BORN IN THE USA? Birth certificate issue No. 1 at Fox News

[Vel]

the question should be why is a lame duck DEAD issue STILL so damned important to you cons out there?

hmmmmm....still no proof huh? oh well....

 

[Care4all]

Actually, the law at the time of Obama's birth was written to say that in order for a child born on foreign soil to an American and any foreigner to be considered a U.S. citizen, the American citizen parent would have had to have lived in the U.S for at least 5 years AFTER they had reached legal age. Obama's mother was only 18 at the time of his birth and did not meet the then existing requirements.

PROOF PLEASE! Where does logic fit in? Do you SERIOUSLY believe Vel, that an American born citizen, living in the usa all of their lives, goes over seas and has a child and that child is NOT a natural born usa citizen if the mother had not come back to the usa for 5 years? I just find that hard to believe? Also, are you saying that Obama had never set foot in the USA until after he was 5 years old? I repeat, that he never stepped foot in the USA? Not to meet his grandparents or for any reason thus if this law is valid, his mother never set foot in America after his birth for over 5 years?

Where do you guys GET THIS CRAPOLA Vel???? Obama's father was here on a visa and continued to go to school in the usa after graduating from university in Hawaii to then going for his graduate degree at Harvard? There are RECORDS of his father attending Harvard for GOODNESS SAKES, during Obama's newborn to toddler years???

Obama's mother Divorced his father just about 3 years in to the marriage for Jimminy's sake...these procedures and legal machinations called a DIVORCE, TOOK PLACE ON USA SOIL???

Even IF THE LAW you spoke about is truly legitimate, WHICH I DOUBT greatly, but IF it were true, there is PROOF that Obama and his mother and his father as a US National, ALL LIVED HERE in the USA within the 5 years of his mother giving BIRTH....next....

Where in the world is COMMON SENSE coming in to the picture with you all?

I STILL....JUST DON'T GET IT Vel?

Care

Allright Care. Calm down a little and you'll see that you've misunderstood what you've read. The law I spoke of had NOTHING to do with whether OBAMA came to the U.S within 5 years of HIS birth. I did however mistype and wrote 5 years after legal age. That should have read the American citizen parent would have to live in the U.S for 5 years after age 14.

Your problem with this is that you're trying to apply current law retroactively. The law that has to be contended with is that which was in force at the time of Obama's birth. Obama's father's visa has NOTHING to do with anything. If Obama was born on U.S. soil ( Hawaii ) then it wouldn't matter if BOTH his parents were aliens, he would still have been a citizen. If he were born in Kenya, as his Grandmother stated, then his mother was not of age to have her citizenship conferred to her son in accordance with the laws in 1961.

"(1) a person born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof;


"(7) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States, who prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than ten years, at least five of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years.
History of US citizenship laws

Vel, this is the U.S. code relating to the Immigration and Naturalization Act of 1952....

If I understand this correctly from all that I have read, beginning with your link, these are the laws pertaining to alien citizens and their naturalization and the citizenship of their children and the requirements... if born in this country or born outside of this country?

This does not involve Obama because his mother was not an alien citizen, but a Natural born USA citizen if i understand it right???

Do a little research, this code you are quoting is for alien citizens and alien nationals...this is the US CODE for the Immigration and Naturalization Act, which pertains to alien citizens?

 

[Vel]

PROOF PLEASE! Where does logic fit in? Do you SERIOUSLY believe Vel, that an American born citizen, living in the usa all of their lives, goes over seas and has a child and that child is NOT a natural born usa citizen if the mother had not come back to the usa for 5 years? I just find that hard to believe? Also, are you saying that Obama had never set foot in the USA until after he was 5 years old? I repeat, that he never stepped foot in the USA? Not to meet his grandparents or for any reason thus if this law is valid, his mother never set foot in America after his birth for over 5 years?

Where do you guys GET THIS CRAPOLA Vel???? Obama's father was here on a visa and continued to go to school in the usa after graduating from university in Hawaii to then going for his graduate degree at Harvard? There are RECORDS of his father attending Harvard for GOODNESS SAKES, during Obama's newborn to toddler years???

Obama's mother Divorced his father just about 3 years in to the marriage for Jimminy's sake...these procedures and legal machinations called a DIVORCE, TOOK PLACE ON USA SOIL???

Even IF THE LAW you spoke about is truly legitimate, WHICH I DOUBT greatly, but IF it were true, there is PROOF that Obama and his mother and his father as a US National, ALL LIVED HERE in the USA within the 5 years of his mother giving BIRTH....next....

Where in the world is COMMON SENSE coming in to the picture with you all?

I STILL....JUST DON'T GET IT Vel?

Care

Allright Care. Calm down a little and you'll see that you've misunderstood what you've read. The law I spoke of had NOTHING to do with whether OBAMA came to the U.S within 5 years of HIS birth. I did however mistype and wrote 5 years after legal age. That should have read the American citizen parent would have to live in the U.S for 5 years after age 14.

Your problem with this is that you're trying to apply current law retroactively. The law that has to be contended with is that which was in force at the time of Obama's birth. Obama's father's visa has NOTHING to do with anything. If Obama was born on U.S. soil ( Hawaii ) then it wouldn't matter if BOTH his parents were aliens, he would still have been a citizen. If he were born in Kenya, as his Grandmother stated, then his mother was not of age to have her citizenship conferred to her son in accordance with the laws in 1961.

"(1) a person born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof;


"(7) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States, who prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than ten years, at least five of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years.
History of US citizenship laws

Vel, this is the U.S. code relating to the Immigration and Naturalization Act of 1952....

If I understand this correctly from all that I have read, beginning with your link, these are the laws pertaining to alien citizens and their naturalization and the citizenship of their children and the requirements... if born in this country or born outside of this country?

This does not involve Obama because his mother was not an alien citizen, but a Natural born USA citizen if i understand it right???

Do a little research, this code you are quoting is for alien citizens and alien nationals...this is the US CODE for the Immigration and Naturalization Act, which pertains to alien citizens?

No. This code pertains to situations where you have a child born on foreign soil ( According to Obama's paternal Grandma, Kenya ) to a foreign national ( Obama Sr. ) AND a U.S. citizen. ( Stanley Ann Dunham ) If Obama was truly born in Kenya, then Stanley Ann was not old enough for her citizenship to automatically be conferred upon her child.

 

[Care4all]

Allright Care. Calm down a little and you'll see that you've misunderstood what you've read. The law I spoke of had NOTHING to do with whether OBAMA came to the U.S within 5 years of HIS birth. I did however mistype and wrote 5 years after legal age. That should have read the American citizen parent would have to live in the U.S for 5 years after age 14.

Your problem with this is that you're trying to apply current law retroactively. The law that has to be contended with is that which was in force at the time of Obama's birth. Obama's father's visa has NOTHING to do with anything. If Obama was born on U.S. soil ( Hawaii ) then it wouldn't matter if BOTH his parents were aliens, he would still have been a citizen. If he were born in Kenya, as his Grandmother stated, then his mother was not of age to have her citizenship conferred to her son in accordance with the laws in 1961.

"(1) a person born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof;


"(7) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States, who prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than ten years, at least five of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years.
History of US citizenship laws

Vel, this is the U.S. code relating to the Immigration and Naturalization Act of 1952....

If I understand this correctly from all that I have read, beginning with your link, these are the laws pertaining to alien citizens and their naturalization and the citizenship of their children and the requirements... if born in this country or born outside of this country?

This does not involve Obama because his mother was not an alien citizen, but a Natural born USA citizen if i understand it right???

Do a little research, this code you are quoting is for alien citizens and alien nationals...this is the US CODE for the Immigration and Naturalization Act, which pertains to alien citizens?

No. This code pertains to situations where you have a child born on foreign soil ( According to Obama's paternal Grandma, Kenya ) to a foreign national ( Obama Sr. ) AND a U.S. citizen. ( Stanley Ann Dunham ) If Obama was truly born in Kenya, then Stanley Ann was not old enough for her citizenship to automatically be conferred upon her child.

Let's presume you are correct for a minute:

Presume Obama was not born in hawaii even though his birth certificate lists honolulu, hawaii as his place of birth....and even though the hawaiian newspaper had an announcement notice of his birth in honolulu in their newspaper new birth section, in august of 1961.

Presume the immigration and naturalization laws you listed are not pertaining to alien nationals and alien citizens but to natural born citizens as well, so this would pertain to Stanley anne...his mom.

Presume these rules in effect at the time have not been repealed and replaced, as they have been....

Obama's mother was born in 1942 according to about.com and he was born in 1961 so she was 19 and had lived in the usa for 5 years after the age of 14.

and btw, obama's father's bio says they got divorced when obama was 3 yrs old...(the obama's certainly were here on usa soil when they were divorced in Honolulu no? And that Senior obama stayed in the usa until 1970 or so, before he returned to kenya with another American woman he ended up marrying or having a couple of children with in Kenya.

his mom was enrolled in a new college in seattle, washington by january of 1962, that's just 5 months after his birth fending as a single mom though not divorced yet....his father graduated with his college degree in hawaii in june of 1962.....when, how, and why would they have been in kenya when obama was born when both his mother and his father were attending college there in Hawaii....

And another thing, did any of you bother to CONFIRM that this quote of his grandmother's actually did occur and was not fabricated to start this whole rumor with no end?

Care

 

[DiveCon]

Vel, this is the U.S. code relating to the Immigration and Naturalization Act of 1952....

If I understand this correctly from all that I have read, beginning with your link, these are the laws pertaining to alien citizens and their naturalization and the citizenship of their children and the requirements... if born in this country or born outside of this country?

This does not involve Obama because his mother was not an alien citizen, but a Natural born USA citizen if i understand it right???

Do a little research, this code you are quoting is for alien citizens and alien nationals...this is the US CODE for the Immigration and Naturalization Act, which pertains to alien citizens?

No. This code pertains to situations where you have a child born on foreign soil ( According to Obama's paternal Grandma, Kenya ) to a foreign national ( Obama Sr. ) AND a U.S. citizen. ( Stanley Ann Dunham ) If Obama was truly born in Kenya, then Stanley Ann was not old enough for her citizenship to automatically be conferred upon her child.

Let's presume you are correct for a minute:

Presume Obama was not born in hawaii even though his birth certificate lists honolulu, hawaii as his place of birth....and even though the hawaiian newspaper had an announcement notice of his birth in honolulu in their newspaper new birth section, in august of 1961.

Presume the immigration and naturalization laws you listed are not pertaining to alien nationals and alien citizens but to natural born citizens as well, so this would pertain to Stanley anne...his mom.

Presume these rules in effect at the time have not been repealed and replaced, as they have been....

Obama's mother was born in 1942 according to about.com and he was born in 1961 so she was 19 and had lived in the usa for 5 years after the age of 14.

and btw, obama's father's bio says they got divorced when obama was 3 yrs old...(the obama's certainly were here on usa soil when they were divorced in Honolulu no? And that Senior obama stayed in the usa until 1970 or so, before he returned to kenya with another American woman he ended up marrying or having a couple of children with in Kenya.

his mom was enrolled in a new college in seattle, washington by january of 1962, that's just 5 months after his birth fending as a single mom though not divorced yet....his father graduated with his college degree in hawaii in june of 1962.....when, how, and why would they have been in kenya when obama was born when both his mother and his father were attending college there in Hawaii....

And another thing, did any of you bother to CONFIRM that this quote of his grandmother's actually did occur and was not fabricated to start this whole rumor with no end?

Care

the newspaper announcement has nothing to do with WHERE he was born
he could have been born on the moon and if the parents wanted it announced in the paper when they got back, the paper would print it

its silly to see people using that as defacto proof

 

[Sinatra]

I still wonder why Obama himself has not released the long form certificate. And why spend money in legal costs fighting this thing?

While I still think he was in fact born in Hawaii, Obama's secrecy lends some measure of credibility to those who wish to see the genuine proof of his birth.

Of more concern to me regarding Obama though on a somewhat related note is his newfound embracing of his Muslim heritage - a fact he went to great lengths to bury while on the campaign trail.

Two recent interviews in which he declares America is not a Christian nation and that if you add up all the American Muslims the United States is one of the largest Muslim nations in the world...SAY WHAT!!!????

 

[Vel]

Vel, this is the U.S. code relating to the Immigration and Naturalization Act of 1952....

If I understand this correctly from all that I have read, beginning with your link, these are the laws pertaining to alien citizens and their naturalization and the citizenship of their children and the requirements... if born in this country or born outside of this country?

This does not involve Obama because his mother was not an alien citizen, but a Natural born USA citizen if i understand it right???

Do a little research, this code you are quoting is for alien citizens and alien nationals...this is the US CODE for the Immigration and Naturalization Act, which pertains to alien citizens?

No. This code pertains to situations where you have a child born on foreign soil ( According to Obama's paternal Grandma, Kenya ) to a foreign national ( Obama Sr. ) AND a U.S. citizen. ( Stanley Ann Dunham ) If Obama was truly born in Kenya, then Stanley Ann was not old enough for her citizenship to automatically be conferred upon her child.

Let's presume you are correct for a minute:

Presume Obama was not born in hawaii even though his birth certificate lists honolulu, hawaii as his place of birth....and even though the hawaiian newspaper had an announcement notice of his birth in honolulu in their newspaper new birth section, in august of 1961.

Presume the immigration and naturalization laws you listed are not pertaining to alien nationals and alien citizens but to natural born citizens as well, so this would pertain to Stanley anne...his mom.

Presume these rules in effect at the time have not been repealed and replaced, as they have been....

Obama's mother was born in 1942 according to about.com and he was born in 1961 so she was 19 and had lived in the usa for 5 years after the age of 14.

and btw, obama's father's bio says they got divorced when obama was 3 yrs old...(the obama's certainly were here on usa soil when they were divorced in Honolulu no? And that Senior obama stayed in the usa until 1970 or so, before he returned to kenya with another American woman he ended up marrying or having a couple of children with in Kenya.

his mom was enrolled in a new college in seattle, washington by january of 1962, that's just 5 months after his birth fending as a single mom though not divorced yet....his father graduated with his college degree in hawaii in june of 1962.....when, how, and why would they have been in kenya when obama was born when both his mother and his father were attending college there in Hawaii....

And another thing, did any of you bother to CONFIRM that this quote of his grandmother's actually did occur and was not fabricated to start this whole rumor with no end?

Care

Stanley Ann was born in late November of 1942. Obama was born Aug 4 1961. His mother would have been 18 years and 9 months old. Three months shy of what the law precribed in order for her to confer her citizenship to her son. The story told by Obama's Kenyan family was that Obama Sr. brought Stanley Ann home to meet the family. Because of her advanced pregnancy she was denied passage to fly until after Obama's birth. There is an audio tape ( youtube )that purports to be a phone call made to Sarah Obama, but as I don't speak to language I only know what the translator says she said. I'll attach an article to this post for you to check out.
I just don't understand why Obama would spend a fortune in court over this issue when he could simply release his Certificate of Birth ( as opposed to his Certification of Live Birth ) The thing that makes me believe that this has credence is that Obama could easily put a stop to these rumors and yet chooses not to. And yes, as he's the one that wanted to be president, it's up to him to prove he's legally eligible. They made it an act of Congress to study whether McCain's birth in the Panama Canal zone would make HIM ineligible. As a U.S. citizen, I think we deserve proof that Obama meets constitutional requirements for the office.



Obama Born In Kenya? His Grandmother Says Yes.
by
Tishrei 13, 5769, 10/12/2008

Someone is lying. According to Obama's Kenyan (paternal) grandmother, as well as his half-brother and half-sister, Barack Hussein Obama was born in Kenya, not in Hawaii as the Democratic candidate for president claims. His grandmother bragged that her grandson is about to be President of the United States and is so proud because she was present DURING HIS BIRTH IN KENYA, in the delivery room. -This, according to several news sites and Pennsylvania attorney Philip J. Berg (see video below) who is, surprisingly, a life long democrat himself. Berg is the former Deputy Attorney General of Pennsylvania, and he has an impressive background in his activities as a democrat, but his support for the party seemingly stops when it comes to his trust in Barack Hussein Obama.





Obama Born In Kenya? His Grandmother Says Yes. - The Tamar Yonah Show - Blogs - Israel National News

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

Again...

This discussion exists as a result of one simple, indisputable fact: to this moment; there is not in record ANYWHERE IN THE KNOWN UNIVERSE, ANY DOCUMENT WHICH CERTIFIES THE THE LORD OF THE IDIOTS WAS BORN ON US SOIL.

There's a document which says he was born alive, and that the location of the certification is Hawaii... so we can all rest easy on that mind bender... President Hussein was born alive, somewhere.

And with ALL that said... The answer to the question is resting behind the seal which was placed on the birth records by THE MR. B. HUSSEIN OBAMA.

In effect, he has 'certified' his birth on little more than the implication of circumstantial evidence, innuendo and the inferences encouraged by and naturally drawn from such.

Reason requires that IF the documents which have been cloistered under seal DEMONSTRATE that Mr. O was born in Hawaii, that he would have long ago produced them in spades; that he has taken to sealing those records, SUGGESTS that there is something within those records which tends towards undermining that inference which he has worked SO HARD to create.

And that's all this discussion is about.

The US CONSTITUTION sets the standard and as is ALWAYS the case; the ideological left comes to DISMISS THE STANDARD AS IRRELEVANT and antiquated... and they do so without regard to the basis in reason on which that standard was founded.

Now kids... let's examine the POTENTIAL precedence which the Left will have foisted upon the US, IF it turns out that The Lord of the Idiots was not born in the US...

What shall we say to a popular individual who comes to the US and seeks election to the Presidency despite his lacking US Citizenship?

Shall the defense be that 'we thought he was a 'naturally born US Citizen?'... but we were misinformed; and our lack of interests and concern shouldn't be held against us?

What will the SCOTUS declare when some citizen comes to challenge his lack of citizenship? That the citizen has no standing interests? As that is where they stood during the contest of The Lord of the Idiots... that a US Citizen has no standing interests in the birth origins of those seeking the highest office in the land.

Of course the left will argue that IF this non-citizen comes to stand for election; that it should be UP TO the PEOPLE to elect or reject his candidacy...

And where that opinion is sustained by a majority of THOSE WHO PARTICIPATE IN THE ELECTION... AKA: The Electorate... then, at THAT POINT... US SOVEREIGNTY IS DESTROYED... The means of the US to apply our own distinct brand of governance... to apply the principles WE HOLD AS TRUTH... to shape our government, will be lost.

And given the vociferous projection of the decided absence of concern as to the birth status of the current President... we're pretty much there right now.

And THAT'S A PROBLEM; add to that, this notion that the left is somehow entitled to do what ever the hell they WANT... without regard to the US Constitution 'because they won an election' is proof positiive that the concept of a Representative Constitutional Republic has been rinsed from the understanding of a fairly significant portion of the US population; this a result of ignorance foisted upon that population through two generations of 'moderate ideas' being central to the education of our children.

It was a bad idea then; it is a worse idea today and it will as was predicted then and what is a certainty today; result in the total destruction of the United States, in terms of this nation remaining faithful to it's founding principles; the principles on which our freedom rest.

The left 'feels' that we'll always be free... and this feeling is based upon NOTHING BUT, their experience that they've always BEEN FREE... sadly, they're ignorant of the reality that their freedom is the historical EXCEPTION and their policies are rapidly undermining that freedom; and that to repair the damage, the costs will go well beyond the scope of capital... requiring hundreds of thousands of lives, if not Millions; and all that based upon little more than the delta of desparity between their opinions and those of individuals who disagree with them.

 

[Care4all]

No. This code pertains to situations where you have a child born on foreign soil ( According to Obama's paternal Grandma, Kenya ) to a foreign national ( Obama Sr. ) AND a U.S. citizen. ( Stanley Ann Dunham ) If Obama was truly born in Kenya, then Stanley Ann was not old enough for her citizenship to automatically be conferred upon her child.

Let's presume you are correct for a minute:

Presume Obama was not born in hawaii even though his birth certificate lists honolulu, hawaii as his place of birth....and even though the hawaiian newspaper had an announcement notice of his birth in honolulu in their newspaper new birth section, in august of 1961.

Presume the immigration and naturalization laws you listed are not pertaining to alien nationals and alien citizens but to natural born citizens as well, so this would pertain to Stanley anne...his mom.

Presume these rules in effect at the time have not been repealed and replaced, as they have been....

Obama's mother was born in 1942 according to about.com and he was born in 1961 so she was 19 and had lived in the usa for 5 years after the age of 14.

and btw, obama's father's bio says they got divorced when obama was 3 yrs old...(the obama's certainly were here on usa soil when they were divorced in Honolulu no? And that Senior obama stayed in the usa until 1970 or so, before he returned to kenya with another American woman he ended up marrying or having a couple of children with in Kenya.

his mom was enrolled in a new college in seattle, washington by january of 1962, that's just 5 months after his birth fending as a single mom though not divorced yet....his father graduated with his college degree in hawaii in june of 1962.....when, how, and why would they have been in kenya when obama was born when both his mother and his father were attending college there in Hawaii....

And another thing, did any of you bother to CONFIRM that this quote of his grandmother's actually did occur and was not fabricated to start this whole rumor with no end?

Care

Stanley Ann was born in late November of 1942. Obama was born Aug 4 1961. His mother would have been 18 years and 9 months old. Three months shy of what the law precribed in order for her to confer her citizenship to her son. The story told by Obama's Kenyan family was that Obama Sr. brought Stanley Ann home to meet the family. Because of her advanced pregnancy she was denied passage to fly until after Obama's birth. There is an audio tape ( youtube )that purports to be a phone call made to Sarah Obama, but as I don't speak to language I only know what the translator says she said. I'll attach an article to this post for you to check out.
I just don't understand why Obama would spend a fortune in court over this issue when he could simply release his Certificate of Birth ( as opposed to his Certification of Live Birth ) The thing that makes me believe that this has credence is that Obama could easily put a stop to these rumors and yet chooses not to. And yes, as he's the one that wanted to be president, it's up to him to prove he's legally eligible. They made it an act of Congress to study whether McCain's birth in the Panama Canal zone would make HIM ineligible. As a U.S. citizen, I think we deserve proof that Obama meets constitutional requirements for the office.



Obama Born In Kenya? His Grandmother Says Yes.
by
Tishrei 13, 5769, 10/12/2008

Someone is lying. According to Obama's Kenyan (paternal) grandmother, as well as his half-brother and half-sister, Barack Hussein Obama was born in Kenya, not in Hawaii as the Democratic candidate for president claims. His grandmother bragged that her grandson is about to be President of the United States and is so proud because she was present DURING HIS BIRTH IN KENYA, in the delivery room. -This, according to several news sites and Pennsylvania attorney Philip J. Berg (see video below) who is, surprisingly, a life long democrat himself. Berg is the former Deputy Attorney General of Pennsylvania, and he has an impressive background in his activities as a democrat, but his support for the party seemingly stops when it comes to his trust in Barack Hussein Obama.





Obama Born In Kenya? His Grandmother Says Yes. - The Tamar Yonah Show - Blogs - Israel National News

Oh for goodness sakes vel, where is your critical thinking and sleuthness?

Look at obama's certificate of birth...look at the date that it was filed with the register of health....august 8th....

Then read the law that you keep posting that says the director of Health needs the parents of the child born out of state to give proof of them living in the usa for a year prior to being abroad and delivering child yah dee dah requirements....when applying for a birth certificate for their child.....HOW LONG do you think this process takes? a month? a few weeks? certainly NOT just a couple of days, which is when obama's birth was registered in honolulu hawaii at the det of health registrar....

did she catch a couple of planes the day or two after obama was born if he was born in kenya in order to get home, and then show the proof of her and his father's residency in the usa for the year prior and get this through our bureacratic system in 4 days? They kept women in the hospital for a week back then on deliveries/live births for goodness sakes....let alone a trip from kenya being at least 4 days back then to get to hawaii....?

obama-birth-certificate1 « Native and Natural Born Citizenship Explored

care

 

[Yurt]

care,

what is the problem with obama spending 10 minutes and $10 to request a copy of the original on file in hawaii? IMO, it would quell a vast majority of those still discussing this issue. it would for me. so what is the problem with him releasing a copy of the original? mccain did.

 

[Care4all]

care,

what is the problem with obama spending 10 minutes and $10 to request a copy of the original on file in hawaii? IMO, it would quell a vast majority of those still discussing this issue. it would for me. so what is the problem with him releasing a copy of the original? mccain did.

well, the only good reasons that I could come up with would be politically strategic.....

-it shows the desperate foolishness of the other side.

-it gets the other side wasting time and hard earned money on it verses other valid things at issue with obama.

-in other words, it makes the other side cry wolf when the wolf isn't present, and when the wolf really does show its teeth, no one will believe you.

Also Yurt, since you are a lawyer, can you tell us what this means?:

This copy serves as prima facie evidence of the fact of birth in any court proceedings. (HRS 338-13(b), 338-19)

Care

 

[Yurt]

care,

what is the problem with obama spending 10 minutes and $10 to request a copy of the original on file in hawaii? IMO, it would quell a vast majority of those still discussing this issue. it would for me. so what is the problem with him releasing a copy of the original? mccain did.

well, the only good reasons that I could come up with would be politically strategic.....

-it shows the desperate foolishness of the other side.

-it gets the other side wasting time and hard earned money on it verses other valid things at issue with obama.

-in other words, it makes the other side cry wolf when the wolf isn't present, and when the wolf really does show its teeth, no one will believe you.

Also Yurt, since you are a lawyer, can you tell us what this means?:

This copy serves as prima facie evidence of the fact of birth in any court proceedings. (HRS 338-13(b), 338-19)

Care

so obama is not releasing solely to play some political game and make those asking for it look "bad".....what a uniter of a president. he said during his campaign that those political days are over, we need to unite and be unified (mass paraphrase) and come together to face this huge economic crisis. all it would take is 10 minutes and 10$ to end this silliness. imo, he produces a copy of the original and this virtually goes away. 10 minutes, $10...

prima facie evidence, in loose terms, simply means the party bringing the evidence has established that the evidence shown is presumptively valid. in this case, the law has declared the type/computer generated copy presumptively valid, iow, it is not conclusive, only presumed to be evidence of that which the party seeks to prove. the burden then shifts to the other party (in this case those who want a copy original) to refute (rebuttal) the presumably valid evidence. those who want to see a copy of the original want to see it in order to refute the presumption that the computer generated copy does, in and of itself, prove obama's eligibility.

 

[slackjawed]

I found this link, is it possible it could be true?
FactCheck.org: Born in the U.S.A.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

You CANNOT be serious! OMFG, the name of his mom's doctor...

ROTFLMNAO...oh God, that's precious.

So...."precious" Dimwit....you can't name him/her so you laugh about it....so typical...

So can you name the hospital? Or the location where he physically was born?

I mean....since u guys claim the big O is such a great Prez....aren't we going to need a birthplace site to visit like with other Presidents?

What's that.....you can't point to the place.........?

I mean seriously. The doctor would have probably been about mid to late 30's then at best. Probably had thousands of births. Would be pushing 80 - 100 years of age by now. And if he's still alive, do you think Obama's birth was so special that he would remember it? If he had a halo on his head or something I could understand.

You libs are really dense....who cares if the doctor is old or even alive today or not....the point is to find some kind of FACTS surrounding the birth of Obama and figure out whether or not he is a bonafide U.S. citizen.

It really ticks me off that McCain was thoroughly investigated and BO wasn't.... when everybody knew that McCain's parents were military and stationed overseas when he was born in Panama....and his father was a frikkin ADMIRAL to boot....

....we should at the very least give the same amount of congressional investigation to the legality of a kid born of a questionable country-hopping hippie woman who married a foreigner...and about whom there are so many unanswered questions....

....but of course the liberal media won't allow any such questioning of the "Perfect One"....and you Dimwits buy into all the lame "proof"....like I said b4 a frikkin piece of paper produced by TPTB is not enough proof to validate the citizenship of someone who would pretend to be President of our country...

 

[Care4all]

you have obama's certification of birth in honolulu, hawaii which is the ONLY legal document required by the court of law, as verification of birth.

you have a certificate of birth for obama, filed with the hawaii department of health registrar 4 days after his birth which definitively proves that he could NOT have been born in kenya, and gotten to hawaii, and gotten the proper paperwork and approval from the director of health to issue his birth certificate as a foriegn born child.

then you have a newspaper that has the Hawaii State Health Bureau of Statistics, listing the birth of barak obama with his parents specific address, along with all other children born in hawaii around his date of birth, just 9 days later...another FACT that makes it impossible that he was born in kenya....

yet you guys continue on this quest as if you have some legitimate complaint when it is PLAIN AS DAY imho, that there is NO legitimacy at all with your claims....NONE!

Here is the link to the Advisor, newspaper, where the Bureau of Health Statistics, listed the birth of Obama, with other children born on the same day, in hawaii....this was not a notice of birth by family members, but a government agency required to verify and keep track of such statistics.
http://wikileaks.org/leak/obama-1961-birth-announcement-from-honolulu-advertiser.pdf
I hate to say it, and it is generally not in my character to say things like I am going to say, but GAME OVER, DONE, FINISHED...it has been proven that Barack O is a natural born citizen and was born in honolulu, Hawaii.

And even if he wasn't born in Hawaii, and his mother met the qualifications of a child being born overseas that is listed on the links that were provided, he is STILL considered a natural born citizen, as John Mccain is considered a natural born citizen by meeting the military rules followed.

So who knows what the true argument is on this kenya thing anyway...the rules and reasons keep changing on why obama can't be a citizen....

Care

 

[Care4all]

some people want to make us believe that if a woman went on vacation that was pregnant and ended up delivering prematurely in this overseas country, that her child would not be a natural born citizen of the united states and I vehemently disagree with that contention.

 

[Navy1960]

This issue of Barack Obama's Birth Certificate has been floating around for some time now. It would appear to be a simple issue to produce one. Which I was under the impression the State of HI. already had. Personally I'm of the opinion that his Birth certificate is legitimate but thats a personal one. What I find interesting is and maybe someone can clear this one up here is if he actually held duel citizenship or renounced his citizenship when he went to live with his step father. I do agree though it would appear to be easily resolved by a simple dispatch of one of your numerous peons to say here now everyone please shut up and lets move on.

 

[Care4all]

This issue of Barack Obama's Birth Certificate has been floating around for some time now. It would appear to be a simple issue to produce one. Which I was under the impression the State of HI. already had. Personally I'm of the opinion that his Birth certificate is legitimate but thats a personal one. What I find interesting is and maybe someone can clear this one up here is if he actually held duel citizenship or renounced his citizenship when he went to live with his step father. I do agree though it would appear to be easily resolved by a simple dispatch of one of your numerous peons to say here now everyone please shut up and lets move on.

Hawaii's certification of birth, IS THE LEGAL DOCUMENT USED to verify the birth of any of their citizens. It is a sworn document, notorized, that it lists the information on the original birth certificate. It says, that this certification of birth IS THE COURT DOCUMENT of Vital statistics, verifying birth.

SIMPLE as that....just follow the law and it is CLEAR AS DAY....his certification of Birth says specifically, that Obama was born in Hawaii and his original birth certificate was filed with the Bureau of Health registrar on august 8, 1961, 4 days after his birth, and it states he was born in honolulu. Nuff said, navy....this is not that hard to understand.

And your speculation on Obama denouncing his own citizenship when he went to school in indonesia...do you really believe a 6 year old can denounce their own citizenship? Get real Navy....you know i luv you but you could not have bought in to that garbage....??? Seriously???

care

 

[Yurt]

you have obama's certification of birth in honolulu, hawaii which is the ONLY legal document required by the court of law, as verification of birth.
you have a certificate of birth for obama, filed with the hawaii department of health registrar 4 days after his birth which definitively proves that he could NOT have been born in kenya, and gotten to hawaii, and gotten the proper paperwork and approval from the director of health to issue his birth certificate as a foriegn born child.

then you have a newspaper that has the Hawaii State Health Bureau of Statistics, listing the birth of barak obama with his parents specific address, along with all other children born in hawaii around his date of birth, just 9 days later...another FACT that makes it impossible that he was born in kenya....

yet you guys continue on this quest as if you have some legitimate complaint when it is PLAIN AS DAY imho, that there is NO legitimacy at all with your claims....NONE!

Here is the link to the Advisor, newspaper, where the Bureau of Health Statistics, listed the birth of Obama, with other children born on the same day, in hawaii....this was not a notice of birth by family members, but a government agency required to verify and keep track of such statistics.
http://wikileaks.org/leak/obama-1961-birth-announcement-from-honolulu-advertiser.pdf
I hate to say it, and it is generally not in my character to say things like I am going to say, but GAME OVER, DONE, FINISHED...it has been proven that Barack O is a natural born citizen and was born in honolulu, Hawaii.

And even if he wasn't born in Hawaii, and his mother met the qualifications of a child being born overseas that is listed on the links that were provided, he is STILL considered a natural born citizen, as John Mccain is considered a natural born citizen by meeting the military rules followed.

So who knows what the true argument is on this kenya thing anyway...the rules and reasons keep changing on why obama can't be a citizen....

Care

false

if the original is available, that is the best evidence. that is the law. read federal rules of evidence regarding hearsay....in a court of law, if the original exists, the certification would be objected to and sustained and obama would have to provide either the original, or most likely a certified copy of the certificate of live birth. did you not read anything i said about prima facie?

see also

§338-19 Photostatic or typewritten copies of records. The department of health is authorized to prepare typewritten, photostatic, or microphotographic copies of any records and files in its office, which by reason of age, usage, or otherwise are in such condition that they can no longer be conveniently consulted or used without danger of serious injury or destruction thereof, and to certify to the correctness of such copies. The typewritten, photostatic, or microphotographic copies shall be competent evidence in all courts of the State with like force and effect as the original.

 

[Navy1960]

Care you misunderstood my intentions there, was more posed as a question to be quite honest. I honestly have no dog in this hunt. This one I'm sort of sitting on the sidelines and every so often I hear a little tidbit hear and there, other than that I remain as dumb as a post when it comes to the issue *laughs*