Demise of Putin's Russia...

[MisterBeale]

Correct all I have is my words. You have a whole list of propaganda items at your disposal that you obviously attempt to influence others with. The bottom line is what you think what you support what's your ideals are. And no matter how you put it I cannot support and insane dictator like Putin. There's absolutely no justification for him to invade the Ukraine. It would be like us attack in Canada because we don't like their trading practices. It's utterly ridiculous.

Documented facts and leaked items of the machinations of the objectives of clandestine services that actually happened, are NOT propaganda items.

Most educated people knew what Victoria Nuland and our NGOs were up to in 2014.

Sorry if you don't like reality pal.

 

[theHawk]

I believe putin's latest attack on the Ukraine regarding the fraudulent referendums is really going to backfire on him. Russia is made up of 23 oblasts and 14 republics. At first the riots and protest against the war were just in Russian in 40 cities now they're spreading throughout the rest of Russia. I wouldn't be surprised if Kaliningrad has a referendum to decide whether to remain part of the Russia or not. The 14 republics I mentioned are scattered throughout Russia but mostly in Asia. Putin may have done Russia a favor after all. Bringing freedom to millions of oppressed peoples dominated by Russia. www.eferl.org vote on annexation in Russian occupied parts of Ukraine held for second day. Whatever happens, Russia will be much less of a Nation than it is today. It's already losing integrity and respect among the world community and now it's going to start losing lots of people.

That would be wonderful. The world’s largest nuclear arsenal divided up between a bunch of failed states. Nothing could possibly go wrong with that.

 

[Stann]

See? That is the part that doesn't make sense about this whole thing.

If you listened to the podcast in post two, they commented on how, Ukraine is STILL letting Russia ship gas through Ukraine, and paying them to do so.

Like, wtf?!

Was Hitler doing business with Stalin while they were at war? Fuck no.

So what the hell is going on? Why is Russia still paying Ukraine, and selling its product to Europe? And why is Europe still buying some of it?

I had heard some conspiracy theory a long time ago, that Putin was a double or triple agent with both/either or, MI6/Mossad around the time of the fall of the Berlin wall.

I honestly don't know what to think sometimes. ???

I see you don't know all the particulars of worldly events either. I never did and I never will. I know my limitations. Most things in life are a two-way street. I'm sure Russia will start if it doesn't get some of the grains from the breadbasket of Europe the Ukraine this winter. And I'll get it somehow. Business always goes on even during wartime.

 

[Stann]

Documented facts and leaked items of the machinations of the objectives of clandestine services that actually happened, are NOT propaganda items.

Most educated people knew what Victoria Nuland and our NGOs were up to in 2014.

Sorry if you don't like reality pal.

I like reality, I just don't agree with your take on it.

 

[Rust_Cohle]

Another bloody infection that comes from the United States and infects the planet...

LOL so now Swastikas and Nazis are American. Your logic train has derailed comrade

 

[MisterBeale]

I see you don't know all the particulars of worldly events either. I never did and I never will. I know my limitations. Most things in life are a two-way street. I'm sure Russia will start if it doesn't get some of the grains from the breadbasket of Europe the Ukraine this winter. And I'll get it somehow. Business always goes on even during wartime.

 

[Stann]

Another bloody infection that comes from the United States and infects the planet...

Actually Russia probably has more far-right extremists then America has. After all, they seem to hate Jews and gays also. Sounds pretty nazi to me. The bottom line is, ignorance is rise to hatred. The one enables the other.

 

[Stann]

Sorry I can't play your games I don't have a whole bunch of stupid little things to put up on here. Try to have a good night, I plan on it and I've had enough of this garbage.

 

[the other mike]

LOL, you can say any b******* you want on here and the government doesn't care. No one's going to come after you no matter how much you bad mouth our government. You go to Russia ( I don't want to, never have. ) And try bad-mouthing the government and see what happens to you. Protest against the government in the streets and see how many years in prison you get or forced into the military against your will. And the courts aren't about Justice they're about supporting the government's ( or in this case) / dictators wishes. That is not a democracy, it's the total opposite of a democracy.

Where is Edward Snowden?
What about Julian Assange.

Nobody is patting Vladimir Putin on the back but the CIA is 50 times worse than the FSB- formerly KGB was.

 

[AZrailwhale]

That's a group of folks that read and speak Russian, and live in Ukraine, and Russia.

I don't trust, or believe in corporate or US media, nor do I listen to what Russian or Ukrainian leaders are saying, an intelligent person know that both have an agenda. I thought you would appreciate some information from relatively unbiased POV, of folks, ON THE GROUND, in that area.

Your analysis is unhinged from reality. What you are basing it on, is several hundred people protesting here and there, and several hundred people leaving Russia.

This is akin to what happened in the US during Vietnam. That is not a realistic way to view events.

If you want to base your thread on the fog of war, and US establishment war propaganda? That is your prerogative, and you have every right to. I was just trying to give it a grounding in reality.

Sorry.

Generally psychologists say, one of the main strategies of dealing with cognitive dissonance, (when facts don't match a person's preconceived world view,) one of the coping strategies is to dismiss or ignore that information.

View attachment 701893

Cognitive dissonance - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Nice.

So the existence of a minority gives Russia the right to invade a sovereign country. Based upon that, Mexico has the right to invade and conquer the USA.

 

[Stann]

Where is Edward Snowden?
What about Julian Assange.

Nobody is patting Vladimir Putin on the back but the CIA is 50 times worse than the FSB- formerly KGB was.

You are talking about criminals I'm talking about ordinary people.

 

[AZrailwhale]

No, this is the explanation to the average american fool, who has no idea about the history and politics abroad. For to declare Russia's operation against fascist Ukraine as aggression is the same, as declaring the USSR's attack on imperial Japan in august 1945 as aggression . But the american fools have not heard about it.
And why am I defending Russia in this conflict? Because I hate nazis. And especially the ukrainian nazis.
I have the right, since I have lived in Ukraine for 25 years of my life and my paternal ancestors have lived there since the 19th century or even longer.

If you take a look at a map, you can easily see what Russia’s motives are. They have nothing to do with ethnic Russians, it has everything to do with establishing a land bridge to the naval base at Sevastopol that would be under Russian control, not the legal Ukranian government’s. Sevastopol is a vital Russian base and the Ukrainian government could cut off access at any point just like the Soviets did with Berlin in the late forties.

 

[the other mike]

You are talking about criminals I'm talking about ordinary people.

Edward Snowden and Julian Assange both pointed out crimes by the government.

If you think they are the criminals then you're a piece of shit.

 

[the other mike]

Stann is an informed CNN viewer.

 

[MisterBeale]

Sorry I can't play your games I don't have a whole bunch of stupid little things to put up on here. Try to have a good night, I plan on it and I've had enough of this garbage.

You're the one that is actually telling me I don't know how the world works, that two nations caught in a life and death struggle, writes, "Business always goes on even during wartime."

NO, never, in the history of the world, have two powers continued to do business with each other once hostilities have initiated.

IN FACT, just the opposite.

During war, they try to strangle off each other's economic activity.

They bomb cities, factories, burn fields, and mines.

They initiate navel block aides and destroy gas pipelines. They do anything and everything to make continuing conducting of the war, and production of war materials impossible.



That fact that you don't want to continue? Is evidence that you are not living in reality.

 

[Stann]

Stann is an informed CNN viewer.

ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS, BBC, the Omaha World Herald, Nebraskaland, Nebraska Life and the Washington county Enterprise. Not so much CNN.

 

[MisterBeale]

If you take a look at a map, you can easily see what Russia’s motives are. They have nothing to do with ethnic Russians, it has everything to do with establishing a land bridge to the naval base at Sevastopol that would be under Russian control, not the legal Ukranian government’s. Sevastopol is a vital Russian base and the Ukrainian government could cut off access at any point just like the Soviets did with Berlin in the late forties.

(sources of Moon of Alabama? wiki and NYT.)

Historic Context Of The Referenda In Ukraine​

MoA - Historic Context Of The Referenda In Ukraine

". . . In 2014, after the violent fascist coup in Kiev, one of the first laws implemented by the new government removed the Russian language from official use. Instead of overcoming the differences between its people it only sealed the predominant split in Ukraine.

The election promise of the current Ukrainian president Vladimir Zelenski to make peace with the Russia aligned rebellious Donbas region by adhering to the Minsk 2 agreements was rewarded with a large share of southeastern votes for his presidency. However, after having been threatened with death by fascists, Zelenski has made a 180 degree turn and has since posed as Ukrainian nationalist. In consequence he has lost all support in southeastern Ukraine.

The southeastern parts of today's Ukraine have for centuries been part of the central Russian empire. They were only attached to the Soviet Republic of Ukraine under Lenin's rule in 1922 and, in the case of Crimea, in 1954 under Nikita Khrushchev who himself had grown up in the Donbas region. . . . "

 

[AZrailwhale]

Russia does not have a democracy. The lack of a free press says mountains to that effect. The Ukraine was a lot further along this way to a good democracy. Russia is going backwards today.

What Ukraine is doing is typical of nations at war. Press freedom is curtailed, dissent is discouraged, or actively suppressed to prevent interference with military operations.

 

[MisterBeale]

ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS, BBC, the Omaha World Herald, Nebraskaland, Nebraska Life and the Washington county Enterprise. Not so much CNN.

(the Omaha World Herald, Nebraskaland, Nebraska Life and the Washington county Enterprise.) = AP News The rest? Same difference, might as well be CNN, it still the consortium.

The American Empire and its Media

Largely unbeknownst to the general public, executives and top journalists of almost all major US news outlets have long been members of the influential Council on Foreign Relations (CFR).

swprs.org

 

[AZrailwhale]

You're trying to blame it on NATO and America. I'm sorry putin is an adult, he might be insane but he's an adult and he's responsible for his own actions. He lied to the world and then invaded another country that he thinks he owns.

He invaded THREE other countries and annexed parts of two of them.