Celebrating Robert E. Lee's Birthday Today Brings Out Southern Pride And Patriotism

[JakeStarkey]

how proud you must be of losing the war

I am thrilled that the North and the West defeated the southern losers like you worship, Yurt.

do ever tire of lying. let's see, i mock those who are proud of the south losing the war and then you claim i worship them.

Obvious connection. You love the Old South and all it stood for, particularly slavery, while I oppose all that. Yep.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

how proud you must be of losing the war

I am thrilled that the North and the West defeated the southern losers like you worship, Yurt.

Which western states were involved in the Civil War?

 

[WinterBorn]

The war was about slavery regardless of how hard you try to spin it

No it was more about money. More specifically issues on taxes, tariffs, internal improvements and states rights vs federal rights of which slavery was a part of.

But go ahead and remain ignorant.

Here we go again folks...

The Civil War was about States Rights....A States Right to allow slavery
The Civil War was about economics......An economy built on slavery

If the Civil War was about states rights to allow slavery, why did the constitution of the CSA remove the right for a state to decide about slavery?

 

[JakeStarkey]

State Sovereignty is immoral now?



******* history flunkies. Jeebus.

If the Civil War was fought, as you claim, over state's rights, why did the constitution of the CSA not support state's rights?

In fact, that constitution allowed no state the right to emancipate slaves. In fact, no state could even be admitted into the CSA unless it agreed to maintain slavery always.

And the idea of a state's right to secede was specifically and emphatically denied by that constitution.

Dude, you really need to read a history book.

Did you know that Gen. Ulysses Grant owned slaves even after the war? And he didn't free them until the 13th Amendment was passed.

Bottom line the war was fought over money.

You moron. His wife's family (the Dents) owned them.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

The war was about slavery regardless of how hard you try to spin it

No it was more about money. More specifically issues on taxes, tariffs, internal improvements and states rights vs federal rights of which slavery was a part of.

But go ahead and remain ignorant.

Here we go again folks...

The Civil War was about States Rights....A States Right to allow slavery
The Civil War was about economics......An economy built on slavery

As I said, go ahead and remain ignorant.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Explain why the

is so offensive to blacks if it doesn't represent the Confederacy and southern pride?

But the fact is, this flag is NOT the "Confederate Flag." It is the "Battle Flag of Northern Virginia." This design, however, is the one most synonymous with the term, and the one used in various forms on many of the other flags that were flown by the Confederate States. It is also the one most hated by those who are completely and totally ignorant of what it stands for.

This is the TRUE Confederate flag"

The only thing that flag is worthy of is toilet paper.

No that wouldn't work. This flag doesn't take shit off anyone.

Since the flag took it up the ass in the Civil War, metaphorically, sure it takes shit.

 

[WinterBorn]

I don't think so. But if you have proof that the Virginia Battle flag was flying in Petersburg or in any of Sherman's sieges then let's see it.

My apologies, I thought you were referring to the Confederate flag.

The Battle flag is so often referred to as the Confederate flag and I think it's due to ignorance or being too lazy to research the flag's origin.

I thought both the confederate flag and the battle flag were shown in the post to which I responded. Perhaps I was wrong there as well.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

If the Civil War was fought, as you claim, over state's rights, why did the constitution of the CSA not support state's rights?

In fact, that constitution allowed no state the right to emancipate slaves. In fact, no state could even be admitted into the CSA unless it agreed to maintain slavery always.

And the idea of a state's right to secede was specifically and emphatically denied by that constitution.

Dude, you really need to read a history book.

Did you know that Gen. Ulysses Grant owned slaves even after the war? And he didn't free them until the 13th Amendment was passed.

Dude, that's a classic non sequitur. Stay on point.

Bottom line the war was fought over money.

Money or property? Both equate to slavery. Times change but character does not, today in the South a popular ruse is to call neo slavery the Right to Work.

Money and property equate to slavery? You'll have to explain that.

What's the unemployment rate in your state and which northern state is that?

 

[Lonestar_logic]

If the Civil War was fought, as you claim, over state's rights, why did the constitution of the CSA not support state's rights?

In fact, that constitution allowed no state the right to emancipate slaves. In fact, no state could even be admitted into the CSA unless it agreed to maintain slavery always.

And the idea of a state's right to secede was specifically and emphatically denied by that constitution.

Dude, you really need to read a history book.

Did you know that Gen. Ulysses Grant owned slaves even after the war? And he didn't free them until the 13th Amendment was passed.

Bottom line the war was fought over money.

You moron. His wife's family (the Dents) owned them.

The last president who ever owned slaves was, ironically, Ulysses S. Grant, elected in 1868 after he had commanded Union forces to victory over the Confederacy in the war that led to the abolition of slavery. Grant owned a slave named William Jones, whom he freed in 1859. Between 1854 and 1859 Grant worked and lived on an 850-acre farm in Missouri, near St. Louis, that was owned by his father-in-law. Grant’s wife, Julia, also owned slaves, and during Grant’s management of the farm he worked along with one of them, a man named Dan. The farm is now the Ulysses S. Grant National Historic Site, part of the National Park Service.

FactCheck.Org

 

[JakeStarkey]

Dude, you really need to read a history book.

Did you know that Gen. Ulysses Grant owned slaves even after the war? And he didn't free them until the 13th Amendment was passed.

Bottom line the war was fought over money.

You moron. His wife's family (the Dents) owned them.

The last president who ever owned slaves was, ironically, Ulysses S. Grant, elected in 1868 after he had commanded Union forces to victory over the Confederacy in the war that led to the abolition of slavery. Grant owned a slave named William Jones, whom he freed in 1859. Between 1854 and 1859 Grant worked and lived on an 850-acre farm in Missouri, near St. Louis, that was owned by his father-in-law. Grant’s wife, Julia, also owned slaves, and during Grant’s management of the farm he worked along with one of them, a man named Dan. The farm is now the Ulysses S. Grant National Historic Site, part of the National Park Service.

FactCheck.Org

Do read what you post. Grant owned a slave whom he freed two years before the war. His wife's family owned slaves who were emancipated in 1865.

 

[Yurt]

I am thrilled that the North and the West defeated the southern losers like you worship, Yurt.

do ever tire of lying. let's see, i mock those who are proud of the south losing the war and then you claim i worship them.

Obvious connection. You love the Old South and all it stood for, particularly slavery, while I oppose all that. Yep.

cite the obvious connection. be specific.

and when i have ever said i love slavery? or what have i said that leads you to believe this?

 

[JakeStarkey]

do ever tire of lying. let's see, i mock those who are proud of the south losing the war and then you claim i worship them.

Obvious connection. You love the Old South and all it stood for, particularly slavery, while I oppose all that. Yep.

cite the obvious connection. be specific.

and when i have ever said i love slavery? or what have i said that leads you to believe this?

Your obvious love for it is your attack on me ABOVE for supporting the North and West's victory over the South.

 

[whitehall]

Washington & Lee University is a premier law school located in Lexington Va. Originally called Washing University the name was changed after Robert E. Lee, it's dean after the Civil War, died and was buried on the grounds at Lee Chapel. It's interesting that the political forces in the city of Lexington are busy trying to erase every sign of it's rich history and Confederate flags are forbidden to be placed on public property. Lexington depends a great deal on tourism generated by the Civil War and it's ironic that political correctness trumps it's own welfare. There was a minor movement to change the name of W&L but at least the elitist academics are smart enough to leave it alone for now. It's Lee, Jackson, King day in the Commonwealth of Va.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

State Sovereignty is immoral now?



******* history flunkies. Jeebus.

If the Civil War was fought, as you claim, over state's rights, why did the constitution of the CSA not support state's rights?

In fact, that constitution allowed no state the right to emancipate slaves. In fact, no state could even be admitted into the CSA unless it agreed to maintain slavery always.

And the idea of a state's right to secede was specifically and emphatically denied by that constitution.

Jeebus. So the only way that slavery could possibley end is with the governments involvement? Nonsense. And the authors of the C.C knew that. All it specifically says is that as it stood, no form of law can impair the ownership of property (slaves) in the confederacy. The admission of a state was done by

3) The Confederate States may acquire new territory; and Congress shall have power to legislate and provide governments for the inhabitants of all territory belonging to the Confederate States, lying without the limits of the several Sates; and may permit them, at such times, and in such manner as it may by law provide, to form States to be admitted into the Confederacy. In all such territory the institution of negro slavery, as it now exists in the Confederate States, shall be recognized and protected be Congress and by the Territorial government; and the inhabitants of the several Confederate States and Territories shall have the right to take to such Territory any slaves lawfully held by them in any of the States or Territories of the Confederate States.

Sec. 3. (I) Other States may be admitted into this Confederacy by a vote of two-thirds of the whole House of Representatives and two-thirds of the Senate, the Senate voting by States; but no new State shall be formed or erected within the jurisdiction of any other State, nor any State be formed by the junction of two or more States, or parts of States, without the consent of the Legislatures of the States concerned, as well as of the Congress.

 

[Yurt]

Obvious connection. You love the Old South and all it stood for, particularly slavery, while I oppose all that. Yep.

cite the obvious connection. be specific.

and when i have ever said i love slavery? or what have i said that leads you to believe this?

Your obvious love for it is your attack on me ABOVE for supporting the North and West's victory over the South.

not true, i attacked your LIE that i support the south slavery. hence, i do not support slavery.

yet again, jake makes a claim and provides zero evidence to back it up and lies about what the person actually said.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

As for secession, it's right in the preamble of the C.C.

"We, the people of the Confederate States, each state acting in its sovereign and independent character, in order to form a permanent federal government, establish justice, insure domestic tranquillity, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity — invoking the favor and guidance of Almighty God — do ordain and establish this Constitution for the Confederate States of America."

 

[WinterBorn]

As for secession, it's right in the preamble of the C.C.

"We, the people of the Confederate States, each state acting in its sovereign and independent character, in order to form a permanent federal government, establish justice, insure domestic tranquillity, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity — invoking the favor and guidance of Almighty God — do ordain and establish this Constitution for the Confederate States of America."

And as for their removing those rights, it is right there in the constitution of the CSA:

"Article IV
Section 1
(3) No slave or other person held to service or labor in any State or Territory of the Confederate States, under the laws thereof, escaping or lawfully carried into another, shall, in consequence of any law or regulation therein, be discharged from such service or labor; but shall be delivered up on claim of the party to whom such slave belongs,. or to whom such service or labor may be due.
Section 2
(3) The Confederate States may acquire new territory; and Congress shall have power to legislate and provide governments for the inhabitants of all territory belonging to the Confederate States, lying without the limits of the several Sates; and may permit them, at such times, and in such manner as it may by law provide, to form States to be admitted into the Confederacy. In all such territory the institution of negro slavery, as it now exists in the Confederate States, shall be recognized and protected be Congress and by the Territorial government; and the inhabitants of the several Confederate States and Territories shall have the right to take to such Territory any slaves lawfully held by them in any of the States or Territories of the Confederate States
Section 3
(3) The Confederate States may acquire new territory; and Congress shall have power to legislate and provide governments for the inhabitants of all territory belonging to the Confederate States, lying without the limits of the several Sates; and may permit them, at such times, and in such manner as it may by law provide, to form States to be admitted into the Confederacy. In all such territory the institution of negro slavery, as it now exists in the Confederate States, shall be recognized and protected be Congress and by the Territorial government; and the inhabitants of the several Confederate States and Territories shall have the right to take to such Territory any slaves lawfully held by them in any of the States or Territories of the Confederate States.."

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Yes, recognized and protected. That has little bearing on whether or not others own slaves. You seem to fall for the typical fallacy that sicne the C.C protected the institution (as it was viewed as private property of the time), that means that every confederacy state MUST own slaves. The slave trade was already dying. Right along with slavery the world over. It would have ended on its own, as many confederates believed. The difference is, the confederacy didnt want congress deciding for everyone that it ends by force. (a fuckin' oxymoron if one ever existed).

No rights were removed, Paco. No one was forced to own slaves. No one was forced to do anything except protect what was considered private property at the time. They simply outlawed the government from making new laws regarding it.

 

[JakeStarkey]

cite the obvious connection. be specific.

and when i have ever said i love slavery? or what have i said that leads you to believe this?

Your obvious love for it is your attack on me ABOVE for supporting the North and West's victory over the South.

not true, i attacked your LIE that i support the south slavery. hence, i do not support slavery.

yet again, jake makes a claim and provides zero evidence to back it up and lies about what the person actually said.

Absolute truth. You attacked me for supporting the North and the West, which means that you supported the South and slavery.

 

[WinterBorn]

Yes, recognized and protected. That has little bearing on whether or not others own slaves. You seem to fall for the typical fallacy that sicne the C.C protected the institution (as it was viewed as private property of the time), that means that every confederacy state MUST own slaves. The slave trade was already dying. Right along with slavery the world over. It would have ended on its own, as many confederates believed. The difference is, the confederacy didnt want congress deciding for everyone that it ends by force. (a fuckin' oxymoron if one ever existed).

It had plenty of bearing. While the claims are made that this was all about states rights to own slaves, the states in the confederacy could not outlaw slavery within their state. This removed any pretense of states rights.