Ask a Catholic

[Meriweather]

God created the Tree.... [blah-blah-blah (my addition)]

Not worth a response because as Isaiah put it:
Listen carefully, but you will not understand;
Look closely, but you will not see.

 

[Meriweather]

They weren't taught as "literature", they were taught as the TRUTH. Sister Mary Butch thought those babies totally deserved to be drowned!!!!

I call baloney. You certainly did not have the same teacher for all twelve years of Catholic school. Even if you had, especially as you matured, there was plenty of notes and commentary available--not to mention just plain common sense--telling you differently. But you would not listen to that. Still won't.

 

[Meriweather]

No, the Parish just tells you to give them money or you will go to Hell Forever and Ever, because God needs money.

Thou shall not bear false witness. You know this was never taught.

 

[JoeB131]

It is in the Catechism of the Catholic Church. Either you are greatly exaggerating your stories, or some bishop truly disliked your parish and sent all the ignorant and all the misfits there. I am leaning towards the former.

I make nothing up. I don't add one word. This crazy shit happened, and frankly, I couldn't get away from these people fast enough.

It was kind of funny, I was visiting my sister for some holiday, and we had "The Blues Brothers" on, with the scene with Sr. Mary Stigmata, whacking Jake and Elwood with a ruler. We laughed hysterically at this scene, but my niece just didn't get while it was so funny. The nuns were really that whacky.

And you focus on them instead of scholars in history, culture, languages, and theology?

Because they are Christianity for mass culture. Most people are never going to see a theologian, they are going to see some priest or minister up there screaming the fire and brimstone. God loves you, but he'll send you to hell if you don't give him money!

Not worth a response because as Isaiah put it:
Listen carefully, but you will not understand;
Look closely, but you will not see.

Yes, I can totally get why you don't like going into critical discussions of Old Testament stories... God comes off like a total dick in most of them.

I call baloney. You certainly did not have the same teacher for all twelve years of Catholic school. Even if you had, especially as you matured, there was plenty of notes and commentary available--not to mention just plain common sense--telling you differently. But you would not listen to that. Still won't.

If you had been paying attention, I said that by High School, they modified the Flood story to make it a lot less impressive. The Flood only happened in Mesopotamia, but somehow the Ark still got to Mount Ararat, which is somewhere in Turkey. I called bullshit on that one, too.

Now, you can debunk the Flood Story ten ways to Sunday, or point out it's an ripoff of earlier myths. That's really not the point. The point is, in that story, God kind of comes off as a monster who slaughters everyone in the world because he makes choices they don't like... and he could do it again. So you better be good.

Thou shall not bear false witness. You know this was never taught.

What I remember was going to church every Sunday to drop off "the envelop" because we had five kids in that school, before the government cracked down on that shit. Those molested altar boys aren't going to pay off themselves!

 

[Meriweather]

It was kind of funny, I was visiting my sister for some holiday, and we had "The Blues Brothers" on, with the scene with Sr. Mary Stigmata, whacking Jake and Elwood with a ruler. We laughed hysterically at this scene, but my niece just didn't get while it was so funny. The nuns were really that whacky.

Not one nun hit anyone where I went to Catholic school. Not one. And none of them told us babies were wicked, that non-Catholics were going to hell, etc. Fourth grade--had a very mean nun, never have met anyone like her before or since, but she did fine teaching religion and about everything else. Didn't stop her meanness, but she taught well. Fortunately we had the kindness nun in fifth grade. She taught even better, especially math.

 

[Meriweather]

Because they are Christianity for mass culture. Most people are never going to see a theologian, they are going to see some priest or minister up there screaming the fire and brimstone. God loves you, but he'll send you to hell if you don't give him money!

This is just plain silly. There have only been three (count them, three) times in my entire life where I have heard a homily about hell--and I have attended at least a dozen Catholic churches, so it wasn't just one place. Second, in all parishes, money was brought up exactly once a year, and the priests seemed to hate that Sunday as much as anyone.

 

[Turtlesoup]

1. Look up the statistics for yourself. You will find your "much" is a lesser percentage than the total population.

2. The Catholic Church does not shun gays--or anyone for that matter. We have this philosophy that sins are forgiven, repentance for the forgiveness of sins. "Catholic" means open and welcoming to everyone.

It seems you are interpreting Catholic teaching of marriage is between a man and a woman as "shunning gays".

Catholic Church "fathers" are often GAY as hell......despite whatever propaganda stat that you are trying to quote. Again........priests raping little boys is defined officially as hetero sex if that helps you statistical understanding. I define it as gay sex......

 

[Turtlesoup]

This is just plain silly. There have only been three (count them, three) times in my entire life where I have heard a homily about hell--and I have attended at least a dozen Catholic churches, so it wasn't just one place. Second, in all parishes, money was brought up exactly once a year, and the priests seemed to hate that Sunday as much as anyone.

Good gawd---where do you come up with this. I went to catholic church as a child with my cousins (6 of them). In Sunday school each and everyone of us were expected to donate money, or we wouldn't be "rewarded" like the kids that donated were...the nuns demanded money. and then when we got into the church, the priest begged and expected more money every sunday the same demand for money. The church has to have money to keep its pope in gold now doesn't it. Oh don't get me started and tithing directly from paychecks BS----mail in money as well. Then there was the special money for special projects (like paying off molested boys families) money begging. The catholic church is greedy..........

 

[Meriweather]

Yes, I can totally get why you don't like going into critical discussions of Old Testament stories...

Wrong again. I love the Old Testament where God comes across as one who cares deeply for His people. But then, I took the time to research the history, culture, and languages of the time. I read rabbinical commentaries, concentrated on the Hebrew. The reason I did this? Because it seemed to me that God didn't sound like God in the Old Testament. In the original Hebrew he sounds like God in the New Testament and beyond. It is amazing what can be learned if we are willing to move beyond our own modern culture and the English language. I have tried to convey some of that to you, but some are too entrenched in modern culture, in English, and so, so satisfied with their own conclusions and disdain of God. If you fall into that group, Joe, you are missing out, and that disappoints me. You deserve better.

 

[Meriweather]

The point is, in that story, God kind of comes off as a monster who slaughters everyone in the world because he makes choices they don't like... and he could do it again.

And once again you do not understand the literature of the time or the lessons. Nor do you embrace the science of our own time.

 

[Meriweather]

What I remember was going to church every Sunday to drop off "the envelop" because we had five kids in that school,

If that's all you remember, you have a very poor memory. The collection usually lasts a couple of minutes. I remember much more.

 

[Meriweather]

despite whatever propaganda stat that you are trying to quote

Not propaganda...actual data from outside statistics that the Church has nothing to do with. It appears you are more immersed in someone's propaganda than I. I was a news reporter at the time, albeit at college. We dug deeper, found that other faiths, and to our dismay, schools, were in worse shape than the Catholic faith, with families being the worse offenders of all.

The regular media didn't pick up on what we found; we were even told that people paid attention to a Catholic scandal, but would dismiss stories about schools, home, etc. Ganging up on Catholics was fair game, but schools and home--that would be like trashing apple pie. So our work was "left on the cutting room floor" as the saying goes.

Taught us to ALWAYS look into what the news isn't telling us, so that was a good lesson I've never forgotten. The other news being left on the cutting room floor? The steps the Catholic Church has taken to prevent such acts is a model for other organizations.

Interesting that the parish in which I was raised never had such a priest. However, just a couple hours away, a good friend I wouldn't meet until much later in life, had a priest that she said all kids knew to avoid--and this was well before the story broke.

 

[JoeB131]

Not one nun hit anyone where I went to Catholic school. Not one. And none of them told us babies were wicked, that non-Catholics were going to hell, etc. Fourth grade--had a very mean nun, never have met anyone like her before or since, but she did fine teaching religion and about everything else. Didn't stop her meanness, but she taught well. Fortunately we had the kindness nun in fifth grade. She taught even better, especially math.

Really? I remember being in a writer's group I belonged to, and there where three of us telling Nun Horror Stories to our one friend who was Protestant and absolutely aghast this kind of thing went on.

Like I said. Best part of the gay liberation movement is all those frustrated lesbians found more constructive ways to unleash their tension.

This is just plain silly. There have only been three (count them, three) times in my entire life where I have heard a homily about hell--and I have attended at least a dozen Catholic churches, so it wasn't just one place. Second, in all parishes, money was brought up exactly once a year, and the priests seemed to hate that Sunday as much as anyone.

Again, every week, if you had kids in the school, you had to drop off the envelop.

Wrong again. I love the Old Testament where God comes across as one who cares deeply for His people. But then, I took the time to research the history, culture, and languages of the time. I read rabbinical commentaries, concentrated on the Hebrew. The reason I did this? Because it seemed to me that God didn't sound like God in the Old Testament. In the original Hebrew he sounds like God in the New Testament and beyond. It is amazing what can be learned if we are willing to move beyond our own modern culture and the English language. I have tried to convey some of that to you, but some are too entrenched in modern culture, in English, and so, so satisfied with their own conclusions and disdain of God. If you fall into that group, Joe, you are missing out, and that disappoints me. You deserve better.

Really? I don't read the Old Testament that way at all.

What I read is a petty Bronze Age God who punishes his creations for shits and grins.

There's poor Onan who didn't want to fuck his dead brother's wife, and spooged on the floor, so God Killed him for pulling out
David and Bathsheba's baby, who suffered for a week to teach David a lesson. (David kept doing dumb shit, so not sure what the point was.)
Jephthah's daughter, who got butchered and burned because her father made a foolish oath.

Now, to give you credit, um, yeah, they never taught me those stories (except the one about David because nuns objectively hated children) in Catholic School, I got to find out about them later.

nd once again you do not understand the literature of the time or the lessons. Nor do you embrace the science of our own time.

Naw, I can just enjoy science without believing in bronze age fairy tales.

If that's all you remember, you have a very poor memory. The collection usually lasts a couple of minutes. I remember much more.

Actually, we had the one father from Lithuania who spent every time he was up to bat whining about the Communists. That was kind of interesting. But most of those 12 years of dropping off the envelop were boring. I'd much rather have been anywhere else.

 

[The Irish Ram]

If you read the bible women are not even allowed to talk in church, I got so mad one time at communion in a Catholic church, when a girl tried to give me the cookie...I refused.

Women preached, taught, wrote letters like Paul....
You can read the Bible over and over and unless you do your research, you are left to your own understanding.

Only one group of women, in one specific church were told to shut up. The bible tells us of other women who were never told to stop ministering.
The letter in question was written to a specific church whose women were sneaking off to an oracle then getting up in church and exclaiming what they were told by the oracle as gospel. That's all it was.
In refusing to take the "cookie" you didn't slight the girl, you slighted the Lord.
Next time, take the cookie, in remembrance of Christ...

 

[surada]

https://www.facebook.com/9ffd4908-003a-44b7-a779-20b662b59ef7

 

[rstrats]

Does anyone have any questions or concerns about the Catholic faith?

As far as scripture is concerned, there are only 3 times mentioned where the Messiah spoke to Mary. And He seemed to be a bit perturbed with her 2 of those times. The 3rd time He merely told her to look at her son. He never addressed her as mother but only as woman. Although He did know of the word when He told the disciple at the cross to look at his (the disciple's) mother.

Also, He only spoke 2 times with regard to what someone said about her and again His responses couldn't be considered very flattering.

There just never seemed to be any warmth shown between them.

In addition, none of the New Testament epistle writers were inspired by the Holy Spirit to mention her other than Galatians 4:4 saying that the Messiah was born of a woman.

So I guess my question is, why is she such a vital part of the Roman/Latin Rite Catholic practicing theology?

 

[Meriweather]

He never addressed her as mother but only as woman.

'Woman' is considered very respectful--it outlines her role as created side by side with man, but as woman and as mother. It also denotes a sense of distance between the two that some believe is to emphasize that Jesus message did not come from family heritage (descendant of David), but from God.

In addition, none of the New Testament epistle writers were inspired by the Holy Spirit to mention her other than Galatians 4:4 saying that the Messiah was born of a woman.

She is also mentioned in Acts 1:14 as being with and praying together with the Apostles.

So I guess my question is, why is she such a vital part of the Roman/Latin Rite Catholic practicing theology?

In the Catholic faith, women of faith work side-by-side with men. As a woman and a mother, Mary is considered the mother of the Church. Not only do Catholic women mother their children, they also mother the Church. We are woman. The Catholic faith does not (and never has) ignored women of faith. That is why we do not ignore Mary.

 

[JoeB131]

In the Catholic faith, women of faith work side-by-side with men. As a woman and a mother, Mary is considered the mother of the Church. Not only do Catholic women mother their children, they also mother the Church. We are woman. The Catholic faith does not (and never has) ignored women of faith. That is why we do not ignore Mary.

That's nice and all..

But the real reason. All across the former Roman Empire, there were Goddess Cults that had to be subsumed into the church, and Mary was really the only major female figure in the Jesus myth... so that's where you get all the crazy veneration.

Not that I am a fan of Protestant faiths, but they had the good sense to get rid of this vestige of paganism (the other being saint veneration and the worship of relics.)

 

[Meriweather]

But the real reason.

Doubtful. First of all the first celebration honoring Mary occurred in the second century prior to the fall of the Roman Empire. That celebration was held in Jerusalem, not Rome. If you are looking for something that occurred after the fall of the Roman empire, you would be waiting for another five hundred years. After that, we are looking at the 1800s. The theory, "It has to come from paganism" doesn't pan out. It is like stating the custom of eating breakfast all around the world came from paganism.

 

[JoeB131]

Doubtful. First of all the first celebration honoring Mary occurred in the second century prior to the fall of the Roman Empire. That celebration was held in Jerusalem, not Rome. If you are looking for something that occurred after the fall of the Roman empire, you would be waiting for another five hundred years. After that, we are looking at the 1800s. The theory, "It has to come from paganism" doesn't pan out. It is like stating the custom of eating breakfast all around the world came from paganism.

Actually, a shitload of "Christian" practices were co-opted Pagan ideas.

Jesus wasn't born on Dec. 25th (He wasn't born at all because he probably never existed), the Church was just co-opting Winter Solstice holidays like Yule and Saturnalia
Same with Samhain becoming Halloween or Pascha becoming Easter. Them pagans loved their holidays.. We'll totally give up our Gods, but we want our holidays. It's why I always find it funny when Christians whine about how we love Santa more than Jesus on Christmas.

The same thing with Wedding cakes, where a bunch of Homophobic Bakers INSIST they can't make wedding cakes for Gays because Jesus hates Gays, just like they do. Except Wedding Cakes aren't a Christian tradition, they are a Roman one. (Except the Romans made their cakes look like genitalia so they could encourage fertility, so we should be glad THAT got modified!)

Mary coopted Goddess Cults such as Artemis of Ephesus. Do you think it's a coincidence that St. Paul wrote to the Ephesians? Nope. That was a hub of Pagan worship that had to be co-opted.

Even in ancient times, BREAST SELL...