Brian Williams Death Penalty QUestion

[Wry Catcher]

Brian Williams showed his liberal disgust with capital punishment in Texas.

And was horrified when the audience applauded.

Perry's answer was awesome. He didn't give an inch.


Rick Perry Proud Of 234 Executions--Brian Williams Shocked Audience Applauds Deaths - YouTube


This is why Perry will eventually prevail over Romney and Obama. He doesn't back down from a fight.

Sometimes backing down from a fight is smart; only drunks and fools believe otherwise.
That said capital punishement is too expensive and puts are country in the league of some very unsavory nations, consider:

* 2010 - The following 23 countries carried out executions in 2010: Bahrain (1), Bangladesh (9+), Belarus (2), Botswana (1), China (2000+), Egypt (4), Equatorial Guinea (4), Iran (252+), Iraq (1+), Japan (2), Libya (18+), Malaysia (1+), North Korea (60+), Palestinian Authority (5), Saudi Arabia (27+), Singapore (1+), Somalia (8+), Sudan (6+), Syria (17+), Taiwan (4), USA (46+), Vietnam (1+), Yemen (53+).

* 2011 - As of 5 May 2011 executions have been reported in the following 9 countries during 2011: Bangladesh, China, Iran, North Korea, the Palestinian Authority, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, UAE, USA.

* Child Execution - Since 2009 Iran and Saudi Arabia have executed offenders who were under the age of 18 at the time the crime was committed

* Public Execution - Since 2009 public executions have reportedly been carried out by the governments of Iran, North Korea, the Palestinian Authority, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Syria, and Yemen.

Better to house offenders in isolation w/o TV or Radio and only professional contacts (attorney, psychological / religious counsel) for life. It's cheaper and a much greater punishment than being put to death.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

How much has the murder rate in Texas gone down since Perry executed over 200 prisoners?

Wingy...did you know that in Texas, they no longer use the electric chair? Now they use the electric sofa so they can take six at a time...

..and the last meal has become a buffet.

Ba-dum.

As Bill Engvall once said, "Other states are outlawing the death penalty; Texas put in an express lane!"

Actually, it was Ron White... Who is from Fritch Texas.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

So, who do we have as company in our publicly sanctioned execution club?

All those barbaric Muslim countries that stone rape victims and non believers
Communist China
India
USA

Countries that have banned Capital punishment
All of Europe
Those barbaric Russians
Canada
Mexico
Australia
South America

Mexico doesn't have capital punishment, but last year 64,000 of it's citizens were killed by drug cartels and narco-terrorists and you claim their looking down their noses at us for having capital punishment??? Okay... and this world that you wake up in everyday, does everyone talk about you behind your back?

RW needs to spend a day or so in a Mexican jail and then come lecture me on their civility.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

How much has the murder rate in Texas gone down since Perry executed over 200 prisoners?

How many people in the entire US have been put to death since Obama took office? How many babies have been put to death since Obama took office? How many terrorists has Obama executed rather than capture and waterboard since he took office?

 

[saveliberty]

Wingy...did you know that in Texas, they no longer use the electric chair? Now they use the electric sofa so they can take six at a time...

..and the last meal has become a buffet.

Ba-dum.

As Bill Engvall once said, "Other states are outlawing the death penalty; Texas put in an express lane!"

Actually, it was Ron White... Who is from Fritch Texas.

...and Ron was not objecting to the death penalty.

 

[Toro]

Actually, the only people who are upset about career dirtbags getting executed are the kind of people who would never vote Republican, anyway.

I am against the death penalty and I have supported Republicans in the past and will probably do so in 2012.

 

[J.E.D]

You are most likely talking about the guy who should have been a crispy critter or dead in the house fire that killed his kids? Yeah, he's guilty as Hell.

And you know this how? I'm not saying that the guy was definitely innocent, but there was an investigation into that case which turned up evidence that suggested he was innocent. Perry chose to ignore that evidence and refused to postpone his execution. Unless you were there to witness the crime, you can't say for sure that he was guilty. Personally, I want a gov't that doesn't ignore evidence, no matter where it points.

Its evidence because you say so? I call those conspiracy theories.

Guilty because you say so? Conspiracy theories? They're not conspiracy theories. The story has been in the paper along with other controversial executions that Perry chose not to stop. I could be wrong, but I doubt that Texas Tribune and the Texas Forensic Science Commission are in the conspiracy theory business.

The Innocence Project - Cameron Todd Willingham: Wrongfully Convicted and Executed in Texas

Months after Willingham was executed, the Chicago Tribune published an investigative report that raised questions about the forensic analysis. The Innocence Project assembled five of the nation’s leading independent arson experts to review the evidence in the case, and this prestigious group issued a 48-page report finding that none of the scientific analysis used to convict Willingham was valid.

In 2006, the Innocence Project formally submitted the case to the Texas Forensic Science Commission, asking the empowered state entity to launch a full investigation. Along with the Willingham case, the Innocence Project submitted information about another arson case in Texas where identical evidence was used to send another man to death row. In that case, Ernest Willis was exonerated and freed from prison because the forensic evidence was not valid.

In 2008, the Texas Forensic Science Commission agreed to investigate the case. The panel’s review was interrupted several times over the last two years, however, and continues today. In 2009, an arson expert hired by the commission issued a report finding that experts who testified at Willingham’s trial should have known it was wrong at the time. Days before the expert was set to testify, however, Gov. Rick Perry replaced key members of the panel, delayed the investigation for months.

Under Perry, Executions Raise Questions — Rick Perry | The Texas Tribune

As Gov. Rick Perry touts his tough-on-crime policies on the national political stage, the case of Cameron Todd Willingham will continue to be scrutinized. Scientists have raised questions about whether Willingham set the blaze that killed his three daughters and led to his 2004 execution.

But Willingham’s execution is not the only controversial one the governor has presided over. During nearly 11 years in office, Perry has overseen 234 executions — by far the most of any recent governor in the United States — and has rarely used his power to grant clemency. He has granted 31 death row commutations; most of those — 28 — were the result of a 2005 U.S. Supreme Court decision banning capital punishment for minors.

To his critics, his parsimonious use of clemency is notable because of continuing concerns about the ability of prisoners facing capital charges in Texas to retain quality legal representation, the execution of those who were minors when they committed their crimes, the ability of some prisoners to intellectually understand their punishment and the international ramifications of executing foreign nationals.

The Texas Tribune has compiled a database of all the executions in Texas under Perry’s leadership. Below, some of the most controversial, by category.

Mental Incapacity
Kelsey Patterson was sentenced to death for the September 1992 shooting deaths of Louis Oates and Dorothy Harris in Palestine.

Testimony showed that without provocation, Patterson walked up to Oates, 63, the owner of Oates Oil Co., and shot him. He shot Harris, 41, when she came out to see what was going on. Patterson then went to a friend’s home nearby, stripped down to his socks and waited in the street for police to arrive.

Dr. James Grigson, a psychiatrist and popular prosecution expert witness who earned the label “Dr. Death” because he rarely found defendants too mentally unfit to face the death penalty, told jurors Patterson was sane at the time of the murders. At trial, Patterson testified at length about devices the military had planted in his head.

From prison, he sent incoherent letters to the courts, including a 2004 letter to the Texas Court of Criminal Appeals, in which he wrote that he wanted to “conduct my legal work needed to stop the execution murder assaults injury execution date murder machines grave graveyard murder ...”

Shortly before his execution on May 18, 2004, the Texas Board of Pardons and Paroles recommended that Perry grant clemency, which Perry rejected. He worried that if he commuted the sentence, Patterson might be released on parole. Patterson’s last statement was a final testimony to his mental condition: “Statement to what? State what? I am not guilty of the charge of capital murder. Steal me and my family’s money. My truth will always be my truth. There is no kin and no friend; no fear what you do to me. No kin to you undertaker.”

Not the Shooter
Robert Lee Thompson did not fire the bullet that resulted in his 2009 execution. Thompson and his accomplice, Sammy Butler, robbed a Houston convenience store in 1996. Thompson shot one of the clerks four times. The man survived.

Butler shot the other clerk, Mansoor Bhai Rahim Mohammed, who died. During Butler’s 1998 trial prosecutors could not prove that Butler intended to kill Mohammed. He received a life sentence and is eligible for parole in 2036.

Jurors, however, assessed the death penalty against Thompson in 1998. Thompson had also been charged — but not convicted — in several other aggravated robberies, including three that involved murders.

The courts rejected the argument that Thompson should not receive a harsher sentence than his accomplice, but the Texas Board of Pardons and Paroles issued a rare clemency recommendation and advised that the sentence be commuted to life in prison.

Questionable Counsel
Leonard Uresti Rojas was convicted in 1996 of shooting to death his common-law wife and his brother. The appellate lawyer appointed to handle Rojas’ case was inexperienced, on probation with the state bar and suffered from mental illness, according to court documents. He had been disciplined for not adequately serving his clients and was serving three probated sentences from the bar while he was working on Rojas’ case. He missed crucial deadlines for filing appeals on Rojas’ behalf, effectively eliminating any chance he might have had for relief.

Shortly before his scheduled execution, new attorneys took on Rojas’ case. They appealed to the Texas Court of Criminal Appeals and asked Perry for a reprieve.

The pleas failed, and Rojas was executed on Dec. 4, 2002.

In a dissenting opinion published after the execution, Tom Price, an appeals court justice, scathingly rebuked the court’s decision. Death penalty appeals, he wrote, should not be left to lawyers with disciplinary problems and no experience.

“He neglected his duties,” Price wrote. “It is hard to imagine that there was no one more able or better qualified.”

“After reviewing all of the facts in the case of Robert Lee Thompson, who had a murderous history and participated in the killing of Mansoor Bhai Rahim Mohammed,” Perry said in a statement, “I have decided to uphold the jury’s capital murder conviction and capital punishment.”

Thompson was executed on Nov. 19, 2009.

And here's a link to the REPORT OF THE TEXAS FORENSIC SCIENCE COMMISSION on the Willingham investigation: http://www.fsc.state.tx.us/documents/FINAL.pdf

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

As Bill Engvall once said, "Other states are outlawing the death penalty; Texas put in an express lane!"

Actually, it was Ron White... Who is from Fritch Texas.

...and Ron was not objecting to the death penalty.

Oh no, no he wasn't... "We'll kill you back".

 

[Toro]

Please explain how a state government is deemed as big government.

There is nothing more Big Government than the state killing people.

Or are you not aware of the fact that we are against big "federal" government.

So communism at the state level is OK?

 

[Toro]

This shows how idiotic liberals are. They are against killing a man convicted of capital murder, but have no problems with killing an unborn child.

Maybe I'm a true liberal... I'm opposed to both.

Me too.

 

[Toro]

This shows how idiotic liberals are. They are against killing a man convicted of capital murder, but have no problems with killing an unborn child.

It shouldn't be the governments decision in either case.

I thought JURIES made these decisions. The government carries out sentences.

There are three branches of government - the executive, the legislative and the judiciary. Juries are part of the judiciary.

Why do conservatives think that government does nothing but fuck up yet put their absolute total faith in the judiciary to never kill an innocent person?

 

[Toro]

So, who do we have as company in our publicly sanctioned execution club?

All those barbaric Muslim countries that stone rape victims and non believers
Communist China
India
USA

Countries that have banned Capital punishment
All of Europe
Those barbaric Russians
Canada
Mexico
Australia
South America

Europe and South America are countries?

Flunked 1st grade geography I see. Lemme guess... postal worker?

Alaska governor?

 

[Wry Catcher]

How much has the murder rate in Texas gone down since Perry executed over 200 prisoners?

How many people in the entire US have been put to death since Obama took office? How many babies have been put to death since Obama took office? How many terrorists has Obama executed rather than capture and waterboard since he took office?

jHow long have you been brain dead?

 

[Lonestar_logic]

And you know this how? I'm not saying that the guy was definitely innocent, but there was an investigation into that case which turned up evidence that suggested he was innocent. Perry chose to ignore that evidence and refused to postpone his execution. Unless you were there to witness the crime, you can't say for sure that he was guilty. Personally, I want a gov't that doesn't ignore evidence, no matter where it points.

Its evidence because you say so? I call those conspiracy theories.

Guilty because you say so? Conspiracy theories? They're not conspiracy theories. The story has been in the paper along with other controversial executions that Perry chose not to stop. I could be wrong, but I doubt that Texas Tribune and the Texas Forensic Science Commission are in the conspiracy theory business.

The Innocence Project - Cameron Todd Willingham: Wrongfully Convicted and Executed in Texas

Months after Willingham was executed, the Chicago Tribune published an investigative report that raised questions about the forensic analysis. The Innocence Project assembled five of the nation’s leading independent arson experts to review the evidence in the case, and this prestigious group issued a 48-page report finding that none of the scientific analysis used to convict Willingham was valid.

In 2006, the Innocence Project formally submitted the case to the Texas Forensic Science Commission, asking the empowered state entity to launch a full investigation. Along with the Willingham case, the Innocence Project submitted information about another arson case in Texas where identical evidence was used to send another man to death row. In that case, Ernest Willis was exonerated and freed from prison because the forensic evidence was not valid.

In 2008, the Texas Forensic Science Commission agreed to investigate the case. The panel’s review was interrupted several times over the last two years, however, and continues today. In 2009, an arson expert hired by the commission issued a report finding that experts who testified at Willingham’s trial should have known it was wrong at the time. Days before the expert was set to testify, however, Gov. Rick Perry replaced key members of the panel, delayed the investigation for months.

Under Perry, Executions Raise Questions — Rick Perry | The Texas Tribune

As Gov. Rick Perry touts his tough-on-crime policies on the national political stage, the case of Cameron Todd Willingham will continue to be scrutinized. Scientists have raised questions about whether Willingham set the blaze that killed his three daughters and led to his 2004 execution.

But Willingham’s execution is not the only controversial one the governor has presided over. During nearly 11 years in office, Perry has overseen 234 executions — by far the most of any recent governor in the United States — and has rarely used his power to grant clemency. He has granted 31 death row commutations; most of those — 28 — were the result of a 2005 U.S. Supreme Court decision banning capital punishment for minors.

To his critics, his parsimonious use of clemency is notable because of continuing concerns about the ability of prisoners facing capital charges in Texas to retain quality legal representation, the execution of those who were minors when they committed their crimes, the ability of some prisoners to intellectually understand their punishment and the international ramifications of executing foreign nationals.

The Texas Tribune has compiled a database of all the executions in Texas under Perry’s leadership. Below, some of the most controversial, by category.

Mental Incapacity
Kelsey Patterson was sentenced to death for the September 1992 shooting deaths of Louis Oates and Dorothy Harris in Palestine.

Testimony showed that without provocation, Patterson walked up to Oates, 63, the owner of Oates Oil Co., and shot him. He shot Harris, 41, when she came out to see what was going on. Patterson then went to a friend’s home nearby, stripped down to his socks and waited in the street for police to arrive.

Dr. James Grigson, a psychiatrist and popular prosecution expert witness who earned the label “Dr. Death” because he rarely found defendants too mentally unfit to face the death penalty, told jurors Patterson was sane at the time of the murders. At trial, Patterson testified at length about devices the military had planted in his head.

From prison, he sent incoherent letters to the courts, including a 2004 letter to the Texas Court of Criminal Appeals, in which he wrote that he wanted to “conduct my legal work needed to stop the execution murder assaults injury execution date murder machines grave graveyard murder ...”

Shortly before his execution on May 18, 2004, the Texas Board of Pardons and Paroles recommended that Perry grant clemency, which Perry rejected. He worried that if he commuted the sentence, Patterson might be released on parole. Patterson’s last statement was a final testimony to his mental condition: “Statement to what? State what? I am not guilty of the charge of capital murder. Steal me and my family’s money. My truth will always be my truth. There is no kin and no friend; no fear what you do to me. No kin to you undertaker.”

Not the Shooter
Robert Lee Thompson did not fire the bullet that resulted in his 2009 execution. Thompson and his accomplice, Sammy Butler, robbed a Houston convenience store in 1996. Thompson shot one of the clerks four times. The man survived.

Butler shot the other clerk, Mansoor Bhai Rahim Mohammed, who died. During Butler’s 1998 trial prosecutors could not prove that Butler intended to kill Mohammed. He received a life sentence and is eligible for parole in 2036.

Jurors, however, assessed the death penalty against Thompson in 1998. Thompson had also been charged — but not convicted — in several other aggravated robberies, including three that involved murders.

The courts rejected the argument that Thompson should not receive a harsher sentence than his accomplice, but the Texas Board of Pardons and Paroles issued a rare clemency recommendation and advised that the sentence be commuted to life in prison.

Questionable Counsel
Leonard Uresti Rojas was convicted in 1996 of shooting to death his common-law wife and his brother. The appellate lawyer appointed to handle Rojas’ case was inexperienced, on probation with the state bar and suffered from mental illness, according to court documents. He had been disciplined for not adequately serving his clients and was serving three probated sentences from the bar while he was working on Rojas’ case. He missed crucial deadlines for filing appeals on Rojas’ behalf, effectively eliminating any chance he might have had for relief.

Shortly before his scheduled execution, new attorneys took on Rojas’ case. They appealed to the Texas Court of Criminal Appeals and asked Perry for a reprieve.

The pleas failed, and Rojas was executed on Dec. 4, 2002.

In a dissenting opinion published after the execution, Tom Price, an appeals court justice, scathingly rebuked the court’s decision. Death penalty appeals, he wrote, should not be left to lawyers with disciplinary problems and no experience.

“He neglected his duties,” Price wrote. “It is hard to imagine that there was no one more able or better qualified.”

“After reviewing all of the facts in the case of Robert Lee Thompson, who had a murderous history and participated in the killing of Mansoor Bhai Rahim Mohammed,” Perry said in a statement, “I have decided to uphold the jury’s capital murder conviction and capital punishment.”

Thompson was executed on Nov. 19, 2009.

And here's a link to the REPORT OF THE TEXAS FORENSIC SCIENCE COMMISSION on the Willingham investigation: http://www.fsc.state.tx.us/documents/FINAL.pdf

Yet no proof he was innocent.

 

[OldUSAFSniper]

So, who do we have as company in our publicly sanctioned execution club?

All those barbaric Muslim countries that stone rape victims and non believers
Communist China
India
USA

Countries that have banned Capital punishment
All of Europe
Those barbaric Russians
Canada
Mexico
Australia
South America

Europe and South America are countries?

Flunked 1st grade geography I see. Lemme guess... postal worker?

Alaska governor?

Are you trying to say that Alaska Governor Sean Parnell would not know that Europe and South America are not countries?? I'm confused as to what you are implying.

 

[Wry Catcher]

34 States have the death penalty on the books; sixteen have abolished it.

States With and Without the Death Penalty | Death Penalty Information Center

 

[J.E.D]

Its evidence because you say so? I call those conspiracy theories.

Guilty because you say so? Conspiracy theories? They're not conspiracy theories. The story has been in the paper along with other controversial executions that Perry chose not to stop. I could be wrong, but I doubt that Texas Tribune and the Texas Forensic Science Commission are in the conspiracy theory business.

Under Perry, Executions Raise Questions — Rick Perry | The Texas Tribune

As Gov. Rick Perry touts his tough-on-crime policies on the national political stage, the case of Cameron Todd Willingham will continue to be scrutinized. Scientists have raised questions about whether Willingham set the blaze that killed his three daughters and led to his 2004 execution.

But Willingham’s execution is not the only controversial one the governor has presided over. During nearly 11 years in office, Perry has overseen 234 executions — by far the most of any recent governor in the United States — and has rarely used his power to grant clemency. He has granted 31 death row commutations; most of those — 28 — were the result of a 2005 U.S. Supreme Court decision banning capital punishment for minors.

To his critics, his parsimonious use of clemency is notable because of continuing concerns about the ability of prisoners facing capital charges in Texas to retain quality legal representation, the execution of those who were minors when they committed their crimes, the ability of some prisoners to intellectually understand their punishment and the international ramifications of executing foreign nationals.

The Texas Tribune has compiled a database of all the executions in Texas under Perry’s leadership. Below, some of the most controversial, by category.

Mental Incapacity
Kelsey Patterson was sentenced to death for the September 1992 shooting deaths of Louis Oates and Dorothy Harris in Palestine.

Testimony showed that without provocation, Patterson walked up to Oates, 63, the owner of Oates Oil Co., and shot him. He shot Harris, 41, when she came out to see what was going on. Patterson then went to a friend’s home nearby, stripped down to his socks and waited in the street for police to arrive.

Dr. James Grigson, a psychiatrist and popular prosecution expert witness who earned the label “Dr. Death” because he rarely found defendants too mentally unfit to face the death penalty, told jurors Patterson was sane at the time of the murders. At trial, Patterson testified at length about devices the military had planted in his head.

From prison, he sent incoherent letters to the courts, including a 2004 letter to the Texas Court of Criminal Appeals, in which he wrote that he wanted to “conduct my legal work needed to stop the execution murder assaults injury execution date murder machines grave graveyard murder ...”

Shortly before his execution on May 18, 2004, the Texas Board of Pardons and Paroles recommended that Perry grant clemency, which Perry rejected. He worried that if he commuted the sentence, Patterson might be released on parole. Patterson’s last statement was a final testimony to his mental condition: “Statement to what? State what? I am not guilty of the charge of capital murder. Steal me and my family’s money. My truth will always be my truth. There is no kin and no friend; no fear what you do to me. No kin to you undertaker.”

Not the Shooter
Robert Lee Thompson did not fire the bullet that resulted in his 2009 execution. Thompson and his accomplice, Sammy Butler, robbed a Houston convenience store in 1996. Thompson shot one of the clerks four times. The man survived.

Butler shot the other clerk, Mansoor Bhai Rahim Mohammed, who died. During Butler’s 1998 trial prosecutors could not prove that Butler intended to kill Mohammed. He received a life sentence and is eligible for parole in 2036.

Jurors, however, assessed the death penalty against Thompson in 1998. Thompson had also been charged — but not convicted — in several other aggravated robberies, including three that involved murders.

The courts rejected the argument that Thompson should not receive a harsher sentence than his accomplice, but the Texas Board of Pardons and Paroles issued a rare clemency recommendation and advised that the sentence be commuted to life in prison.

Questionable Counsel
Leonard Uresti Rojas was convicted in 1996 of shooting to death his common-law wife and his brother. The appellate lawyer appointed to handle Rojas’ case was inexperienced, on probation with the state bar and suffered from mental illness, according to court documents. He had been disciplined for not adequately serving his clients and was serving three probated sentences from the bar while he was working on Rojas’ case. He missed crucial deadlines for filing appeals on Rojas’ behalf, effectively eliminating any chance he might have had for relief.

Shortly before his scheduled execution, new attorneys took on Rojas’ case. They appealed to the Texas Court of Criminal Appeals and asked Perry for a reprieve.

The pleas failed, and Rojas was executed on Dec. 4, 2002.

In a dissenting opinion published after the execution, Tom Price, an appeals court justice, scathingly rebuked the court’s decision. Death penalty appeals, he wrote, should not be left to lawyers with disciplinary problems and no experience.

“He neglected his duties,” Price wrote. “It is hard to imagine that there was no one more able or better qualified.”

“After reviewing all of the facts in the case of Robert Lee Thompson, who had a murderous history and participated in the killing of Mansoor Bhai Rahim Mohammed,” Perry said in a statement, “I have decided to uphold the jury’s capital murder conviction and capital punishment.”

Thompson was executed on Nov. 19, 2009.

And here's a link to the REPORT OF THE TEXAS FORENSIC SCIENCE COMMISSION on the Willingham investigation: http://www.fsc.state.tx.us/documents/FINAL.pdf

Yet no proof he was innocent.

Yeah, except for the REPORT OF THE TEXAS FORENSIC SCIENCE COMMISSION, which found that the forensic evidence in the case wasn't accurate. Keep telling yourself that.

 

[Jarhead]

Please explain how a state government is deemed as big government.

There is nothing more Big Government than the state killing people.

Or are you not aware of the fact that we are against big "federal" government.

So communism at the state level is OK?

No..

But if and when a state government becomes too large or too controlling I have the option of moving to another state without having to leave the land that I love.

There IS a difference.

 

[Jarhead]

JosefK....I am curious.....exactly what is your point? Are you saying that Perry had access to infomration that may have proven the guy innocent yet he opted to ignore it and let the man die by lethal injection anyway?

Do you truly believe Perry is such a man?

Do you realize that there was likely an enormous amount of evidence against the man where the "innacuracy" of the aforementioned evidence still did not change the sentiments that the man was guilty?

I dont know this for sure...but I must assume this is the case. Perry does not come across as a man that likes to kill people.

 

[Toro]

Europe and South America are countries?

Flunked 1st grade geography I see. Lemme guess... postal worker?

Alaska governor?

Are you trying to say that Alaska Governor Sean Parnell would not know that Europe and South America are not countries?? I'm confused as to what you are implying.

lol

touché