BORN IN THE USA? Birth certificate issue No. 1 at Fox News

[Care4all]

you have obama's certification of birth in honolulu, hawaii which is the ONLY legal document required by the court of law, as verification of birth.
you have a certificate of birth for obama, filed with the hawaii department of health registrar 4 days after his birth which definitively proves that he could NOT have been born in kenya, and gotten to hawaii, and gotten the proper paperwork and approval from the director of health to issue his birth certificate as a foriegn born child.

then you have a newspaper that has the Hawaii State Health Bureau of Statistics, listing the birth of barak obama with his parents specific address, along with all other children born in hawaii around his date of birth, just 9 days later...another FACT that makes it impossible that he was born in kenya....

yet you guys continue on this quest as if you have some legitimate complaint when it is PLAIN AS DAY imho, that there is NO legitimacy at all with your claims....NONE!

Here is the link to the Advisor, newspaper, where the Bureau of Health Statistics, listed the birth of Obama, with other children born on the same day, in hawaii....this was not a notice of birth by family members, but a government agency required to verify and keep track of such statistics.
http://wikileaks.org/leak/obama-1961-birth-announcement-from-honolulu-advertiser.pdf
I hate to say it, and it is generally not in my character to say things like I am going to say, but GAME OVER, DONE, FINISHED...it has been proven that Barack O is a natural born citizen and was born in honolulu, Hawaii.

And even if he wasn't born in Hawaii, and his mother met the qualifications of a child being born overseas that is listed on the links that were provided, he is STILL considered a natural born citizen, as John Mccain is considered a natural born citizen by meeting the military rules followed.

So who knows what the true argument is on this kenya thing anyway...the rules and reasons keep changing on why obama can't be a citizen....

Care

false

if the original is available, that is the best evidence. that is the law. read federal rules of evidence regarding hearsay....in a court of law, if the original exists, the certification would be objected to and sustained and obama would have to provide either the original, or most likely a certified copy of the certificate of live birth. did you not read anything i said about prima facie?

see also

§338-19 Photostatic or typewritten copies of records. The department of health is authorized to prepare typewritten, photostatic, or microphotographic copies of any records and files in its office, which by reason of age, usage, or otherwise are in such condition that they can no longer be conveniently consulted or used without danger of serious injury or destruction thereof, and to certify to the correctness of such copies. The typewritten, photostatic, or microphotographic copies shall be competent evidence in all courts of the State with like force and effect as the original.

FALSE the law in hawaii specifically STATES that the certification of birth IS THE ONLY DOCUMENT NEEDED for any court of law, or for ANY LEGAL REASON, for the certification of birth.

What is it about this that you don't understand? Do you want me to list the statutes covering this? Do you want Hawaii to change their laws so to meet your personal requirements?

It's the law Yurt, the certification of birth is their birth certificates for any legal need?

It is AGAINST THE LAW for anyone's original birth certificate being released by the Health Department.

 

[Care4all]

What on the original do you want to see so badly? The hospital? what?

 

[Yurt]

you have obama's certification of birth in honolulu, hawaii which is the ONLY legal document required by the court of law, as verification of birth.
you have a certificate of birth for obama, filed with the hawaii department of health registrar 4 days after his birth which definitively proves that he could NOT have been born in kenya, and gotten to hawaii, and gotten the proper paperwork and approval from the director of health to issue his birth certificate as a foriegn born child.

then you have a newspaper that has the Hawaii State Health Bureau of Statistics, listing the birth of barak obama with his parents specific address, along with all other children born in hawaii around his date of birth, just 9 days later...another FACT that makes it impossible that he was born in kenya....

yet you guys continue on this quest as if you have some legitimate complaint when it is PLAIN AS DAY imho, that there is NO legitimacy at all with your claims....NONE!

Here is the link to the Advisor, newspaper, where the Bureau of Health Statistics, listed the birth of Obama, with other children born on the same day, in hawaii....this was not a notice of birth by family members, but a government agency required to verify and keep track of such statistics.
http://wikileaks.org/leak/obama-1961-birth-announcement-from-honolulu-advertiser.pdf
I hate to say it, and it is generally not in my character to say things like I am going to say, but GAME OVER, DONE, FINISHED...it has been proven that Barack O is a natural born citizen and was born in honolulu, Hawaii.

And even if he wasn't born in Hawaii, and his mother met the qualifications of a child being born overseas that is listed on the links that were provided, he is STILL considered a natural born citizen, as John Mccain is considered a natural born citizen by meeting the military rules followed.

So who knows what the true argument is on this kenya thing anyway...the rules and reasons keep changing on why obama can't be a citizen....

Care

false

if the original is available, that is the best evidence. that is the law. read federal rules of evidence regarding hearsay....in a court of law, if the original exists, the certification would be objected to and sustained and obama would have to provide either the original, or most likely a certified copy of the certificate of live birth. did you not read anything i said about prima facie?

see also

§338-19 Photostatic or typewritten copies of records. The department of health is authorized to prepare typewritten, photostatic, or microphotographic copies of any records and files in its office, which by reason of age, usage, or otherwise are in such condition that they can no longer be conveniently consulted or used without danger of serious injury or destruction thereof, and to certify to the correctness of such copies. The typewritten, photostatic, or microphotographic copies shall be competent evidence in all courts of the State with like force and effect as the original.

FALSE the law in hawaii specifically STATES that the certification of birth IS THE ONLY DOCUMENT NEEDED for any court of law, or for ANY LEGAL REASON, for the certification of birth.

What is it about this that you don't understand? Do you want me to list the statutes covering this? Do you want Hawaii to change their laws so to meet your personal requirements?

It's the law Yurt, the certification of birth is their birth certificates for any legal need?

It is AGAINST THE LAW for anyone's original birth certificate being released by the Health Department.

yes provide the law that says a computer generated copy is the ONLY document needed. the statutes i cited list when a non original can be used in a court of law....the best evidence rule is well established law, i guarantee you HI evidence code mirrors the federal evidence code. i am not saying that computer generated copy is not valid, i am telling you as a fact that it is not the best evidence, period. if an original is available, either the original or a copy of the original is the best evidence.

i have explained, at your request, what prima facie evidence means, it clearly means the evidence is not conclusive. the document itself says it is NOT the best evidence. what more do you need?

 

[Yurt]

What on the original do you want to see so badly? The hospital? what?

why do you, the dems and obama want to hide it so badly? why?

10 minutes, $10

just think of all the time you've spent arguing against providing, think of all the court time obama has spent arguing against it, think of all the time he has spent deleting requests from the transparency in government website

10 minutes, $10

there is really no excuse for not simply putting this to rest and providing a certified copy of the original. none.

 

[KittenKoder]

What on the original do you want to see so badly? The hospital? what?

why do you, the dems and obama want to hide it so badly? why?

10 minutes, $10

just think of all the time you've spent arguing against providing, think of all the court time obama has spent arguing against it, think of all the time he has spent deleting requests from the transparency in government website

10 minutes, $10

there is really no excuse for not simply putting this to rest and providing a certified copy of the original. none.

Yes, there is an excuse, to keep people distracted so they can't do anything to oppose his idiotic policies because they are wasting more time worrying about this instead.

 

[Yurt]

What on the original do you want to see so badly? The hospital? what?

why do you, the dems and obama want to hide it so badly? why?

10 minutes, $10

just think of all the time you've spent arguing against providing, think of all the court time obama has spent arguing against it, think of all the time he has spent deleting requests from the transparency in government website

10 minutes, $10

there is really no excuse for not simply putting this to rest and providing a certified copy of the original. none.

Yes, there is an excuse, to keep people distracted so they can't do anything to oppose his idiotic policies because they are wasting more time worrying about this instead.

logical fallacy, assumes people can't think about more than one subject. good grief kitten....why don't you pick and choose the topics of this forum so we can stay on "topic"

 

[KittenKoder]

why do you, the dems and obama want to hide it so badly? why?

10 minutes, $10

just think of all the time you've spent arguing against providing, think of all the court time obama has spent arguing against it, think of all the time he has spent deleting requests from the transparency in government website

10 minutes, $10

there is really no excuse for not simply putting this to rest and providing a certified copy of the original. none.

Yes, there is an excuse, to keep people distracted so they can't do anything to oppose his idiotic policies because they are wasting more time worrying about this instead.

logical fallacy, assumes people can't think about more than one subject. good grief kitten....why don't you pick and choose the topics of this forum so we can stay on "topic"

They can? Could have fooled me ... and it seems to have fooled the media. Fact is, people are capable of dong something but that does not mean they do it. People can think for themselves, but how many do you really know that do? People can cook for themselves, but how many eat home cooked meals these days?

No, people are letting themselves be easily distracted, many have decided to turn off their brains altogether, and this is issue is just evidence that it's working and that the media is trying to keep people that way. But it won't last much longer, if people stopped focusing on these tiny issues.

There are three active threads on this very topic, always at least one with a recent post, often all three in the most recent five. Tell me it's not working again after considering that. Just because you are not fully focused on one thing does not mean you are not distracted.

 

[Yurt]

Yes, there is an excuse, to keep people distracted so they can't do anything to oppose his idiotic policies because they are wasting more time worrying about this instead.

logical fallacy, assumes people can't think about more than one subject. good grief kitten....why don't you pick and choose the topics of this forum so we can stay on "topic"

They can? Could have fooled me ... and it seems to have fooled the media. Fact is, people are capable of dong something but that does not mean they do it. People can think for themselves, but how many do you really know that do? People can cook for themselves, but how many eat home cooked meals these days?

No, people are letting themselves be easily distracted, many have decided to turn off their brains altogether, and this is issue is just evidence that it's working and that the media is trying to keep people that way. But it won't last much longer, if people stopped focusing on these tiny issues.

There are three active threads on this very topic, always at least one with a recent post, often all three in the most recent five. Tell me it's not working again after considering that. Just because you are not fully focused on one thing does not mean you are not distracted.

so there are no threads about anything else....no threads about his speeches, the budget, the wasteful spendulus spending etc....

i enjoy the debate on it becuase its fun to dellve into evidence rules etc...

 

[KittenKoder]

logical fallacy, assumes people can't think about more than one subject. good grief kitten....why don't you pick and choose the topics of this forum so we can stay on "topic"

They can? Could have fooled me ... and it seems to have fooled the media. Fact is, people are capable of dong something but that does not mean they do it. People can think for themselves, but how many do you really know that do? People can cook for themselves, but how many eat home cooked meals these days?

No, people are letting themselves be easily distracted, many have decided to turn off their brains altogether, and this is issue is just evidence that it's working and that the media is trying to keep people that way. But it won't last much longer, if people stopped focusing on these tiny issues.

There are three active threads on this very topic, always at least one with a recent post, often all three in the most recent five. Tell me it's not working again after considering that. Just because you are not fully focused on one thing does not mean you are not distracted.

so there are no threads about anything else....no threads about his speeches, the budget, the wasteful spendulus spending etc....

i enjoy the debate on it becuase its fun to dellve into evidence rules etc...

Again, just because they exist doesn't make them as active. The only reason I ventured into these threads was because it was either here, Flame Zone threads, or more about the environuts ... getting bored with the other two. All the rest come and go, topics having short lives really, except this one, this one is just itching so many people ... ever notice that?

 

[Zoom-boing]

What on the original do you want to see so badly? The hospital? what?

why do you, the dems and obama want to hide it so badly? why?

10 minutes, $10

just think of all the time you've spent arguing against providing, think of all the court time obama has spent arguing against it, think of all the time he has spent deleting requests from the transparency in government website

10 minutes, $10

there is really no excuse for not simply putting this to rest and providing a certified copy of the original. none.

The fact that he is going to great lengths to not have this released . . . . leads one to believe that there is something on it that he does not want the public to know. That's how it appears to me anyway.

 

[Yurt]

They can? Could have fooled me ... and it seems to have fooled the media. Fact is, people are capable of dong something but that does not mean they do it. People can think for themselves, but how many do you really know that do? People can cook for themselves, but how many eat home cooked meals these days?

No, people are letting themselves be easily distracted, many have decided to turn off their brains altogether, and this is issue is just evidence that it's working and that the media is trying to keep people that way. But it won't last much longer, if people stopped focusing on these tiny issues.

There are three active threads on this very topic, always at least one with a recent post, often all three in the most recent five. Tell me it's not working again after considering that. Just because you are not fully focused on one thing does not mean you are not distracted.

so there are no threads about anything else....no threads about his speeches, the budget, the wasteful spendulus spending etc....

i enjoy the debate on it becuase its fun to dellve into evidence rules etc...

Again, just because they exist doesn't make them as active. The only reason I ventured into these threads was because it was either here, Flame Zone threads, or more about the environuts ... getting bored with the other two. All the rest come and go, topics having short lives really, except this one, this one is just itching so many people ... ever notice that?

nope....people still talk about how bush stole the elections in 2000...people still talk about how obama is a socialist, turning this country into a socialist country, the fact his peeps avoid taxes, etc... this is not the only topic that keeps getting discussed. the fact that this topic has really only one subject - obama's birth certificate - may make it seem boring and repetitive to you, however, that is ONLY because obama refuses to release a copy thereof. it hasn't distracted me the least from his other failures, this one intrigues primarily in that so many are so wrong about what the law says regarding his certification vs his certificate.

 

[jgbkab]

What on the original do you want to see so badly? The hospital? what?

why do you, the dems and obama want to hide it so badly? why?

10 minutes, $10

just think of all the time you've spent arguing against providing, think of all the court time obama has spent arguing against it, think of all the time he has spent deleting requests from the transparency in government website

10 minutes, $10

there is really no excuse for not simply putting this to rest and providing a certified copy of the original. none.

The fact that he is going to great lengths to not have this released . . . . leads one to believe that there is something on it that he does not want the public to know. That's how it appears to me anyway.

Well, I'm sure we all can agree that it's not where he was born or his citizenship status.

 

[Zoom-boing]

why do you, the dems and obama want to hide it so badly? why?

10 minutes, $10

just think of all the time you've spent arguing against providing, think of all the court time obama has spent arguing against it, think of all the time he has spent deleting requests from the transparency in government website

10 minutes, $10

there is really no excuse for not simply putting this to rest and providing a certified copy of the original. none.

The fact that he is going to great lengths to not have this released . . . . leads one to believe that there is something on it that he does not want the public to know. That's how it appears to me anyway.

Well, I'm sure we all can agree that it's not where he was born or his citizenship status.

What other info is on the long form? Are all long forms alike?

 

[jgbkab]

The fact that he is going to great lengths to not have this released . . . . leads one to believe that there is something on it that he does not want the public to know. That's how it appears to me anyway.

Well, I'm sure we all can agree that it's not where he was born or his citizenship status.

What other info is on the long form? Are all long forms alike?

It's mother and father personal information and hospital and doctor information. No country of birth or none of that. It's on the other BC conspiracy thread. No, not that one, the other one.

 

[Zoom-boing]

Well, I'm sure we all can agree that it's not where he was born or his citizenship status.

What other info is on the long form? Are all long forms alike?

It's mother and father personal information and hospital and doctor information. No country of birth or none of that. It's on the other BC conspiracy thread. No, not that one, the other one.

 

[Vel]

Let's presume you are correct for a minute:

Presume Obama was not born in hawaii even though his birth certificate lists honolulu, hawaii as his place of birth....and even though the hawaiian newspaper had an announcement notice of his birth in honolulu in their newspaper new birth section, in august of 1961.

Presume the immigration and naturalization laws you listed are not pertaining to alien nationals and alien citizens but to natural born citizens as well, so this would pertain to Stanley anne...his mom.

Presume these rules in effect at the time have not been repealed and replaced, as they have been....

Obama's mother was born in 1942 according to about.com and he was born in 1961 so she was 19 and had lived in the usa for 5 years after the age of 14.

and btw, obama's father's bio says they got divorced when obama was 3 yrs old...(the obama's certainly were here on usa soil when they were divorced in Honolulu no? And that Senior obama stayed in the usa until 1970 or so, before he returned to kenya with another American woman he ended up marrying or having a couple of children with in Kenya.

his mom was enrolled in a new college in seattle, washington by january of 1962, that's just 5 months after his birth fending as a single mom though not divorced yet....his father graduated with his college degree in hawaii in june of 1962.....when, how, and why would they have been in kenya when obama was born when both his mother and his father were attending college there in Hawaii....

And another thing, did any of you bother to CONFIRM that this quote of his grandmother's actually did occur and was not fabricated to start this whole rumor with no end?

Care

Stanley Ann was born in late November of 1942. Obama was born Aug 4 1961. His mother would have been 18 years and 9 months old. Three months shy of what the law precribed in order for her to confer her citizenship to her son. The story told by Obama's Kenyan family was that Obama Sr. brought Stanley Ann home to meet the family. Because of her advanced pregnancy she was denied passage to fly until after Obama's birth. There is an audio tape ( youtube )that purports to be a phone call made to Sarah Obama, but as I don't speak to language I only know what the translator says she said. I'll attach an article to this post for you to check out.
I just don't understand why Obama would spend a fortune in court over this issue when he could simply release his Certificate of Birth ( as opposed to his Certification of Live Birth ) The thing that makes me believe that this has credence is that Obama could easily put a stop to these rumors and yet chooses not to. And yes, as he's the one that wanted to be president, it's up to him to prove he's legally eligible. They made it an act of Congress to study whether McCain's birth in the Panama Canal zone would make HIM ineligible. As a U.S. citizen, I think we deserve proof that Obama meets constitutional requirements for the office.



Obama Born In Kenya? His Grandmother Says Yes.
by
Tishrei 13, 5769, 10/12/2008

Someone is lying. According to Obama's Kenyan (paternal) grandmother, as well as his half-brother and half-sister, Barack Hussein Obama was born in Kenya, not in Hawaii as the Democratic candidate for president claims. His grandmother bragged that her grandson is about to be President of the United States and is so proud because she was present DURING HIS BIRTH IN KENYA, in the delivery room. -This, according to several news sites and Pennsylvania attorney Philip J. Berg (see video below) who is, surprisingly, a life long democrat himself. Berg is the former Deputy Attorney General of Pennsylvania, and he has an impressive background in his activities as a democrat, but his support for the party seemingly stops when it comes to his trust in Barack Hussein Obama.





Obama Born In Kenya? His Grandmother Says Yes. - The Tamar Yonah Show - Blogs - Israel National News

Oh for goodness sakes vel, where is your critical thinking and sleuthness?

Look at obama's certificate of birth...look at the date that it was filed with the register of health....august 8th....

Then read the law that you keep posting that says the director of Health needs the parents of the child born out of state to give proof of them living in the usa for a year prior to being abroad and delivering child yah dee dah requirements....when applying for a birth certificate for their child.....HOW LONG do you think this process takes? a month? a few weeks? certainly NOT just a couple of days, which is when obama's birth was registered in honolulu hawaii at the det of health registrar....

did she catch a couple of planes the day or two after obama was born if he was born in kenya in order to get home, and then show the proof of her and his father's residency in the usa for the year prior and get this through our bureacratic system in 4 days? They kept women in the hospital for a week back then on deliveries/live births for goodness sakes....let alone a trip from kenya being at least 4 days back then to get to hawaii....?

obama-birth-certificate1 « Native and Natural Born Citizenship Explored

care

Bless you Care, you're claiming it took 4 days to fly from Kenya to Hawaii in 1961 and yet questioning MY critical thinking skills? I think you and I are just going to have to agree to disagree on this issue. For every argument you can muster showing "proof" that Obama is a citizen, I can find an argument showing proof that he isn't. Even little things like your premise that it would have taken quite a bit for the Obama's to prove their residency, I would call BS on that because no one questions that the Obama's lived in Hawaii and could easily have produced driver's licenses, electric bills and so on. The things you are citing as proof are no more compelling than the citations questioning his citizenship. Less so in fact than the "big one", which is. Why in hell spend millions defending an issue that can be settled by simply requesting a copy of his Certificate of Live Birth ( as opposed to the Certification of Live Birth )? And the distraction argument really doesn't work. It's quite possible to see the mess that Obama is making at the same time I question his legitimacy.
So while you continue to see Obama as honest and forthright (or something along those lines ) I'll continue to see him as deceptive and conniving. History will someday prove one of us correct

 

[xotoxi]

Oh for goodness sakes vel, where is your critical thinking and sleuthness?

Look at obama's certificate of birth...look at the date that it was filed with the register of health....august 8th....

I've always found that to be interesting. She has a baby in Kenya...and then immediately post partum, she boards a plane to fly from Nairobi to Honolulu with a newborn infant.

And I'm sure that there is no direct Nairobi to Honolulu flight...especially in 1961. Probably it would have been Nairobi to Cairo. Cairo to London. London to New York. New York to LA. LA to Honolulu. All in four days. All immediately post partum after a third world delivery. All with a newborn infant.

And why? Why rush back to quickly? Did she want to make sure he was eligible for Presidency?

 

[Vel]

Oh for goodness sakes vel, where is your critical thinking and sleuthness?

Look at obama's certificate of birth...look at the date that it was filed with the register of health....august 8th....

I've always found that to be interesting. She has a baby in Kenya...and then immediately post partum, she boards a plane to fly from Nairobi to Honolulu with a newborn infant.

And I'm sure that there is no direct Nairobi to Honolulu flight...especially in 1961. Probably it would have been Nairobi to Cairo. Cairo to London. London to New York. New York to LA. LA to Honolulu. All in four days. All immediately post partum after a third world delivery. All with a newborn infant.

And why? Why rush back to quickly? Did she want to make sure he was eligible for Presidency?

Who knows? I'm sure that if I'd found myself, an American used to proper and high tech medical care, stuck in Kenya because they wouldn't allow me on a plane and forced to give birth to my baby in some backwoods clinic, I'd get the hell out of there as quickly as I could. All women react to childbirth differently as well. If Stanley Ann was healthy and hadn't gained a ton of weight, she may have felt well enough to travel. From the way Obama described her in his books, she seems the type that would have been pissed enough at being told she couldn't leave, that she would've done whatever necessary to get out.

 

[Shadow]

Disagree. The GOP's do-nothingness is preferable to the activism of the Democrats.

Those "Contract with America" jerks don't get it. Had they any balls and done what they were elected to do, they'd STILL be in power. Problem is, they don't have the blind, shove it up your ass whether you like it or not attitude of the left. They spent 12 years acting as if the left still had control and wimpering at every barb the supreme idiots Reid and Pelosi tossed.

The Democrats suck because they want to shove their fascism down everyone's throats in their self-righteous zealotry while in contrast, the Republicans are bunch of pussies.

Both parties suck and neither deserve positions of leadership in this nation, and I'd wager neithe has a clue what the US Constitution actually says.

"We, the people," are caught between them.

Well put..

You are a great American.

The conservatives are in exile ...and the Republicans have turned into girly men like Arnold Schwarzennigger... and my Colon Powell... He says he's a Republican...this African American is confused he's voted Democrat every time... I guess....(bloods of a feather flock together)

Arnold and Powell are the future of the GOP. Those hard-right conservatives need to reconcile themselves to that or plan on the Demo-Gods running the show. Democracies move left. Period. The Democrats went through the same thing with Carter.

The RINO's and neo-cons are, if not the majority in the GOP now, close to it. All this blather from the left that these far-rightwing groups are running the party is just the usual shitscreen from them. The hard line conservatives, if anything, are obstructing the GOP from moving on.

2010 and 2012 would be PERFECT opportunities for the GOP to retake DC. They're their own worst enemies, putting in-house fighting above what's best for the nation. In the meantime, Herr Obama has carte blanche to continue running it into the ground.

You can't blame this all on the left, nor does the left have a clue with their "mandate" bullshit. Equal blame goes to conservatives of all stripes who played that "if it's not MY guy, I'm not voting" bullshit. So busy taking a stand on principle you didn't pay attention to those of us that kept telling you the left had no such qualms. They lined up like sheep and voted "D" and look what we got as a result.

Some of you need to quit blaming others and take a long look in the mirror. Those who didn't vote against Obama are as guilty of putting him in office as those who voted for him.

I totally agree with this. I'm sick to death of listening to the self rightous "conservatives" who screwed the country over because they were too proud to vote for McCain, whine and toss the "blame" every where else except at themself. They got what they asked for,at everyone elses expense....hope they are happy.

 

[Shadow]

Their focus is Obama's birth certificate, it's a Republican wet dream that one day, he will be found to be disqualified and not only thrown out of office but completely out of the country..

Really? This from the left who threw everything to include the sink against the wall, making baseless, bullshit accusations for 8 years.

Hypocrites, the lot of you.

It was all warranted with Bush/Cheney. The BC accusations are what's bullshit.

Wrong. The majority of the libtard accusations were what was bullshit...