Conservatives forget history in discrediting Trump protesters

[9thIDdoc]

The political memory sure seems to be suffering from Alzheimers...


Trump refers to them as "professional protesters" - which simultaneously discredits them (with no evidence) and fans the flames. A typical tactic to delegitimize their concerns which are just as valid as the concerns that moved people to vote for trump.

Conservatives forget history in discrediting Trump protesters:

Trump’s supporters also perceive these protests as “unfair” because they claim there were no riots following Obama’s election.

According to conservatives on social media, “Republicans have jobs and responsibilities” and therefore couldn’t engage in civil disobedience to voice their discontent with the 2008 and 2012 elections. With this perception of the Obama elections and subsequent claims of “ Republican acceptance,” Trump supporters are now demanding the same “fairness” for Donald J. Trump’s presidency, “We sat through do nothing politics for 8 years, the least they can do is go shut up and sit in the corner for 8 themselves,” on Trump supporter explained.

However, these perceptions do not reflect what actually followed the election of our country’s first black president, much less the difference between why people are protesting Donald J. Trump’s presidency as compared to Barack Obama’s presidency.
Obama’s election in 2008 was preceded and followed by violent attacks and property destruction targeted against minorities.​

Now, this blog is in it's own way as decidely biased as the pro-Trumpers view, but it does point out some conveniently forgotten truths of a previous election win. There were protests. And violence. And some pretty bad behavior.

Trump loves Russia.

He does not even like America.

The actual point is, and should be, that violent destructive riots are not "protest" and there is no excuse for them. By anyone. Ever. In this particular case there is considerable doubt what they are about because they have been going on for a couple of years now with constantly changing rationale.
Also they are particularly idiotic because Trump won the election. It's an accomplished fact. No amount of "protest" is going to change that. You are not going to convince you are looting in an attempt to change anything.

 

[peach174]

Ok, so you believe this is different?

Yes

Can you tell me how you believe it is different?

The difference is on two levels. On is in the reaction after the election - mass protests in a larger scale then we've seen for a while. The level of violence from these demonstrations as well, though it falls far short of what is being spread about it in social media - it's greater than prior recent elections.

The other is less tangible - the ugliness and the vitriole of the campaign itself, the deliberate fanning of flames and division, the incredible amount of false information/disinformation/fake news dumped into the campaign, the effect of Wikileaks, of Russian hacking, of Comey's last minute injection of the emails. You also have the Trump campaign's claims through out the campaign of "rigging" and "cheating" and "stealing". All together that sets the stage for a really toxic environment. I think people really believe that Trump won unfairly and, I strongly suspect if Clinton had won, Trump supporters would be feeling the same.

There is something I'm coming to realize. There is a lot of anger that has been generated and encouraged in this election cycle - it's not going to disappear overnight, when the election is over. It needs someplace to go. I think because of this you can't simply denounce the protests - they are a legitimate expression. As long as you don't go over into violence and property destruction. My initial reaction to it was - they need to grow up, accept the results and move on to 2018. But maybe that's not exactly realistic. People need to blow off steam - if they win they need to celebrate if they lose, likewise, the right to express their anger. Leadership recognizes that they need to allow this because if they just repress it - it may break out in a worse way later on. The caveate being it needs to stay within the law. I see this on these boards as moderator.

I don't ever remember an election cycle like this - never.

It has been building on boths sides now for twenty years and neither side listened.
So now this is the result.
Let's see how Trump and the repubs do, if not then maybe we will need another Revolution.
I think if we get back to stable long term solutions it will help to stablize the country.
They have been lawless for to long up there in D.C.

Yep. Our society has adopted the behaviors of our so-called leaders. I won't be holding my breath that anything short of civil or world war will change it.

Maybe so.
We shall see won't we.

 

[ding]

Yes

Can you tell me how you believe it is different?

The difference is on two levels. On is in the reaction after the election - mass protests in a larger scale then we've seen for a while. The level of violence from these demonstrations as well, though it falls far short of what is being spread about it in social media - it's greater than prior recent elections.

The other is less tangible - the ugliness and the vitriole of the campaign itself, the deliberate fanning of flames and division, the incredible amount of false information/disinformation/fake news dumped into the campaign, the effect of Wikileaks, of Russian hacking, of Comey's last minute injection of the emails. You also have the Trump campaign's claims through out the campaign of "rigging" and "cheating" and "stealing". All together that sets the stage for a really toxic environment. I think people really believe that Trump won unfairly and, I strongly suspect if Clinton had won, Trump supporters would be feeling the same.

There is something I'm coming to realize. There is a lot of anger that has been generated and encouraged in this election cycle - it's not going to disappear overnight, when the election is over. It needs someplace to go. I think because of this you can't simply denounce the protests - they are a legitimate expression. As long as you don't go over into violence and property destruction. My initial reaction to it was - they need to grow up, accept the results and move on to 2018. But maybe that's not exactly realistic. People need to blow off steam - if they win they need to celebrate if they lose, likewise, the right to express their anger. Leadership recognizes that they need to allow this because if they just repress it - it may break out in a worse way later on. The caveate being it needs to stay within the law. I see this on these boards as moderator.

I don't ever remember an election cycle like this - never.

It has been building on boths sides now for twenty years and neither side listened.
So now this is the result.
Let's see how Trump and the repubs do, if not then maybe we will need another Revolution.
I think if we get back to stable long term solutions it will help to stablize the country.
They have been lawless for to long up there in D.C.

Yep. Our society has adopted the behaviors of our so-called leaders. I won't be holding my breath that anything short of civil or world war will change it.

Maybe so.
We shall see won't we.

Yes, indeed. It will only take a three week disruption of services before they start eating each other to survive.

 

[peach174]

Talk about ironic as we all are here discussing the breakdown of our failed government, I'm sitting here on the phone with the USPS for a hold time of 16 to 23 minutes.
Peach is not a very happy camper right now!

 

[ding]

Talk about ironic as we all are here discussing the breakdown of our failed government, I'm sitting here on the phone with the USPS for a hold time of 16 to 23 minutes.
Peach is not a very happy camper right now!

It boggles my mind how many people want more of inept government.

 

[Tilly]

Not my problem if you don't like the link.

sure it is, it's your integrity, BTW, I just deleted my post on the ambulance story because I couldn't find a reliable news source to validate it. I have integrity. I didn't do my due diligence and apologize.

But you made a statement and it is not validated. without that, it's not real.

Ok, that's reasonable.

The claim I made in the OP was (copied from the blog I linked to):

Trump’s supporters also perceive these protests as “unfair” because they claim there were no riots following Obama’s election.

According to conservatives on social media, “Republicans have jobs and responsibilities” and therefore couldn’t engage in civil disobedience to voice their discontent with the 2008 and 2012 elections. With this perception of the Obama elections and subsequent claims of “ Republican acceptance,” Trump supporters are now demanding the same “fairness” for Donald J. Trump’s presidency, “We sat through do nothing politics for 8 years, the least they can do is go shut up and sit in the corner for 8 themselves,” one Trump supporter explained.

However, these perceptions do not reflect what actually followed the election of our country’s first black president, much less the difference between why people are protesting Donald J. Trump’s presidency as compared to Barack Obama’s presidency.

Obama’s election in 2008 was preceded and followed by violent attacks and property destruction targeted against minorities.
​

So here are some links:
Anti-Obama Protest at University of Mississippi Turns Unruly
Guilty plea in Springfield church fire
Idaho students chant Obama threat on school bus
Obama election spurs race threats, crimes

Now, I'm going to say this about 2008 and the ways in which it differs from now:
In 2008 and 2012, the unrest was not as wide spread, was more in invidual acts around the country, but individual acts that added up to some pretty ugly stuff including a church burning and assaults but no large scale demonstrations, so I'll agree I was wrong to go with that comparison. Mea Culpa

There are some other differences though - between then and now - that ought to be part of the conversation.

McCain made a deliberate effort to calm flames from his supporters when the rhetoric started to go over the top throughout the campaign. Trump pumped it up and I think part of that is a reason why these protests are so charged, if you fan the flames like that right up to and through the election, how are you going to control them after the election - when someone HAS to lose? Do you honestly think Trump supporters would have quietly accepted it it after months of rhetoric about rigging and cheating? You had people threatening revolution, shooting, etc. At this point, it's all rhetoric and speculation and we'll never know.

Add to that, as soon as the protests started, what does Trump do? Tweets that they had a "fair and transparent" (because he won) and the Dems were bussing in paid protestors (again, a charge without evidence). That is not calming the flames, it's fanning them. Some of that might be the problem with Twitter - a medium not designed to convey nuance or much else either. He first lashed out at out at the protestors accusing them of being paid operatives then, the next day praising them for their passion and calling for unity.

Another point to consider - the question of has Hillary and Obama said and done enough to calm the protests? When I've looked over the articles, I've seen multiple moments, on various trips and talks, where Obama AND his supporters, such as Oprah Winfrey and Dave Chappelle, have called for unity, and for people to work with Mr. Trump and give him a chance. He has emphasized to his followers that a Trump Administration doesn't automatically mean a rejection of everything they've worked for. Obama has refused to criticize or talk about Trump's potential appointments or any aspects of the transition. Though not related to the protests, has met with foreign dignataries to assure them that their will be continuity with the Trump Administration. All this, together - is an effort to calm the flames and to try to reassure the people who supported him: unity not violence. I think that is sufficient unless things get really out of hand. So far, this is not the riots of the civil rights era, nor Rodney King nor even Fergeson. The protests are still by and large peaceful.

I'm not really sure how to respond to this post. it seems you are now pulling in the bullshit from the campaign. And friend, that's over and water under the dam and I don't care. You're right no conservative rallies or protests occurred after either victory for obummer. So again, the OP is not accurate. Just isn't. Take your lump and call it what you stated here, you took it at face value and it isn't true.

And again, I'm not sure what you think Trump can do with people shouting fk trump you're not my president while rioting and causing damage to other people's property and interfering with traffic and other peoples time.

it isn't his supporters, it is up to Hitlery and obummer to quiet the fools on the crybaby left. For you to impose that expectation on Trump is truly stupid.

You really can't seperate out the campaign from the post-election. Both sides have a responsibility here. And, let me point out - Trump has yet to denounce the outbreak in hate crime violence that has also occurred. Calling for unity from both sides is good, imo, and both sides HAVE done that.

look, this is getting old, he told any/all of his supporters to stop on 60 minutes sunday night. I haven't heard jack from your side. And for during the campaign, I'd ask you who was causing violence where? Can you name where the violence was and how it was started? Please, can you be fking honest? have some integrity.

She doesn't have any integrity. That's why so many posters here, me included, simply ignore her. She isn't interested in facts or truth, just in what she perceives as 'winning'. You have the patience of a saint, but sadly really are wasting your time.

 

[Tilly]

Most of the imbecilic leftards arrested in Oregon couldnt even be bothered to vote. This hypocrisy though, is typical of the left.

That appears to be yet another of the claims that has been debunked as "unproven": Most Trump Protesters Didn't Vote?

Why do you insist on spreading unproven or debunked claims such as this?

coyote, please, you're wrong again. reread your own link here let me pull out the piece for you:

"WHAT'S TRUE: An Oregon-based news outlet claimed it checked voter activity against a list of arrests and determined that a majority did not vote at all in the 2016 general election.

WHAT'S FALSE: The data omitted important variables; the information only included 112 people arrested in Portland and not all protesters in all anti-Trump demonstrations."
which means many of the arrested folks in Portland didn't vote. What's inaccurate?

She didn't say "Portland". She said Oregon.

Edited to add:

What she said was: "Most of the imbecilic leftards arrested in Oregon couldnt even be bothered to vote."

So here is another source: At least third of arrested anti-Trump protesters didn't vote

Even with that - 1/3 didn't vote that they know of.

isn't portland in oregon?

Thank you, JC456. As far as I'm aware, the riots were/are only occurring in Portland - not elsewhere in Oregon, so yes, that's what I meant. Thanks.

 

[peach174]

Talk about ironic as we all are here discussing the breakdown of our failed government, I'm sitting here on the phone with the USPS for a hold time of 16 to 23 minutes.
Peach is not a very happy camper right now!

It boggles my mind how many people want more of inept government.

Yep!
Just got done with them, almost 30 min. on hold !
Not a minute to soon because the package would have been sent back in the morning.
Grrrrr......
I'm so angry I'm tempted to go out and do some target shooting with my husbands new Remington 1100.

 

[Coyote]

Yes, most were: Orcinus: When Obama Was Elected: An Outpouring of Hate in 2008

No massive organized protests.

Ok, so you believe this is different?

Yes

Can you tell me how you believe it is different?

The difference is on two levels. On is in the reaction after the election - mass protests in a larger scale then we've seen for a while. The level of violence from these demonstrations as well, though it falls far short of what is being spread about it in social media - it's greater than prior recent elections.

The other is less tangible - the ugliness and the vitriole of the campaign itself, the deliberate fanning of flames and division, the incredible amount of false information/disinformation/fake news dumped into the campaign, the effect of Wikileaks, of Russian hacking, of Comey's last minute injection of the emails. You also have the Trump campaign's claims through out the campaign of "rigging" and "cheating" and "stealing". All together that sets the stage for a really toxic environment. I think people really believe that Trump won unfairly and, I strongly suspect if Clinton had won, Trump supporters would be feeling the same.

There is something I'm coming to realize. There is a lot of anger that has been generated and encouraged in this election cycle - it's not going to disappear overnight, when the election is over. It needs someplace to go. I think because of this you can't simply denounce the protests - they are a legitimate expression. As long as you don't go over into violence and property destruction. My initial reaction to it was - they need to grow up, accept the results and move on to 2018. But maybe that's not exactly realistic. People need to blow off steam - if they win they need to celebrate if they lose, likewise, the right to express their anger. Leadership recognizes that they need to allow this because if they just repress it - it may break out in a worse way later on. The caveate being it needs to stay within the law. I see this on these boards as moderator.

I don't ever remember an election cycle like this - never.

It has been building on boths sides now for twenty years and neither side listened.
So now this is the result.
Let's see how Trump and the repubs do, if not then maybe we will need another Revolution.
I think if we get back to stable long term solutions it will help to stablize the country.
They have been lawless for to long up there in D.C.

Ya, you're right about that.

But I think we need more parties.

 

[Coyote]

Talk about ironic as we all are here discussing the breakdown of our failed government, I'm sitting here on the phone with the USPS for a hold time of 16 to 23 minutes.
Peach is not a very happy camper right now!

It boggles my mind how many people want more of inept government.

I think we need to be very very careful of throwing the baby out with the bathwater in this.

 

[Coyote]

sure it is, it's your integrity, BTW, I just deleted my post on the ambulance story because I couldn't find a reliable news source to validate it. I have integrity. I didn't do my due diligence and apologize.

But you made a statement and it is not validated. without that, it's not real.

Ok, that's reasonable.

The claim I made in the OP was (copied from the blog I linked to):

Trump’s supporters also perceive these protests as “unfair” because they claim there were no riots following Obama’s election.

According to conservatives on social media, “Republicans have jobs and responsibilities” and therefore couldn’t engage in civil disobedience to voice their discontent with the 2008 and 2012 elections. With this perception of the Obama elections and subsequent claims of “ Republican acceptance,” Trump supporters are now demanding the same “fairness” for Donald J. Trump’s presidency, “We sat through do nothing politics for 8 years, the least they can do is go shut up and sit in the corner for 8 themselves,” one Trump supporter explained.

However, these perceptions do not reflect what actually followed the election of our country’s first black president, much less the difference between why people are protesting Donald J. Trump’s presidency as compared to Barack Obama’s presidency.

Obama’s election in 2008 was preceded and followed by violent attacks and property destruction targeted against minorities.
​

So here are some links:
Anti-Obama Protest at University of Mississippi Turns Unruly
Guilty plea in Springfield church fire
Idaho students chant Obama threat on school bus
Obama election spurs race threats, crimes

Now, I'm going to say this about 2008 and the ways in which it differs from now:
In 2008 and 2012, the unrest was not as wide spread, was more in invidual acts around the country, but individual acts that added up to some pretty ugly stuff including a church burning and assaults but no large scale demonstrations, so I'll agree I was wrong to go with that comparison. Mea Culpa

There are some other differences though - between then and now - that ought to be part of the conversation.

McCain made a deliberate effort to calm flames from his supporters when the rhetoric started to go over the top throughout the campaign. Trump pumped it up and I think part of that is a reason why these protests are so charged, if you fan the flames like that right up to and through the election, how are you going to control them after the election - when someone HAS to lose? Do you honestly think Trump supporters would have quietly accepted it it after months of rhetoric about rigging and cheating? You had people threatening revolution, shooting, etc. At this point, it's all rhetoric and speculation and we'll never know.

Add to that, as soon as the protests started, what does Trump do? Tweets that they had a "fair and transparent" (because he won) and the Dems were bussing in paid protestors (again, a charge without evidence). That is not calming the flames, it's fanning them. Some of that might be the problem with Twitter - a medium not designed to convey nuance or much else either. He first lashed out at out at the protestors accusing them of being paid operatives then, the next day praising them for their passion and calling for unity.

Another point to consider - the question of has Hillary and Obama said and done enough to calm the protests? When I've looked over the articles, I've seen multiple moments, on various trips and talks, where Obama AND his supporters, such as Oprah Winfrey and Dave Chappelle, have called for unity, and for people to work with Mr. Trump and give him a chance. He has emphasized to his followers that a Trump Administration doesn't automatically mean a rejection of everything they've worked for. Obama has refused to criticize or talk about Trump's potential appointments or any aspects of the transition. Though not related to the protests, has met with foreign dignataries to assure them that their will be continuity with the Trump Administration. All this, together - is an effort to calm the flames and to try to reassure the people who supported him: unity not violence. I think that is sufficient unless things get really out of hand. So far, this is not the riots of the civil rights era, nor Rodney King nor even Fergeson. The protests are still by and large peaceful.

I'm not really sure how to respond to this post. it seems you are now pulling in the bullshit from the campaign. And friend, that's over and water under the dam and I don't care. You're right no conservative rallies or protests occurred after either victory for obummer. So again, the OP is not accurate. Just isn't. Take your lump and call it what you stated here, you took it at face value and it isn't true.

And again, I'm not sure what you think Trump can do with people shouting fk trump you're not my president while rioting and causing damage to other people's property and interfering with traffic and other peoples time.

it isn't his supporters, it is up to Hitlery and obummer to quiet the fools on the crybaby left. For you to impose that expectation on Trump is truly stupid.

You really can't seperate out the campaign from the post-election. Both sides have a responsibility here. And, let me point out - Trump has yet to denounce the outbreak in hate crime violence that has also occurred. Calling for unity from both sides is good, imo, and both sides HAVE done that.

look, this is getting old, he told any/all of his supporters to stop on 60 minutes sunday night. I haven't heard jack from your side. And for during the campaign, I'd ask you who was causing violence where? Can you name where the violence was and how it was started? Please, can you be fking honest? have some integrity.

She doesn't have any integrity. That's why so many posters here, me included, simply ignore her. She isn't interested in facts or truth, just in what she perceives as 'winning'. You have the patience of a saint, but sadly really are wasting your time.

Pot. Kettle.

Tell us how 1/3 of the protestors arrested in Portland didn't vote translates into most then come back and tell us about your integrity.

 

[Coyote]

Talk about ironic as we all are here discussing the breakdown of our failed government, I'm sitting here on the phone with the USPS for a hold time of 16 to 23 minutes.
Peach is not a very happy camper right now!

It boggles my mind how many people want more of inept government.

Yep!
Just got done with them, almost 30 min. on hold !
Not a minute to soon because the package would have been sent back in the morning.
Grrrrr......
I'm so angry I'm tempted to go out and do some target shooting with my husbands new Remington 1100.

I hate how automation has made a freaking simple phone call into hours of waiting, pressing buttons and repeating the same information to a robot!

 

[Coyote]

She didn't say "Portland". She said Oregon.

Edited to add:

What she said was: "Most of the imbecilic leftards arrested in Oregon couldnt even be bothered to vote."

So here is another source: At least third of arrested anti-Trump protesters didn't vote

Even with that - 1/3 didn't vote that they know of.

isn't portland in oregon?

Portland is one city, in a state.

and they didn't vote, they weren't even residents and didn't vote. still not sure how that makes it wrong.

1/3 is not "most".

semantics, come on, it was a fking a point. you're calling blogs news outlets. and you continued to fight that one. you're acting like a hypocrite.

So suddenly accuracy doesn't matter? Come on JC. It matters when I exagerate to make a point but what, a free pass when it comes from your side making a ******* point? Do you ever call your side on it? Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think I called blogs news outlets.

 

[Coyote]

Ok, that's reasonable.

The claim I made in the OP was (copied from the blog I linked to):

Trump’s supporters also perceive these protests as “unfair” because they claim there were no riots following Obama’s election.

According to conservatives on social media, “Republicans have jobs and responsibilities” and therefore couldn’t engage in civil disobedience to voice their discontent with the 2008 and 2012 elections. With this perception of the Obama elections and subsequent claims of “ Republican acceptance,” Trump supporters are now demanding the same “fairness” for Donald J. Trump’s presidency, “We sat through do nothing politics for 8 years, the least they can do is go shut up and sit in the corner for 8 themselves,” one Trump supporter explained.

However, these perceptions do not reflect what actually followed the election of our country’s first black president, much less the difference between why people are protesting Donald J. Trump’s presidency as compared to Barack Obama’s presidency.

Obama’s election in 2008 was preceded and followed by violent attacks and property destruction targeted against minorities.
​

So here are some links:
Anti-Obama Protest at University of Mississippi Turns Unruly
Guilty plea in Springfield church fire
Idaho students chant Obama threat on school bus
Obama election spurs race threats, crimes

Now, I'm going to say this about 2008 and the ways in which it differs from now:
In 2008 and 2012, the unrest was not as wide spread, was more in invidual acts around the country, but individual acts that added up to some pretty ugly stuff including a church burning and assaults but no large scale demonstrations, so I'll agree I was wrong to go with that comparison. Mea Culpa

There are some other differences though - between then and now - that ought to be part of the conversation.

McCain made a deliberate effort to calm flames from his supporters when the rhetoric started to go over the top throughout the campaign. Trump pumped it up and I think part of that is a reason why these protests are so charged, if you fan the flames like that right up to and through the election, how are you going to control them after the election - when someone HAS to lose? Do you honestly think Trump supporters would have quietly accepted it it after months of rhetoric about rigging and cheating? You had people threatening revolution, shooting, etc. At this point, it's all rhetoric and speculation and we'll never know.

Add to that, as soon as the protests started, what does Trump do? Tweets that they had a "fair and transparent" (because he won) and the Dems were bussing in paid protestors (again, a charge without evidence). That is not calming the flames, it's fanning them. Some of that might be the problem with Twitter - a medium not designed to convey nuance or much else either. He first lashed out at out at the protestors accusing them of being paid operatives then, the next day praising them for their passion and calling for unity.

Another point to consider - the question of has Hillary and Obama said and done enough to calm the protests? When I've looked over the articles, I've seen multiple moments, on various trips and talks, where Obama AND his supporters, such as Oprah Winfrey and Dave Chappelle, have called for unity, and for people to work with Mr. Trump and give him a chance. He has emphasized to his followers that a Trump Administration doesn't automatically mean a rejection of everything they've worked for. Obama has refused to criticize or talk about Trump's potential appointments or any aspects of the transition. Though not related to the protests, has met with foreign dignataries to assure them that their will be continuity with the Trump Administration. All this, together - is an effort to calm the flames and to try to reassure the people who supported him: unity not violence. I think that is sufficient unless things get really out of hand. So far, this is not the riots of the civil rights era, nor Rodney King nor even Fergeson. The protests are still by and large peaceful.

I'm not really sure how to respond to this post. it seems you are now pulling in the bullshit from the campaign. And friend, that's over and water under the dam and I don't care. You're right no conservative rallies or protests occurred after either victory for obummer. So again, the OP is not accurate. Just isn't. Take your lump and call it what you stated here, you took it at face value and it isn't true.

And again, I'm not sure what you think Trump can do with people shouting fk trump you're not my president while rioting and causing damage to other people's property and interfering with traffic and other peoples time.

it isn't his supporters, it is up to Hitlery and obummer to quiet the fools on the crybaby left. For you to impose that expectation on Trump is truly stupid.

You really can't seperate out the campaign from the post-election. Both sides have a responsibility here. And, let me point out - Trump has yet to denounce the outbreak in hate crime violence that has also occurred. Calling for unity from both sides is good, imo, and both sides HAVE done that.

BTW, the campaign is over so yes I don't see the need to go pull all of that violence. there is enough violence from your side after the election cycle ended that you should be ashamed and denounce them. you still haven't done that.

You're wrong. I've denounced it multiple times on threads regarding these protests.

Have you denounced the violence from YOUR side? Maybe you should be ashamed as well.

I don't condone any violence, any. Right now it's all the libturd crybabies. shame on their violence. I spit at them

I don't condone any violence either.

 

[peach174]

Talk about ironic as we all are here discussing the breakdown of our failed government, I'm sitting here on the phone with the USPS for a hold time of 16 to 23 minutes.
Peach is not a very happy camper right now!

It boggles my mind how many people want more of inept government.

Yep!
Just got done with them, almost 30 min. on hold !
Not a minute to soon because the package would have been sent back in the morning.
Grrrrr......
I'm so angry I'm tempted to go out and do some target shooting with my husbands new Remington 1100.

I hate how automation has made a freaking simple phone call into hours of waiting, pressing buttons and repeating the same information to a robot!

YEP!

Went out and did some target shooting. Much better than throwing rocks.
One of the advantages of living in the middle of the sticks.
Besides it was really an excuse.
Sweet shot gun I love it. Hopefully I got some of those dang pocket gophers.

Wow I feel much better now!

 

[Coyote]

Talk about ironic as we all are here discussing the breakdown of our failed government, I'm sitting here on the phone with the USPS for a hold time of 16 to 23 minutes.
Peach is not a very happy camper right now!

It boggles my mind how many people want more of inept government.

Yep!
Just got done with them, almost 30 min. on hold !
Not a minute to soon because the package would have been sent back in the morning.
Grrrrr......
I'm so angry I'm tempted to go out and do some target shooting with my husbands new Remington 1100.

I hate how automation has made a freaking simple phone call into hours of waiting, pressing buttons and repeating the same information to a robot!

YEP!

Went out and did some target shooting. Much better than throwing rocks.
One of the advantages of living in the middle of the sticks.
Besides it was really an excuse.
Sweet shot gun I love it. Hopefully I got some of those dang pocket gophers.

Wow I feel much better now!

 

[ding]

Talk about ironic as we all are here discussing the breakdown of our failed government, I'm sitting here on the phone with the USPS for a hold time of 16 to 23 minutes.
Peach is not a very happy camper right now!

It boggles my mind how many people want more of inept government.

I think we need to be very very careful of throwing the baby out with the bathwater in this.

I agree, but we have some very dirty bath water.

 

[Tilly]

Imbecile leftards who couldn't even be bothered to vote should just

PORTLAND, Ore. — Most of the 112 protesters arrested in Portland last week didn’t vote in Oregon, according to state election records. Approximately 30 percent did cast a ballot in Oregon or in another state.

At least seventy-nine demonstrators either didn’t turn in a ballot or weren’t registered to vote in the state...

KGW compiled a list of the 112 people arrested by the Portland Police Bureau during recent protests. Those names and ages, provided by police, were then compared to state voter logs by Multnomah County Elections officials.

Records show 39 of the protesters arrested were registered in the state but didn’t return a ballot for the November 8 election. Thirty-five of the demonstrators taken into custody weren’t registered to vote in Oregon.

Kevin Grigsby was one of 71 arrested during the Saturday night protest. He said he didn't do anything wrong, but told KGW he also did not vote...

It is unclear if those who aren't registered in Oregon are registered to vote in other states. Most of those gave Oregon addresses as their official residence in court records.

Four of the 112 arrestees are under the age of 18 and thus not eligible to vote, and 34 of the protesters did vote.

There have been theories floating around the internet that protesters are being brought in from elsewhere and encouraged by outside agitators.

Our analysis of court records shows the majority of those arrested in Portland are from either Oregon or Washington. Of the 112 arrested protesters we looked at, 89 listed Oregon addresses and seven listed Washington addresses.

One listed a California address and one listed a Texas address. Fourteen protesters didn’t have addresses listed in court records. ..

More than half of arrested anti-Trump protesters didn't vote in Oregon

 

[peach174]

Talk about ironic as we all are here discussing the breakdown of our failed government, I'm sitting here on the phone with the USPS for a hold time of 16 to 23 minutes.
Peach is not a very happy camper right now!

It boggles my mind how many people want more of inept government.

I think we need to be very very careful of throwing the baby out with the bathwater in this.

I agree with you but I think Trump knows that too.
I think people are going to find out he is more like President Kennedy's ideology.

 

[Coyote]

Talk about ironic as we all are here discussing the breakdown of our failed government, I'm sitting here on the phone with the USPS for a hold time of 16 to 23 minutes.
Peach is not a very happy camper right now!

It boggles my mind how many people want more of inept government.

I think we need to be very very careful of throwing the baby out with the bathwater in this.

I agree, but we have some very dirty bath water.

I think that...this is like Brexit. I don't think the average American knows what he is really getting into, when he voted "change" for no reason then change "get rid of establishment" and that worries me a great deal. Regardless of what you say about The Establishment - they know governance. We have a new crew with almost zero experience coming in and "draining the swamp". You know who the last "outsider" was who did this? Carter. I was listening to Marketplace talking about Trump's grandiose infrastructure plan and it has me worried. Do these guys know what they are doing and if they don't - do they have the ability to listen to advice, even unpalatable advice? I get the feeling they view the presidency as a Grand Experiment, a Giant Game Show and freaks me out. I can deal with ideological differences, but this is a bit more.