Can anyone please tell me if the liberals are claiming that no democrat has ever tried to dig dirt?

[Indeependent]

Is this what they are claiming? The best quote from JR was the fact that he loved it. I think that is funny as hell.

No, no one is claiming that.

The problem is that when you go digging for dirt with a foreign government, that is against the law. Also, really unseemly.

Against the law? Which law? Where is the evidence?

C'mon, you're not allowed to ask for detail swhen someone uses the phrase, "foreign government".

 

[martybegan]

And if you extend the concept of information having intrinsic value, all sorts of other laws come into play regarding other parties.

nope, the law we are discussing ONLY INVOLVES foreign governments involvement in to our election process.

Again, we are discussing the concept of value of information. You just can't decide value means one thing with regards to this law, then ignore that definition when it comes to another law.

And if you extend the concept of information having intrinsic value, all sorts of other laws come into play regarding other parties.

nope, the law we are discussing ONLY INVOLVES foreign governments involvement in to our election process.

Again, we are discussing the concept of value of information. You just can't decide value means one thing with regards to this law, then ignore that definition when it comes to another law.

there is value in use, and value in exchange...

I think it says the meaning of value, depends on each individual case....

AS example:
IF it's just talk, with no proof in writing presented....That could be worthless to them....if it was the private emails of Hillary Clinton given to them, then those emails have value in use.... imo

The word value has many meanings and may be used in different senses. Because value is usually a relative term, its true meaning must be determined by the context in which it appears.

Value sometimes expresses the inherent usefulness of an object and sometimes the power of purchasing other goods with it. The first is called value in use, the latter value in exchange. Value in use is the utility of an object in satisfying, directly or indirectly, the needs or desires of human beings. Value in exchange is the amount of commodities, commonly represented by money, for which a thing can be exchanged in an open market. This concept is usually referred to as market value.

Courts have frequently used the word value without any clear indication of whether it referred to value in use or market value.



---------------------------------------------------------

noun
Value is the worth in goods, services or money of an object or person.

1. An example of value is the amount given by an appraiser after appraising a house.
2. An example of value is how much a consultant's input is worth to a committee.

You can quote dictionary definitions until the cows come home, it doesn't make it a legal concept. The law clearly meant things like cars and jewelry and property. Its how items of value have been interpreted before and will continue to be interpreted.

But feel free to keep up this Quixotic quest to think this is the one final "gotcha" moment, like all the other final gotcha moments.

Marty, what;s the reason for the law?

The reason was to prevent outside influence on elections via monetary or cash value equivalents.

Any restriction on information changing hands probably has 1st amendment issues, a Bentley doesn't.

 

[deanrd]

No Democratic president in history has ever had a hostile foreign government break the law to get them elected

No Democratic president in history has ever had key campaign members meet repeatedly with that hostile government

No Democratic president in history has ever had key members of their family actively pursue participating in that illegal action

You can't say no Democrat in history.

Remember, before the middle 1960's, Democrats were the conservative confederate "white" party. Just like Republicans are now.

 

[rightwinger]

What Lil' Donnie was offered

"official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary [Clinton] and her dealings with Russia," documents that were cast as full of "obviously very high-level and sensitive information" that was "part of Russia and its government's support for Mr. Trump."

Did Trump Jr. refuse such an untoward offer and immediately alert the FBI? No.

"If it's what you say I love it," Trump Jr. gleefully replied.

It would be perfectly legal, moron.

Sent from my SM-G935P using USMessageBoard.com mobile app

Tell it to the judge

 

[rightwinger]

No Democratic president in history has ever had a hostile foreign government break the law to get them elected

No Democratic president in history has ever had key campaign members meet repeatedly with that hostile government

No Democratic president in history has ever had key members of their family actively pursue participating in that illegal action

You can't say no Democrat in history.

Remember, before the middle 1960's, Democrats were the conservative confederate "white" party. Just like Republicans are now.

Still no candidate before Trump met with a hostile government to obtain secrets to help get elected

 

[bripat9643]

Is this what they are claiming? The best quote from JR was the fact that he loved it. I think that is funny as hell.

I don't listen to anything the left have to say. I am long done with all of their double standards, lies and petulant bullshit.

Are they claiming that democrats have never tried to dig up dirt on their political opponents?

Is this what they are saying? The best part about all of this is the dirt that we found out about their pants suit kuuunt is being ignored. By everyone. The actual crimes.

Nope.

We are saying that we didn't solicit dirt from a hostile government known to be trying to fuck up our election and our entire democratic system of choosing representation. AND THEN LIE ABOUT IT FOR A YEAR and on TV and, in Kushner and Sessions case, under oath or on federal disclosure forms.

Kushner didn't "solicit" anything, you fucking moron. Even if he did, it would still be perfectly legal.

Sent from my SM-G935P using USMessageBoard.com mobile app

Fuck legal. There is right and wrong. You assholes think doing shit is cool as long as it's legal. That's why you suck.

We are a nation of laws AND a nation that does the right thing. You do not fit in. Thus, you are on the way out. Won't be too long now. You may even be here to witness the whole thing.

So now you're admitting it's legal? Now you're whining that's not ethical? And that's your justification for your demand that Trump be impeached? The problem with idiots like you is that your hero Hillary did just as much and much more. She made quid pro quo deals with the Russian government while she was secretary of state. The Democrats solicited the Steele "dossier," which is far slimier than anything Trump has been accused of. I could go on and on about all the sleaze that went on in the Democrat party during the election.

 

[bripat9643]

What Lil' Donnie was offered

"official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary [Clinton] and her dealings with Russia," documents that were cast as full of "obviously very high-level and sensitive information" that was "part of Russia and its government's support for Mr. Trump."

Did Trump Jr. refuse such an untoward offer and immediately alert the FBI? No.

"If it's what you say I love it," Trump Jr. gleefully replied.

It would be perfectly legal, moron.

Sent from my SM-G935P using USMessageBoard.com mobile app

Tell it to the judge

There won't ever be any judge, moron.

 

[bripat9643]

No Democratic president in history has ever had a hostile foreign government break the law to get them elected

No Democratic president in history has ever had key campaign members meet repeatedly with that hostile government

No Democratic president in history has ever had key members of their family actively pursue participating in that illegal action

You can't say no Democrat in history.

Remember, before the middle 1960's, Democrats were the conservative confederate "white" party. Just like Republicans are now.

Still no candidate before Trump met with a hostile government to obtain secrets to help get elected

ROFL! You're forgetting Ted Kennedy, moron. And labeling Russia a "hostile government" is purely a snowflake pretension. There's no official designation of "hostile." Russia is no more "hostile" than France.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Theowl32, post: 17701799

re they claiming that democrats have never tried to dig up dirt on their political opponents?

No. You are a fool if you think that is what the issue is.

Can you name one single time a Democratic Presidential candidate agreed to meet in the hopes of acquiring opposition research directly from a foreign government regarded as adversarial to US interests, because that foreign government told them they wanted their candidate to win - to further the foreign governments goals against the US and its democratic institutions?

Can you?

If not shut up and quit crying about itz

 

[bripat9643]

Theowl32, post: 17701799

re they claiming that democrats have never tried to dig up dirt on their political opponents?

No. You are a fool if you think that is what the issue is.

Can you name one single time a Democratic Presidential candidate agreed to meet in the hopes of acquiring opposition research directly from a foreign government regarded as adversarial to US interests, because that foreign government told them they wanted their candidate to win - to further the foreign governments goals against the US and its democratic institutions?

Can you?

If not shut up and quit crying about itz

the Russian lawyer didn't work for the Russian government, dumbass. The Russian government didn't say a thing to the Trump campaign about the election.

You would experience a lot less stress if you stuck to the known facts rather than making up a bunch of shit that makes you look like an hysterical raving paranoiac.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Dearest hypocrites- WHERE is your OUTRAGE over Hillary's collusion with Ukraine that went on for MONTHS and involved payments?

There is no collusion or impropriety between Ukraine and the Democratic Party. Ukraine legally released public records from Ukraine on Paul Manafort's paid PR work for pro-Putin Oligarchs in The Ukraine.

You cannot make a case that there was . Go ahead and try.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

bripat9643, post: 17733269

The Russian lawyer didn't work for the Russian government, dumbass. The Russian government didn't say a thing to the Trump campaign about the election.

It's sad that an American voicing opinions on this matter does not know the contents of the email chain that DTjr released just before The NYT was ready to release them.

Very pathetic indeed.

 

[Care4all]

nope, the law we are discussing ONLY INVOLVES foreign governments involvement in to our election process.

Again, we are discussing the concept of value of information. You just can't decide value means one thing with regards to this law, then ignore that definition when it comes to another law.

nope, the law we are discussing ONLY INVOLVES foreign governments involvement in to our election process.

Again, we are discussing the concept of value of information. You just can't decide value means one thing with regards to this law, then ignore that definition when it comes to another law.

there is value in use, and value in exchange...

I think it says the meaning of value, depends on each individual case....

AS example:
IF it's just talk, with no proof in writing presented....That could be worthless to them....if it was the private emails of Hillary Clinton given to them, then those emails have value in use.... imo

The word value has many meanings and may be used in different senses. Because value is usually a relative term, its true meaning must be determined by the context in which it appears.

Value sometimes expresses the inherent usefulness of an object and sometimes the power of purchasing other goods with it. The first is called value in use, the latter value in exchange. Value in use is the utility of an object in satisfying, directly or indirectly, the needs or desires of human beings. Value in exchange is the amount of commodities, commonly represented by money, for which a thing can be exchanged in an open market. This concept is usually referred to as market value.

Courts have frequently used the word value without any clear indication of whether it referred to value in use or market value.



---------------------------------------------------------

noun
Value is the worth in goods, services or money of an object or person.

1. An example of value is the amount given by an appraiser after appraising a house.
2. An example of value is how much a consultant's input is worth to a committee.

You can quote dictionary definitions until the cows come home, it doesn't make it a legal concept. The law clearly meant things like cars and jewelry and property. Its how items of value have been interpreted before and will continue to be interpreted.

But feel free to keep up this Quixotic quest to think this is the one final "gotcha" moment, like all the other final gotcha moments.

Marty, what;s the reason for the law?

The reason was to prevent outside influence on elections via monetary or cash value equivalents.

Any restriction on information changing hands probably has 1st amendment issues, a Bentley doesn't.

It does not say of cash value....it says value...and opposition research does have a cash value, in many more ways than one, in this situation....

and the MAIN purpose, is NOT to have any foreign government's influence in our Democracy, and with our sacred voting process...we citizens want to believe and know, that it is our own American voters that choose without the influence of a foreign government. and so that American campaigns or elected officials do not OWE a foreign government allegiance for their help....right now, we all can legitimately ask, what is President Trump doing or going to do, to pay them back? this is NOT GOOD for our Democracy.

No amount of money in the world could pay for all of the help the Russians gave Donald Trump, and it appears, he and his team, accepted with open arms...they loved it....especially later in the summer...

 

[LoneLaugher]

Is this what they are claiming? The best quote from JR was the fact that he loved it. I think that is funny as hell.

I don't listen to anything the left have to say. I am long done with all of their double standards, lies and petulant bullshit.

Are they claiming that democrats have never tried to dig up dirt on their political opponents?

Is this what they are saying? The best part about all of this is the dirt that we found out about their pants suit kuuunt is being ignored. By everyone. The actual crimes.

Nope.

We are saying that we didn't solicit dirt from a hostile government known to be trying to fuck up our election and our entire democratic system of choosing representation. AND THEN LIE ABOUT IT FOR A YEAR and on TV and, in Kushner and Sessions case, under oath or on federal disclosure forms.

Kushner didn't "solicit" anything, you fucking moron. Even if he did, it would still be perfectly legal.

Sent from my SM-G935P using USMessageBoard.com mobile app

Fuck legal. There is right and wrong. You assholes think doing shit is cool as long as it's legal. That's why you suck.

We are a nation of laws AND a nation that does the right thing. You do not fit in. Thus, you are on the way out. Won't be too long now. You may even be here to witness the whole thing.

So now you're admitting it's legal? Now you're whining that's not ethical? And that's your justification for your demand that Trump be impeached? The problem with idiots like you is that your hero Hillary did just as much and much more. She made quid pro quo deals with the Russian government while she was secretary of state. The Democrats solicited the Steele "dossier," which is far slimier than anything Trump has been accused of. I could go on and on about all the sleaze that went on in the Democrat party during the election.

Why are you talking about Hillary?

 

[CowboyTed]

If "digging for dirt" were the only thing going on here, it would be quite normal.

As we all know, however, there is much more to the story.

And it is happening in the context of a much larger story. And it includes verifiable lies.

As we all know.
.

You are against verifiable lies? You proudly voted for the kuunt witch in a pants suit? That is funny as fuck. You, are dumber than all fuck. Not to mention a pathetic double talking hypocrite.

Give us your best analysis of the golden showers dossier.

I will be expecting for an asshole like you to tell me that it is not the same. Of course not.

The "golden showers dossier"? I don't know much about it - although I have heard Rush talking about, so I'm sure you're well-versed. Some story about Trump asking a hooker to pee on a bed the Obamas slept in or something. Don't know, no proof, don't care.

What does hookers peeing in a bed have to do with Junior meeting with a Russian after learning the Russians were trying to help his Dad? Were the hookers at the meeting? Was the Russian lady a hooker? Is Junior a hooker?

And why are you trying to deflect from your own thread?


.

Right so... Arrest Hillary Clinton for it... Bring your case...

you see the RWers here have got proof that Hillary's campaign were involved in producing that dossier... By the way the GOP orginally paid for the Trump Dossier initial findings... You stupid idiots...
Former MI6 officer Christopher Steele, who produced Donald Trump Russian dossier, 'terrified for his safety' and went to ground before name released
"His research was initially funded by anti-Trump Republicans, and later by Democrats."

Those were private individuals and Steele didn't work for the UK government at the time...

 

[whutTHEYsay]

bripat9643, post: 17733212

She made quid pro quo deals with the Russian government while she was secretary of state.

No she didn't. You are lying. You have nothing to show in support of your claim.

 

[bripat9643]

bripat9643, post: 17733269

The Russian lawyer didn't work for the Russian government, dumbass. The Russian government didn't say a thing to the Trump campaign about the election.

It's sad that an American voicing opinions on this matter does not know the contents of the email chain that DTjr released just before The NYT was ready to release them.

Very pathetic indeed.

It's sad that you're so fucking dumb and sleazy that you would claim the Russian government had anything to do with that email chain. That just didn't happen. Not even the CNN fake news is willing to make that claim.

 

[bripat9643]

bripat9643, post: 17733212

She made quid pro quo deals with the Russian government while she was secretary of state.

No she didn't. You are lying. You have nothing to show in support of your claim.

There is plenty of for support the claim. A guy wrote an entire book about all the Clinton bribes

 

[Care4all]

Theowl32, post: 17701799

re they claiming that democrats have never tried to dig up dirt on their political opponents?

No. You are a fool if you think that is what the issue is.

Can you name one single time a Democratic Presidential candidate agreed to meet in the hopes of acquiring opposition research directly from a foreign government regarded as adversarial to US interests, because that foreign government told them they wanted their candidate to win - to further the foreign governments goals against the US and its democratic institutions?

Can you?

If not shut up and quit crying about itz

the Russian lawyer didn't work for the Russian government, dumbass. The Russian government didn't say a thing to the Trump campaign about the election.

You would experience a lot less stress if you stuck to the known facts rather than making up a bunch of shit that makes you look like an hysterical raving paranoiac.

nope, she really did work for the Russian Government, for the Chief Prosecutor of the Russian Federation there, who was hand picked by Putin...she checked in with him frequently, she is the one who has said so.

You have no idea what they said or didn't say, nor do I.

We were only given emails that this lady lawyer was meeting with them.....

WHAT IN THE HECK HAPPENED between the emails we saw, and the actual meeting for there to be 8 PEOPLE PRESENT AT THIS MEETING.... Would Manafort, and Kushner and Donny Junior really let 4 additional people in to this meeting without having some notice ahead of time? NO WAY!

We are MISSING emails or telephone conversations that allowed 8 people in the meeting vs just 4, the three from Trump's team and the lady govt lawyer representing Russia....

Soooooooo, since we know the Trump's are LYING again, through omission, of who attended....

we can easily presume they are LYING about what was discussed or given to them.

 

[bripat9643]

Theowl32, post: 17701799

re they claiming that democrats have never tried to dig up dirt on their political opponents?

No. You are a fool if you think that is what the issue is.

Can you name one single time a Democratic Presidential candidate agreed to meet in the hopes of acquiring opposition research directly from a foreign government regarded as adversarial to US interests, because that foreign government told them they wanted their candidate to win - to further the foreign governments goals against the US and its democratic institutions?

Can you?

If not shut up and quit crying about itz

the Russian lawyer didn't work for the Russian government, dumbass. The Russian government didn't say a thing to the Trump campaign about the election.

You would experience a lot less stress if you stuck to the known facts rather than making up a bunch of shit that makes you look like an hysterical raving paranoiac.

nope, she really did work for the Russian Government, for the Chief Prosecutor of the Russian Federation there, who was hand picked by Putin...she checked in with him frequently, she is the one who has said so.

You have no idea what they said or didn't say, nor do I.

We were only given emails that this lady lawyer was meeting with them.....

WHAT IN THE HECK HAPPENED between the emails we saw, and the actual meeting for there to be 8 PEOPLE PRESENT AT THIS MEETING.... Would Manafort, and Kushner and Donny Junior really let 4 additional people in to this meeting without having some notice ahead of time? NO WAY!

We are MISSING emails or telephone conversations that allowed 8 people in the meeting vs just 4, the three from Trump's team and the lady govt lawyer representing Russia....

Soooooooo, since we know the Trump's are LYING again, through omission, of who attended....

we can easily presume they are LYING about what was discussed or given to them.

Wrong, douche bag:

Chuck Grassley wants to know how Russian attorney Natalia Veselnitskaya was able to enter US for Donald Trump Jr. meeting

The lawyer told the Washington Post in an interview Tuesday that she has no connection to the Kremlin.
​

If you don't know what was said at the meeting, then how can you claim it was anything illicit?

You are a special kind of stupid, ya know it? It appears that snowflakes believe the fake news because they are retarded or suffering brain damage. No intelligent person could fall for these obvious lies.