Christianity in a Nutshell

[ding]

Revelations is about the end of the Roman Empire, not the end of days.

It isn't about the end of the Roman empire.. its about the end of Temple Judaism. The Roman empire ended in the late summer of 476 AD..

Fundamentalist and mainstream Christians make up their own eschatology, disregarding the timelines. If the events of Revelation and the Olivet Discourse occurred in AD 70, then Bible prophecy regarding Rome falls short by 300 years. If those events have not yet happened, then prophecies regarding Rome were overshot by 1500 years.

Most Christians just don't think critically, so they cannot articulate Christianity.

You are assuming revelations is more than it is. Rome wasn't built in a day and Rome did not fall in a day. But Rome did fall.

 

[norwegen]

Well, no.. Revelation is disputed as to when it was written. Some scholars say 75 AD. some say 90 AD. Its pretty certain the Temple was already destroyed.

John the revelator was exiled to Patmos and most of it he's writing to the 7 Churches of Anatolia and the Med.

This is another example of the failure of Christians to think critically. The Revelator sent his vision to seven churches in Asia in the first century, yet they believe the Revelator was actually addressing people in the distant future.

Then they call it "code."

 

[ding]

Revelations is about the end of the Roman Empire, not the end of days.

It isn't about the end of the Roman empire.. its about the end of Temple Judaism. The Roman empire ended in the late summer of 476 AD..

At the time it was written it was not describing the fall, it was predicting the fall.

Which is why they used code words. Because they were still being occupied and could not come right and speak against the roman empire.

Well, no.. Revelation is disputed as to when it was written. Some scholars say 75 AD. some say 90 AD. Its pretty certain the Temple was already destroyed.

John the revelator was exiled to Patmos and most of it he's writing to the 7 Churches of Anatolia and the Med.

Again... I'm not saying Revelations is about the fall of a temple and neither is the link I provided from PBS. I am saying revelations is about the fall of the roman empire. So whether it was written in 75 or 90AD is irrelevant.

 

[norwegen]

Revelations is about the end of the Roman Empire, not the end of days.

It isn't about the end of the Roman empire.. its about the end of Temple Judaism. The Roman empire ended in the late summer of 476 AD..

Fundamentalist and mainstream Christians make up their own eschatology, disregarding the timelines. If the events of Revelation and the Olivet Discourse occurred in AD 70, then Bible prophecy regarding Rome falls short by 300 years. If those events have not yet happened, then prophecies regarding Rome were overshot by 1500 years.

Most Christians just don't think critically, so they cannot articulate Christianity.

" then Bible prophecy regarding Rome falls short by 300 years.".... I'm confused.

Oh, my mistake (government schooling). 400 years. AD 70 is 400 years short of 476.

 

[ding]

Well, no.. Revelation is disputed as to when it was written. Some scholars say 75 AD. some say 90 AD. Its pretty certain the Temple was already destroyed.

John the revelator was exiled to Patmos and most of it he's writing to the 7 Churches of Anatolia and the Med.

This is another example of the failure of Christians to think critically. The Revelator sent his vision to seven churches in Asia in the first century, yet they believe the Revelator was actually addressing people in the distant future.

Then they call it "code."

The extreme symbology used in Revelations or CODE was because they were still occupied by romans when it was written. They had to use that unusual and extreme symbology. So if you can't understand why revelations was written with such extreme symbology than any other book, you are the one devoid of critical thinking.

 

[surada]

Revelations is about the end of the Roman Empire, not the end of days.

It isn't about the end of the Roman empire.. its about the end of Temple Judaism. The Roman empire ended in the late summer of 476 AD..

At the time it was written it was not describing the fall, it was predicting the fall.

Which is why they used code words. Because they were still being occupied and could not come right and speak against the roman empire.

Well, no.. Revelation is disputed as to when it was written. Some scholars say 75 AD. some say 90 AD. Its pretty certain the Temple was already destroyed.

John the revelator was exiled to Patmos and most of it he's writing to the 7 Churches of Anatolia and the Med.

Again... I'm not saying Revelations is about the fall of a temple and neither is the link I provided from PBS. I am saying revelations is about the fall of the roman empire. So whether it was written in 75 or 90AD is irrelevant.

I missed your PBS link which I would love to read. Revelation is NOT about the fall of the Roman Empire. What text makes you think so?

 

[ding]

Revelations is about the end of the Roman Empire, not the end of days.

It isn't about the end of the Roman empire.. its about the end of Temple Judaism. The Roman empire ended in the late summer of 476 AD..

Fundamentalist and mainstream Christians make up their own eschatology, disregarding the timelines. If the events of Revelation and the Olivet Discourse occurred in AD 70, then Bible prophecy regarding Rome falls short by 300 years. If those events have not yet happened, then prophecies regarding Rome were overshot by 1500 years.

Most Christians just don't think critically, so they cannot articulate Christianity.

" then Bible prophecy regarding Rome falls short by 300 years.".... I'm confused.

Oh, my mistake (government schooling). 400 years. AD 70 is 400 years short of 476.

Again... rome was not built in a day and rome did not fall in a day.

 

[ding]

Revelations is about the end of the Roman Empire, not the end of days.

It isn't about the end of the Roman empire.. its about the end of Temple Judaism. The Roman empire ended in the late summer of 476 AD..

At the time it was written it was not describing the fall, it was predicting the fall.

Which is why they used code words. Because they were still being occupied and could not come right and speak against the roman empire.

Well, no.. Revelation is disputed as to when it was written. Some scholars say 75 AD. some say 90 AD. Its pretty certain the Temple was already destroyed.

John the revelator was exiled to Patmos and most of it he's writing to the 7 Churches of Anatolia and the Med.

Again... I'm not saying Revelations is about the fall of a temple and neither is the link I provided from PBS. I am saying revelations is about the fall of the roman empire. So whether it was written in 75 or 90AD is irrelevant.

I missed your PBS link which I would love to read. Revelation is NOT about the fall of the Roman Empire. What text makes you think so?

Book Of Revelation | Apocalypse! FRONTLINE | PBS

 

[surada]

Well, no.. Revelation is disputed as to when it was written. Some scholars say 75 AD. some say 90 AD. Its pretty certain the Temple was already destroyed.

John the revelator was exiled to Patmos and most of it he's writing to the 7 Churches of Anatolia and the Med.

This is another example of the failure of Christians to think critically. The Revelator sent his vision to seven churches in Asia in the first century, yet they believe the Revelator was actually addressing people in the distant future.

Then they call it "code."

Revelation was about the first century A.D.

 

[norwegen]

Well, no.. Revelation is disputed as to when it was written. Some scholars say 75 AD. some say 90 AD. Its pretty certain the Temple was already destroyed.

John the revelator was exiled to Patmos and most of it he's writing to the 7 Churches of Anatolia and the Med.

This is another example of the failure of Christians to think critically. The Revelator sent his vision to seven churches in Asia in the first century, yet they believe the Revelator was actually addressing people in the distant future.

Then they call it "code."

The extreme symbology used in Revelations or CODE was because they were still occupied by romans when it was written. They had to use that unusual and extreme symbology. So if you can't understand why revelations was written with such extreme symbology than any other book, you are the one devoid of critical thinking.

Oh, goody, I'm arguing with ding again, the man who knows what Revelation (singular) is about, yet insists that it's in code.

 

[norwegen]

Well, no.. Revelation is disputed as to when it was written. Some scholars say 75 AD. some say 90 AD. Its pretty certain the Temple was already destroyed.

John the revelator was exiled to Patmos and most of it he's writing to the 7 Churches of Anatolia and the Med.

This is another example of the failure of Christians to think critically. The Revelator sent his vision to seven churches in Asia in the first century, yet they believe the Revelator was actually addressing people in the distant future.

Then they call it "code."

Revelation was about the first century A.D.

Yes.

Why are you arguing with me when I already know that?

 

[ding]

Well, no.. Revelation is disputed as to when it was written. Some scholars say 75 AD. some say 90 AD. Its pretty certain the Temple was already destroyed.

John the revelator was exiled to Patmos and most of it he's writing to the 7 Churches of Anatolia and the Med.

This is another example of the failure of Christians to think critically. The Revelator sent his vision to seven churches in Asia in the first century, yet they believe the Revelator was actually addressing people in the distant future.

Then they call it "code."

The extreme symbology used in Revelations or CODE was because they were still occupied by romans when it was written. They had to use that unusual and extreme symbology. So if you can't understand why revelations was written with such extreme symbology than any other book, you are the one devoid of critical thinking.

Oh, goody, I'm arguing with ding again, the man who knows what Revelation (singular) is about, yet insists that it's in code.

Good Lord, you sure are harping on one word. It should be obvious to everyone that revelations stands out from the other books of the NT because of its unusual and extreme use of symbolism. It's like no other book in the NT. The reason for this is because it would have been seditious to discuss the fall of the roman empire while rome was occupying and in control of those lands.

And I am not sharing with you my opinions. I am sharing with you the opinions of experts who I am almost certain know more than you.

Lastly, if you judge the content of my posts on anything other than the content of my posts, then that's on you, not me.

 

[emilynghiem]

What makes religion logical? Not much, generally speaking, in my opinion. I profess Christianity, then, not only for my personal experience through conversion, but also because it actually exhibits a certain logic, or historical and cultural cohesion.

In short, the Bible is history from ancient Israel’s perspective, which includes her prehistory as Adam (mankind) who roamed the wilderness for some 800 years or so without the God they once knew. Then ethnic Israel’s history begins with their patriarchs and their attempts to reconcile with God in their attempts at obedience (tabernacle, law, and a misguided devotion to ethnic progeny). This history ends with the destruction of the temple and hence the Law and any self-imposed rights to territory (detailed in the gospels, epistles, and the Apocalypse).

That’s it, really. That’s the Bible. Historically and culturally verifiable (generally speaking). And then comes Christianity, the seeds of which were planted in ethnic Israel’s eschaton. This new "heavenly" Israel, in its way, brings back to life the spiritual underpinnings that God initiated in the Garden. And it also correlates with history in its growth and its vision that government would rest on Christ's shoulders.

Like a fig tree in springtime, and indeed all trees in that season, the church was sprouting green shoots, but after the fall of the cult of temple, summer would come; the empire of the saints and their king would blossom, and eventually, in a most glorious and unstoppable way, would spread its branches throughout the world. Jesus knew this would begin to happen and happen soon—in his generation:

Look at the fig tree, and all the trees. As soon as they come out in leaf, you see for yourselves and know that the summer is already near. So also, when you see these things taking place, you know that the kingdom of God is near. Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all has taken place. (Lk 21:29b-32).​

The historical accuracy of ethnic Israel’s prophecies really are kind of hard to deny. Just my two cents.

Ultimately norwegen
It has to make sense and ring true to the person to be their real beliefs and faith.
It has to make sense to them, as it has to make sense to us.

Religions are like languages for the laws.

So the purpose is to match the right terms, concepts and approaches to what people naturally follow as their native inborn language.

If one narrative doesn't work, we need to find and focus on what does to communicate with each person or group by their culture or tribal tongue.

Not all things are going to make sense to the same people. How Theists and Nontheists express truth are radically different and lose the other audience. Liberals and Conservatives don't define Govt the same way either, and may require separate administrations to manage both areas, like Protestants and Catholics under separate jurisdiction.

What is universal is love of truth, justice and peace. Everyone I know responds to these.

The difference is how we express these and our experiences we use as the framework.

Not all instruments in the orchestra play the same music in the same key. We are different for a reason, but if we all stick to our part, we can harmonize and still produce the symphony as designed.

Our parts may not make sense to each other. But the whole being greater than the sum of the parts is still perfect.

 

[surada]

Revelations is about the end of the Roman Empire, not the end of days.

It isn't about the end of the Roman empire.. its about the end of Temple Judaism. The Roman empire ended in the late summer of 476 AD..

At the time it was written it was not describing the fall, it was predicting the fall.

Which is why they used code words. Because they were still being occupied and could not come right and speak against the roman empire.

Well, no.. Revelation is disputed as to when it was written. Some scholars say 75 AD. some say 90 AD. Its pretty certain the Temple was already destroyed.

John the revelator was exiled to Patmos and most of it he's writing to the 7 Churches of Anatolia and the Med.

Again... I'm not saying Revelations is about the fall of a temple and neither is the link I provided from PBS. I am saying revelations is about the fall of the roman empire. So whether it was written in 75 or 90AD is irrelevant.

I missed your PBS link which I would love to read. Revelation is NOT about the fall of the Roman Empire. What text makes you think so?

Book Of Revelation | Apocalypse! FRONTLINE | PBS

Thank you.. Very good read. The only criticism I have is that I don't see how Rome could possibly be the Whore of Babylon. Babylon had no influence on Rome and it seems to defy scripture that repeatedly speaks of Israel whoring after false gods. Plus, Jerusalem has seven hills.

This is one of the best explanations of Scofield's influence I have seen:

The most popular has been that of John Nelson Darby (1800-1882), which is known as Dispensationalism, a view made popular in England and America in the early XXth century through the publication of Cyrus Scofield (1843-1921).

First published in 1909, it came to be known as The Scofield Reference Bible. On each page it printed the King James translation of 1611 alongside of Scofield's own copious "notes" on how to read each passage of the Bible in conjunction with other "prophecies." It thus provided a chainlink interreferencing system to the Book of Revelation, by which one could jump from passage to passage to follow the "true" meaning.

The Scofield Bible continued to be popular among certain Protestant Christian groups. From 1909 to 1967 it sold more than 10 million copies; reprinted in 1967, it is said to have sold another 2.5 million copies by 1990. More than any other "future history" interpretation, this one has had the most impact on current literalist interpretations of Revelation.

 

[surada]

Well, no.. Revelation is disputed as to when it was written. Some scholars say 75 AD. some say 90 AD. Its pretty certain the Temple was already destroyed.

John the revelator was exiled to Patmos and most of it he's writing to the 7 Churches of Anatolia and the Med.

This is another example of the failure of Christians to think critically. The Revelator sent his vision to seven churches in Asia in the first century, yet they believe the Revelator was actually addressing people in the distant future.

Then they call it "code."

The extreme symbology used in Revelations or CODE was because they were still occupied by romans when it was written. They had to use that unusual and extreme symbology. So if you can't understand why revelations was written with such extreme symbology than any other book, you are the one devoid of critical thinking.

Oh, goody, I'm arguing with ding again, the man who knows what Revelation (singular) is about, yet insists that it's in code.

Good Lord, you sure are harping on one word. It should be obvious to everyone that revelations stands out from the other books of the NT because of its unusual and extreme use of symbolism. It's like no other book in the NT. The reason for this is because it would have been seditious to discuss the fall of the roman empire while rome was occupying and in control of those lands.

And I am not sharing with you my opinions. I am sharing with you the opinions of experts who I am almost certain know more than you.

Lastly, if you judge the content of my posts on anything other than the content of my posts, then that's on you, not me.

Apocalyptic literature was VERY popular for about 300 years and many apocalypses were written ( I'll post a link) I disagree that it was written in code. The people of the first century understood the symbolism perfectly. We don't because we don't study historical context.

 

[surada]

Early Christian Writings: New Testament, Apocrypha, Gnostics, Church Fathers

earlychristianwritings.com

You can find the Apocalypses of James and Paul and Adam above.

 

[ding]

Well, no.. Revelation is disputed as to when it was written. Some scholars say 75 AD. some say 90 AD. Its pretty certain the Temple was already destroyed.

John the revelator was exiled to Patmos and most of it he's writing to the 7 Churches of Anatolia and the Med.

This is another example of the failure of Christians to think critically. The Revelator sent his vision to seven churches in Asia in the first century, yet they believe the Revelator was actually addressing people in the distant future.

Then they call it "code."

The extreme symbology used in Revelations or CODE was because they were still occupied by romans when it was written. They had to use that unusual and extreme symbology. So if you can't understand why revelations was written with such extreme symbology than any other book, you are the one devoid of critical thinking.

Oh, goody, I'm arguing with ding again, the man who knows what Revelation (singular) is about, yet insists that it's in code.

Good Lord, you sure are harping on one word. It should be obvious to everyone that revelations stands out from the other books of the NT because of its unusual and extreme use of symbolism. It's like no other book in the NT. The reason for this is because it would have been seditious to discuss the fall of the roman empire while rome was occupying and in control of those lands.

And I am not sharing with you my opinions. I am sharing with you the opinions of experts who I am almost certain know more than you.

Lastly, if you judge the content of my posts on anything other than the content of my posts, then that's on you, not me.

Apocalyptic literature was VERY popular for about 300 years and many apocalypses were written ( I'll post a link) I disagree that it was written in code. The people of the first century understood the symbolism perfectly. We don't because we don't study historical context.

Maybe code was a bad choice of words. They chose their words to conceal talk of sedition.

 

[surada]

Well, no.. Revelation is disputed as to when it was written. Some scholars say 75 AD. some say 90 AD. Its pretty certain the Temple was already destroyed.

John the revelator was exiled to Patmos and most of it he's writing to the 7 Churches of Anatolia and the Med.

This is another example of the failure of Christians to think critically. The Revelator sent his vision to seven churches in Asia in the first century, yet they believe the Revelator was actually addressing people in the distant future.

Then they call it "code."

The extreme symbology used in Revelations or CODE was because they were still occupied by romans when it was written. They had to use that unusual and extreme symbology. So if you can't understand why revelations was written with such extreme symbology than any other book, you are the one devoid of critical thinking.

Oh, goody, I'm arguing with ding again, the man who knows what Revelation (singular) is about, yet insists that it's in code.

Good Lord, you sure are harping on one word. It should be obvious to everyone that revelations stands out from the other books of the NT because of its unusual and extreme use of symbolism. It's like no other book in the NT. The reason for this is because it would have been seditious to discuss the fall of the roman empire while rome was occupying and in control of those lands.

And I am not sharing with you my opinions. I am sharing with you the opinions of experts who I am almost certain know more than you.

Lastly, if you judge the content of my posts on anything other than the content of my posts, then that's on you, not me.

Apocalyptic literature was VERY popular for about 300 years and many apocalypses were written ( I'll post a link) I disagree that it was written in code. The people of the first century understood the symbolism perfectly. We don't because we don't study historical context.

Maybe code was a bad choice of words. They chose their words to conceal talk of sedition.

I think it was written to encourage the new Christians... to comfort them. That Nero and Domitian would be defeated by the truth of the word.

 

[ding]

Well, no.. Revelation is disputed as to when it was written. Some scholars say 75 AD. some say 90 AD. Its pretty certain the Temple was already destroyed.

John the revelator was exiled to Patmos and most of it he's writing to the 7 Churches of Anatolia and the Med.

This is another example of the failure of Christians to think critically. The Revelator sent his vision to seven churches in Asia in the first century, yet they believe the Revelator was actually addressing people in the distant future.

Then they call it "code."

The extreme symbology used in Revelations or CODE was because they were still occupied by romans when it was written. They had to use that unusual and extreme symbology. So if you can't understand why revelations was written with such extreme symbology than any other book, you are the one devoid of critical thinking.

Oh, goody, I'm arguing with ding again, the man who knows what Revelation (singular) is about, yet insists that it's in code.

Good Lord, you sure are harping on one word. It should be obvious to everyone that revelations stands out from the other books of the NT because of its unusual and extreme use of symbolism. It's like no other book in the NT. The reason for this is because it would have been seditious to discuss the fall of the roman empire while rome was occupying and in control of those lands.

And I am not sharing with you my opinions. I am sharing with you the opinions of experts who I am almost certain know more than you.

Lastly, if you judge the content of my posts on anything other than the content of my posts, then that's on you, not me.

Apocalyptic literature was VERY popular for about 300 years and many apocalypses were written ( I'll post a link) I disagree that it was written in code. The people of the first century understood the symbolism perfectly. We don't because we don't study historical context.

Maybe code was a bad choice of words. They chose their words to conceal talk of sedition.

I think it was written to encourage the new Christians... to comfort them. That Nero and Domitian would be defeated by the truth of the word.

That sounds reasonable. But it certainly isn't about end times.

 

[ding]

Early Christian Writings: New Testament, Apocrypha, Gnostics, Church Fathers

earlychristianwritings.com

You can find the Apocalypses of James and Paul and Adam above.

Here is a good discussion on the early Christians.

The Diversity Of Early Christianity | From Jesus To Christ - The First Christians | FRONTLINE | PBS

www.pbs.org