Cost of Bakhmut ‘meat grinder’ battle on Russian army revealed

[JohnDB]

Last report I seen that was near anything independent....basing their numbers off of social media of people looking for their MIA family and various other means....it appears that Russia has 146,000 KIA with another roughly 54,000+ wounded and unable to return to battle.

Meaning Russia has lost 200,000 soldiers to date. (Best edumacated guess)

Ukraine numbers are even more difficult to figure out as you have a huge number of civilians and volunteers from other nations coming in to fight. Many people also have fled the country. So from that it's difficult to tell if it was indiscriminate artillery and rocket fire killing civilians or were they militia fighting off the invaders? Certain brigades have been completely lost...and there's always ongoing reconstituted brigades being formed. Making numbers even more difficult for the bean counters. (Most likely deliberately obscuring the numbers)

So....
Since Russia is the aggressor in this and Putin does have to answer for the human cost....at what point of human casualties will he call off this war? Or will Russian women be begging for husbands from around the world again?

 

[Litwin]

 

[Litwin]

Last report I seen that was near anything independent....basing their numbers off of social media of people looking for their MIA family and various other means....it appears that Russia has 146,000 KIA with another roughly 54,000+ wounded and unable to return to battle.

Meaning Russia has lost 200,000 soldiers to date. (Best edumacated guess)

Ukraine numbers are even more difficult to figure out as you have a huge number of civilians and volunteers from other nations coming in to fight. Many people also have fled the country. So from that it's difficult to tell if it was indiscriminate artillery and rocket fire killing civilians or were they militia fighting off the invaders? Certain brigades have been completely lost...and there's always ongoing reconstituted brigades being formed. Making numbers even more difficult for the bean counters. (Most likely deliberately obscuring the numbers)

So....
Since Russia is the aggressor in this and Putin does have to answer for the human cost....at what point of human casualties will he call off this war? Or will Russian women be begging for husbands from around the world again?

this summer will be like 1917 all over again for moscow empire
A conversation between soldiers of a regiment full of mobilized Muscovites from Kaliningrad (east prussia ) and their commander.

 

[Bleipriester]

this summer will be like 1917 all over again for moscow empire
A conversation between soldiers of a regiment full of mobilized Muscovites from Kaliningrad (east prussia ) and their commander.

Millions, man, millions. With one missile.

 

[toomuchtime_]

.

Tell your stupid ass whatever you want to ... That's kind of the point I have been making all along.
You'll believe whatever you want ... And are not in the least bit interested in whether or not it is true.
Now you are talking about feelings ... Like that's going to make a difference ...

.​

Of course, just the opposite is true. You've been talking about your feelings all along and are now appalled when I show you the ideas you are actually expressing.

 

[BlackSand]

Of course, just the opposite is true. You've been talking about your feelings all along and are now appalled when I show you the ideas you are actually expressing.

.

I have been ... And still am talking about your desire to believe something based on an anonymous source.
Your ideas mean nothing ... When they are based on nothing but your desires to believe.
If you think your feelings make a difference in that ... They don't.

That's not me talking about my feelings ... It's you trying to pretend your desires make a difference ...

.​

 

[toomuchtime_]

.

I have been ... And still am talking about your desire to believe something based on an anonymous source.
Your ideas mean nothing ... When they are based on nothing but your desires to believe.
If you think your feelings make a difference in that ... They don't.

That's not me talking about my feelings ... It's you trying to pretend your desires make a difference ...

.​

Your bizarre babbling about "anonymous sources" and your insistence on treating western media as if it were a single sources show clearly you are not able to think clearly about any of this.

 

[para bellum]

Last report I seen that was near anything independent....basing their numbers off of social media of people looking for their MIA family and various other means....it appears that Russia has 146,000 KIA with another roughly 54,000+ wounded and unable to return to battle.

This number is kind of backwards I think. The "default" assumption is 3:1 WIA/KIA. That's loosely based on the US WW2/Korea numbers. So for 200K casualties, 50K KIA and150K WIA would be the typical assumption.

The thing that affects the ratio most directly is battlefield medicine/medevac, and also the type of weapons in theatre. In Afghanistan the main killer was IED's, and the US has very good medivac. We had approx. 2K killed and 20K wounded, for a 10:1 WIA/KIA.

In Ukraine Russia is the attacker, and from what I have seen Russia doesn't appear to do that well at evacuating their wounded. So I expect the number of casualties and the WIA/KIA ratios to favor Ukraine. (That's pretty conventional thinking)

I should add that in May/June 2022 that is flip-flopped, Russia was on the offensive at Severodonetsk/Lysychansk and the AFU was out of ammunition and waiting for western supplies to come in. They withstood 2 terrible months or Russian artillery barrages, that was the toughest time for the AFU in this war (so far).

Parsing out militias and irregular forces vice regular forces is an exercise in futility, I consider there are 2 sides, and each side has their numbers and that's all that really matters.

 

[BlackSand]

Your bizarre babbling about "anonymous sources" and your insistence on treating western media as if it were a single sources show clearly you are not able to think clearly about any of this.

.

It's not my thinking that is causing the problem ... It's your lack of it.

You don't need to keep telling me you don't understand ... I know you don't.
How many times do I have to tell you that you can pretend what you are posting means something?

That doesn't require you saying anything either ...
If you think about it ...

.​

 

[para bellum]

Certain brigades have been completely lost...and there's always ongoing reconstituted brigades being formed.

You said this about the AFU- if you know of any Bde's that have been lost, I'd like to know which ones you are referring to and where you got that information. I'm not aware of any Bde's lost to combat on the AFU side (largely because the AFU is not a maneuver army).

Reinforcing existing Bde's, and forming up new ones, yes. Combining two into one, or disbanding one due to combat losses? I may be wrong, but think I would have heard about it.

The only real large-scale maneuver by the AFU was the Kharkiv offensive, and that was pretty much a rout. Company-sized assaults are the norm for both sides, unless one side is actually on the offensive (meaning they have combat-ready reserves available to exploit a breakthrough).

 

[Flash]

No, it doesn´t. The war rages since 2014.

When the Russian filth decided to annex the Crimea and sent their invading army.

Russians are assholes. Always have been and always will be..

 

[Bleipriester]

When the Russian filth decided to annex the Crimea and sent their invading army.

Russians are assholes. Always have been and always will be..

No Putsch, no separatists? Just Crimea? And when the US attacks a country?

 

[Flash]

No Putsch, no separatists? Just Crimea? And when the US attacks a country?

Just Russia trying to take land by force. We have seen their shit many times.

Russians are assholes. We thought the bastards would start playing nice after the Soviet Union failed but that didn't happen. They reverted to being their normal asshole selves.

 

[Bleipriester]

toomuchtime_ Litwin

Do you thank that is true?

""The resources which Russia has at the moment would be enough to continue the war at the present intensity for two years," the chief, Elegijus Paulavicius, told reporters in Vilnius."

Russia has sufficient resources to wage war in Ukraine for two years - Lithuanian intelligence

The chief of the Lithuanian military intelligence said Russia has enough resources continue the war in Ukraine

www.jpost.com

 

[toomuchtime_]

toomuchtime_ Litwin

Do you thank that is true?

""The resources which Russia has at the moment would be enough to continue the war at the present intensity for two years," the chief, Elegijus Paulavicius, told reporters in Vilnius."

Russia has sufficient resources to wage war in Ukraine for two years - Lithuanian intelligence

The chief of the Lithuanian military intelligence said Russia has enough resources continue the war in Ukraine

www.jpost.com

I doubt it.

Iran has supplied Russia with a large shipment of ammunition including millions of bullets and hundreds of thousands of shells, Sky News reported Wednesday, citing an unnamed security source.

“Iran sent two cargo ships to the combat zone in Ukraine, carrying approximately 200 new shipping containers that contained ammunition for the Russian fighting in Ukraine,” the source said.

Tracking data showed two Russian-flagged ships, the Musa Jalil and the Begey, departing an Iranian port in January and arriving later that month in Russia, according to the report.


On board were around 100 million bullets and 300,000 shells, the source said.

Iran said to have supplied Russia with large shipment of ammunition

Two ships tracked leaving Iranian port and arriving in Russian dock in January; security source tells Sky News 100 million bullets and 300,000 shells on board

www.timesofisrael.com

 

[Bleipriester]

I doubt it.

Iran has supplied Russia with a large shipment of ammunition including millions of bullets and hundreds of thousands of shells, Sky News reported Wednesday, citing an unnamed security source.

“Iran sent two cargo ships to the combat zone in Ukraine, carrying approximately 200 new shipping containers that contained ammunition for the Russian fighting in Ukraine,” the source said.

Tracking data showed two Russian-flagged ships, the Musa Jalil and the Begey, departing an Iranian port in January and arriving later that month in Russia, according to the report.


On board were around 100 million bullets and 300,000 shells, the source said.

Iran said to have supplied Russia with large shipment of ammunition

Two ships tracked leaving Iranian port and arriving in Russian dock in January; security source tells Sky News 100 million bullets and 300,000 shells on board

www.timesofisrael.com

I think that is more than Ukraine gets from Pakistan.
If true, Iran can deliver more than the entire west. They have really sophisticated drones, too.
Time to agree that Ukraine can´t win and every fallen soldier is a lost sacrifice.

 

[toomuchtime_]

I think that is more than Ukraine gets from Pakistan.
If true, Iran can deliver more than the entire west. They have really sophisticated drones, too.
Time to agree that Ukraine can´t win and every fallen soldier is a lost sacrifice.

The question was, does Russia have enough resources to fight at the present intensity for two more years, and this suggests it doesn't and that it doesn't have the industrial capacity to manufacture its own ammo in the amounts needed.

 

[Bleipriester]

The question was, does Russia have enough resources to fight at the present intensity for two more years, and this suggests it doesn't and that it doesn't have the industrial capacity to manufacture its own ammo in the amounts needed.

From the source you apparently didn´t even bother to read:

""How long Russia is be able to wage the war will also depend on the support for Russia's military from states, such as Iran, North Korea. But if you look at what Russia has today, such as the strategic reserve, equipment, ammunition, armaments - it can wage it at the present intensity for two years," he added."

Support looks strong if we are set to believe the news. It means 2 years+ with Iranian support.

 

[toomuchtime_]

From the source you apparently didn´t even bother to read:

""How long Russia is be able to wage the war will also depend on the support for Russia's military from states, such as Iran, North Korea. But if you look at what Russia has today, such as the strategic reserve, equipment, ammunition, armaments - it can wage it at the present intensity for two years," he added."

Support looks strong if we are set to believe the news. It means 2 years+ with Iranian support.

I read the message. It said that without importing ammo, Russia can continue to fight at the present intensity for two years.

But if you look at what Russia has today, such as the strategic reserve, equipment, ammunition, armaments - it can wage it at the present intensity for two years," he added."

 

[Bleipriester]

I read the message. It said that without importing ammo, Russia can continue to fight at the present intensity for two years.

No, it doesn´t.

But if you look at what Russia has today, such as the strategic reserve, equipment, ammunition, armaments - it can wage it at the present intensity for two years," he added."

No imports, no own production are accounted. And we can only assume that the two years are a long guess. It could be more.