CDZ Chaos By the Bay

[YoursTruly]

And yet we open the border to thousands more homeless and support them more than our own citizens.

I'd take in a homeless family straight in from Mexico a lot faster than these homeless druggy Americans.

I don't want either one, but I would rather see my tax dollars spent on Americans than $82M spent on putting illegals up in hotels and turning barracks meant for American GIs into homes for illegals.

If you had the slightest idea on what is most cost effective, you would bite your tongue and feel shame about your lack of understanding.

I'm getting alerts saying someone quoted me. When I'm not actually getting quoted. It's someone else that quoted someone else that quoted me.

 

[AZrailwhale]

I don't think there is a an immediate fix- if you do, lets talk about it.

We need to reorder the social system, and that is the government chartering system.

That task should be left to the state governments. The big problem with that is they would need federal funding. With federal funding comes some measure of federal control.

You, and the rest of your fellow Amlericans are already off on a tangent that will take you further away from any possible answers.

How's this for a possible start, even though it may come across as an exaggeration:

Release a full half of America's prison population, with no emphasis on any of the crimes committed.
Then spend 1.9T on rehabilitating them.

And so even though it would be absolutely impossible in America, it' already been proven to be very symbolic of Norway's huge success.

And then so, if America can't accept the facts then it becomes just one more example of why America will inevitably fail.

I rule out war for America's course in it's search for betterment because of the M.A.D. factor.

Many could see it as the M.A.D. factor's influence coming to fruition over the last 75 years in which America needed to turn to 40 smaller scale conflicts for it's perceived gains. But each and every one of those wars has failed to pay off. Even the more hopeful have resulted in none of the desired control over ME oil resources. China and Russia are spiriting that prize away by making friends!

You can’t rehabilitate people who think it’s better to steal than work. That’s the basis for criminal behavior right there. The only way to prevent people becoming criminals is to make the results of criminality a lot worse than the results of working.

 

[ClaireH]

View attachment 473528

Currently people can only be helped if they choose to be helped.

The policy right now is they have rights and to allow what some consider criminal acts to occur without repercussions.

There is nothing that can be done without a loss of rights to the individuals it directly affects.

*****SMILE*****

There is a time when someone’s individual rights should be compromised: when public safety is at risk. Obviously, throwing more money at the growing homeless situation is not going to help improve things or it would have produced positive change by now, nor does a day or two in jail (they still get drugs so it’s just a temporary change of address for homeless drug addicts) when what they need is a hand up to better their lives. As depicted in the OP’s video, this hand up to help started with police intervention, whose primary duty is to keep people safe from crime. As I said, jail time isn’t what helps drug addicts and certainly not drug addicts with mental illnesses, but if the arrest process were to direct these individuals to get some actual help it could be (and has proven to be) a workable solution.

You’re right though DE, a person has got to want the help to accept it.

 

[Concerned American]

View attachment 473528

Currently people can only be helped if they choose to be helped.

The policy right now is they have rights and to allow what some consider criminal acts to occur without repercussions.

There is nothing that can be done without a loss of rights to the individuals it directly affects.

*****SMILE*****

There is a time when someone’s individual rights should be compromised: when public safety is at risk. Obviously, throwing more money at the growing homeless situation is not going to help improve things or it would have produced positive change by now, nor does a day or two in jail (they still get drugs so it’s just a temporary change of address for homeless drug addicts) when what they need is a hand up to better their lives. As depicted in the OP’s video, this hand up to help started with police intervention, whose primary duty is to keep people safe from crime. As I said, jail time isn’t what helps drug addicts and certainly not drug addicts with mental illnesses, but if the arrest process were to direct these individuals to get some actual help it could be (and has proven to be) a workable solution.

You’re right though DE, a person has got to want the help to accept it.

Since they have decriminalized all dangerous drugs, I don't see a government/social solution. What I do see happening is natural selection. The users who have self control will survive and those who don't, will not. Life is hard, it is harder when you're stupid.

 

[Damaged Eagle]

View attachment 473528

Currently people can only be helped if they choose to be helped.

The policy right now is they have rights and to allow what some consider criminal acts to occur without repercussions.

There is nothing that can be done without a loss of rights to the individuals it directly affects.

*****SMILE*****

There is a time when someone’s individual rights should be compromised: when public safety is at risk. Obviously, throwing more money at the growing homeless situation is not going to help improve things or it would have produced positive change by now, nor does a day or two in jail (they still get drugs so it’s just a temporary change of address for homeless drug addicts) when what they need is a hand up to better their lives. As depicted in the OP’s video, this hand up to help started with police intervention, whose primary duty is to keep people safe from crime. As I said, jail time isn’t what helps drug addicts and certainly not drug addicts with mental illnesses, but if the arrest process were to direct these individuals to get some actual help it could be (and has proven to be) a workable solution.

You’re right though DE, a person has got to want the help to accept it.

Since they have decriminalized all dangerous drugs, I don't see a government/social solution. What I do see happening is natural selection. The users who have self control will survive and those who don't, will not. Life is hard, it is harder when you're stupid.

Short of leaving them be there isn't much that can be done at this time.

*****SMILE*****

 

[EvilCat Breath]

Will Trump's election in 2024 be enough for you to pick up weapons and fight for communism?

No, if you're thinking that Canadians would fight as mercenaries against a future Trump fascist regime.
And to speculate on the democracies taking up arms to defeat a fasxist US regime, wouldn't be wise right at the moment.

But mostly, I would bet money on Trump not being the fascist leader of choice for the US. He doesn't have much of what it would take to convince the American people that it's not the very wealthy in America who are the enemy of the people.

Trump likely just accidentally copied some of Hitler's tactics, and likely didn't really understand what he was doing.

Of course he did nearly all of what he did to serve his own vanity and his money interests..

We'll see what the future brings. Biden's big gift was a one-timer and can never cure that which ails the failed American way of greedy capitalism.

In other words
Waaaa anyone I don't like is Hitler.

 

[EvilCat Breath]

View attachment 473528

Currently people can only be helped if they choose to be helped.

The policy right now is they have rights and to allow what some consider criminal acts to occur without repercussions.

There is nothing that can be done without a loss of rights to the individuals it directly affects.

*****SMILE*****

There is a time when someone’s individual rights should be compromised: when public safety is at risk. Obviously, throwing more money at the growing homeless situation is not going to help improve things or it would have produced positive change by now, nor does a day or two in jail (they still get drugs so it’s just a temporary change of address for homeless drug addicts) when what they need is a hand up to better their lives. As depicted in the OP’s video, this hand up to help started with police intervention, whose primary duty is to keep people safe from crime. As I said, jail time isn’t what helps drug addicts and certainly not drug addicts with mental illnesses, but if the arrest process were to direct these individuals to get some actual help it could be (and has proven to be) a workable solution.

You’re right though DE, a person has got to want the help to accept it.

There is no help. In a backhand way the Chinese\Mexican fentanyl alliance is the only workable solution. Allow the homeless to overdose.

 

[Mac-7]

My Nextdoor group has a chronic thread jumping conversation on homeless policy. I've had to stop participating because I am so sick of being called a racist whitey because I think homelessness is a public health crisis.

Liberals get angry when confronted with conservative logic and common sense because they sense you are right

 

[Mac-7]

There is no help. In a backhand way the Chinese\Mexican fentanyl alliance is the only workable solution. Allow the homeless to overdose.

Those people are beyond help

we should convert Alcatraz into a hospital and send the homeless drug addicts there away from the rest of society

 

[asaratis]

View attachment 473528

Currently people can only be helped if they choose to be helped.

The policy right now is they have rights and to allow what some consider criminal acts to occur without repercussions.

There is nothing that can be done without a loss of rights to the individuals it directly affects.

*****SMILE*****

There is a time when someone’s individual rights should be compromised: when public safety is at risk. Obviously, throwing more money at the growing homeless situation is not going to help improve things or it would have produced positive change by now, nor does a day or two in jail (they still get drugs so it’s just a temporary change of address for homeless drug addicts) when what they need is a hand up to better their lives. As depicted in the OP’s video, this hand up to help started with police intervention, whose primary duty is to keep people safe from crime. As I said, jail time isn’t what helps drug addicts and certainly not drug addicts with mental illnesses, but if the arrest process were to direct these individuals to get some actual help it could be (and has proven to be) a workable solution.

You’re right though DE, a person has got to want the help to accept it.

Perhaps the professional help should be forced upon them.

 

[asaratis]

View attachment 473528

Currently people can only be helped if they choose to be helped.

The policy right now is they have rights and to allow what some consider criminal acts to occur without repercussions.

There is nothing that can be done without a loss of rights to the individuals it directly affects.

*****SMILE*****

There is a time when someone’s individual rights should be compromised: when public safety is at risk. Obviously, throwing more money at the growing homeless situation is not going to help improve things or it would have produced positive change by now, nor does a day or two in jail (they still get drugs so it’s just a temporary change of address for homeless drug addicts) when what they need is a hand up to better their lives. As depicted in the OP’s video, this hand up to help started with police intervention, whose primary duty is to keep people safe from crime. As I said, jail time isn’t what helps drug addicts and certainly not drug addicts with mental illnesses, but if the arrest process were to direct these individuals to get some actual help it could be (and has proven to be) a workable solution.

You’re right though DE, a person has got to want the help to accept it.

Since they have decriminalized all dangerous drugs, I don't see a government/social solution. What I do see happening is natural selection. The users who have self control will survive and those who don't, will not. Life is hard, it is harder when you're stupid.

One is stupid to take the first hit of meth. It is highly additive, more so than heroine, I've read. Decriminalizing all drugs was a STUPID move that entrapped thousands of today's addicts.

 

[Gdjjr]

So, there is no quick fix- only arguments about who, or what, or where, the fault is-

What we see happening, is a real crisis- not a hoax as so many other crises are. To me, the obvious question is why people turn to drugs in the first place?

There's way too much information readily available to not be able to see and make an informed decision. Yet they do. Why? Too easy to get? Not stiff enough penalties? I think it goes way deeper than that- way deeper. There will lie the answer- anybody can figure out how- knowing why puts you a step ahead of everyone else. And the answer won't be a quick fix. This didn't happen over night and it won't be fixed soon, no matter how you frame soon.

More money is not the answer- but, let's start with money- follow it you find the agenda- drugs are a business. A very lucrative business, world wide. The figures go into the billions- what can billions do? What can billions buy? Better yet, who can billions (and less) buy? Now, that begs the question; why can they be bought? They, being the same people, who create this kind of crap and then ignore it- that's the money, succinctly stated.

But, again; why are so many people turning to drugs to begin with? I'd like to hear the recovered addict in the video's take on that. I wonder why that wasn't brought out in the interview- anything and everything done without addressing the root cause is no more than placating we have to do something- we've been doing something for 50 years and it's just getting worse-

I noted the argument about the difference in population between a European country and the US and discounting it's model because of population- what's the population of the Bay Area? What about addressing one region at a time? Obviously one size fits all doesn't work- we have 50 years of evidence.

I also noted, and I concur, there has to be a want to with the addicts- that is a two way street- there has to be a want to with those who aren't addicted- so far, what I see lock-em up, let em die seems to be popular- is that really going to fix anything?

 

[YoursTruly]

Trump did NOTHING like Hitler unlike Biden. Trump was the best thing to happen to America since Reagan.

What Trump did to get elected, was almost exactly like Hitler. Made promises he knew he's never be able to fulfill.

Wait, they all do that.

Nevermind.

 

[YoursTruly]

So, there is no quick fix- only arguments about who, or what, or where, the fault is-

What we see happening, is a real crisis- not a hoax as so many other crises are. To me, the obvious question is why people turn to drugs in the first place?

Because they want to. They chose that route. It's as simple as that. Their troubles and woe's doesn't matter, because they're theirs.

What I'm 100% concerned about is how to get them away from decent property & business owners. Get them out of the publics eye, because the decent people in public are business owners. They're shoppers who want to spend money with those businesses. They're people who respect the rights, freedoms and liberties of others.
Homeless druggies, don't care about others rights, freedoms and liberties. They care about their next fix, that's it. They'll steal from anyone. They'll beat you for your stuff. They'll steal from your kids & grandkids. They'll spit on them. Take a piss in front of them.
They're the walking dead and should be treated as such. What ever it takes. Help those that want to be help, and cast out those that refuse the help.

 

[YoursTruly]

Since they have decriminalized all dangerous drugs, I don't see a government/social solution. What I do see happening is natural selection. The users who have self control will survive and those who don't, will not. Life is hard, it is harder when you're stupid.

One thing I've noticed about the governments "official story" is the lack of numbers dealing with drugs and druggies. Since they're not getting arrested, then most of the numbers just aren't being recorded. So it makes it only seem like it's getting better.

Sort of like unemployment numbers.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

Hasn't the democrat party's response to covid convinced people that they are committed to public safety?

I mean, why else would they create sanctuary cities and invite the diseased to come shit in the streets?

 

[ClaireH]

View attachment 473528

Currently people can only be helped if they choose to be helped.

The policy right now is they have rights and to allow what some consider criminal acts to occur without repercussions.

There is nothing that can be done without a loss of rights to the individuals it directly affects.

*****SMILE*****

There is a time when someone’s individual rights should be compromised: when public safety is at risk. Obviously, throwing more money at the growing homeless situation is not going to help improve things or it would have produced positive change by now, nor does a day or two in jail (they still get drugs so it’s just a temporary change of address for homeless drug addicts) when what they need is a hand up to better their lives. As depicted in the OP’s video, this hand up to help started with police intervention, whose primary duty is to keep people safe from crime. As I said, jail time isn’t what helps drug addicts and certainly not drug addicts with mental illnesses, but if the arrest process were to direct these individuals to get some actual help it could be (and has proven to be) a workable solution.

You’re right though DE, a person has got to want the help to accept it.

Perhaps the professional help should be forced upon them.

Quite a quandary, but you’ve hit the solution if the goal is to clean up the streets and help a few individuals in the process, is it not? Like the guy in the video who lived on the streets for six months, police intervention was what saved him and that was forced. I’d venture to say that at that time he was arrested, he didn’t look at it as help as the only thing he said he wanted to do was to maintain his addiction. The reality is that not many can be saved with forced measures (or with any measures) but some can as depicted in the video.

I was talking with my 18-year-old daughter last night about this very issue and she also watch this video. Her recommendation is to make drugs like alcohol, where it’s illegal to be intoxicated out in the streets same for using drugs out in public. She supports legalizing all drugs but thinks there should be a law against using out in public. I would like to throw fentanyl out of the legalized mix, but given that people living with chronic conditions need that for pain when morphine isn’t effective makes that mute... at least right now.

All I know is fentanyl is one bad drug used by addicts, and it’s taking various parts of this country down in a big way. I’m glad my family isn’t exposed to that, I would really be losing a lot of sleep actually. I’d move. I cannot imagine worrying about my kids playing at the public park where there are individuals lying around overdosing or close to it. Good grief.

Yes, I have sympathy for these drug addicts who are mentality ill, but does that mean I’m willing to be exposed to their lifestyle as in right in my face? No thanks.

I greatly appreciate my conservatively run state. My state has been said to be, by more than a few, a tossup with Tennessee as far as which state will be the last hold out to legalize marijuana. Right now, I’m more OK with that than I was yesterday.

 

[Damaged Eagle]

.......I also noted, and I concur, there has to be a want to with the addicts- that is a two way street- there has to be a want to with those who aren't addicted- so far, what I see lock-em up, let em die seems to be popular- is that really going to fix anything?

Yes I removed the top half of your post because I only wanted to address the end...That said...

I think most the posters here are sympathetic to the issue. However the cure to the issue is complex because it involves the human condition. People become addicted for a multitude of reasons depression, loss, it's the thing to do, etc,..... or even future shock.

Throwing money at it will not solve the problem and might even make the problem worse. There will be those that are saved and many more that will not be and there will always be more that will see taking drugs as a solution.

The only real cure is for the drug addict to be offered a solution that involves them signing, at least some, of their rights away. This would be similar to the police throwing them in prison. On the other hand it doesn't have to involve the police as remedy to their problem.

It could be something as simple as being approached and they sign up for and are taken to a remote location, like a ranch, and isolated from society for a time to clean up (Just a thought). This is a program I would support but it would probably not have many people voluntarily sign up to attend. Again >human nature< reigns supreme.

Otherwise there is the "they have rights" issue that stands in the way of anything done. In which case it is best to simply leave them alone and let nature take it's course. Perhaps a soup kitchen and simple shelters but no money to feed their addiction.

*****SMILE*****

 

[ESay]

was talking with my 18-year-old daughter last night about this very issue and she also watch this video. Her recommendation is to make drugs like alcohol, where it’s illegal to be intoxicated out in the streets same for using drugs out in public. She supports legalizing all drugs but thinks there should be a law against using out in public

Very wise opinion, I think. I don't know why it hasn't been implemented yet. My guess is that a certain group of powerful people makes a great deal of easy money out of that.

 

[sartre play]

Start by not thinking about what kind of people the homeless are and start thinking about what created the situation. We have always had some homeless by choice or not, nothing like what has been going on in recent years. Could it be money has become God?