Boycott Arizona.

[Cecilie1200]

If you have to ask, "what's the big deal", you're hopeless.
If you're here illegally, you are a criminial; if you hire an illegal alien, you (the employer) is a criminal and conspire to violate Federal Law.
Capisca?

If I'm here legally, can I carry proof of citizenship?

Of course you CAN. That's not the point, is it? Are you required to carry 'papers'? Nope. At least not in the U.S. Seems as if the RW Fringe hope we become more like the former Soviet Bloc, a police state, wherein everyone is required to show their citizen papers, passport, etc just because some government bureaucrat is bored and doesn't like the cut of your pants (or likes the cut of you girlfriends blouse) and need entertainment.

Actually, my understanding is that the law ALREADY requires legal permanent residents - aka green card holders - to have their green card in their possession at all times. Oops. Your bad.

 

[Zona]

Isn't checking people's papers the epitome of Big Government?

This involves brown people. Seems, it doesn't matter to republicans.

 

[Wry Catcher]

If I'm here legally, can I carry proof of citizenship?

Of course you CAN. That's not the point, is it? Are you required to carry 'papers'? Nope. At least not in the U.S. Seems as if the RW Fringe hope we become more like the former Soviet Bloc, a police state, wherein everyone is required to show their citizen papers, passport, etc just because some government bureaucrat is bored and doesn't like the cut of your pants (or likes the cut of you girlfriends blouse) and need entertainment.

Actually, my understanding is that the law ALREADY requires legal permanent residents - aka green card hold.ers - to have their green card in their possession at all times. Oops. Your bad.

You missed the point. Read real slowly...simply because a peace officer has a reasonable suspicion someone doesn't look like a native born or naturalized citizen, the officer does not have the authority to stop and search the person. Read the Fourth Amedment to the U.S. Constitution and then the 14th Amendment.
Simply because a resident alien must carry such ID does not give a peace officer the authority to 'search' or demand proof of legal status, notwithstanding the Governnor of Arizona's opinion.

 

[Zona]

If I'm here legally, can I carry proof of citizenship?

Of course you CAN. That's not the point, is it? Are you required to carry 'papers'? Nope. At least not in the U.S. Seems as if the RW Fringe hope we become more like the former Soviet Bloc, a police state, wherein everyone is required to show their citizen papers, passport, etc just because some government bureaucrat is bored and doesn't like the cut of your pants (or likes the cut of you girlfriends blouse) and need entertainment.

Actually, my understanding is that the law ALREADY requires legal permanent residents - aka green card holders - to have their green card in their possession at all times. Oops. Your bad.

I have to look this up, but apparently, a green card alone is not enough. I know a license isn't. I also know military id is not good enough.

Big government at its worse.

 

[SFC Ollie]

Isn't checking people's papers the epitome of Big Government?

This involves brown people. Seems, it doesn't matter to republicans.

**** you Zona, My wife is of Mexican decent. And we are against illegals not people of any color skin.

 

[Zona]

Isn't checking people's papers the epitome of Big Government?

This involves brown people. Seems, it doesn't matter to republicans.

**** you Zona, My wife is of Mexican decent. And we are against illegals not people of any color skin.

Such language! Oh and stay the **** out of our state. OH and God bless.

 

[del]

Of course you CAN. That's not the point, is it? Are you required to carry 'papers'? Nope. At least not in the U.S. Seems as if the RW Fringe hope we become more like the former Soviet Bloc, a police state, wherein everyone is required to show their citizen papers, passport, etc just because some government bureaucrat is bored and doesn't like the cut of your pants (or likes the cut of you girlfriends blouse) and need entertainment.

tissue?

Please disagree with me Del, but don't pretend to be as F'n stupid as the RW Fringe (sometimes you make sense).

link?

 

[Cecilie1200]

Of course you CAN. That's not the point, is it? Are you required to carry 'papers'? Nope. At least not in the U.S. Seems as if the RW Fringe hope we become more like the former Soviet Bloc, a police state, wherein everyone is required to show their citizen papers, passport, etc just because some government bureaucrat is bored and doesn't like the cut of your pants (or likes the cut of you girlfriends blouse) and need entertainment.

Actually, my understanding is that the law ALREADY requires legal permanent residents - aka green card hold.ers - to have their green card in their possession at all times. Oops. Your bad.

You missed the point. Read real slowly...simply because a peace officer has a reasonable suspicion someone doesn't look like a native born or naturalized citizen, the officer does not have the authority to stop and search the person. Read the Fourth Amedment to the U.S. Constitution and then the 14th Amendment.
Simply because a resident alien must carry such ID does not give a peace officer the authority to 'search' or demand proof of legal status, notwithstanding the Governnor of Arizona's opinion.

Read slowly: where does the new law say "reasonable suspicion someone doesn't look native-born"? And where do you get the idea this is just "the Governor of Arizona's opinion", or for that matter that she ever expressed the crap you're spouting at all?

And read the passage I took the liberty of highlighting. Sounds like I got the point I was answering pretty clearly. Some people ARE required to carry papers.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Okay, enough paranoid screeching. Let's explore the actual "horror" that is this law, shall we? That is, if too much reality won't permanently damage the leftist brains around here.

A. NO OFFICIAL OR AGENCY OF THIS STATE OR A COUNTY, CITY, TOWN OR OTHER POLITICAL SUBDIVISION OF THIS STATE MAY ADOPT A POLICY THAT LIMITS OR RESTRICTS THE ENFORCEMENT OF FEDERAL IMMIGRATION LAWS TO LESS THAN THE FULL EXTENT PERMITTED BY FEDERAL LAW.

Ohmigod. No "sanctuary cities". A law that requires the environs of this state to abide by federal immigration law. ::gasp::

B. FOR ANY LAWFUL CONTACT MADE BY A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICIAL OR AGENCY
21 OF THIS STATE OR A COUNTY, CITY, TOWN OR OTHER POLITICAL SUBDIVISION OF THIS STATE WHERE REASONABLE SUSPICION EXISTS THAT THE PERSON IS AN ALIEN WHO IS UNLAWFULLY PRESENT IN THE UNITED STATES, A REASONABLE ATTEMPT SHALL BE MADE, WHEN PRACTICABLE, TO DETERMINE THE IMMIGRATION STATUS OF THE PERSON. THE PERSON'S IMMIGRATION STATUS SHALL BE VERIFIED WITH THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT PURSUANT TO 8 UNITED STATES CODE SECTION 1373(c).

I'm guessing this is the part that has all the leftist panties in a ruffle about "stopping people on the street", but they sorta missed the "lawful contact" part and the "verification pursuant to" already existing federal law. Not exactly the big, shocking Gestapo action they'd like us to believe.

C. IF AN ALIEN WHO IS UNLAWFULLY PRESENT IN THE UNITED STATES IS CONVICTED OF A VIOLATION OF STATE OR LOCAL LAW, ON DISCHARGE FROM IMPRISONMENT OR ASSESSMENT OF ANY FINE THAT IS IMPOSED, THE ALIEN SHALL BE TRANSFERRED IMMEDIATELY TO THE CUSTODY OF THE UNITED STATES IMMIGRATION AND CUSTOMS ENFORCEMENT OR THE UNITED STATES CUSTOMS AND BORDER PROTECTION.

Deportation of criminals?! What IS the world coming to?

D. NOTWITHSTANDING ANY OTHER LAW, A LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCY MAY SECURELY TRANSPORT AN ALIEN WHO IS UNLAWFULLY PRESENT IN THE UNITED STATES AND WHO IS IN THE AGENCY'S CUSTODY TO A FEDERAL FACILITY IN THIS STATE OR TO ANY OTHER POINT OF TRANSFER INTO FEDERAL CUSTODY THAT IS OUTSIDE THE JURISDICTION OF THE LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCY.

More facilitation of deporting illegals.

E. A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER, WITHOUT A WARRANT, MAY ARREST A PERSON IF THE OFFICER HAS PROBABLE CAUSE TO BELIEVE THAT THE PERSON HAS COMMITTED
ANY PUBLIC OFFENSE THAT MAKES THE PERSON REMOVABLE FROM THE UNITED STATES.

Look, guys. No arrests just for "looking Latino", whatever you'd like us to believe.

F. EXCEPT AS PROVIDED IN FEDERAL LAW, OFFICIALS OR AGENCIES OF THIS STATE AND COUNTIES, CITIES, TOWNS AND OTHER POLITICAL SUBDIVISIONS OF THIS STATE MAY NOT BE PROHIBITED OR IN ANY WAY BE RESTRICTED FROM SENDING, RECEIVING OR MAINTAINING INFORMATION RELATING TO THE IMMIGRATION STATUS OF ANY INDIVIDUAL OR EXCHANGING THAT INFORMATION WITH ANY OTHER FEDERAL, STATE OR LOCAL GOVERNMENTAL ENTITY FOR THE FOLLOWING OFFICIAL PURPOSES:

1. DETERMINING ELIGIBILITY FOR ANY PUBLIC BENEFIT, SERVICE OR LICENSE PROVIDED BY ANY FEDERAL, STATE, LOCAL OR OTHER POLITICAL SUBDIVISION OF THIS STATE.

2. VERIFYING ANY CLAIM OF RESIDENCE OR DOMICILE IF DETERMINATION OF RESIDENCE OR DOMICILE IS REQUIRED UNDER THE LAWS OF THIS STATE OR A JUDICIAL ORDER ISSUED PURSUANT TO A CIVIL OR CRIMINAL PROCEEDING IN THIS STATE.

3. CONFIRMING THE IDENTITY OF ANY PERSON WHO IS DETAINED.

4. IF THE PERSON IS AN ALIEN, DETERMINING WHETHER THE PERSON IS IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE FEDERAL REGISTRATION LAWS PRESCRIBED BY TITLE II, CHAPTER 7 OF THE FEDERAL IMMIGRATION AND NATIONALITY ACT.

Communication between government agencies, rather than expecting them to pretend ignorance and collude with illegals in their law-breaking. It's just all too, too sordid and shocking, ain't it?

G. A PERSON MAY BRING AN ACTION IN SUPERIOR COURT TO CHALLENGE ANY OFFICIAL OR AGENCY OF THIS STATE OR A COUNTY, CITY, TOWN OR OTHER POLITICAL SUBDIVISION OF THIS STATE THAT ADOPTS OR IMPLEMENTS A POLICY THAT LIMITS OR4 RESTRICTS THE ENFORCEMENT OF FEDERAL IMMIGRATION LAWS TO LESS THAN THE FULL EXTENT PERMITTED BY FEDERAL LAW. IF THERE IS A JUDICIAL FINDING THAT AN ENTITY HAS VIOLATED THIS SECTION, THE COURT SHALL ORDER ANY OF THE FOLLOWING:

1. THAT THE PERSON WHO BROUGHT THE ACTION RECOVER COURT COSTS AND ATTORNEY FEES.

2. THAT THE ENTITY PAY A CIVIL PENALTY OF NOT LESS THAN ONE THOUSAND DOLLARS AND NOT MORE THAN FIVE THOUSAND DOLLARS FOR EACH DAY THAT THE POLICY HAS REMAINED IN EFFECT AFTER THE FILING OF AN ACTION PURSUANT TO THIS SUBSECTION.

What's this? Giving the people legal standing to rein in misbehaving local government? Well, we can't have THAT.

H. A COURT SHALL COLLECT THE CIVIL PENALTY PRESCRIBED IN SUBSECTION G AND REMIT THE CIVIL PENALTY TO THE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY FOR DEPOSIT IN
THE GANG AND IMMIGRATION INTELLIGENCE TEAM ENFORCEMENT MISSION FUND
ESTABLISHED BY SECTION 41-1724.

Gotta do something with the fines, and this seems logical.

I. A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER IS INDEMNIFIED BY THE LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER'S AGENCY AGAINST REASONABLE COSTS AND EXPENSES, INCLUDING ATTORNEY FEES, INCURRED BY THE OFFICER IN CONNECTION WITH ANY ACTION, SUIT OR PROCEEDING BROUGHT PURSUANT TO THIS SECTION TO WHICH THE OFFICER MAY BE A PARTY BY REASON OF THE OFFICER BEING OR HAVING BEEN A MEMBER OF THE LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCY, EXCEPT IN RELATION TO MATTERS IN WHICH THE OFFICER IS ADJUDGED TO HAVE ACTED IN BAD FAITH.

Protecting law enforcement officers from punishment for doing their jobs properly. That'll certainly chap some liberal hides.

J. THIS SECTION SHALL BE IMPLEMENTED IN A MANNER CONSISTENT WITH FEDERAL LAWS REGULATING IMMIGRATION, PROTECTING THE CIVIL RIGHTS OF ALL PERSONS AND RESPECTING THE PRIVILEGES AND IMMUNITIES OF UNITED STATES CITIZENS.

What?! Respecting federal law and protecting civil rights? But I thought we were all about Gestapo harassment!

. . . To be continued.

 

[Wry Catcher]

tissue?

Please disagree with me Del, but don't pretend to be as F'n stupid as the RW Fringe (sometimes you make sense).

link?

Link? Ah, um...I...ah...maybe you have never made sense?

 

[eagleseven]

At least some in Arizona are real Americans

Indeed. Most in Arizona are real Mexicans...

 

[Wry Catcher]

At least some in Arizona are real Americans

Indeed. Most in Arizona are real Mexicans...

"The only positive thing we saw this year were signs in busineses in Flagstaff stating, "NO FIREARMS!". At least some in Arizona are real Americans and understand the real meaning of freedom and libery."
Quotes in context are honest, out of context less so.

 

[eagleseven]

At least some in Arizona are real Americans

Indeed. Most in Arizona are real Mexicans...

"The only positive thing we saw this year were signs in busineses in Flagstaff stating, "NO FIREARMS!". At least some in Arizona are real Americans and understand the real meaning of freedom and libery."
Quotes in context are honest, out of context less so.

Because Real Americans ignore the bill of rights?

Creo que confudiste Mexicanos para Yanquis...

 

[Wry Catcher]

Indeed. Most in Arizona are real Mexicans...

"The only positive thing we saw this year were signs in busineses in Flagstaff stating, "NO FIREARMS!". At least some in Arizona are real Americans and understand the real meaning of freedom and libery."
Quotes in context are honest, out of context less so.

Because Real Americans ignore the bill of rights?

Creo que confudiste Mexicanos para Yanquis...

"

"Because Real Americans ignore the Bill of Rights?" Yep, you be ignorant. The Bill of Rights, in this particular case the Second Amendment, does not protect a citizen from being denied entry into a private business by the business ownership. You may feel you have the right to do so, but you do not.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Notwithstanding the outrage of the fringe, it seems the movement to boycott Arizona is underway.

 

[Tom Clancy]

Is there a way to boycott you?

 

[Wry Catcher]

Is there a way to boycott you?

Sure, I generally boycott the posts of those I consider not worthy of my time. You may have noticed this is the first and likely my last acknowledgment of you.

 

[Tom Clancy]

Is there a way to boycott you?

Sure, I generally boycott the posts of those I consider not worthy of my time. You may have noticed this is the first and likely my last acknowledgment of you.

Good for you, now go crawl back into your Partisan cave.

 

[manu1959]

their law is basically the same as the fed one ICE enforces (or doesn't enforce) ...

are you all planning on boycotting america.....

 

[Wry Catcher]

their law is basically the same as the fed one ICE enforces (or doesn't enforce) ...

are you all planning on boycotting america.....

No it's not. INS agents had probable cause (usually when we called them to report we had an illegal alien in custody); I assume this is true now that the agency has been renamed ICE.
The Arizona law sets aside the Probable Cause requirment and allows any peace officer the power to stop anyone s/he has reasonable suspicion that they're an illegal alien.
So someone from Portugul or Spain, Italy or Greece, on vacation in Arizona is at risk of providing papers (their passport) based solely on their appearance, or poor English.
Even with their passport they may be taken into temporary custody until they are able to prove they are in our country legally.

As to your question. Yep, we will boycott Arizona. I usually go to see some Spring baseball, and have gone to see the Niners play the Cards. We had planned to go again this May (our second time in 2010) to watch the Giants and Padres and then the Giants and Diamondbacks - not now. I'll spend my money in So. Ca. as well as hope the Red Wings beat the Coyotes tomorrow night. Not that I'll go to Detroit, but I might have gone to Phoenix if the Sharks there.

in May - now we plan on seeing the Padres only.