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Ban affirmative action. Support equality based on merit.

Dragonlady

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We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
You'll fit in great here, getting everything exactly ass backwards is a popular stance around here.

We can't do away with AA yet because there are still too many bigots around
who wouldn't give those people a chance.
Getting rid of AA pulls the teeth of the bigots on both sides. AA has been in effect for over fifty years, if it was going to accomplish anything, by now the improvements would be obvious. It has failed despite billions of dollars being spent. It’s past time to try something else. Make equality the law, not preference.
The improvements have been obvious, but we're not there yet.
since AA was started the minority communities have gone downhill not improved,,

I would not say that at all.
AA has encouraged more minorities to get into and succeed in college.
The change you refer to likely is just the entire poor working class in the whole country, of all races, has gone downhill, due to offshoring reducing wages for all working class.
AA hasnt encouraged anyone,, its forced others to hire or choose them for something they most likely were not qualified for,,

and since its beginning the quality of life in the black community has declines for the majority,,

Most people learn on the job really, so as long as their aptitude was properly evaluated, then AA does no harm.
As far as I know, AA just means you can't just go by standardized test scores.

It is true quality of life has declined in the Black community since AA, but not because of AA, and quality of life has also declined in the poor white community.
not sure why quality has gone down, but it did start about the same time so you do the math,,

pre all the civil rights stuff blacks had the strongest family structures and ever since its gone to the worst,,

So you don't think that the lower quality of life in the black community has anything to do with:
  • the lack of good paying jobs in urban settings
  • cuts to education
  • lack of public recreational facilities and programs due to tax cuts; or
  • over policing in the black communities

In Toronto, the Conservative government closed all of the free programs in poor minority communities, and put "user fees" on the use of all recreation centres. 8 years later we had the highest rates of gun crime and murder in the city's history.

There is a direct correlation between investing in children in poor communities, and both poverty and crime - regardless of race.
 

Jim H - VA USA

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Okay, so how do you want to go about dismantling the system that is in place?
remove skin color and gender from all applications,, problem solved,,,

It's not in any applications. They tried a study where they mixed up the names on resumes. The "black names" got picked WAY less than the white sounding names. When they swapped the names around and put the white names on the black people's resumes, the white names got picked. It wasn't their skills or their "merit's". The HR staff were picking the applicants they thought were white.


> It's not in any applications.

It was on my son's college applications.

It was also on the US Census we filled out. We checked "other" and wrote in "US citizen." Unlike Senator Warner, we have not had DNA tests to determine if we are Native Americans or not.

You must see these check boxes occasionally as well.

I am a Canadian, living in Canada. It's not on ANY forms here. It's illegal to ask that question. Our census forms ask for "ethnic origin", not race.
>I am a Canadian, living in Canada. It's not on ANY forms here. It's illegal to ask that question. Our census forms ask for "ethnic origin", not race.

You need to learn more about your own country and quit spreading erroneous information about it...

Here is your country's 2021 Census Form 2A-L, question 25...


25. Is this person:

Mark "x" more than one circle or specify, if applicable.

  • White
  • South Asian (e.g., East Indian, Pakistani, Sri Lankan)
  • Chinese
  • Black
  • Filipino
  • Arab
  • Latin American
  • Southeast Asian (e.g., Vietnamese, Cambodian, Laotian, Thai)
  • West Asian (e.g., Iranian, Afghan)
  • Korean
  • Japanese
  • Other group — specify:

But that implies you could check them all or none.
> But that implies you could check them all or none.

She said it is illegal in Canada to even ask the question. Please follow along.
 

progressive hunter

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We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
You'll fit in great here, getting everything exactly ass backwards is a popular stance around here.

We can't do away with AA yet because there are still too many bigots around
who wouldn't give those people a chance.
Getting rid of AA pulls the teeth of the bigots on both sides. AA has been in effect for over fifty years, if it was going to accomplish anything, by now the improvements would be obvious. It has failed despite billions of dollars being spent. It’s past time to try something else. Make equality the law, not preference.
The improvements have been obvious, but we're not there yet.
since AA was started the minority communities have gone downhill not improved,,

I would not say that at all.
AA has encouraged more minorities to get into and succeed in college.
The change you refer to likely is just the entire poor working class in the whole country, of all races, has gone downhill, due to offshoring reducing wages for all working class.
AA hasnt encouraged anyone,, its forced others to hire or choose them for something they most likely were not qualified for,,

and since its beginning the quality of life in the black community has declines for the majority,,

Most people learn on the job really, so as long as their aptitude was properly evaluated, then AA does no harm.
As far as I know, AA just means you can't just go by standardized test scores.

It is true quality of life has declined in the Black community since AA, but not because of AA, and quality of life has also declined in the poor white community.
not sure why quality has gone down, but it did start about the same time so you do the math,,

pre all the civil rights stuff blacks had the strongest family structures and ever since its gone to the worst,,

So you don't think that the lower quality of life in the black community has anything to do with the lack of good paying jobs in urban settings, and cuts to education, public recreational facilities and programs due to tax cuts, and over policing in the black communities have anything to do with that declining quality of life????

In Toronto, the Conservative government closed all of the free programs in poor minority communities, and put "user fees" on the use of all recreation centres. 8 years later we had the highest rates of gun crime and murder in the city's history.

There is a direct correlation between investing in children in poor communities, and both poverty and crime - regardless of race.
NOPE!!

its because of decades of oppression from the dem party,,
 

Concerned American

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white males, some of whom are not so subtle about their dislike of my presence in their world.
Your disdain for white people is quite evident in your posts. You preach equality, but that is not what you live. Your hatred must make your world an unpleasant place to live. You have made not so subtle comments about my race as a whole while vilifying me and you don't know anything about me. You paint with an unjustly broad brush.
 

Concerned American

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We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
You'll fit in great here, getting everything exactly ass backwards is a popular stance around here.
Did your parents have any children that weren't mentally challenged?
People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.
> People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.

OldLady, you just said that hiring based upon race is not racist. Literally.

You don't fight racism by instituting racist policies.

Instead of an insult you deserve, I'll give you a compliment... Cute avatar. :)
Racism involves believing other groups are inferior to yours. It's not a racist policy to break centuries of bigotry by encouraging minorities get a chance.
youre implying minorities are inferior and should be hired or selected because of that for equality,,

so youre a racist to support AA
Nope. I'm saying minorities deserve an equal chance. We tried just telling people to do it; they didn't. So we went to policies.
They made laws to address discrimination and you morons, like today, refuse to enforce existing laws and turn to racism to answer racism--don't you see a problem with that. Silly me--No you don't.
That wouldn't be the Civil Rights Act of 1964 would it?
That is one of many
So why do you think it's not being enforced?
Because after 55 years, you claim it is not.
We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
You'll fit in great here, getting everything exactly ass backwards is a popular stance around here.
Did your parents have any children that weren't mentally challenged?
People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.
> People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.

OldLady, you just said that hiring based upon race is not racist. Literally.

You don't fight racism by instituting racist policies.

Instead of an insult you deserve, I'll give you a compliment... Cute avatar. :)
Racism involves believing other groups are inferior to yours. It's not a racist policy to break centuries of bigotry by encouraging minorities get a chance.

you think minorities need your encouragement? I don’t know sounds awfully paternalistic
I'm not one who hires or selects students to my university. But some of them do, yeah.
> I'm not one who hires or selects students to my university. But some of them [minorities] do, yeah.

OldLady, that's just more racism from you. Some of every group of people requires encouragement to succeed.

You keep focusing on skin color, when you should be focused on character. Extra help should be based upon need, not DNA. Counting skin colors and lowering standards for people based upon ethnicity is inherently racist and has been illegal for over 55 years..
I agree if everyone were that fair minded, that would be right. Everyone is not that fair minded.
Everyone is not that fair minded. I agree but you are defending the unfairness on one side while vilifying it on the other side. That is the same as Affirmative Action. Equality means equal treatment. Giving preferential treatment based on ethnicity is RACISM and "preferential" is contrary to "equal."
Actually the agency created to enforce and monitor compliance of the work portion of the Civil Rights Act is the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission. Emphasis on "Opportunity".

Some of you sound like you're afraid you can't compete on a level playing field.
Never had anything else--I entered the workforce in 1965. I have worked blue collar jobs, white collar jobs and military in my career. In EVERY one of those jobs I worked and fought side by side with every ethnic and gender group in the US. In not one of those jobs were the wages paid one cent different by job. What wasn't the same was the playing field. Every one of those people that I worked with enjoyed employment preferences that were not available to me. Sure that playing field. You seem to think that you can be a perpetual victim of ---- race, gender, whatever. What you really are is a racist bigot.
So you entered the workforce probably within 12 months of the passage of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Do you honestly think that the minute the ink was dry on that EO all racists the country jumped in line to comply?

What exactly did EVERYONE else get that you were not able to avail yourself of? And please be specific. And is there anything else you're presently being deprived of because of "unqualified" minorities?
I am not the one who is a perpetual victim here--you are. You are the one claiming that you need preferential treatment in order to compete. I have witnessed a career of equal treatment of everyone that I worked with--(what was that you said about reading comprehension?). I believe in equality--that means no special treatment for anyone. You do not. Your posts this evening have revealed you for the racist bigot perpetual victim that you are. Take you whining down the road. I have no sympathy for you.
Come on, you're getting too invested in this because you are out of mind if you think I'm seeking sympathy from racists on the internet lol.

I noticed you didn't answer my question though about how affirmative action and alleged "unqualified" minorities are depriving you anything or are you just annoyed that you perceive someone else getting something that you didn't? What is it? A job? A seat at a prestigious university, a significant other (you can't blame on affirmative action though). What?!?

Oh and I forgot to mention you said this, not me because I happened to know that efforts to enforce our Civil Rights Laws are being made but what you were implying is that just because we now have these laws, everyone is complying with them which after 55 years, they're still not.
So why do you think it's not being enforced?​
Because after 55 years, you claim it is not.
If after 55 years, a law is not working, it is a bad law. The only way to equality is EQUALITY. I will say it again. YOU CAN'T FIGHT RACISM WITH RACISM.
 

Turtlesoup

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So you want someone to work hard for $10 per hour? No way no how. Pay is always equated with expected productivity. The more pay the harder one works. The less pay the less one works. As it should be.
People with work ethic work regardless of pay--------------lazy people at $10 are lazy at $100 an hour.
 

Dragonlady

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We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
You'll fit in great here, getting everything exactly ass backwards is a popular stance around here.

We can't do away with AA yet because there are still too many bigots around
who wouldn't give those people a chance.
Getting rid of AA pulls the teeth of the bigots on both sides. AA has been in effect for over fifty years, if it was going to accomplish anything, by now the improvements would be obvious. It has failed despite billions of dollars being spent. It’s past time to try something else. Make equality the law, not preference.
The improvements have been obvious, but we're not there yet.
since AA was started the minority communities have gone downhill not improved,,

I would not say that at all.
AA has encouraged more minorities to get into and succeed in college.
The change you refer to likely is just the entire poor working class in the whole country, of all races, has gone downhill, due to offshoring reducing wages for all working class.
AA hasnt encouraged anyone,, its forced others to hire or choose them for something they most likely were not qualified for,,

and since its beginning the quality of life in the black community has declines for the majority,,

Most people learn on the job really, so as long as their aptitude was properly evaluated, then AA does no harm.
As far as I know, AA just means you can't just go by standardized test scores.

It is true quality of life has declined in the Black community since AA, but not because of AA, and quality of life has also declined in the poor white community.
not sure why quality has gone down, but it did start about the same time so you do the math,,

pre all the civil rights stuff blacks had the strongest family structures and ever since its gone to the worst,,

So you don't think that the lower quality of life in the black community has anything to do with the lack of good paying jobs in urban settings, and cuts to education, public recreational facilities and programs due to tax cuts, and over policing in the black communities have anything to do with that declining quality of life????

In Toronto, the Conservative government closed all of the free programs in poor minority communities, and put "user fees" on the use of all recreation centres. 8 years later we had the highest rates of gun crime and murder in the city's history.

There is a direct correlation between investing in children in poor communities, and both poverty and crime - regardless of race.
NOPE!!

its because of decades of oppression from the dem party,,

Yes, that old lie again. You just keep swallowing all of that gaslighting shit the Republican Party feeds you and say "Please sir, can I have some more".

Yes the "oppression" of the Civil Rights Act, the Voting Rights Act, and the War on Poverty, which cut black poverty from 40% in the early 60, to less than 15% in 1980. Reagan ended the war on poverty because it was WORKING, and started demonizing the lazy "urban" citizens who lived off the public teat.

Have you ever wondered why Ronald Reagan vetoed the bill sanctioning South Africa for Apartheid and racist policies? I did at the time. How could an AMERICAN President not condemn Apartheid? But now I can see clearly why he did it. Reagan ended AA, but Johnson's Bills gave black people the vote and finally a chance at an education, and planted the seeds of the black middle class.

That middle class has taken root, and grown into a powerful force. Republicans keep focusing on the 25% of black people who are still poor. They pretend that the 75% of well educated, law abiding, working and middle class black people don't exist. Well they do and they are fed up with being treated like lazy and dangerous criminals, and shot down in the streets, or murdered in broad daylight by the police.
 

Mac-7

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progressive hunter

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We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
You'll fit in great here, getting everything exactly ass backwards is a popular stance around here.

We can't do away with AA yet because there are still too many bigots around
who wouldn't give those people a chance.
Getting rid of AA pulls the teeth of the bigots on both sides. AA has been in effect for over fifty years, if it was going to accomplish anything, by now the improvements would be obvious. It has failed despite billions of dollars being spent. It’s past time to try something else. Make equality the law, not preference.
The improvements have been obvious, but we're not there yet.
since AA was started the minority communities have gone downhill not improved,,

I would not say that at all.
AA has encouraged more minorities to get into and succeed in college.
The change you refer to likely is just the entire poor working class in the whole country, of all races, has gone downhill, due to offshoring reducing wages for all working class.
AA hasnt encouraged anyone,, its forced others to hire or choose them for something they most likely were not qualified for,,

and since its beginning the quality of life in the black community has declines for the majority,,

Most people learn on the job really, so as long as their aptitude was properly evaluated, then AA does no harm.
As far as I know, AA just means you can't just go by standardized test scores.

It is true quality of life has declined in the Black community since AA, but not because of AA, and quality of life has also declined in the poor white community.
not sure why quality has gone down, but it did start about the same time so you do the math,,

pre all the civil rights stuff blacks had the strongest family structures and ever since its gone to the worst,,

So you don't think that the lower quality of life in the black community has anything to do with the lack of good paying jobs in urban settings, and cuts to education, public recreational facilities and programs due to tax cuts, and over policing in the black communities have anything to do with that declining quality of life????

In Toronto, the Conservative government closed all of the free programs in poor minority communities, and put "user fees" on the use of all recreation centres. 8 years later we had the highest rates of gun crime and murder in the city's history.

There is a direct correlation between investing in children in poor communities, and both poverty and crime - regardless of race.
NOPE!!

its because of decades of oppression from the dem party,,

Yes, that old lie again. You just keep swallowing all of that gaslighting shit the Republican Party feeds you and say "Please sir, can I have some more".

Yes the "oppression" of the Civil Rights Act, the Voting Rights Act, and the War on Poverty, which cut black poverty from 40% in the early 60, to less than 15% in 1980. Reagan ended the war on poverty because it was WORKING, and started demonizing the lazy "urban" citizens who lived off the public teat.

Have you ever wondered why Ronald Reagan vetoed the bill sanctioning South Africa for Apartheid and racist policies? I did at the time. How could an AMERICAN President not condemn Apartheid? But now I can see clearly why he did it. Reagan ended AA, but Johnson's Bills gave black people the vote and finally a chance at an education, and planted the seeds of the black middle class.

That middle class has taken root, and grown into a powerful force. Republicans keep focusing on the 25% of black people who are still poor. They pretend that the 75% of well educated, law abiding, working and middle class black people don't exist. Well they do and they are fed up with being treated like lazy and dangerous criminals, and shot down in the streets, or murdered in broad daylight by the police.
if you were american you would know that the civil rights act was only needed because of what dems were doing to black people for over 100 yrs,, and also before it the black family was one of the strongest in the country and now they are the bottom of the barrel,,
 

Dragonlady

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We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
You'll fit in great here, getting everything exactly ass backwards is a popular stance around here.
Did your parents have any children that weren't mentally challenged?
People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.
> People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.

OldLady, you just said that hiring based upon race is not racist. Literally.

You don't fight racism by instituting racist policies.

Instead of an insult you deserve, I'll give you a compliment... Cute avatar. :)
Racism involves believing other groups are inferior to yours. It's not a racist policy to break centuries of bigotry by encouraging minorities get a chance.
youre implying minorities are inferior and should be hired or selected because of that for equality,,

so youre a racist to support AA
Nope. I'm saying minorities deserve an equal chance. We tried just telling people to do it; they didn't. So we went to policies.
They made laws to address discrimination and you morons, like today, refuse to enforce existing laws and turn to racism to answer racism--don't you see a problem with that. Silly me--No you don't.
That wouldn't be the Civil Rights Act of 1964 would it?
That is one of many
So why do you think it's not being enforced?
Because after 55 years, you claim it is not.
We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
You'll fit in great here, getting everything exactly ass backwards is a popular stance around here.
Did your parents have any children that weren't mentally challenged?
People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.
> People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.

OldLady, you just said that hiring based upon race is not racist. Literally.

You don't fight racism by instituting racist policies.

Instead of an insult you deserve, I'll give you a compliment... Cute avatar. :)
Racism involves believing other groups are inferior to yours. It's not a racist policy to break centuries of bigotry by encouraging minorities get a chance.

you think minorities need your encouragement? I don’t know sounds awfully paternalistic
I'm not one who hires or selects students to my university. But some of them do, yeah.
> I'm not one who hires or selects students to my university. But some of them [minorities] do, yeah.

OldLady, that's just more racism from you. Some of every group of people requires encouragement to succeed.

You keep focusing on skin color, when you should be focused on character. Extra help should be based upon need, not DNA. Counting skin colors and lowering standards for people based upon ethnicity is inherently racist and has been illegal for over 55 years..
I agree if everyone were that fair minded, that would be right. Everyone is not that fair minded.
Everyone is not that fair minded. I agree but you are defending the unfairness on one side while vilifying it on the other side. That is the same as Affirmative Action. Equality means equal treatment. Giving preferential treatment based on ethnicity is RACISM and "preferential" is contrary to "equal."
Actually the agency created to enforce and monitor compliance of the work portion of the Civil Rights Act is the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission. Emphasis on "Opportunity".

Some of you sound like you're afraid you can't compete on a level playing field.
Never had anything else--I entered the workforce in 1965. I have worked blue collar jobs, white collar jobs and military in my career. In EVERY one of those jobs I worked and fought side by side with every ethnic and gender group in the US. In not one of those jobs were the wages paid one cent different by job. What wasn't the same was the playing field. Every one of those people that I worked with enjoyed employment preferences that were not available to me. Sure that playing field. You seem to think that you can be a perpetual victim of ---- race, gender, whatever. What you really are is a racist bigot.
So you entered the workforce probably within 12 months of the passage of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Do you honestly think that the minute the ink was dry on that EO all racists the country jumped in line to comply?

What exactly did EVERYONE else get that you were not able to avail yourself of? And please be specific. And is there anything else you're presently being deprived of because of "unqualified" minorities?
I am not the one who is a perpetual victim here--you are. You are the one claiming that you need preferential treatment in order to compete. I have witnessed a career of equal treatment of everyone that I worked with--(what was that you said about reading comprehension?). I believe in equality--that means no special treatment for anyone. You do not. Your posts this evening have revealed you for the racist bigot perpetual victim that you are. Take you whining down the road. I have no sympathy for you.
Come on, you're getting too invested in this because you are out of mind if you think I'm seeking sympathy from racists on the internet lol.

I noticed you didn't answer my question though about how affirmative action and alleged "unqualified" minorities are depriving you anything or are you just annoyed that you perceive someone else getting something that you didn't? What is it? A job? A seat at a prestigious university, a significant other (you can't blame on affirmative action though). What?!?

Oh and I forgot to mention you said this, not me because I happened to know that efforts to enforce our Civil Rights Laws are being made but what you were implying is that just because we now have these laws, everyone is complying with them which after 55 years, they're still not.
So why do you think it's not being enforced?​
Because after 55 years, you claim it is not.
If after 55 years, a law is not working, it is a bad law. The only way to equality is EQUALITY. I will say it again. YOU CAN'T FIGHT RACISM WITH RACISM.

THE LAW IS WORKING. THAT'S WHY REPUBLICANS WANT IT TO END. THEY DON'T WANT BLACKS TO HAVE EQUALITY IN ANY WAY.

White people have all sorts of "affirmative action benefits", like "legacy admissions" into university. If college can reserve 30% of their opening for the children of alumni, regardless of their qualifications, why can't they reserve 10% of their openings for designated minorities to balance that "affirmative action for legacies".

You're not proposing and end to any of the white advantages in hiring, only those which favor minorities. Since white people have legacies, and the "old boy's network", and nepotism going for them, why can't minorities at least have AA?

Basically what you're saying is that white people need to keep these advantages just to keep minorities from getting jobs, and minorities should not be given ANYTHING, to help them in any way. It's like throwing all of the minority kids into the water with rocks in their pockets, while the rich white kids all get water wings and diving fins. Let's see who swims fastest.
 

NewsVine_Mariyam

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For every single Hate Hoax that gets busted, there are ten that do not.

Affirmative action is the cause of the hate hoaxers. It is an industry. It is what affirmative action students are taught.
You are nutso. Seek professional help.


Whenever you point out truth to a black bigot, a left wing homo, or a Zionist Jew, you get this type of response.

Affirmative action does not produce equals. It produces hatehoaxing bigots who are intellectually incapable of debate, since their "education" didn't teach debate,it taught shouting down and screaming racism, and doing hate hoaxes to provide "evidence" of racism...
Yeah, I would say that pretty accurately describes white racists
 

NewsVine_Mariyam

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Okay, so how do you want to go about dismantling the system that is in place?
remove skin color and gender from all applications,, problem solved,,,

It's not in any applications. They tried a study where they mixed up the names on resumes. The "black names" got picked WAY less than the white sounding names. When they swapped the names around and put the white names on the black people's resumes, the white names got picked. It wasn't their skills or their "merit's". The HR staff were picking the applicants they thought were white.


> It's not in any applications.

It was on my son's college applications.

It was also on the US Census we filled out. We checked "other" and wrote in "US citizen." Unlike Senator Warner, we have not had DNA tests to determine if we are Native Americans or not.

You must see these check boxes occasionally as well.
You're not required to answer them, truthfully or otherwise.

> You're not required to answer them, truthfully or otherwise.

You are good at making things up.


13 U.S. Code § 221 - Refusal or neglect to answer questions; false answers

(a) Whoever, being over eighteen years of age, refuses or willfully neglects, when requested by the Secretary, or by any other authorized officer or employee of the Department of Commerce or bureau or agency thereof acting under the instructions of the Secretary or authorized officer, to answer, to the best of his knowledge, any of the questions on any schedule submitted to him in connection with any census or survey provided for by subchapters I, II, IV, and V of chapter 5 of this title, applying to himself or to the family to which he belongs or is related, or to the farm or farms of which he or his family is the occupant, shall be fined not more than $100.

(b) Whoever, when answering questions described in subsection (a) of this section, and under the conditions or circumstances described in such subsection, willfully gives any answer that is false, shall be fined not more than $500.

(c) Notwithstanding any other provision of this title, no person shall be compelled to disclose information relative to his religious beliefs or to membership in a religious body.

Where's the part about not providing your race information on a college application?

Oh and it would also help if you had included the title to the text you quoted in order to add some context to what you're quoting.

This is what I was talking about, sorry if it confused you:

The Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) requires all private employers with 100 or more employees as well as federal contractors and first-tier subcontractors with 50 or more employees AND contracts of at least $50,000 complete an EEO-1 report each year. Covered employers must invite employees to self-identify gender and race for this report.​
Completion of this form is voluntary and will not affect your opportunity for employment, or the terms or conditions of your employment. This form will be used for EEO-1 reporting purposes only and will be kept separate from all other personnel records only accessed by the Human Resources department. Please return completed forms to the HR department..​
 
Last edited:

NewsVine_Mariyam

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We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
You'll fit in great here, getting everything exactly ass backwards is a popular stance around here.
Did your parents have any children that weren't mentally challenged?
People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.
> People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.

OldLady, you just said that hiring based upon race is not racist. Literally.

You don't fight racism by instituting racist policies.

Instead of an insult you deserve, I'll give you a compliment... Cute avatar. :)
Racism involves believing other groups are inferior to yours. It's not a racist policy to break centuries of bigotry by encouraging minorities get a chance.

you think minorities need your encouragement? I don’t know sounds awfully paternalistic
I'm not one who hires or selects students to my university. But some of them do, yeah.
> I'm not one who hires or selects students to my university. But some of them [minorities] do, yeah.

OldLady, that's just more racism from you. Some of every group of people requires encouragement to succeed.

You keep focusing on skin color, when you should be focused on character. Extra help should be based upon need, not DNA. Counting skin colors and lowering standards for people based upon ethnicity is inherently racist and has been illegal for over 55 years..
I agree if everyone were that fair minded, that would be right. Everyone is not that fair minded.
Everyone is not that fair minded. I agree but you are defending the unfairness on one side while vilifying it on the other side. That is the same as Affirmative Action. Equality means equal treatment. Giving preferential treatment based on ethnicity is RACISM and "preferential" is contrary to "equal."
Actually the agency created to enforce and monitor compliance of the work portion of the Civil Rights Act is the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission. Emphasis on "Opportunity".

Some of you sound like you're afraid you can't compete on a level playing field.
Never had anything else--I entered the workforce in 1965. I have worked blue collar jobs, white collar jobs and military in my career. In EVERY one of those jobs I worked and fought side by side with every ethnic and gender group in the US. In not one of those jobs were the wages paid one cent different by job. What wasn't the same was the playing field. Every one of those people that I worked with enjoyed employment preferences that were not available to me. Sure that playing field. You seem to think that you can be a perpetual victim of ---- race, gender, whatever. What you really are is a racist bigot.
You had white male preference. It's the preference that has existed since the country started. There are no perpetual victims, just perpetual amnesia based delusions by whites, specifically right wing white males.


Black bigots get actual preferences by law.

Blacks get privileges while whitesandasians get discrimination.

When asked, we get phantom "white privilege" bs and hate hoaxes as evidence of racism.

The black bigot hates whites and Asians, practices bigotry and discrimination against whites and Asians, and we are to conclude that the "problem" is not from the side practicing bigotry and discrimination, but the actual victims who are framed by the hate hoaxes.

Im2 has likely been involved in dozens of hate hoaxes, and likely sucked the dicks of both Jussie Smollett and Michelle Obama.
We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
You'll fit in great here, getting everything exactly ass backwards is a popular stance around here.
Did your parents have any children that weren't mentally challenged?
People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.
> People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.

OldLady, you just said that hiring based upon race is not racist. Literally.

You don't fight racism by instituting racist policies.

Instead of an insult you deserve, I'll give you a compliment... Cute avatar. :)


Look how she worded it. Those supporting discrimination are not racist - but they are bigots, because in the sick mind of the bigoted leftwing hypocrite, there is a difference between racism and bigotry. Racism implies looking down, and hence blacks and all the other bogus "victim" classes of the left cannot be racist...

EVEN AS THEY PRACTICE BIGOTRY AND DISCRIMINATION
We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported

Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action

What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
What's wrong with a merit standard? White racists do not believe or do not want to believe that there are black people who are just as capable, intelligent, skilled, and educated as they are. There are also some who exceed them in those areas as well, yet they would NEVER find them meritorious enough to receive things that they've worked for and are entitled to, whether it's a good paying good, a prestigious job promotion, acceptance into an ivy league school, etc.

A case in point, read the ridiculous comments that the resident white racists of USMB have made about black people and women, even when qualified, not being "the best" candidate and then employee to pilot a commercial aircraft, even after it was pointed out to them that they have been doing so, just not is substantially large numbers for the last close to 75 years.

But since white racists also suffer from inferiority complexes and financial & social envy of successful blacks (because they cannot reconcile mentally how a black person could ever do better than they have) they attribute this "anomaly" to blacks allegedly being given advantages denied to them, affirmative action being their favorite pinata that they like to whack .

I am of the opinion that perhaps the true reason for them lagging behind is lack of critical thinking skills and abysmal reading comprehension skills. Perhaps you can assist by pointing out where in the text below ANYONE is given preference over ANYONE else, let alone over WHITES?

While the concept of affirmative action has existed in America since the 19th century, it first appeared in its current form in President Kennedy's Executive Order 10925 (1961): "The contractor will take affirmative action to ensure that applicants are employed, and that employees are treated during employment, without regard to their race, creed, color, or national origin."​
For federal contractors and subcontractors, affirmative action must be taken by covered employers to recruit and advance qualified minorities, women, persons with disabilities, and covered veterans. Affirmative actions include training programs, outreach efforts, and other positive steps. These procedures should be incorporated into the company's written personnel policies. Employers with written affirmative action programs must implement them, keep them on file and update them annually. Affirmative Action | U.S. Department of Labor
COMMENT: According to the department of labor, you are WRONG. Racist.
Yeah, you pulled one segment out of the entire page and ignored all of the rest. The Department of Labor is also where I obtained the text of the affirmative action EO I quoted, it's the same government agency:
Executive Order 11246, As Amended | U.S. Department of Labor

So where does it give preference to "unqualified blacks" over "qualified" whites? Depending upon your interpretation of the law, the whole point of the program is to increase the pool of qualified candidates that employers can select from and making sure that they include minorities as well as others. Do you have the same hostilities towards veterans and persons with disabilities? They cover the whole spectrum of races.

And when the government gives you money (contracts) then they get to specify the way you conduct the business you do for them including insisting that you comply with any and all applicable anti-discrimination laws, which you should be doing anyway. If you want to insist upon your right to be a raging racist then fine you can work for someone else.

And I'm sure you know this but just in case you or anyone else didn't, white women have benefited from affirmative action more than any other demographic according to the U.S. Department of Labor (same agency once again)
Findings
  • The study found that compliance reviews initiated against an establishment in the 1970s significantly increased the share of women and African Americans it employed as managers, not only in the 1970s but also through the 1980s and 1990s. A first compliance review in the 1970s increased the odds of white women in management by an estimated 34 percent, of African American women by 18 percent, and of African American men by 28 percent.
  • Compliance reviews initiated in the 1970s led to significantly greater increases in female and African American employment shares than did reviews conducted in the 1980s.
  • Larger numbers of lawsuits significantly increased employment shares for women and African Americans.
Try reading everything next time--This section (in the link that I gave you) essentially dictates that the workforce of particular sized companies must have workforces that reflect to demographic of an area. Here is the pertinent ppg.
Subpart B—Purpose and Contents of Affirmative Action Programs

return arrow Back to Top
§60-2.10 General purpose and contents of affirmative action programs.
(a) Purpose. (1) An affirmative action program is a management tool designed to ensure equal employment opportunity. A central premise underlying affirmative action is that, absent discrimination, over time a contractor's workforce, generally, will reflect the gender, racial and ethnic profile of the labor pools from which the contractor recruits and selects. Affirmative action programs contain a diagnostic component which includes a number of quantitative analyses designed to evaluate the composition of the workforce of the contractor and compare it to the composition of the relevant labor pools. Affirmative action programs also include action-oriented programs. If women and minorities are not being employed at a rate to be expected given their availability in the relevant labor pool, the contractor's affirmative action program includes specific practical steps designed to address this underutilization. Effective affirmative action programs also include internal auditing and reporting systems as a means of measuring the contractor's progress toward achieving the workforce that would be expected in the absence of discrimination.
I refer you back to the portion of one of my previous comment in which I mention subpar reading comprehension abilities. What they're saying is that the workforce should reflect the composition of the "relevent labor pool" "absent discrimination":

Subpart B—Purpose and Contents of Affirmative Action Programs

return arrow Back to Top
§60-2.10 General purpose and contents of affirmative action programs.
(a) Purpose. (1) An affirmative action program is a management tool designed to ensure equal employment opportunity. A central premise underlying affirmative action is that, ****absent discrimination****, over time a contractor's workforce, generally, will reflect the gender, racial and ethnic profile of the labor pools from which the contractor recruits and selects. Affirmative action programs contain a diagnostic component which includes a number of quantitative analyses designed to evaluate the composition of the workforce of the contractor and compare it to the composition of the relevant labor pools. Affirmative action programs also include action-oriented programs. If women and minorities are not being employed at a rate to be expected given their availability in the relevant labor pool, the contractor's affirmative action program includes specific practical steps designed to address this underutilization. Effective affirmative action programs also include internal auditing and reporting systems as a means of measuring the contractor's progress toward achieving the workforce that would be expected ****in the absence of discrimination****.
By your reckoning the NBA should be 87% white. You are a racist and cannot compete on a level playing field--if you could, you would not be adverse to repealing affirmative action, indeed I feel that all mention of gender and race should be removed from any official documentation. You become XYZ123 in anything official and let the chips fall where they may. I am open to that scenario--ARE YOU?
Oh is that why you're laughing like a hyena? Because you think I'm a racist "victim" who cannot compete without affirmative action? Are you making a wager? What's the stakes and in what field(s) are we going to compete? According to when you entered the work force you'd have to be in your 70s, are you even still looking for work and don't feel you should have to compete with black people at all, is that what you're saying?'

Because that's what affirmative action has done for me, it's provided me with an opportunity to compete in fields in which I would otherwise be possibly excluded, not because I was unable to compete but due to my race and/or gender. Both of the fields I'm in presently are dominated by white males, some of whom are not so subtle about their dislike of my presence in their world.

So, what's your story? Who's depriving you of opportunities, how and in what fields? Inquiring minds want to know.
> Both of the fields I'm in presently are dominated by white males

Congratulations! When it comes time for layoffs, there is no way they will cut you, even if your performance is sub-par, for fear of a discrimination lawsuit. Enjoy your privilege! :)
LOL is this what you're teaching your "getting ready for college age" son? That no matter how well the non-whites do, always know you're better than them?
 

Concerned American

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For every single Hate Hoax that gets busted, there are ten that do not.

Affirmative action is the cause of the hate hoaxers. It is an industry. It is what affirmative action students are taught.
You are nutso. Seek professional help.


Whenever you point out truth to a black bigot, a left wing homo, or a Zionist Jew, you get this type of response.

Affirmative action does not produce equals. It produces hatehoaxing bigots who are intellectually incapable of debate, since their "education" didn't teach debate,it taught shouting down and screaming racism, and doing hate hoaxes to provide "evidence" of racism...
Yeah, I would say that pretty accurately describes white racists
Is that what you see when you look in the mirror? Racist bigot.
 

Concerned American

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We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
You'll fit in great here, getting everything exactly ass backwards is a popular stance around here.
Did your parents have any children that weren't mentally challenged?
People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.
> People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.

OldLady, you just said that hiring based upon race is not racist. Literally.

You don't fight racism by instituting racist policies.

Instead of an insult you deserve, I'll give you a compliment... Cute avatar. :)
Racism involves believing other groups are inferior to yours. It's not a racist policy to break centuries of bigotry by encouraging minorities get a chance.

you think minorities need your encouragement? I don’t know sounds awfully paternalistic
I'm not one who hires or selects students to my university. But some of them do, yeah.
> I'm not one who hires or selects students to my university. But some of them [minorities] do, yeah.

OldLady, that's just more racism from you. Some of every group of people requires encouragement to succeed.

You keep focusing on skin color, when you should be focused on character. Extra help should be based upon need, not DNA. Counting skin colors and lowering standards for people based upon ethnicity is inherently racist and has been illegal for over 55 years..
I agree if everyone were that fair minded, that would be right. Everyone is not that fair minded.
Everyone is not that fair minded. I agree but you are defending the unfairness on one side while vilifying it on the other side. That is the same as Affirmative Action. Equality means equal treatment. Giving preferential treatment based on ethnicity is RACISM and "preferential" is contrary to "equal."
Actually the agency created to enforce and monitor compliance of the work portion of the Civil Rights Act is the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission. Emphasis on "Opportunity".

Some of you sound like you're afraid you can't compete on a level playing field.
Never had anything else--I entered the workforce in 1965. I have worked blue collar jobs, white collar jobs and military in my career. In EVERY one of those jobs I worked and fought side by side with every ethnic and gender group in the US. In not one of those jobs were the wages paid one cent different by job. What wasn't the same was the playing field. Every one of those people that I worked with enjoyed employment preferences that were not available to me. Sure that playing field. You seem to think that you can be a perpetual victim of ---- race, gender, whatever. What you really are is a racist bigot.
You had white male preference. It's the preference that has existed since the country started. There are no perpetual victims, just perpetual amnesia based delusions by whites, specifically right wing white males.


Black bigots get actual preferences by law.

Blacks get privileges while whitesandasians get discrimination.

When asked, we get phantom "white privilege" bs and hate hoaxes as evidence of racism.

The black bigot hates whites and Asians, practices bigotry and discrimination against whites and Asians, and we are to conclude that the "problem" is not from the side practicing bigotry and discrimination, but the actual victims who are framed by the hate hoaxes.

Im2 has likely been involved in dozens of hate hoaxes, and likely sucked the dicks of both Jussie Smollett and Michelle Obama.
We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
You'll fit in great here, getting everything exactly ass backwards is a popular stance around here.
Did your parents have any children that weren't mentally challenged?
People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.
> People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.

OldLady, you just said that hiring based upon race is not racist. Literally.

You don't fight racism by instituting racist policies.

Instead of an insult you deserve, I'll give you a compliment... Cute avatar. :)


Look how she worded it. Those supporting discrimination are not racist - but they are bigots, because in the sick mind of the bigoted leftwing hypocrite, there is a difference between racism and bigotry. Racism implies looking down, and hence blacks and all the other bogus "victim" classes of the left cannot be racist...

EVEN AS THEY PRACTICE BIGOTRY AND DISCRIMINATION
We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported

Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action

What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
What's wrong with a merit standard? White racists do not believe or do not want to believe that there are black people who are just as capable, intelligent, skilled, and educated as they are. There are also some who exceed them in those areas as well, yet they would NEVER find them meritorious enough to receive things that they've worked for and are entitled to, whether it's a good paying good, a prestigious job promotion, acceptance into an ivy league school, etc.

A case in point, read the ridiculous comments that the resident white racists of USMB have made about black people and women, even when qualified, not being "the best" candidate and then employee to pilot a commercial aircraft, even after it was pointed out to them that they have been doing so, just not is substantially large numbers for the last close to 75 years.

But since white racists also suffer from inferiority complexes and financial & social envy of successful blacks (because they cannot reconcile mentally how a black person could ever do better than they have) they attribute this "anomaly" to blacks allegedly being given advantages denied to them, affirmative action being their favorite pinata that they like to whack .

I am of the opinion that perhaps the true reason for them lagging behind is lack of critical thinking skills and abysmal reading comprehension skills. Perhaps you can assist by pointing out where in the text below ANYONE is given preference over ANYONE else, let alone over WHITES?

While the concept of affirmative action has existed in America since the 19th century, it first appeared in its current form in President Kennedy's Executive Order 10925 (1961): "The contractor will take affirmative action to ensure that applicants are employed, and that employees are treated during employment, without regard to their race, creed, color, or national origin."​
For federal contractors and subcontractors, affirmative action must be taken by covered employers to recruit and advance qualified minorities, women, persons with disabilities, and covered veterans. Affirmative actions include training programs, outreach efforts, and other positive steps. These procedures should be incorporated into the company's written personnel policies. Employers with written affirmative action programs must implement them, keep them on file and update them annually. Affirmative Action | U.S. Department of Labor
COMMENT: According to the department of labor, you are WRONG. Racist.
Yeah, you pulled one segment out of the entire page and ignored all of the rest. The Department of Labor is also where I obtained the text of the affirmative action EO I quoted, it's the same government agency:
Executive Order 11246, As Amended | U.S. Department of Labor

So where does it give preference to "unqualified blacks" over "qualified" whites? Depending upon your interpretation of the law, the whole point of the program is to increase the pool of qualified candidates that employers can select from and making sure that they include minorities as well as others. Do you have the same hostilities towards veterans and persons with disabilities? They cover the whole spectrum of races.

And when the government gives you money (contracts) then they get to specify the way you conduct the business you do for them including insisting that you comply with any and all applicable anti-discrimination laws, which you should be doing anyway. If you want to insist upon your right to be a raging racist then fine you can work for someone else.

And I'm sure you know this but just in case you or anyone else didn't, white women have benefited from affirmative action more than any other demographic according to the U.S. Department of Labor (same agency once again)
Findings
  • The study found that compliance reviews initiated against an establishment in the 1970s significantly increased the share of women and African Americans it employed as managers, not only in the 1970s but also through the 1980s and 1990s. A first compliance review in the 1970s increased the odds of white women in management by an estimated 34 percent, of African American women by 18 percent, and of African American men by 28 percent.
  • Compliance reviews initiated in the 1970s led to significantly greater increases in female and African American employment shares than did reviews conducted in the 1980s.
  • Larger numbers of lawsuits significantly increased employment shares for women and African Americans.
Try reading everything next time--This section (in the link that I gave you) essentially dictates that the workforce of particular sized companies must have workforces that reflect to demographic of an area. Here is the pertinent ppg.
Subpart B—Purpose and Contents of Affirmative Action Programs

return arrow Back to Top
§60-2.10 General purpose and contents of affirmative action programs.
(a) Purpose. (1) An affirmative action program is a management tool designed to ensure equal employment opportunity. A central premise underlying affirmative action is that, absent discrimination, over time a contractor's workforce, generally, will reflect the gender, racial and ethnic profile of the labor pools from which the contractor recruits and selects. Affirmative action programs contain a diagnostic component which includes a number of quantitative analyses designed to evaluate the composition of the workforce of the contractor and compare it to the composition of the relevant labor pools. Affirmative action programs also include action-oriented programs. If women and minorities are not being employed at a rate to be expected given their availability in the relevant labor pool, the contractor's affirmative action program includes specific practical steps designed to address this underutilization. Effective affirmative action programs also include internal auditing and reporting systems as a means of measuring the contractor's progress toward achieving the workforce that would be expected in the absence of discrimination.
I refer you back to the portion of one of my previous comment in which I mention subpar reading comprehension abilities. What they're saying is that the workforce should reflect the composition of the "relevent labor pool" "absent discrimination":

Subpart B—Purpose and Contents of Affirmative Action Programs

return arrow Back to Top
§60-2.10 General purpose and contents of affirmative action programs.
(a) Purpose. (1) An affirmative action program is a management tool designed to ensure equal employment opportunity. A central premise underlying affirmative action is that, ****absent discrimination****, over time a contractor's workforce, generally, will reflect the gender, racial and ethnic profile of the labor pools from which the contractor recruits and selects. Affirmative action programs contain a diagnostic component which includes a number of quantitative analyses designed to evaluate the composition of the workforce of the contractor and compare it to the composition of the relevant labor pools. Affirmative action programs also include action-oriented programs. If women and minorities are not being employed at a rate to be expected given their availability in the relevant labor pool, the contractor's affirmative action program includes specific practical steps designed to address this underutilization. Effective affirmative action programs also include internal auditing and reporting systems as a means of measuring the contractor's progress toward achieving the workforce that would be expected ****in the absence of discrimination****.
By your reckoning the NBA should be 87% white. You are a racist and cannot compete on a level playing field--if you could, you would not be adverse to repealing affirmative action, indeed I feel that all mention of gender and race should be removed from any official documentation. You become XYZ123 in anything official and let the chips fall where they may. I am open to that scenario--ARE YOU?
Oh is that why you're laughing like a hyena? Because you think I'm a racist "victim" who cannot compete without affirmative action? Are you making a wager? What's the stakes and in what field(s) are we going to compete? According to when you entered the work force you'd have to be in your 70s, are you even still looking for work and don't feel you should have to compete with black people at all, is that what you're saying?'

Because that's what affirmative action has done for me, it's provided me with an opportunity to compete in fields in which I would otherwise be possibly excluded, not because I was unable to compete but due to my race and/or gender. Both of the fields I'm in presently are dominated by white males, some of whom are not so subtle about their dislike of my presence in their world.

So, what's your story? Who's depriving you of opportunities, how and in what fields? Inquiring minds want to know.
> Both of the fields I'm in presently are dominated by white males

Congratulations! When it comes time for layoffs, there is no way they will cut you, even if your performance is sub-par, for fear of a discrimination lawsuit. Enjoy your privilege! :)
LOL is this what you're teaching your "getting ready for college age" son? That no matter how well the non-whites do, always know you're better than them?
You have a serious self image problem. Do you honestly believe that people are judged on the color of their skin? Sounds like a racist bigot with an inferiority complex to me. Run along now.
 

NewsVine_Mariyam

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We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
You'll fit in great here, getting everything exactly ass backwards is a popular stance around here.
Did your parents have any children that weren't mentally challenged?
People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.
> People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.

OldLady, you just said that hiring based upon race is not racist. Literally.

You don't fight racism by instituting racist policies.

Instead of an insult you deserve, I'll give you a compliment... Cute avatar. :)
Racism involves believing other groups are inferior to yours. It's not a racist policy to break centuries of bigotry by encouraging minorities get a chance.

you think minorities need your encouragement? I don’t know sounds awfully paternalistic
I'm not one who hires or selects students to my university. But some of them do, yeah.
> I'm not one who hires or selects students to my university. But some of them [minorities] do, yeah.

OldLady, that's just more racism from you. Some of every group of people requires encouragement to succeed.

You keep focusing on skin color, when you should be focused on character. Extra help should be based upon need, not DNA. Counting skin colors and lowering standards for people based upon ethnicity is inherently racist and has been illegal for over 55 years..
I agree if everyone were that fair minded, that would be right. Everyone is not that fair minded.
Everyone is not that fair minded. I agree but you are defending the unfairness on one side while vilifying it on the other side. That is the same as Affirmative Action. Equality means equal treatment. Giving preferential treatment based on ethnicity is RACISM and "preferential" is contrary to "equal."
Actually the agency created to enforce and monitor compliance of the work portion of the Civil Rights Act is the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission. Emphasis on "Opportunity".

Some of you sound like you're afraid you can't compete on a level playing field.
Never had anything else--I entered the workforce in 1965. I have worked blue collar jobs, white collar jobs and military in my career. In EVERY one of those jobs I worked and fought side by side with every ethnic and gender group in the US. In not one of those jobs were the wages paid one cent different by job. What wasn't the same was the playing field. Every one of those people that I worked with enjoyed employment preferences that were not available to me. Sure that playing field. You seem to think that you can be a perpetual victim of ---- race, gender, whatever. What you really are is a racist bigot.
You had white male preference. It's the preference that has existed since the country started. There are no perpetual victims, just perpetual amnesia based delusions by whites, specifically right wing white males.


Black bigots get actual preferences by law.

Blacks get privileges while whitesandasians get discrimination.

When asked, we get phantom "white privilege" bs and hate hoaxes as evidence of racism.

The black bigot hates whites and Asians, practices bigotry and discrimination against whites and Asians, and we are to conclude that the "problem" is not from the side practicing bigotry and discrimination, but the actual victims who are framed by the hate hoaxes.

Im2 has likely been involved in dozens of hate hoaxes, and likely sucked the dicks of both Jussie Smollett and Michelle Obama.
We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
You'll fit in great here, getting everything exactly ass backwards is a popular stance around here.
Did your parents have any children that weren't mentally challenged?
People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.
> People fighting bigotry with programs that encourage minority hiring are not racist; they are trying to combat it, shortbus.

OldLady, you just said that hiring based upon race is not racist. Literally.

You don't fight racism by instituting racist policies.

Instead of an insult you deserve, I'll give you a compliment... Cute avatar. :)


Look how she worded it. Those supporting discrimination are not racist - but they are bigots, because in the sick mind of the bigoted leftwing hypocrite, there is a difference between racism and bigotry. Racism implies looking down, and hence blacks and all the other bogus "victim" classes of the left cannot be racist...

EVEN AS THEY PRACTICE BIGOTRY AND DISCRIMINATION
We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported

Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action

What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
What's wrong with a merit standard? White racists do not believe or do not want to believe that there are black people who are just as capable, intelligent, skilled, and educated as they are. There are also some who exceed them in those areas as well, yet they would NEVER find them meritorious enough to receive things that they've worked for and are entitled to, whether it's a good paying good, a prestigious job promotion, acceptance into an ivy league school, etc.

A case in point, read the ridiculous comments that the resident white racists of USMB have made about black people and women, even when qualified, not being "the best" candidate and then employee to pilot a commercial aircraft, even after it was pointed out to them that they have been doing so, just not is substantially large numbers for the last close to 75 years.

But since white racists also suffer from inferiority complexes and financial & social envy of successful blacks (because they cannot reconcile mentally how a black person could ever do better than they have) they attribute this "anomaly" to blacks allegedly being given advantages denied to them, affirmative action being their favorite pinata that they like to whack .

I am of the opinion that perhaps the true reason for them lagging behind is lack of critical thinking skills and abysmal reading comprehension skills. Perhaps you can assist by pointing out where in the text below ANYONE is given preference over ANYONE else, let alone over WHITES?

While the concept of affirmative action has existed in America since the 19th century, it first appeared in its current form in President Kennedy's Executive Order 10925 (1961): "The contractor will take affirmative action to ensure that applicants are employed, and that employees are treated during employment, without regard to their race, creed, color, or national origin."​
For federal contractors and subcontractors, affirmative action must be taken by covered employers to recruit and advance qualified minorities, women, persons with disabilities, and covered veterans. Affirmative actions include training programs, outreach efforts, and other positive steps. These procedures should be incorporated into the company's written personnel policies. Employers with written affirmative action programs must implement them, keep them on file and update them annually. Affirmative Action | U.S. Department of Labor
COMMENT: According to the department of labor, you are WRONG. Racist.
Yeah, you pulled one segment out of the entire page and ignored all of the rest. The Department of Labor is also where I obtained the text of the affirmative action EO I quoted, it's the same government agency:
Executive Order 11246, As Amended | U.S. Department of Labor

So where does it give preference to "unqualified blacks" over "qualified" whites? Depending upon your interpretation of the law, the whole point of the program is to increase the pool of qualified candidates that employers can select from and making sure that they include minorities as well as others. Do you have the same hostilities towards veterans and persons with disabilities? They cover the whole spectrum of races.

And when the government gives you money (contracts) then they get to specify the way you conduct the business you do for them including insisting that you comply with any and all applicable anti-discrimination laws, which you should be doing anyway. If you want to insist upon your right to be a raging racist then fine you can work for someone else.

And I'm sure you know this but just in case you or anyone else didn't, white women have benefited from affirmative action more than any other demographic according to the U.S. Department of Labor (same agency once again)
Findings
  • The study found that compliance reviews initiated against an establishment in the 1970s significantly increased the share of women and African Americans it employed as managers, not only in the 1970s but also through the 1980s and 1990s. A first compliance review in the 1970s increased the odds of white women in management by an estimated 34 percent, of African American women by 18 percent, and of African American men by 28 percent.
  • Compliance reviews initiated in the 1970s led to significantly greater increases in female and African American employment shares than did reviews conducted in the 1980s.
  • Larger numbers of lawsuits significantly increased employment shares for women and African Americans.
Try reading everything next time--This section (in the link that I gave you) essentially dictates that the workforce of particular sized companies must have workforces that reflect to demographic of an area. Here is the pertinent ppg.
Subpart B—Purpose and Contents of Affirmative Action Programs

return arrow Back to Top
§60-2.10 General purpose and contents of affirmative action programs.
(a) Purpose. (1) An affirmative action program is a management tool designed to ensure equal employment opportunity. A central premise underlying affirmative action is that, absent discrimination, over time a contractor's workforce, generally, will reflect the gender, racial and ethnic profile of the labor pools from which the contractor recruits and selects. Affirmative action programs contain a diagnostic component which includes a number of quantitative analyses designed to evaluate the composition of the workforce of the contractor and compare it to the composition of the relevant labor pools. Affirmative action programs also include action-oriented programs. If women and minorities are not being employed at a rate to be expected given their availability in the relevant labor pool, the contractor's affirmative action program includes specific practical steps designed to address this underutilization. Effective affirmative action programs also include internal auditing and reporting systems as a means of measuring the contractor's progress toward achieving the workforce that would be expected in the absence of discrimination.
I refer you back to the portion of one of my previous comment in which I mention subpar reading comprehension abilities. What they're saying is that the workforce should reflect the composition of the "relevent labor pool" "absent discrimination":

Subpart B—Purpose and Contents of Affirmative Action Programs

return arrow Back to Top
§60-2.10 General purpose and contents of affirmative action programs.
(a) Purpose. (1) An affirmative action program is a management tool designed to ensure equal employment opportunity. A central premise underlying affirmative action is that, ****absent discrimination****, over time a contractor's workforce, generally, will reflect the gender, racial and ethnic profile of the labor pools from which the contractor recruits and selects. Affirmative action programs contain a diagnostic component which includes a number of quantitative analyses designed to evaluate the composition of the workforce of the contractor and compare it to the composition of the relevant labor pools. Affirmative action programs also include action-oriented programs. If women and minorities are not being employed at a rate to be expected given their availability in the relevant labor pool, the contractor's affirmative action program includes specific practical steps designed to address this underutilization. Effective affirmative action programs also include internal auditing and reporting systems as a means of measuring the contractor's progress toward achieving the workforce that would be expected ****in the absence of discrimination****.
By your reckoning the NBA should be 87% white. You are a racist and cannot compete on a level playing field--if you could, you would not be adverse to repealing affirmative action, indeed I feel that all mention of gender and race should be removed from any official documentation. You become XYZ123 in anything official and let the chips fall where they may. I am open to that scenario--ARE YOU?
Oh is that why you're laughing like a hyena? Because you think I'm a racist "victim" who cannot compete without affirmative action? Are you making a wager? What's the stakes and in what field(s) are we going to compete? According to when you entered the work force you'd have to be in your 70s, are you even still looking for work and don't feel you should have to compete with black people at all, is that what you're saying?'

Because that's what affirmative action has done for me, it's provided me with an opportunity to compete in fields in which I would otherwise be possibly excluded, not because I was unable to compete but due to my race and/or gender. Both of the fields I'm in presently are dominated by white males, some of whom are not so subtle about their dislike of my presence in their world.

So, what's your story? Who's depriving you of opportunities, how and in what fields? Inquiring minds want to know.
> Both of the fields I'm in presently are dominated by white males

Congratulations! When it comes time for layoffs, there is no way they will cut you, even if your performance is sub-par, for fear of a discrimination lawsuit. Enjoy your privilege! :)
Well since I own the company, that's not much of a concern.

As far as my other gig, because we provide data upon request to the legal department we have a pretty good feel for the challenges that come up within the organization and I haven't seen much regarding discrimination lawsuits, not that I'm looking.

If I didn't know any better I'd wonder if you don't perhaps resent the fact that I'm gainfully employed, for the moment :cool:
 
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NewsVine_Mariyam

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For every single Hate Hoax that gets busted, there are ten that do not.

Affirmative action is the cause of the hate hoaxers. It is an industry. It is what affirmative action students are taught.
You are nutso. Seek professional help.


Whenever you point out truth to a black bigot, a left wing homo, or a Zionist Jew, you get this type of response.

Affirmative action does not produce equals. It produces hatehoaxing bigots who are intellectually incapable of debate, since their "education" didn't teach debate,it taught shouting down and screaming racism, and doing hate hoaxes to provide "evidence" of racism...
Yeah, I would say that pretty accurately describes white racists
Is that what you see when you look in the mirror? Racist bigot.
You just can't stop being insulting can you? Must be a personality defect. I heard racists have lots of them.
 

LuckyDuck

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We should do away with preferences for skin color, gender, sexuality. That is discrimination. Those who support affirmative action support discrimination. Those who support discrimination are bigots and supremacists.

Hence, the supporters of affirmative action are bigots and supremacists, as if that isn't the most obvious insight since someone said the sun is hot..

Why are the Democrats so afraid of equality? The democrat party has never supported equality. It has supported


Slavery
Segregation
Affirmative action


What is wrong with a merit standard?

If you believe your own demographic is too inferior to stand up in an equal merit based society, does that not make you a bigot and supremacist?

The left cannot debate this issue.

They rather will respond with hate and card tosses...
My concern regarding "Affirmative Action" and schools dumbing down the material for those blacks that have trouble with knowing the material needed to pass, is....what crap you have as an attorney, doctor, pharmacist, et cetera. College professors have complained that in the case of minorities, is clearly beyond their comprehension of the material.
What is needed is:
1. Stop dumbing down the material. If you don't understand it and likely won't without being put into a separate class with experts that can use different methods to find a different method to help you learn the material, short of dumbing it down, you must consider that college isn't for you.
2. Stop "social-promoting" students that are failing. If they can't pass their classes and using separate classes and different methods to get them to understand the material, you have achieved the level of your competence and that is when they should probably have the students take something like the Keirsey-Bates Temperament Assessment Test or Holland Occupational Codes Test, to see what they may be better at, rather than college (although, if it was given to all students, the students could see what path might be the best career path for them).
3. Parental supervision. The parents must sit down with the students when it comes to working on the students school homework. If they are single parents and the kids are "lock-key" kids, the parent needs to have a backup adult in the area, who can supervise the kid and is willing to help them with the kid's homework.
4. Schools must be held accountable. The recent example of a school in which the students were graduating high school with GPA's that didn't even reach the minimum 2.0 GPA out of the usual 4.0 GPA. If a school does this, it must be shut down. It's only ruining the kids chances in life.
5. Parents must monitor who their kids hang out with. They must ask themselves, "Are the people my kids hanging with, negative influences on my kid?" They must steer their kids in the direction of positive role models. People that are positive influences.
Affirmative Action helped get minorities into college that otherwise would not have been able to, however, there must be NO dumbing down of materials to get the person to obtain a degree. That is putting someone into the real world that could ultimately be dangerous to those seeking out that person for help, physically or mentally.
 

Concerned American

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For every single Hate Hoax that gets busted, there are ten that do not.

Affirmative action is the cause of the hate hoaxers. It is an industry. It is what affirmative action students are taught.
You are nutso. Seek professional help.


Whenever you point out truth to a black bigot, a left wing homo, or a Zionist Jew, you get this type of response.

Affirmative action does not produce equals. It produces hatehoaxing bigots who are intellectually incapable of debate, since their "education" didn't teach debate,it taught shouting down and screaming racism, and doing hate hoaxes to provide "evidence" of racism...
Yeah, I would say that pretty accurately describes white racists
Is that what you see when you look in the mirror? Racist bigot.
You just can't stop being insulting can you? Must be a personality defect. I heard racists have lots of them.
I believe it was you that painted an entire race of people as "not being able to compete on a level playing field" when it is you, with your unearned privilege, who in fact refuses to compete on that same level playing field, insisting that the world has somehow denied you a fair shake. Quit whining and being a perpetual victim. Life is hard.
 

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