Couple who pulled guns on Black mother and daughters charged with felony assault

[Aletheia4u]

I'm finding it more and more disturbing how many people carry firearms without apprently knowing the laws regarding when they can draw and/or shoot.

"Jillian Wuestenberg, 32, and Eric Wuestenberg, 42, got into an altercation with the family outside a Chipotle in Michigan.



Watch: Video shows white woman pulling out gun on Black woman in Chipotle parking lot

July 3, 2020, 8:20 AM PDT
By Minyvonne Burke

A white couple from Clarkston, Michigan, was arrested and charged with a felony after a video showed the woman pointing a gun at a Black mother and her two daughters.

Jillian Wuestenberg, 32, and Eric Wuestenberg, 42, were taken into custody on Wednesday, the same day they got into an altercation with the family at a Chipotle in Orion Township.

The Oakland County Prosecutor's Office announced Thursday that the Wuestenbergs were charged with felonious assault.

Deputies were called to the Chipotle around 6 p.m. local time for reports of threats involving a firearm, the Oakland County Sheriff's Office said in a press release. Both the Wuestenbergs and the family, whom authorities did not identify, had called police on each other.

Part of the altercation was captured on cellphone video and shows two women off-camera accusing Jillian Wuestenberg of bumping into them. Eric Wuestenberg enters the frame and helps his wife get into their car before exchanging words with the mother.

Jillian Deanne Wuestenberg, 32,

Things quickly escalate after Eric Wuestenberg begins to reverse the vehicle out of the parking spot.

"You gonna f---ing hit me," the mother yells. Both groups begin arguing and the video shows Jillian Wuestenberg get out of the car and point a gun at the mother.

"Get away," Jillian Wuestenberg says, telling her husband to call the police. "Get the f--- away."

The video ends with Jillian Wuestenberg getting back into the car and the couple driving away. The footage does not show what led up to the altercation but Oakland County Sheriff Mike Bouchard said that it began when one group bumped into the other.
[snipped]

Minyvonne Burke is a breaking news reporter for NBC News."

Couple who pulled guns on Black mother and daughters charged with felony assault

Well if they would have moved to a Red State like Florida, they can pull out anything if they feel that their life is being threaten. But that is what these Globalist want. They want all Republicans to move away from Blue States so that they can takeover these States to bring in the Green New Deal that is going to raise property taxes to $3,000 and up per month. And then everyone will have to surrender their homes to Big bankers because they are unable to pay their taxes.

 

[CarlinAnnArbor]

Well if they would have moved to a Red State like Florida, they can pull out anything if they feel that their life is being threaten

She has that right in Michigan. I've posted the law twice now. The problem is the Oakland County prosecutor playing politics in this BLM age .

 

[JoeMoma]

Funny, the black mom and her two daughters didn't seem to fear the woman with the gun. They simply stood there and kept arguing and called the police. If someone pulled a gun on me and told me to back off, I would back off.

 

[CarlinAnnArbor]

Funny, the black mom and her two daughters didn't seem to fear the woman with the gun. They simply stood there and kept arguing and called the police. If someone pulled a gun on me and told me to back off, I would back off.

Ghetto rats are stupid. That makes them dangerous. The white woman was trained and did everything right. The ghetto ape was in no danger unless she did something stupid which is always a possibility.

 

[Gracie]

She said she was going to "beat his white ass". The black people were the only racists in this incident, which is par for the course i suppose.

What's the slur there?

Using "white ass" in a negative way is a slur. "Shut your white ass up" or "ill beat your white ass" is a racist term. Quit making excuses for racists..

you black bitch...uttered by a white person.
you white bitch....uttered by a black person.

Which is racist?

 

[Correll]

It will get worse. And worse. The Prog dominated media/entertainers/politicians propagandists need to start backing off.

No, violent tRumplings need their weapons confiscated.

Said the little baby.

Lol, you ain't all there, are ya?

I'm not the one on a political discussion board, talking like a little baby. Or a retarded child. You are.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

So is it just my imagination or does the trend seem to be white people pulling guns on black people and attempting to force them to comply with their demands because I can't recall any stories about black people pulling guns on white people solely to attempt to get them to do something/stop doing something. And for the records, I'm not talking about armed robbery or anything else in that category.

I've heard some firearm instructors say that if you pull you weapon but don't use it or have to use it to defend yourself, then there was probably no threat which required an armed response to begin with. I don't fully agree with that stance because sometimes the mere sight of the weapon de-escalates the situation, but not in the last couple of these types of stories have I seen it do so. Pulling a firearm on someone for no good reason or as an attempt to intimidate can piss some people off and cause then to go on the attack because they were just threated with a deadly weapon.

If it keeps happening, then as long as the people who unlawfully pointed a weapon at another get charged and convicted, then I guess our laws are working as designed, correct?

Do you think, that pointing a weapon at a criminal, illegally blocking your way is a crime?

There is nothing in the story that established the person with whom she was in an altercation was a "criminal".

Having the ability or right to carry a weapon does not allow a person to use that weapon indiscriminately and at this current time, private citizens are held to the same standard that our law enforcement officers must adhere to in order to claim lawful self-defense and that standard is "an imminent threat of grevious bodily harm or death".

Being pissed off at someone because they bumped into you, or because they are antagonizing you in an attempt to get you to apologize is not a imminent threat of death or severe bodily harm. Every indication I've seen shows that she was pissed off, not in fear and I have no idea where the video came from but that's pretty damning if you're trying to claim self-defense because you were in fear for life.

Similar to that couple in Missouri who lived in a gated community and pulled their weapons on "trespassers". People who are in fear for their lives do not arm themselves and then leave their home where they have a measure of security/safety to go out and confront the people that they are allegedly in fear of by placing themselves in the open where they can be attacked. How much sense does that make?

But to answer your question, no it is not lawful to point your weapon at anyone except to defend your life or the life of another from death or severe bodily injury and this situation didn't warrant that type of response. If someone is doing something unlawful to you, including blocking your vehicle, you call the police, write down the license plate of the vehicle, get a photo of it if you can and hopefully things will get squared away. You can then press charges, take them to court if you have quantifiable damages or whatever but at least you won't be going to jail and possibly getting convicted.

In this exact situation police didn't protect their lawful freedom. So, there was only one way to protect their lawful right on free movement.

That's not how our laws work. The police aren't there for the most part to prevent crime. They're tasked with enforcing the laws and just because a police officer is not conveniently nearby does not mean that you then get to assume the role of a law enforcement officer and attempt to order people about at gunpoint.

The fact that you and most of the commenters who are responding to this story in support of the couple DON'T KNOW THIS is what I find so disturbing.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

Watch the full video. The couple (whites) made every attempt to leave peacefully without incident. The mother of the two daughters (Blacks) refused to let them leave.

Can someone justify why and how Blacks are now entitled to block whites from leaving?

Why are you contributing to the entire black race the unbecoming behavior of this couple of individuals?

 

[freyasman]

So is it just my imagination or does the trend seem to be white people pulling guns on black people and attempting to force them to comply with their demands because I can't recall any stories about black people pulling guns on white people solely to attempt to get them to do something/stop doing something. And for the records, I'm not talking about armed robbery or anything else in that category.

I've heard some firearm instructors say that if you pull you weapon but don't use it or have to use it to defend yourself, then there was probably no threat which required an armed response to begin with. I don't fully agree with that stance because sometimes the mere sight of the weapon de-escalates the situation, but not in the last couple of these types of stories have I seen it do so. Pulling a firearm on someone for no good reason or as an attempt to intimidate can piss some people off and cause then to go on the attack because they were just threated with a deadly weapon.

If it keeps happening, then as long as the people who unlawfully pointed a weapon at another get charged and convicted, then I guess our laws are working as designed, correct?

Do you think, that pointing a weapon at a criminal, illegally blocking your way is a crime?

There is nothing in the story that established the person with whom she was in an altercation was a "criminal".

Having the ability or right to carry a weapon does not allow a person to use that weapon indiscriminately and at this current time, private citizens are held to the same standard that our law enforcement officers must adhere to in order to claim lawful self-defense and that standard is "an imminent threat of grevious bodily harm or death".

Being pissed off at someone because they bumped into you, or because they are antagonizing you in an attempt to get you to apologize is not a imminent threat of death or severe bodily harm. Every indication I've seen shows that she was pissed off, not in fear and I have no idea where the video came from but that's pretty damning if you're trying to claim self-defense because you were in fear for life.

Similar to that couple in Missouri who lived in a gated community and pulled their weapons on "trespassers". People who are in fear for their lives do not arm themselves and then leave their home where they have a measure of security/safety to go out and confront the people that they are allegedly in fear of by placing themselves in the open where they can be attacked. How much sense does that make?

But to answer your question, no it is not lawful to point your weapon at anyone except to defend your life or the life of another from death or severe bodily injury and this situation didn't warrant that type of response. If someone is doing something unlawful to you, including blocking your vehicle, you call the police, write down the license plate of the vehicle, get a photo of it if you can and hopefully things will get squared away. You can then press charges, take them to court if you have quantifiable damages or whatever but at least you won't be going to jail and possibly getting convicted.

In this exact situation police didn't protect their lawful freedom. So, there was only one way to protect their lawful right on free movement.

That's not how our laws work. The police aren't there for the most part to prevent crime. They're tasked with enforcing the laws and just because a police officer is not conveniently nearby does not mean that you then get to assume the role of a law enforcement officer and attempt to order people about at gunpoint.

The fact that you and most of the commenters who are responding to this story in support of the couple DON'T KNOW THIS is what I find so disturbing.

She overreacted and should not have drawn. But she probably isn't used to psycho chicks getting in her face.

 

[MarcATL]

it's a matter of perception

No, it's a matter of racist USMB whites lying about the facts. As usual.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

I'm finding it more and more disturbing how many people carry firearms without apprently knowing the laws regarding when they can draw and/or shoot.

"Jillian Wuestenberg, 32, and Eric Wuestenberg, 42, got into an altercation with the family outside a Chipotle in Michigan.



Watch: Video shows white woman pulling out gun on Black woman in Chipotle parking lot

July 3, 2020, 8:20 AM PDT
By Minyvonne Burke

A white couple from Clarkston, Michigan, was arrested and charged with a felony after a video showed the woman pointing a gun at a Black mother and her two daughters.

Jillian Wuestenberg, 32, and Eric Wuestenberg, 42, were taken into custody on Wednesday, the same day they got into an altercation with the family at a Chipotle in Orion Township.

The Oakland County Prosecutor's Office announced Thursday that the Wuestenbergs were charged with felonious assault.

Deputies were called to the Chipotle around 6 p.m. local time for reports of threats involving a firearm, the Oakland County Sheriff's Office said in a press release. Both the Wuestenbergs and the family, whom authorities did not identify, had called police on each other.

Part of the altercation was captured on cellphone video and shows two women off-camera accusing Jillian Wuestenberg of bumping into them. Eric Wuestenberg enters the frame and helps his wife get into their car before exchanging words with the mother.

Jillian Deanne Wuestenberg, 32,

Things quickly escalate after Eric Wuestenberg begins to reverse the vehicle out of the parking spot.

"You gonna f---ing hit me," the mother yells. Both groups begin arguing and the video shows Jillian Wuestenberg get out of the car and point a gun at the mother.

"Get away," Jillian Wuestenberg says, telling her husband to call the police. "Get the f--- away."

The video ends with Jillian Wuestenberg getting back into the car and the couple driving away. The footage does not show what led up to the altercation but Oakland County Sheriff Mike Bouchard said that it began when one group bumped into the other.
[snipped]

Minyvonne Burke is a breaking news reporter for NBC News."

Couple who pulled guns on Black mother and daughters charged with felony assault

Its only going to get worse as guns proliferate. We really are the biggest threat to our own species.

Some day when you find yourself surrounded by an angry negro mob, your opinion will change

yawn. just because you’re afraid of black people doesn’t mean I have to be.

I think you may have hit upon a core component of the problem, that a significant number of white people fear black people and as a result their fear causes them to see threats in far too many situations where a threat (of severe bodiy harm or death) simply does not exist.

Nonetheless in most cases their fear is deemed to be justified and allowable as the excuse for shooting and killing black people.

Actually, this is the same thing we see with police shootings.

 

[freyasman]

I'm finding it more and more disturbing how many people carry firearms without apprently knowing the laws regarding when they can draw and/or shoot.

"Jillian Wuestenberg, 32, and Eric Wuestenberg, 42, got into an altercation with the family outside a Chipotle in Michigan.



Watch: Video shows white woman pulling out gun on Black woman in Chipotle parking lot

July 3, 2020, 8:20 AM PDT
By Minyvonne Burke

A white couple from Clarkston, Michigan, was arrested and charged with a felony after a video showed the woman pointing a gun at a Black mother and her two daughters.

Jillian Wuestenberg, 32, and Eric Wuestenberg, 42, were taken into custody on Wednesday, the same day they got into an altercation with the family at a Chipotle in Orion Township.

The Oakland County Prosecutor's Office announced Thursday that the Wuestenbergs were charged with felonious assault.

Deputies were called to the Chipotle around 6 p.m. local time for reports of threats involving a firearm, the Oakland County Sheriff's Office said in a press release. Both the Wuestenbergs and the family, whom authorities did not identify, had called police on each other.

Part of the altercation was captured on cellphone video and shows two women off-camera accusing Jillian Wuestenberg of bumping into them. Eric Wuestenberg enters the frame and helps his wife get into their car before exchanging words with the mother.

Jillian Deanne Wuestenberg, 32,

Things quickly escalate after Eric Wuestenberg begins to reverse the vehicle out of the parking spot.

"You gonna f---ing hit me," the mother yells. Both groups begin arguing and the video shows Jillian Wuestenberg get out of the car and point a gun at the mother.

"Get away," Jillian Wuestenberg says, telling her husband to call the police. "Get the f--- away."

The video ends with Jillian Wuestenberg getting back into the car and the couple driving away. The footage does not show what led up to the altercation but Oakland County Sheriff Mike Bouchard said that it began when one group bumped into the other.
[snipped]

Minyvonne Burke is a breaking news reporter for NBC News."

Couple who pulled guns on Black mother and daughters charged with felony assault

Its only going to get worse as guns proliferate. We really are the biggest threat to our own species.

Some day when you find yourself surrounded by an angry negro mob, your opinion will change

yawn. just because you’re afraid of black people doesn’t mean I have to be.

I think you may have hit upon a core component of the problem, that a significant number of white people fear black people and as a result their fear causes them to see threats in far too many situations where a threat (of severe bodiy harm or death) simply does not exist.

Nonetheless in most cases their fear is deemed to be justified and allowable as the excuse for shooting and killing black people.

Actually, this is the same thing we see with police shootings.

All those violent world star videos probably don't help.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

SELF-DEFENSE ACT (EXCERPT)
Act 309 of 2006

780.972 Use of deadly force by individual not engaged in commission of crime; conditions.
Sec. 2.

(1) An individual who has not or is not engaged in the commission of a crime at the time he or she uses deadly force may use deadly force against another individual anywhere he or she has the legal right to be with no duty to retreat if either of the following applies:
(a) The individual honestly and reasonably believes that the use of deadly force is necessary to prevent the imminent death of or imminent great bodily harm to himself or herself or to another individual.
(b) The individual honestly and reasonably believes that the use of deadly force is necessary to prevent the imminent sexual assault of himself or herself or of another individual.
(2) An individual who has not or is not engaged in the commission of a crime at the time he or she uses force other than deadly force may use force other than deadly force against another individual anywhere he or she has the legal right to be with no duty to retreat if he or she honestly and reasonably believes that the use of that force is necessary to defend himself or herself or another individual from the imminent unlawful use of force by another individual.

No one engaged in deadly force therefore it's not a self-defense claim

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

So is it just my imagination or does the trend seem to be white people pulling guns on black people and attempting to force them to comply with their demands because I can't recall any stories about black people pulling guns on white people solely to attempt to get them to do something/stop doing something. And for the records, I'm not talking about armed robbery or anything else in that category.

I've heard some firearm instructors say that if you pull you weapon but don't use it or have to use it to defend yourself, then there was probably no threat which required an armed response to begin with. I don't fully agree with that stance because sometimes the mere sight of the weapon de-escalates the situation, but not in the last couple of these types of stories have I seen it do so. Pulling a firearm on someone for no good reason or as an attempt to intimidate can piss some people off and cause then to go on the attack because they were just threated with a deadly weapon.

If it keeps happening, then as long as the people who unlawfully pointed a weapon at another get charged and convicted, then I guess our laws are working as designed, correct?

Do you think, that pointing a weapon at a criminal, illegally blocking your way is a crime?

It doesn’t matter what anyone ‘thinks’ – as a fact of law pointing a gun at someone is felonious assault.

And the woman at whom the gun was pointed was not committing a criminal act.

The illegal blocking someone movements is a crime. Protection of someones freedom of movement is not a crime.

Do you understand that even if blocking someone's movements is a crime, the APPROPRIATE response is NOT to pull a firearm and theaten to shoot them? The APPROPRIATE response is to call the police and have them physically remove or arrest her,

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

A different look at the story from the one spun by the MSM.

Mainstream Media Reported On Armed Woman Pulling Her Gun On BLM Provocateur – But They Didn’t Present The Entire Truth – Here It Is - DC Clothesline

The mainstream media is right there to provide cover and propaganda for the Black Lives Matter provocateurs. In one of the latest evidences of this kind of “reporting” by the MSM, a video was created showing what was presented by the media concerning a couple leaving a local Chipotles...

www.dcclothesline.com

Yep. THIS is why I expect the charges to be dropped.
As the victim and her husband tried to retreat, one BLM protester circled around the back of their vehicle….. The BLM protester attempted to physically stop her vehicle by standing in the way of the vehicle while the victim’s reversed out of the parking stall…The BLM protester tried to blame the woman that is actually not driving the vehicle and is a passenger. The BLM protesters accused the innocent victims of trying to run them over on purpose. At that point the victim felt threatened and pulled her legally owned gun on the protesters…. screaming at them to back away and leave her alone

What does BLM have to do with this story? I thought they were at a strip mall or someplace where there is a Chipotle.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

Funny, the black mom and her two daughters didn't seem to fear the woman with the gun. They simply stood there and kept arguing and called the police. If someone pulled a gun on me and told me to back off, I would back off.

Ghetto rats are stupid. That makes them dangerous. The white woman was trained and did everything right. The ghetto ape was in no danger unless she did something stupid which is always a possibility.

Trained how? She had her finger on the trigger which is a violation of one of the basic rules of safe firearm handling.

 

[Silver Cat]

So is it just my imagination or does the trend seem to be white people pulling guns on black people and attempting to force them to comply with their demands because I can't recall any stories about black people pulling guns on white people solely to attempt to get them to do something/stop doing something. And for the records, I'm not talking about armed robbery or anything else in that category.

I've heard some firearm instructors say that if you pull you weapon but don't use it or have to use it to defend yourself, then there was probably no threat which required an armed response to begin with. I don't fully agree with that stance because sometimes the mere sight of the weapon de-escalates the situation, but not in the last couple of these types of stories have I seen it do so. Pulling a firearm on someone for no good reason or as an attempt to intimidate can piss some people off and cause then to go on the attack because they were just threated with a deadly weapon.

If it keeps happening, then as long as the people who unlawfully pointed a weapon at another get charged and convicted, then I guess our laws are working as designed, correct?

Do you think, that pointing a weapon at a criminal, illegally blocking your way is a crime?

It doesn’t matter what anyone ‘thinks’ – as a fact of law pointing a gun at someone is felonious assault.

And the woman at whom the gun was pointed was not committing a criminal act.

The illegal blocking someone movements is a crime. Protection of someones freedom of movement is not a crime.

Do you understand that even if blocking someone's movements is a crime, the APPROPRIATE response is NOT to pull a firearm and theaten to shoot them? The APPROPRIATE response is to call the police and have them physically remove or arrest her,

As we see, the Democrats-controlled, defunded and demoralized police can't defend decent and lawful citizens. Therefore citizens must protect themselves. At the next stage there will be organisation of white militia, you know.

 

[Silver Cat]

I'm finding it more and more disturbing how many people carry firearms without apprently knowing the laws regarding when they can draw and/or shoot.

"Jillian Wuestenberg, 32, and Eric Wuestenberg, 42, got into an altercation with the family outside a Chipotle in Michigan.



Watch: Video shows white woman pulling out gun on Black woman in Chipotle parking lot

July 3, 2020, 8:20 AM PDT
By Minyvonne Burke

A white couple from Clarkston, Michigan, was arrested and charged with a felony after a video showed the woman pointing a gun at a Black mother and her two daughters.

Jillian Wuestenberg, 32, and Eric Wuestenberg, 42, were taken into custody on Wednesday, the same day they got into an altercation with the family at a Chipotle in Orion Township.

The Oakland County Prosecutor's Office announced Thursday that the Wuestenbergs were charged with felonious assault.

Deputies were called to the Chipotle around 6 p.m. local time for reports of threats involving a firearm, the Oakland County Sheriff's Office said in a press release. Both the Wuestenbergs and the family, whom authorities did not identify, had called police on each other.

Part of the altercation was captured on cellphone video and shows two women off-camera accusing Jillian Wuestenberg of bumping into them. Eric Wuestenberg enters the frame and helps his wife get into their car before exchanging words with the mother.

Jillian Deanne Wuestenberg, 32,

Things quickly escalate after Eric Wuestenberg begins to reverse the vehicle out of the parking spot.

"You gonna f---ing hit me," the mother yells. Both groups begin arguing and the video shows Jillian Wuestenberg get out of the car and point a gun at the mother.

"Get away," Jillian Wuestenberg says, telling her husband to call the police. "Get the f--- away."

The video ends with Jillian Wuestenberg getting back into the car and the couple driving away. The footage does not show what led up to the altercation but Oakland County Sheriff Mike Bouchard said that it began when one group bumped into the other.
[snipped]

Minyvonne Burke is a breaking news reporter for NBC News."

Couple who pulled guns on Black mother and daughters charged with felony assault

Its only going to get worse as guns proliferate. We really are the biggest threat to our own species.

Some day when you find yourself surrounded by an angry negro mob, your opinion will change

yawn. just because you’re afraid of black people doesn’t mean I have to be.

I think you may have hit upon a core component of the problem, that a significant number of white people fear black people and as a result their fear causes them to see threats in far too many situations where a threat (of severe bodiy harm or death) simply does not exist.

Nonetheless in most cases their fear is deemed to be justified and allowable as the excuse for shooting and killing black people.

Actually, this is the same thing we see with police shootings.

In a matter of fact, when group of criminals block your way, there are significant chances, that it is a first stage of robbery or murder. And yes, it is a bit better to be jailed by a Democratic government, than to be killed by a Democtratic gang. But much better, imho, is to defund ghettos and force them all to work. "Idle hands are the devil's workshop", you know.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

More victims of Americas crazy gun laws. In the UK we settle these things in a less violent fashion and nobody gets killed.
Thats a better way in my opinion.

Ya you mean like a knife attack? Sorry but your country is very violent with assaults and battery occurring all the time and Knife and firearm attacks going up year by year. Mind your own damn business.

 

[candycorn]

So is it just my imagination or does the trend seem to be white people pulling guns on black people and attempting to force them to comply with their demands because I can't recall any stories about black people pulling guns on white people solely to attempt to get them to do something/stop doing something. And for the records, I'm not talking about armed robbery or anything else in that category.

I've heard some firearm instructors say that if you pull you weapon but don't use it or have to use it to defend yourself, then there was probably no threat which required an armed response to begin with. I don't fully agree with that stance because sometimes the mere sight of the weapon de-escalates the situation, but not in the last couple of these types of stories have I seen it do so. Pulling a firearm on someone for no good reason or as an attempt to intimidate can piss some people off and cause then to go on the attack because they were just threated with a deadly weapon.

If it keeps happening, then as long as the people who unlawfully pointed a weapon at another get charged and convicted, then I guess our laws are working as designed, correct?

Do you think, that pointing a weapon at a criminal, illegally blocking your way is a crime?

It doesn’t matter what anyone ‘thinks’ – as a fact of law pointing a gun at someone is felonious assault.

And the woman at whom the gun was pointed was not committing a criminal act.

The illegal blocking someone movements is a crime. Protection of someones freedom of movement is not a crime.

Do you understand that even if blocking someone's movements is a crime, the APPROPRIATE response is NOT to pull a firearm and theaten to shoot them? The APPROPRIATE response is to call the police and have them physically remove or arrest her,

As we see, the Democrats-controlled, defunded and demoralized police can't defend decent and lawful citizens. Therefore citizens must protect themselves. At the next stage there will be organisation of white militia, you know.

Next stage? That stage arrived about 1865. They used to be called the KKK. Now we just call them conservatives.