors, we have juries that have to be convinced before the person is found guilty. Think Duke Lacrosse. Think about it.

You are easily convinced and would gladly send an innocent person to prison or to death. Are you trying to be funny on this subject?
 
OK. I thought about it.




You are easily convinced and would gladly send an innocent person to prison or to death. Are you trying to be funny on this subject?

Yet another lefty lacking perspective. Very easy to be appalled and dismayed in hindsight isn't it?

Given that there was no DNA technology available when he was convicted, what exactley do you propose should have been done almost thirty years ago? There is never going to be an error free justice system.

You of course know the particulars of the case right? You know he was convicted by an overzealous prosecutor some thirty years ago, right?
 
Yet another lefty lacking perspective. Very easy to be appalled and dismayed in hindsight isn't it?

Given that there was no DNA technology available when he was convicted, what exactley do you propose should have been done almost thirty years ago? There is never going to be an error free justice system.

You of course know the particulars of the case right? You know he was convicted by an overzealous prosecutor some thirty years ago, right?


what can be done in retrospect is to throw the woman in jail who incorrectly fingered him out of a photo lineup. that would be just.
 
what can be done in retrospect is to throw the woman in jail who incorrectly fingered him out of a photo lineup. that would be just.

Oh come on MM. One, it isn't illegal to make an accidental incorrect identification. Two, courts don't throw people in jail based on that alone. Three, you don't even know if that's what happened. You know and I know our justice system is never going to get it right 100% of the time. Is it unfortunate this happened? Yes. I just want to know how anyone thinks, given the circumstances (which we know almost nothing about) some thirty years ago, we're suppossed to be expressing this ridiculous shock and indignation over this.
 
Oh come on MM. One, it isn't illegal to make an accidental incorrect identification. Two, courts don't throw people in jail based on that alone. Three, you don't even know if that's what happened. You know and I know our justice system is never going to get it right 100% of the time. Is it unfortunate this happened? Yes. I just want to know how anyone thinks, given the circumstances (which we know almost nothing about) some thirty years ago, we're suppossed to be expressing this ridiculous shock and indignation over this.
1. how do you know it was accidental?

2. I know that...I only suggested that would be a just resolution.

3. he was picked out of a photo lineup by a woman who lived five doors down from him. that was the state's case. she sent him to jail for a quarter of a century. what does she do now? say..."my bad" and call it square?

4. and it is for this very reason that I am certain that the death penalty is cruel and unusual punishment. Given the experiences in Illinois just a few years ago where DNA exonerated a score of death row inmates, you have to be sucking on the koolaid pretty fucking hard to not accept the fact that the likelihood that we have, in this country, executed innocent men before. Being killed for a crime that one did not commit is the ultimate cruel and unusual punishment, wouldn't you agree?
 
As long as YOU are not charged or convicted of anything, that's cool perspective, right?

Yet another lefty lacking perspective. Very easy to be appalled and dismayed in hindsight isn't it?

Given that there was no DNA technology available when he was convicted, what exactley do you propose should have been done almost thirty years ago? There is never going to be an error free justice system.

You of course know the particulars of the case right? You know he was convicted by an overzealous prosecutor some thirty years ago, right?

I thought so. You are so shallow, B'80.
 
It seems to be happening everyday now. DNA saves innocent people. How many other innocents must suffer for the over zealousness and misguided judgements of District Attorneys, Sheriffs, Deputy's and Policemen where DNA is not a factor? Think about it, children.

By JEFF CARLTON, Associated Press Writer
Thu Jan 3, 6:25 PM ET



DALLAS - Three times during his nearly 27 years in prison, Charles Chatman went before a parole board and refused to admit he was a rapist. His steadfastness was vindicated Thursday, when a judge released him because of new DNA evidence showing he indeed wasn't. The release of Chatman, 47, added to Dallas County's nationally unmatched number of wrongfully convicted inmates.

"Every time I'd go to parole, they'd want a description of the crime or my version of the crime," Chatman said. "I don't have a version of the crime. I never committed the crime. I never will admit to doing this crime that I know I didn't do."

District Judge John Creuzot, whom defense lawyers credited with shepherding Chatman's case for exoneration through the legal system, recommended that Texas' Court of Criminal Appeals find Chatman not guilty. With several relatives dabbing at their eyes with tissues and cheering, Chatman was released.

"I really can't tell you how I feel," said his aunt, Ethel Barley. "But I can tell you it is a different feeling than I have had in a long time, just to be holding his own hand."

Before the crime is officially cleared from Chatman's record, the appeals court must accept the recommendation or the governor must grant a pardon. Either step is considered a formality after Creuzot's ruling.

Chatman became the 15th inmate from Dallas County since 2001 to be freed by DNA testing. He served more time than any of the other inmates, four of whom were in court Thursday to show their support.

Dallas has freed more inmates after DNA testing than any other county nationwide, said Natalie Roetzel of the Innocence Project of Texas. Texas leads the country in prisoners freed by DNA testing, releasing at least 30 wrongfully convicted inmates since 2001, according to the Innocence Project.

One of the biggest reasons for the large number of exonerations is the crime lab used by Dallas County, which accounts for about half the state's DNA cases. Unlike many jurisdictions, the lab used by police and prosecutors retains biological evidence, meaning DNA testing is a viable option for decades-old crimes.

District Attorney Craig Watkins also attributes the exonerations to a past culture of overly aggressive prosecutors seeking convictions at any cost. Watkins has started a program in which law students, supervised by the Innocence Project of Texas, are reviewing about 450 cases in which convicts have requested DNA testing to prove their innocence.

"It is time we stop kidding ourselves in believing that what happened in Dallas is somehow unique," said Jeff Blackburn, the founder of the Innocence Project of Texas. "What happened in Dallas is common. This is Texas."

The hearing attracted a standing-room-only crowd that included Watkins, who was greeted warmly by two wrongly convicted Dallas men who have since won their freedom. Also there was state Rep. Terri Hodge, a member of the criminal jurisprudence committee, who promised unspecified reforms when the Legislature convenes in 2009.

Chatman was 20 when the victim, a young woman in her 20s, picked him from a lineup. Chatman said he lived five houses down from the victim for 13 years but never knew her.

She identified him in court as the attacker, and serology tests showed that the type of blood found at the crime scene matched that of Chatman — along with 40 percent of other black males.

Chatman said he was working at the time of the assault, an alibi supported by his sister, who was also his employer. Nevertheless, Chatman was convicted of aggravated sexual assault in 1981 and sentenced to 99 years in prison.

Chatman said he believes his race led to his arrest and conviction. The jury, he said, had one black member.

"I was convicted because a black man committed a crime against a white woman," Chatman said. "And I was available."

Chatman said he wants to work with the Innocence Project of Texas to support other people exonerated or wrongly convicted.

"I believe that there are hundreds, and I know of two or three personally that very well could be sitting in this seat if they had the support and they had the backing that I have," Chatman said. "My No. 1 interest is trying to help people who have been in the situation I am ,,,,,,,,,

More: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080103/ap_on_re_us/dna_exoneration;_ylt=Ah715fu6T8qMnk4loEwp_WoDW7oF

I know that life ain't fair, but is this justified in any way?

Talk about spin.:rolleyes:

I'm glad the man was exonerated. No, I don't feel ashamed. No one should.

This isn't a case of rushing anyone to the gallows as you would have others believe. It required DNA evidence to prove this man innocent. DNA evidence was not available when he was originally convicted. He was convicted by a jury based on the evidence presented at the time.

You are trying to condemn the legal process THEN based on information available NOW, but not available then. WAY uncool.
 
what can be done in retrospect is to throw the woman in jail who incorrectly fingered him out of a photo lineup. that would be just.

I would agree ONLY if it can proven that she purposefully did so. Otherwise, I don't see that it serves any purpose to toss her in jail.

If she actually has a conscience, living with the knowledge that he was wrongly convicted and imprisoned based on her testimony is punishment enough.
 
1. how do you know it was accidental?

2. I know that...I only suggested that would be a just resolution.

3. he was picked out of a photo lineup by a woman who lived five doors down from him. that was the state's case. she sent him to jail for a quarter of a century. what does she do now? say..."my bad" and call it square?

4. and it is for this very reason that I am certain that the death penalty is cruel and unusual punishment. Given the experiences in Illinois just a few years ago where DNA exonerated a score of death row inmates, you have to be sucking on the koolaid pretty fucking hard to not accept the fact that the likelihood that we have, in this country, executed innocent men before. Being killed for a crime that one did not commit is the ultimate cruel and unusual punishment, wouldn't you agree?

You cannot convict a person based on a making a mistaken ID. That's pushing it a bit far.

DNA exonerated a "score" of death row inmates? Methinks you might be exaggerating.

Flipside: It appears from a glance at the surface, it is far more likely to be criminal let off the hook than a wrongly convicted death row inmate in this country.

I do not have a problem with forfeiture of life for certain crimes. I have and DO take issue with HOW the death penalty is applied.
 
It seems to be happening everyday now. DNA saves innocent people. How many other innocents must suffer for the over zealousness and misguided judgements of District Attorneys, Sheriffs, Deputy's and Policemen where DNA is not a factor? Think about it, children.

By JEFF CARLTON, Associated Press Writer
Thu Jan 3, 6:25 PM ET



DALLAS - Three times during his nearly 27 years in prison, Charles Chatman went before a parole board and refused to admit he was a rapist. His steadfastness was vindicated Thursday, when a judge released him because of new DNA evidence showing he indeed wasn't. The release of Chatman, 47, added to Dallas County's nationally unmatched number of wrongfully convicted inmates.

"Every time I'd go to parole, they'd want a description of the crime or my version of the crime," Chatman said. "I don't have a version of the crime. I never committed the crime. I never will admit to doing this crime that I know I didn't do."

District Judge John Creuzot, whom defense lawyers credited with shepherding Chatman's case for exoneration through the legal system, recommended that Texas' Court of Criminal Appeals find Chatman not guilty. With several relatives dabbing at their eyes with tissues and cheering, Chatman was released.

"I really can't tell you how I feel," said his aunt, Ethel Barley. "But I can tell you it is a different feeling than I have had in a long time, just to be holding his own hand."

Before the crime is officially cleared from Chatman's record, the appeals court must accept the recommendation or the governor must grant a pardon. Either step is considered a formality after Creuzot's ruling.

Chatman became the 15th inmate from Dallas County since 2001 to be freed by DNA testing. He served more time than any of the other inmates, four of whom were in court Thursday to show their support.

Dallas has freed more inmates after DNA testing than any other county nationwide, said Natalie Roetzel of the Innocence Project of Texas. Texas leads the country in prisoners freed by DNA testing, releasing at least 30 wrongfully convicted inmates since 2001, according to the Innocence Project.

One of the biggest reasons for the large number of exonerations is the crime lab used by Dallas County, which accounts for about half the state's DNA cases. Unlike many jurisdictions, the lab used by police and prosecutors retains biological evidence, meaning DNA testing is a viable option for decades-old crimes.

District Attorney Craig Watkins also attributes the exonerations to a past culture of overly aggressive prosecutors seeking convictions at any cost. Watkins has started a program in which law students, supervised by the Innocence Project of Texas, are reviewing about 450 cases in which convicts have requested DNA testing to prove their innocence.

"It is time we stop kidding ourselves in believing that what happened in Dallas is somehow unique," said Jeff Blackburn, the founder of the Innocence Project of Texas. "What happened in Dallas is common. This is Texas."

The hearing attracted a standing-room-only crowd that included Watkins, who was greeted warmly by two wrongly convicted Dallas men who have since won their freedom. Also there was state Rep. Terri Hodge, a member of the criminal jurisprudence committee, who promised unspecified reforms when the Legislature convenes in 2009.

Chatman was 20 when the victim, a young woman in her 20s, picked him from a lineup. Chatman said he lived five houses down from the victim for 13 years but never knew her.

She identified him in court as the attacker, and serology tests showed that the type of blood found at the crime scene matched that of Chatman — along with 40 percent of other black males.

Chatman said he was working at the time of the assault, an alibi supported by his sister, who was also his employer. Nevertheless, Chatman was convicted of aggravated sexual assault in 1981 and sentenced to 99 years in prison.

Chatman said he believes his race led to his arrest and conviction. The jury, he said, had one black member.

"I was convicted because a black man committed a crime against a white woman," Chatman said. "And I was available."

Chatman said he wants to work with the Innocence Project of Texas to support other people exonerated or wrongly convicted.

"I believe that there are hundreds, and I know of two or three personally that very well could be sitting in this seat if they had the support and they had the backing that I have," Chatman said. "My No. 1 interest is trying to help people who have been in the situation I am ,,,,,,,,,

More: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080103/ap_on_re_us/dna_exoneration;_ylt=Ah715fu6T8qMnk4loEwp_WoDW7oF

I know that life ain't fair, but is this justified in any way?

It would seem to the "informed observer", that important information is missing from this somewhat slanted article.

While I'm pleased for the man's family, that he was released, I think there must have been a history with this man, something that directed the police toward him.

Convictions based solely on a line up are rare, and generally still require much more evidence.

I only hope this man's release doesn't come back to bite anyone on the ass.:neutral:
 
You cannot convict a person based on a making a mistaken ID. That's pushing it a bit far.

DNA exonerated a "score" of death row inmates? Methinks you might be exaggerating.

Flipside: It appears from a glance at the surface, it is far more likely to be criminal let off the hook than a wrongly convicted death row inmate in this country.

I do not have a problem with forfeiture of life for certain crimes. I have and DO take issue with HOW the death penalty is applied.

At least 29 have been freed in Texas alone. Check it out.

http://www.innocenceproject.org/news/StateView.php
 
I do have a problem with the death penalty as it is now enforced in the United States. The system is broken and those without money tend to be convicted easier by a faulty system.

I do not have a problem with the death penalty in essence. If a person takes someone else's life, I believe they forfeit the right to their life.:mad:

If there is an after life, God will take care of the murderer if that is what is suppposed to happen.

If there is no afterlife and someone takes away my or anyone else's total existence, then screw them, take theirs away also. It has nothing to do with recidivism, it has to do with justice.

And I am a moderate progressive.
 
OK. I thought about it.

You are easily convinced and would gladly send an innocent person to prison or to death. Are you trying to be funny on this subject?

Wow, that is deep. WalMart have a sale on magic 8 balls lately?

what can be done in retrospect is to throw the woman in jail who incorrectly fingered him out of a photo lineup. that would be just.

Problem is that mistakes are not criminal offenses. So long as she truthfully believed he was the rapist....

4. and it is for this very reason that I am certain that the death penalty is cruel and unusual punishment. Given the experiences in Illinois just a few years ago where DNA exonerated a score of death row inmates, you have to be sucking on the koolaid pretty fucking hard to not accept the fact that the likelihood that we have, in this country, executed innocent men before. Being killed for a crime that one did not commit is the ultimate cruel and unusual punishment, wouldn't you agree?

Actually the DP is neither cruel nor unusual when considering the crimes that must be committed to merit it.

Having said that, I am glad we have DNA evidence that will more securely nail shut the coffin on these offenders. I would bet your retirement check against a box of krispy kremes that innocent folks have gone to the gallows. I would also make that same bet that the overwhelming majority received a fair trial using the abilities available at the time.

Still, I advocate the use of the DP against anyone who takes a life during the commission of any crime. To do that we need to revamp the appeals process so that DP cases go to the head of the line. We also need to develop and use a bona fide truth machine or machines to ensure that we are getting as close as scientifically possible to zero errors.
 
say what you want, phil, but if I am an innocent man and I am put to death, regardless of the seriousness of the crime that I was supposed to have committed, my actual innocence makes the punishment ultimately cruel and unusual.
 
say what you want, phil, but if I am an innocent man and I am put to death, regardless of the seriousness of the crime that I was supposed to have committed, my actual innocence makes the punishment ultimately cruel and unusual.

I think he only addressed the death penalty insofar as those who actually merit it.

I agree with you that it would REALLY suck to be an innocent person wrongfully put to death. IMO, the problem is not with the death penalty itself, but the system that hands it out.

It is also my opinion that if there is ANY doubt whatsoever, then we should err on the side of life in prison. Where there is no doubt, I have no problem with that person forfeiting his/her life for the commission of crimes that rates such punishment.
 

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