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Cnn On The Republican Debate

deepthunk

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I just read an opinion on cnn.com I would like to share. Are Republicans at war with reality?
It’s a fairly enjoyable read mostly about the policies expressed by the G.O.P. hopefuls during Thursday’s debate. There is one small point I would disagree with the author on however. Are Republicans at war with reality? - CNN.com
In the op/ed, John Avlon writes: “The lowest moment for responsible governance occurred when all the candidates on stage raised their hands to say that they would reject a 10-to-1 spending cut to tax hike split as a deal to reduce the deficit. That is a sign of a party that is being held intellectually captive by its most extreme activist elements”.
Frankly I think everyone should be clear on this one point if nothing else, conservatives (both republican and teaparty) are being held “intellectually captive” by their billionaire puppet masters and the corporations who buy and sell politicians in Washington like cattle at a meat market. They didn’t care what the American people thought; I doubt they care what some activists think either (that is as long as fox news can keep conning people into voting for them).
I think when we sit here and pretend like conservative fiscal policies aren’t written by and handed down to them from the Koch brothers and other like minded top earners, it lends both conservatives and their ludicrous economic policies legitimacy they do not deserve.
 

flacaltenn

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Look DeepOne:

I'm not a Repub or a Dem, but I'm also not "played like a puppet" by anyone at any corporation.. That's ridiculous to blame the sum total incompetentcy and corruption of Congress on Heinz Ketchup..

And the hand-raising incident that you cite is NOT just dogmatic spite. It reflects the serious reality that Congress has NEVER followed thru with the promised budget cuts after getting a tax hike or someother negiotiated benefit.

In fact, if you think back to the Budget continuation debate (not the more recent spending cap), even the Tea Partiers were suckered into believing that Congress was gonna cough up 60Bill in cuts. Now it appears it was more like 0.8Bill.

If the question had been phrased "would you support 10 to 1 IF -- the cuts were enacted and verified FIRST" -- you probably would have gotten different results. It's Charlie Brown and the football, not just partisian idiotcy...
 
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I just read an opinion on cnn.com I would like to share. Are Republicans at war with reality?
It’s a fairly enjoyable read mostly about the policies expressed by the G.O.P. hopefuls during Thursday’s debate. There is one small point I would disagree with the author on however. Are Republicans at war with reality? - CNN.com
In the op/ed, John Avlon writes: “The lowest moment for responsible governance occurred when all the candidates on stage raised their hands to say that they would reject a 10-to-1 spending cut to tax hike split as a deal to reduce the deficit. That is a sign of a party that is being held intellectually captive by its most extreme activist elements”.
Frankly I think everyone should be clear on this one point if nothing else, conservatives (both republican and teaparty) are being held “intellectually captive” by their billionaire puppet masters and the corporations who buy and sell politicians in Washington like cattle at a meat market. They didn’t care what the American people thought; I doubt they care what some activists think either (that is as long as fox news can keep conning people into voting for them).
I think when we sit here and pretend like conservative fiscal policies aren’t written by and handed down to them from the Koch brothers and other like minded top earners, it lends both conservatives and their ludicrous economic policies legitimacy they do not deserve.

Oh, good grief. Another idiot who whines about 'billionaire puppet masters' on one side, while giving the other a free pass.

Twit.
 
OP
deepthunk

deepthunk

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Oh joy... a new libtard mouth breather for the board. Goody!


Actually I’m neither liberal nor conservative, I’m a registered independent and my opinions reflect that. I’m not offended though, I have noticed some people are quick to label one as the opposition the moment ones opinions disagree with their own.
I have been known to criticize or support policies from either side, and I’m often labeled as a conservative when I disagree with liberal policies and a liberal when I disagree with conservatives. I suppose its just par for the course anytime one engages in political discussions.

 

Oldstyle

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I just read an opinion on cnn.com I would like to share. Are Republicans at war with reality?
It’s a fairly enjoyable read mostly about the policies expressed by the G.O.P. hopefuls during Thursday’s debate. There is one small point I would disagree with the author on however. Are Republicans at war with reality? - CNN.com
In the op/ed, John Avlon writes: “The lowest moment for responsible governance occurred when all the candidates on stage raised their hands to say that they would reject a 10-to-1 spending cut to tax hike split as a deal to reduce the deficit. That is a sign of a party that is being held intellectually captive by its most extreme activist elements”.
Frankly I think everyone should be clear on this one point if nothing else, conservatives (both republican and teaparty) are being held “intellectually captive” by their billionaire puppet masters and the corporations who buy and sell politicians in Washington like cattle at a meat market. They didn’t care what the American people thought; I doubt they care what some activists think either (that is as long as fox news can keep conning people into voting for them).
I think when we sit here and pretend like conservative fiscal policies aren’t written by and handed down to them from the Koch brothers and other like minded top earners, it lends both conservatives and their ludicrous economic policies legitimacy they do not deserve.

What economic policies of conservatives do you find "ludicrous"?
 
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deepthunk

deepthunk

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Look DeepOne:

I'm not a Repub or a Dem, but I'm also not "played like a puppet" by anyone at any corporation.. That's ridiculous to blame the sum total incompetentcy and corruption of Congress on Heinz Ketchup..

And the hand-raising incident that you cite is NOT just dogmatic spite. It reflects the serious reality that Congress has NEVER followed thru with the promised budget cuts after getting a tax hike or someother negiotiated benefit.

In fact, if you think back to the Budget continuation debate (not the more recent spending cap), even the Tea Partiers were suckered into believing that Congress was gonna cough up 60Bill in cuts. Now it appears it was more like 0.8Bill.

If the question had been phrased "would you support 10 to 1 IF -- the cuts were enacted and verified FIRST" -- you probably would have gotten different results. It's Charlie Brown and the football, not just partisian idiotcy...


I’m not trying to blame all the corruption on billionaire lobbying. However It is a fact that the super rich have been spending hundreds of millions on campaign donations with the vast majority going to conservatives, and conservative fiscal policy clearly shows this.
 

DiamondDave

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Yeah... someone claiming puppet masters and Fox working for Republican votes is a balanced independent :rolleyes:

Time will tell.. but I know exactly what I would place my money on for a bet on where this newbie's political affiliation sits
 

Two Thumbs

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Off hand, there is no instance, that I know of, where congress raised taxes and then followed through with the spending cuts.

And since the hopefull know this themselves, they wisely voted against the tax increase.


It was a loaded question with no right answer.

They either stoopidly said yes and the sheep bleated that they are unreasonable, or voted no and got shit on for saying they would raise taxes.

Take note, you fell for it and are spreading it.
 

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Look DeepOne:

I'm not a Repub or a Dem, but I'm also not "played like a puppet" by anyone at any corporation.. That's ridiculous to blame the sum total incompetentcy and corruption of Congress on Heinz Ketchup..

And the hand-raising incident that you cite is NOT just dogmatic spite. It reflects the serious reality that Congress has NEVER followed thru with the promised budget cuts after getting a tax hike or someother negiotiated benefit.

In fact, if you think back to the Budget continuation debate (not the more recent spending cap), even the Tea Partiers were suckered into believing that Congress was gonna cough up 60Bill in cuts. Now it appears it was more like 0.8Bill.

If the question had been phrased "would you support 10 to 1 IF -- the cuts were enacted and verified FIRST" -- you probably would have gotten different results. It's Charlie Brown and the football, not just partisian idiotcy...


I’m not trying to blame all the corruption on billionaire lobbying. However It is a fact that the super rich have been spending hundreds of millions on campaign donations with the vast majority going to conservatives, and conservative fiscal policy clearly shows this.

Then why do dem billionaires even exist?
 

toxicmedia

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Oh joy... a new libtard mouth breather for the board. Goody!


Actually I’m neither liberal nor conservative, I’m a registered independent and my opinions reflect that. I’m not offended though, I have noticed some people are quick to label one as the opposition the moment ones opinions disagree with their own.
I have been known to criticize or support policies from either side, and I’m often labeled as a conservative when I disagree with liberal policies and a liberal when I disagree with conservatives. I suppose its just par for the course anytime one engages in political discussions.

I get the same thing from the same haters who attacked you above. They can't imagine a conservative who thinks the Republican candidates we have to choose from are for the most part idiots. Guys like Pawlenty and Daniels just aren't angry and hsyterical enough for them.

The current GOP strategy is embarrasing, and the platform is hopelesslly monolithic.

Back in the 50's...there were moderates, and even liberals in the GOP, and the party was pretty secular. Ahh...the good old days of an actual big tent...now it seems like it's mostly just socially conservative Christian southerners and midwesterners. Not that that's a bad thing though.
 
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deepthunk

deepthunk

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I just read an opinion on cnn.com I would like to share. Are Republicans at war with reality?
It’s a fairly enjoyable read mostly about the policies expressed by the G.O.P. hopefuls during Thursday’s debate. There is one small point I would disagree with the author on however. Are Republicans at war with reality? - CNN.com
In the op/ed, John Avlon writes: “The lowest moment for responsible governance occurred when all the candidates on stage raised their hands to say that they would reject a 10-to-1 spending cut to tax hike split as a deal to reduce the deficit. That is a sign of a party that is being held intellectually captive by its most extreme activist elements”.
Frankly I think everyone should be clear on this one point if nothing else, conservatives (both republican and teaparty) are being held “intellectually captive” by their billionaire puppet masters and the corporations who buy and sell politicians in Washington like cattle at a meat market. They didn’t care what the American people thought; I doubt they care what some activists think either (that is as long as fox news can keep conning people into voting for them).
I think when we sit here and pretend like conservative fiscal policies aren’t written by and handed down to them from the Koch brothers and other like minded top earners, it lends both conservatives and their ludicrous economic policies legitimacy they do not deserve.

What economic policies of conservatives do you find "ludicrous"?


Now that is a reasonable post.
Specifically I think its incredible foolish to cut taxes when the country is running a minor budget surplus and then increase military spending dramatically so the country returns to an enormous deficit when the economy is strong, run that deficit for a decade, then when the economy is weak demand huge spending cuts while insisting on doing nothing to increase revenues.
The fact is the Bush administration should have maintained the budget surplus, but now that it’s too late we should at least wait until the economy is strong again to demand budget cuts. Furthermore, I think we should close some tax loopholes to require some of the 66% of corporations that pay no taxes, to pay some.

 

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Look DeepOne:

I'm not a Repub or a Dem, but I'm also not "played like a puppet" by anyone at any corporation.. That's ridiculous to blame the sum total incompetentcy and corruption of Congress on Heinz Ketchup..

And the hand-raising incident that you cite is NOT just dogmatic spite. It reflects the serious reality that Congress has NEVER followed thru with the promised budget cuts after getting a tax hike or someother negiotiated benefit.

In fact, if you think back to the Budget continuation debate (not the more recent spending cap), even the Tea Partiers were suckered into believing that Congress was gonna cough up 60Bill in cuts. Now it appears it was more like 0.8Bill.

If the question had been phrased "would you support 10 to 1 IF -- the cuts were enacted and verified FIRST" -- you probably would have gotten different results. It's Charlie Brown and the football, not just partisian idiotcy...


I’m not trying to blame all the corruption on billionaire lobbying. However It is a fact that the super rich have been spending hundreds of millions on campaign donations with the vast majority going to conservatives, and conservative fiscal policy clearly shows this.

Richest People in America are Democrats
Evil, Greedy CEOs Give Heavily to Democrats - Kevin Glass
Democrats Rake In Record Donations From Corporations - ABC News
Obama biggest recipient of BP cash - Erika Lovley - POLITICO.com
The Volokh Conspiracy - Corporations Give More Money to Democrats:
http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2010/07/02/high-tech-industry-gives-more-money-to-democrats

You were saying?
 
OP
deepthunk

deepthunk

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Oh joy... a new libtard mouth breather for the board. Goody!


Actually I’m neither liberal nor conservative, I’m a registered independent and my opinions reflect that. I’m not offended though, I have noticed some people are quick to label one as the opposition the moment ones opinions disagree with their own.
I have been known to criticize or support policies from either side, and I’m often labeled as a conservative when I disagree with liberal policies and a liberal when I disagree with conservatives. I suppose its just par for the course anytime one engages in political discussions.

I get the same thing from the same haters who attacked you above. They can't imagine a conservative who thinks the Republican candidates we have to choose from are for the most part idiots. Guys like Pawlenty and Daniels just aren't angry and hsyterical enough for them.

The current GOP strategy is embarrasing, and the platform is hopelesslly monlithic.

Back in the 50's...there were moderates, and even liberals in the GOP, and the party was pretty secular. Ahh...the good old days of an actual big tent...now it seems like it's mostly just socially conservative Christian southerners and midwesterners. Not that that's a bad thing though.


All true, of course liberals have their own brand of “vitriol” as well; I suppose it just shows how extremists have come to dominate the discussion on a national level.
You know, I have a funny little theory. If we could have a perfect democracy with totally free speech and zero partisanship where everyone has a chance to be heard and be given due consideration, then valuable and intelligent opinions and policies would be elevated while less valuable ones shrink to obscurity. The end result would be the cumulative intelligence of the entire nation becomes equal to the combined intelligence of every citizen; the result would be government would work well and the nation would prosper endlessly.
This is, of course, and unattainable perfect ideal. But while it may be impossible to attain a truly perfect democracy, we should always strive to because the closer we can come the more the country will benefit as a result.

 

Ernie S.

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Oh joy... a new libtard mouth breather for the board. Goody!


Actually I’m neither liberal nor conservative, I’m a registered independent and my opinions reflect that. I’m not offended though, I have noticed some people are quick to label one as the opposition the moment ones opinions disagree with their own.
I have been known to criticize or support policies from either side, and I’m often labeled as a conservative when I disagree with liberal policies and a liberal when I disagree with conservatives. I suppose its just par for the course anytime one engages in political discussions.

I'll reserve judgment until I see you critical of liberal policy. Until then, if it quacks like a duck......
 

DiamondDave

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I just read an opinion on cnn.com I would like to share. Are Republicans at war with reality?
It’s a fairly enjoyable read mostly about the policies expressed by the G.O.P. hopefuls during Thursday’s debate. There is one small point I would disagree with the author on however. Are Republicans at war with reality? - CNN.com
In the op/ed, John Avlon writes: “The lowest moment for responsible governance occurred when all the candidates on stage raised their hands to say that they would reject a 10-to-1 spending cut to tax hike split as a deal to reduce the deficit. That is a sign of a party that is being held intellectually captive by its most extreme activist elements”.
Frankly I think everyone should be clear on this one point if nothing else, conservatives (both republican and teaparty) are being held “intellectually captive” by their billionaire puppet masters and the corporations who buy and sell politicians in Washington like cattle at a meat market. They didn’t care what the American people thought; I doubt they care what some activists think either (that is as long as fox news can keep conning people into voting for them).
I think when we sit here and pretend like conservative fiscal policies aren’t written by and handed down to them from the Koch brothers and other like minded top earners, it lends both conservatives and their ludicrous economic policies legitimacy they do not deserve.

What economic policies of conservatives do you find "ludicrous"?


Now that is a reasonable post.
Specifically I think its incredible foolish to cut taxes when the country is running a minor budget surplus and then increase military spending dramatically so the country returns to an enormous deficit when the economy is strong, run that deficit for a decade, then when the economy is weak demand huge spending cuts while insisting on doing nothing to increase revenues.
The fact is the Bush administration should have maintained the budget surplus, but now that it’s too late we should at least wait until the economy is strong again to demand budget cuts. Furthermore, I think we should close some tax loopholes to require some of the 66% of corporations that pay no taxes, to pay some.


Yet you do not speak about the tax laws and loopholes that have ~50% of the citizenry that pay no federal income tax.... you do not speak about the fact that it is increased spending that is the major cause of the deficit increase, and not a revenue problem... not do you talk about the mythical surplus (please look at all govt spending inclusive of things outside what was published in the budget) and how military cuts to the point of hurting national defense and the military were a big part of the path that was taken to get there... you do not talk about which party was in charge of spending (I.E. congress) when things happened...

It is pretty evident, at least IMHO, where your 'political loyalty' sits
 

DiamondDave

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Actually I’m neither liberal nor conservative, I’m a registered independent and my opinions reflect that. I’m not offended though, I have noticed some people are quick to label one as the opposition the moment ones opinions disagree with their own.
I have been known to criticize or support policies from either side, and I’m often labeled as a conservative when I disagree with liberal policies and a liberal when I disagree with conservatives. I suppose its just par for the course anytime one engages in political discussions.

I get the same thing from the same haters who attacked you above. They can't imagine a conservative who thinks the Republican candidates we have to choose from are for the most part idiots. Guys like Pawlenty and Daniels just aren't angry and hsyterical enough for them.

The current GOP strategy is embarrasing, and the platform is hopelesslly monlithic.

Back in the 50's...there were moderates, and even liberals in the GOP, and the party was pretty secular. Ahh...the good old days of an actual big tent...now it seems like it's mostly just socially conservative Christian southerners and midwesterners. Not that that's a bad thing though.


All true, of course liberals have their own brand of “vitriol” as well; I suppose it just shows how extremists have come to dominate the discussion on a national level.
You know, I have a funny little theory. If we could have a perfect democracy with totally free speech and zero partisanship where everyone has a chance to be heard and be given due consideration, then valuable and intelligent opinions and policies would be elevated while less valuable ones shrink to obscurity. The end result would be the cumulative intelligence of the entire nation becomes equal to the combined intelligence of every citizen; the result would be government would work well and the nation would prosper endlessly.
This is, of course, and unattainable perfect ideal. But while it may be impossible to attain a truly perfect democracy, we should always strive to because the closer we can come the more the country will benefit as a result.


Democracy (I.E. tyranny of the masses, unchecked) is a perfect ideal?? Nah... I'll stick with a constitutional republic over that, every time
 

toxicmedia

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Look DeepOne:

I'm not a Repub or a Dem, but I'm also not "played like a puppet" by anyone at any corporation.. That's ridiculous to blame the sum total incompetentcy and corruption of Congress on Heinz Ketchup..

And the hand-raising incident that you cite is NOT just dogmatic spite. It reflects the serious reality that Congress has NEVER followed thru with the promised budget cuts after getting a tax hike or someother negiotiated benefit.

In fact, if you think back to the Budget continuation debate (not the more recent spending cap), even the Tea Partiers were suckered into believing that Congress was gonna cough up 60Bill in cuts. Now it appears it was more like 0.8Bill.

If the question had been phrased "would you support 10 to 1 IF -- the cuts were enacted and verified FIRST" -- you probably would have gotten different results. It's Charlie Brown and the football, not just partisian idiotcy...


I’m not trying to blame all the corruption on billionaire lobbying. However It is a fact that the super rich have been spending hundreds of millions on campaign donations with the vast majority going to conservatives, and conservative fiscal policy clearly shows this.

Richest People in America are Democrats
Evil, Greedy CEOs Give Heavily to Democrats - Kevin Glass
Democrats Rake In Record Donations From Corporations - ABC News
Obama biggest recipient of BP cash - Erika Lovley - POLITICO.com
The Volokh Conspiracy - Corporations Give More Money to Democrats:
High Tech Industry Gives More Money to Democrats - US News and World Report

You were saying?
You have really got to stop gooling without reading the links you drag in here.

The New American Gazette?...Townhall.com?....The Volokh Conspiracy!!??

Your BP article is talking about contributions over the last 20 years!...and high tech companies are mostly in blue states who have Democrats in office.
 

toxicmedia

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I get the same thing from the same haters who attacked you above. They can't imagine a conservative who thinks the Republican candidates we have to choose from are for the most part idiots. Guys like Pawlenty and Daniels just aren't angry and hsyterical enough for them.

The current GOP strategy is embarrasing, and the platform is hopelesslly monlithic.

Back in the 50's...there were moderates, and even liberals in the GOP, and the party was pretty secular. Ahh...the good old days of an actual big tent...now it seems like it's mostly just socially conservative Christian southerners and midwesterners. Not that that's a bad thing though.


All true, of course liberals have their own brand of “vitriol” as well; I suppose it just shows how extremists have come to dominate the discussion on a national level.
You know, I have a funny little theory. If we could have a perfect democracy with totally free speech and zero partisanship where everyone has a chance to be heard and be given due consideration, then valuable and intelligent opinions and policies would be elevated while less valuable ones shrink to obscurity. The end result would be the cumulative intelligence of the entire nation becomes equal to the combined intelligence of every citizen; the result would be government would work well and the nation would prosper endlessly.
This is, of course, and unattainable perfect ideal. But while it may be impossible to attain a truly perfect democracy, we should always strive to because the closer we can come the more the country will benefit as a result.


Democracy (I.E. tyranny of the masses, unchecked) is a perfect ideal?? Nah... I'll stick with a constitutional republic over that, every time
Right...because the tyranny of the minority is a great thing. Just look at Wisconsin...the Republicans won!...so they should get to be able to pass the laws they want, even if they are the majority. Do you think that situation is an example of the tyranny of the masses?
 
OP
deepthunk

deepthunk

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Oh joy... a new libtard mouth breather for the board. Goody!


Actually I’m neither liberal nor conservative, I’m a registered independent and my opinions reflect that. I’m not offended though, I have noticed some people are quick to label one as the opposition the moment ones opinions disagree with their own.
I have been known to criticize or support policies from either side, and I’m often labeled as a conservative when I disagree with liberal policies and a liberal when I disagree with conservatives. I suppose its just par for the course anytime one engages in political discussions.

I'll reserve judgment until I see you critical of liberal policy. Until then, if it quacks like a duck......


The health care law commonly referred too as Obama care is an area I can certainly criticize.This Health care law is a excellent example of democrats being simply wrong and deserving of criticism.
When President Obama was running for office what he promised us was Universal health care. I (like most everyone else) took this to mean a British type health care system where the sick simply walk into a doctor’s office or hospital and receive treatment.
What we got once he was elected was mandatory health insurance, a bill designed to hand millions of new customers to the health insurance corporations. This Health care law does NOTHING to reform the brutal health care system, but instead forces working class people (under threat of monetary penalty, and possibly worse) to buy health insurance they cannot afford. Furthermore the people deciding if said working class people can afford said insurance will be the heartless, overpaid, and under worked bureaucrats that work for the IRS, not the working people who have to balance their own budget and pay the bills.
Several times now I have heard the left try to justify this law by comparing it to mandatory auto insurance (in fact they have used some vary tricky word-plays to try and justify that position), however this is not a valid analogy. The simple fact is you have a choice in whether or not you own or operate a motor vehicle, that choice is usually made based on whether or not one can afford the cost and the mandatory insurance is the most significant part of that cost. Since liberals haven’t seemed to notice, there are allot of people who ride the bus because they can’t afford a car.
Unlike a car, people don’t have a choice in whether or not they live. To try and force people to pay for insanely expense health insurance that they clearly can’t afford is even more cruel and heartless than taking away the basic minimum state health care that has been keeping some people alive.
There is no mistaking that washington liberals have betrayed working class americans this time, in fact they have out right cut our throughts for the sake of money from the health insurance lobby and that’s a fundamental betrayal of every working class person who voted for them.
 

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