Atheists are hoping aliens from outer space will contact us...

[Syriusly]

I am an atheist. Whether or not we ever encounter alien life form doesn't change my 'atheism' either way.

Hypothetical question: What if we make contact with an alien civilization much different than our own in many ways but the one obvious commonality is they also have the propensity to worship a higher power?

Would that cause you to reconsider your viewpoint or would you find a way to explain this most incredible similarity?

Well that is an interesting question isn't it?

Not only for me- but for every Christian, Muslim, Jew, Buddhist out there.

Why would i believe their worship any more than any American religion?
Now- if they had some evidence that
a) there was some sort of higher power and
b) that worshipping that higher power made sense
- of course I would reconsider my point of view.

I am curious how those people who believe in a particular faith would take up that challenge.

(On a related note, if there was some sort of cosmic event here on Earth- where 'God' directly communicated with us- certainly I would reconsider my position)

 

[sealybobo]

We may or may not be alone but even if we are not, it doesn't mean there is no God. God is a creator, so why would he feel restricted to just one tiny planet in our galaxy? He could have all kinds of other worlds with different kinds of life/creatures/people.

But it might cause a crisis in Christianity, especially Catholicism.

Catholicism is a very humanocentric religion. We believe that God sent his only Son to be Man, and it is through the Son of God's death, as a man, that we are saved.

We consume the Body and Blood of Christ during the Mass, and the reason that works is because we share humanity with Christ.

The introduction of an alien life form that was intelligent but not human might throw the entire equation out of whack for Catholics.

Might? That word alone tells me Catholicism will easily explain away aliens when they are discovered

 

[sealybobo]

I am an atheist. Whether or not we ever encounter alien life form doesn't change my 'atheism' either way.

Hypothetical question: What if we make contact with an alien civilization much different than our own in many ways but the one obvious commonality is they also have the propensity to worship a higher power?

Would that cause you to reconsider your viewpoint or would you find a way to explain this most incredible similarity?

If they have the ability to wish and hope and wonder what happens after they die. If they are social creatures

 

[TNHarley]

The chances for Aliens are probably 1,000,000 times more likely compared to your chances of some mythical man coming out of the clouds.

This is a fact.

Hell, there's probably a better chance of westwall flying drunk over your house tonight then that too. hahaha

My point is there's 300-500 billion galaxies in the universe and 300-500 billion stars within our own...Every star probably has on avg one planet and probably more and 1 out of every 3 or 4 probably has a habitable zone rocky planet. Think about it.

I can think about it, but I'm not overly impressed with large numbers.

What does impress me is that in this very large universe, not one alien civilization, NOT ONE, has contacted our planet or left any evidence here that they ever came to visit.

What that tells me is that the most probable conclusion is that there are NO alien civilizations out there, because if there were only one in a trillion chance of there being an alien civilization around a star, we would have gobs of visitors by now.

How do you know? You dedicate your life to faith but have none outside of your little box?

 

[Boss]

Why do you think we are alone?

I can explain why I think we're alone... or virtually alone, in the sense there is probably no other "life as we know it" out there.

It's because our unique set of circumstances resulted in what we have. There are hundreds, if not thousands of variables which culminate in bringing about "life as we know it" on this planet.

What are the mathematical odds or probability that you could be sitting in Las Vegas and I could be in Atlantic City at poker tables and we would both be drawing the same exact hands at the same time, and this would repeat through thousands of hands? I would say that's a remarkably slim possibility... nearly impossible. Even if you had thousands or millions of people sitting at poker tables around the world, the probability that any two would be consistently drawing the same exact hands repeatedly is near impossible.

In order to have "life as we know it" anywhere else, there are so many circumstantial conditions that have to be met in precise order it makes it a near mathematical impossibility. It takes much more than simply having a rock in the Goldilocks Zone.

Now... microbial life? Plant life? Primitive forms of life? Yeah, that's possible.... but actual intelligent beings such as humans? That's a whole different ball of wax. For instance, you have to realize something.... Had there never been a mass extinction event that wiped out the dinosaurs, large mammals such as humans would've never existed here. We could have never evolved. So just that one circumstantial event changed the course of evolution and helped create "life as we know it" on Earth.

All land-based life emerged from our oceans... But life doesn't exist in a stagnant ocean. What enabled life in our oceans was the presence of a moon which caused tides and a wobbly rotation of the planet which created "seasons" on our planet and oceanic convection. So you're going to need to find another "water world" in the Goldilocks Zone, with a substantial moon close enough to create tides and the planet needs a wobbly rotation to cause seasons. That's just for the basic starter conditions of life to form. The course of that life's evolution will depend on thousands of other circumstances and variables, some of which are very delicate and important.

 

[Syriusly]

Why do you think we are alone?

I can explain why I think we're alone... or virtually alone, in the sense there is probably no other "life as we know it" out there.

It's because our unique set of circumstances resulted in what we have. There are hundreds, if not thousands of variables which culminate in bringing about "life as we know it" on this planet.

What are the mathematical odds or probability that you could be sitting in Las Vegas and I could be in Atlantic City at poker tables and we would both be drawing the same exact hands at the same time, and this would repeat through thousands of hands? I would say that's a remarkably slim possibility... nearly impossible. Even if you had thousands or millions of people sitting at poker tables around the world, the probability that any two would be consistently drawing the same exact hands repeatedly is near impossible.

In order to have "life as we know it" anywhere else, there are so many circumstantial conditions that have to be met in precise order it makes it a near mathematical impossibility. It takes much more than simply having a rock in the Goldilocks Zone.

Now... microbial life? Plant life? Primitive forms of life? Yeah, that's possible.... but actual intelligent beings such as humans? That's a whole different ball of wax. For instance, you have to realize something.... Had there never been a mass extinction event that wiped out the dinosaurs, large mammals such as humans would've never existed here. We could have never evolved. So just that one circumstantial event changed the course of evolution and helped create "life as we know it" on Earth.

All land-based life emerged from our oceans... But life doesn't exist in a stagnant ocean. What enabled life in our oceans was the presence of a moon which caused tides and a wobbly rotation of the planet which created "seasons" on our planet and oceanic convection. So you're going to need to find another "water world" in the Goldilocks Zone, with a substantial moon close enough to create tides and the planet needs a wobbly rotation to cause seasons. That's just for the basic starter conditions of life to form. The course of that life's evolution will depend on thousands of other circumstances and variables, some of which are very delicate and important.

All very good points- but you leave out the vastness of our universe. In our galaxy alone there might be 100 billion stars.

Of course the vastness of our galaxy- and the difficulty of evolution- also explains why we are unlikely to encounter alien life. Even if it exists- it is likely so far away as to be meaningless.

 

[K9Buck]

Once upon a time there was no universe. In fact, there was nothing at all. Then, the universe created itself and then mankind appeared from out of the blue. Anyone who thinks differently is insane.

 

[Skieler]

I believe in alien existence..only question is in what form and where are they in the evolutionary process. I mean no way are we the only living organisms in this vast universe.

What I do hope though is that if they do ever make it here, they're kinder and nothing like humankind. I mean just think if they are just a bunch of psychopathic murderers like Muslims who after landing here would take offense and start lopping off heads just because we don't worship their God?

 

[RWS]

There you go again, but this time, you're squaring around and bunting...

You're just waiting to see which side takes a lead, so you can team up with them.

It's ok for you to want to get a group to circle-jerk each other.

But it's not how I roll...

We all have to understand our place in this world. And what we can do to make it better. It can be by maintaining the status quo, or wanting something better.

And in the case of institutionalized religions, we should want something better. Because what they give us, are the reasons we have most of the major problems in this world.

Now, how can that get better?

Certainly not with us fools debating with each other on a forum.

It can only happen with enlightenment. Which brings us back to the OP... It's the only way it can happen, where people will start opening their eyes and drop their birth religions and fundamentalist views.

It's suggested that we should find conclusive evidence of ET-life in the next 10 years. It may not be intelligent, but it will show that life is not exclusive to Earth. Which can set the foundation for a new reality, and hope.

Well no, I'm not bunting or switch-hitting or whatever dumb analogy you'd like to make. I am speaking philosophically over your head, which isn't very hard to do, to be perfectly honest.

Now... let's discuss this concept you've presented about "better" and what that means exactly? Better than what? Better in what sense? By what measure are you determining what is or isn't "better" for all of mankind? Is this from some sense of "good" that you are ordained with which none of the rest of us have? And what IS "good"? And what IS "evil"?

To me, these are all arbitrary criteria which are essentially rooted in our spiritual foundations. Your ideas of what constitutes "good" or "better" or "best" may be completely different from mine. Your ideas aren't validated simply because you believe they are true and neither are mine.

Hitler thought it was "better" and "good" to exterminate 7 million Jews. The 19 hijackers on 9/11 thought it was "better" and "good" to fly airplanes into the WTC buildings. Their ideas weren't validated because they believed them to be true.

Dude, what you have done, from the beginning of our discussions, is to pick a side to debate.

You told me that you do that, even when you don't agree with that position. You just want to debate.

And that's cool. But you can't do it to me over and over again, because I see how you switch. And being a baseball fan, I like to use baseball analogies on your posting style.

Now, I never change. Nor do most of the people here. However, you post what would seem to be most rosier to your agenda. Which is getting likes and happy faces.

You are not smarter than anyone here, you need to learn from people here...

And when I speak of "better", I mean a place that doesn't fear other religions. A place without zealots, that will let you be as you are and grow as you should.

Not a place where fear-mongers tell you what you must believe in, and are damned if you don't... Those people are the problems. And you defend them. To continue your debate with me and/or others. You keep changing sides, so I don't know what you truly think.

 

[Boss]

And when I speak of "better", I mean a place that doesn't fear other religions. A place without zealots, that will let you be as you are and grow as you should.

That's totally subjective and not a very realistic expectation. You can't have 7 billion people all content to accept the same "better" ...that's a Utopian fantasy. What's "better" for you may not be "better" for me and visa versa.

Sounds like you want to be dictator of the world and tell everyone what they're to believe in and how they are to think.

Dude, what you have done, from the beginning of our discussions, is to pick a side to debate.

You told me that you do that, even when you don't agree with that position. You just want to debate.

No, I don't think I've ever told you that. I won't debate things I don't agree with. I may play "devil's advocate" sometimes, for the sake of conversation... that's not a debate. I honestly don't see where you think I've changed my positions. My views are consistent... I'm not a Christian... I am a Spiritualist. I don't believe in a Christian God... I believe in Spiritual Energy as God. I don't have disdain for religion unless it's radical Islam which I don't consider a religion. I will defend religion when it's under attack by anti-religious zealots.

 

[RWS]

To Part One... Utopian fantasy is our ultimate goal, is it not?

Or is your goal division?

I don't want to be a dictator in any world. That's totally against my way of thinking about things....


To Part Two:
You said it to me, and I can find the post and quote it if necessary. You just want to debate. And that's cool. You definitely like to play "devil's advocate". And I have shown you wrong before, and is why I ask why you are trying again.

2 outta 3? Is that your game?

If I handed you a knife, would you kill me because of my thoughts?

 

[sealybobo]

Why do you think we are alone?

I can explain why I think we're alone... or virtually alone, in the sense there is probably no other "life as we know it" out there.

It's because our unique set of circumstances resulted in what we have. There are hundreds, if not thousands of variables which culminate in bringing about "life as we know it" on this planet.

What are the mathematical odds or probability that you could be sitting in Las Vegas and I could be in Atlantic City at poker tables and we would both be drawing the same exact hands at the same time, and this would repeat through thousands of hands? I would say that's a remarkably slim possibility... nearly impossible. Even if you had thousands or millions of people sitting at poker tables around the world, the probability that any two would be consistently drawing the same exact hands repeatedly is near impossible.

In order to have "life as we know it" anywhere else, there are so many circumstantial conditions that have to be met in precise order it makes it a near mathematical impossibility. It takes much more than simply having a rock in the Goldilocks Zone.

Now... microbial life? Plant life? Primitive forms of life? Yeah, that's possible.... but actual intelligent beings such as humans? That's a whole different ball of wax. For instance, you have to realize something.... Had there never been a mass extinction event that wiped out the dinosaurs, large mammals such as humans would've never existed here. We could have never evolved. So just that one circumstantial event changed the course of evolution and helped create "life as we know it" on Earth.

All land-based life emerged from our oceans... But life doesn't exist in a stagnant ocean. What enabled life in our oceans was the presence of a moon which caused tides and a wobbly rotation of the planet which created "seasons" on our planet and oceanic convection. So you're going to need to find another "water world" in the Goldilocks Zone, with a substantial moon close enough to create tides and the planet needs a wobbly rotation to cause seasons. That's just for the basic starter conditions of life to form. The course of that life's evolution will depend on thousands of other circumstances and variables, some of which are very delicate and important.

If humans never evolved this planet would still have life on it.

I'm sure their evolutionary path is different from ours

 

[sealybobo]

Once upon a time there was no universe. In fact, there was nothing at all. Then, the universe created itself and then mankind appeared from out of the blue. Anyone who thinks differently is insane.

What did god do 20 billion years ago? How about 50? There was nothing? I doubt that.

And you can't tell us anything about the days before our universe started

 

[K9Buck]

Why do you think we are alone?

I can explain why I think we're alone... or virtually alone, in the sense there is probably no other "life as we know it" out there.

It's because our unique set of circumstances resulted in what we have. There are hundreds, if not thousands of variables which culminate in bringing about "life as we know it" on this planet.

What are the mathematical odds or probability that you could be sitting in Las Vegas and I could be in Atlantic City at poker tables and we would both be drawing the same exact hands at the same time, and this would repeat through thousands of hands? I would say that's a remarkably slim possibility... nearly impossible. Even if you had thousands or millions of people sitting at poker tables around the world, the probability that any two would be consistently drawing the same exact hands repeatedly is near impossible.

In order to have "life as we know it" anywhere else, there are so many circumstantial conditions that have to be met in precise order it makes it a near mathematical impossibility. It takes much more than simply having a rock in the Goldilocks Zone.

Now... microbial life? Plant life? Primitive forms of life? Yeah, that's possible.... but actual intelligent beings such as humans? That's a whole different ball of wax. For instance, you have to realize something.... Had there never been a mass extinction event that wiped out the dinosaurs, large mammals such as humans would've never existed here. We could have never evolved. So just that one circumstantial event changed the course of evolution and helped create "life as we know it" on Earth.

All land-based life emerged from our oceans... But life doesn't exist in a stagnant ocean. What enabled life in our oceans was the presence of a moon which caused tides and a wobbly rotation of the planet which created "seasons" on our planet and oceanic convection. So you're going to need to find another "water world" in the Goldilocks Zone, with a substantial moon close enough to create tides and the planet needs a wobbly rotation to cause seasons. That's just for the basic starter conditions of life to form. The course of that life's evolution will depend on thousands of other circumstances and variables, some of which are very delicate and important.

If humans never evolved this planet would still have life on it.

I'm sure their evolutionary path is different from ours

Yea, we evolved from a primordial soup after lightning struck and, somehow, life began. We were once a single cell amoeba and evolved into what we are now. In time we'll grow wings to fly!

 

[K9Buck]

Once upon a time there was no universe. In fact, there was nothing at all. Then, the universe created itself and then mankind appeared from out of the blue. Anyone who thinks differently is insane.

What did god do 20 billion years ago? How about 50? There was nothing? I doubt that.

And you can't tell us anything about the days before our universe started

God? No. I told you, everything came from nothing. Why is that so hard to believe? Don't you believe in science?

 

[Mudda]

Once upon a time there was no universe. In fact, there was nothing at all. Then, the universe created itself and then mankind appeared from out of the blue. Anyone who thinks differently is insane.

What did god do 20 billion years ago? How about 50? There was nothing? I doubt that.

And you can't tell us anything about the days before our universe started

God? No. I told you, everything came from nothing. Why is that so hard to believe? Don't you believe in science?

Science doesn't say that. Please try again.

 

[rightwinger]

...and tell us there's no God.

That is why scientists like Carl Sagan so eagerly tell us there MUST be life on other planets, but it's a wish, there is no science to back up his claims.

So far, after decades of listening with radio telescopes, the skies have been totally silent.

Either aliens don't exist at all anywhere in the universe, or they are so far away their transmissions will never reach us.

And in either case, we will never have aliens visit us.

We are probably alone.

I think there is life on other planets, but most is of the order of magnitude of slime or single cell organisms

Intelligent life takes precise climatic conditions that don't exist through most of the universe.

 

[K9Buck]

Once upon a time there was no universe. In fact, there was nothing at all. Then, the universe created itself and then mankind appeared from out of the blue. Anyone who thinks differently is insane.

What did god do 20 billion years ago? How about 50? There was nothing? I doubt that.

And you can't tell us anything about the days before our universe started

God? No. I told you, everything came from nothing. Why is that so hard to believe? Don't you believe in science?

Science doesn't say that. Please try again.

Feel free to present your theory. I could use a good laugh.

 

[Mudda]

Once upon a time there was no universe. In fact, there was nothing at all. Then, the universe created itself and then mankind appeared from out of the blue. Anyone who thinks differently is insane.

What did god do 20 billion years ago? How about 50? There was nothing? I doubt that.

And you can't tell us anything about the days before our universe started

God? No. I told you, everything came from nothing. Why is that so hard to believe? Don't you believe in science?

Science doesn't say that. Please try again.

Feel free to present your theory. I could use a good laugh.

Science is still looking for the answers, and doesn't PRETEND to know like you do.

 

[hobelim]

...and tell us there's no God.

That is why scientists like Carl Sagan so eagerly tell us there MUST be life on other planets, but it's a wish, there is no science to back up his claims.

So far, after decades of listening with radio telescopes, the skies have been totally silent.

Either aliens don't exist at all anywhere in the universe, or they are so far away their transmissions will never reach us.

And in either case, we will never have aliens visit us.

We are probably alone.

I think there is life on other planets, but most is of the order of magnitude of slime or single cell organisms

Intelligent life takes precise climatic conditions that don't exist through most of the universe.

The earth is teeming with life with many intelligent life forms flourishing in environments that would kill you.

Chances are the universe is also teeming with intelligent life, not necessarily in a form that we could recognize even if it was already here like a mysterious virus of unknown origin, for instance, that was somehow spliced whole into the human genome, our own DNA, around 750,000 years ago...