Antisemitism is growing on American campuses

[Dogmaphobe]

Wrong. That's why you cannot argue that it does.

I just said I wishedIsrael were not a Jewish state. I wish it were a secular state.

Predictably, some anti intellectual dumbass can along to claim that as anti Semitic. As predicted.

Again, thank you for doing the one job I had for you.

Actual intellectuals are not as monumentally ignorant as you.

The Zionist movement was and continues to be a secular movement and the State of Israel is by no means a theocracy. The Knesset includes Arabs as well as Jews among its membership.

Your knowing absolutely nothing at all sure doesn't preclude you from acting like you do, though, does it?

 

[Coyote]

If I have to take a side in the middle east conflict, i take the side of Israel. They are the nation with a western style democracy. They are the ones willing to live in peace with their belligerent neighbors.

I think it is more complicated then that, I resist unconditionally taking one side or the other. In some situations I think Israel is right, in some I think the Palestinians. In all cases though, Israel is here to stay and the Palestinians are a peop,e who also inhabit the same patch of land.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

So?

Getting back to the OP.. .

Do you think there is more, or less hostility to the Jewish state, than there is, to say. . . Iran?

I take it that was an implied "yes".

More hostility? Measured... how? I mean, Iran was at war with its neighbor Iraq not long ago. Do you mean, in the United States? Iran, easiy..

Or do you mean, more enemies that pose an actual threat? Then, I suppose Israel.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

The Zionist movement was and continues to be a secular movement

Lie. It represents a Jewish State to many of not most Zionists, not just "a State full of jews".

and the State of Israel is by no means a theocracy.

True, but it still has special sponsorship for one religion. You don't get to ignore what its leaders and voters think. Bibi made sure this was codified, to remove your confusion. Didn't work, apparently.

 

[Coyote]

So, you do not believe Jews have any right to self determination.

Do you believe Japanese should have no self determination? French? Brazilians? Is there any OTHER ethnicity you seek to deny the ability to determine their own destiny?

Like the Palestinians?

 

[Dogmaphobe]

Like the Palestinians?

Palestinians are not an ethnicity. They are simply a group of Arabs who were encouraged to call themselves "Palestinian" at the behest of an Egyptian terrorist as a response to the Arab loss during the 6 day war.

But, yes, Arabs deserve self determination and already enjoy such via the no fewer than the 22 states they currently control. Unlike Israel, though, most of these states also mandate a state religion, which Israel does not.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Palestinians are not an ethnicity.

The United Nations Partition Plan for Palestine, which brought the British mandate to an end in 1948, referred to a "Jewish state" and an "Arab state." - wiki

 

[Coyote]

Palestinians are not an ethnicity. They are simply a group of Arabs who were encouraged to call themselves "Palestinian" at the behest of an Egyptian terrorist as a response to the Arab loss during the 6 day war.

But, yes, Arabs deserve self determination and already enjoy such via the no fewer than the 22 states they currently control. Unlike Israel, though, most of these states also mandate a state religion, which Israel does not.

Ok. So Palestinians do not have a right of self determination in your book.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

The United Nations Partition Plan for Palestine, which brought the British mandate to an end in 1948, referred to a "Jewish state" and an "Arab state." - wiki

Yes, the Arabs DID get 78% of the mandate via the state of Jordan.

You are simply too stupid and ignorant to know they did.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Yes, the Arabs DID get 78% of the mandate via the state of Jordan.

The United Nations Partition Plan for Palestine was a proposal by the United Nations, which recommended a partition of Mandatory Palestine at the end of the British Mandate. On 29 November 1947, the UN General Assembly adopted the Plan as Resolution 181 (II).[2] -wiki

 

[Dogmaphobe]

Ok. So Palestinians do not have a right of self determination in your book.

Arabs already have 22 states, but if the recently created sub-group now called "Palestinians" were to ever show the responsibility and distinctness from other Arabs necessary to justify a state of their own, I have no problem with that.

As soon as they actually want a state more than they want to kill Jews, I say give one to them.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

The United Nations Partition Plan for Palestine was a proposal by the United Nations, which recommended a partition of Mandatory Palestine at the end of the British Mandate. On 29 November 1947, the UN General Assembly adopted the Plan as Resolution 181 (II).[2] -wiki

This is the mandate in question, you profoundly ignorant fool.

 

[Coyote]

I think getting into the history of the Mandate is derailing the thread, let’s trend back to anti semitism,anti Zionism, college campuses…

 

[frigidweirdo]

Not that this should be a surprise, considering who makes up a good deal of the student and faculty population today.

Antisemitism is a Growing Problem Among College Diversity Administrators | Opinion​

MSN

www.msn.com

People like to be angry, they like to create groups to blame things on. Because rule number one is: It's never my fault.

 

[JoeB131]

Everything is stolen land at some point. After 75 years in existence as a nation, it is not going anywhere nor should it. For some reason, it is The Only nation on earth who’s right to exist is still questioned….after 75 years. Does that mean that there are not unresolved injustices and inequities in regards to the Palestinians? Of course not. But to continue to hammer down on it’s very right to exist after 75 years (and unlike any other nation with human rights issues and conflicts) opens up the question of anti-semitism, especially when people go on to insist on calling them European invaders who should go back to Europe.

Quite the contrary, the real problem here is how the Zionist Entity MAINTAINS its existence, not just its existence. The end of colonialism after WWII meant that the white settler regimes across Africa and Asia were deposed from power. The Zionist Entity is really exactly what it appears to be, a European Colonial State.

The only analog I can really point to is Apartheid South Africa, where the only way the White minority was able to hold on to power was to disenfranchise blacks. Much the same thing here. If the Zionist Entity were to allow full enfranchisement of the Palestinians and allow Hama and Fatah delegates to sit in the Knesset, the Zionist Entity would no longer exist.

The alternative solution would be the "Two State" solution, where the Zionists get to keep the land from the pre-1967 border and some of the choicer bits of the West Bank (Including East Jerusalem) and relegate the Palestinians to the impoverished areas.

Apartheid South Africa tried this shit with the homeland policies. The world didn't buy it and boycotts continued until the Botha regime gave up power.

 

[JoeB131]

I tend to agree. I think ”Anti-Zionist” is really a rebranding of “Anti-Semitism” to make it seem more appear legitimate in mainstream culture and politics. Much the same way White Supremacy rebranded into White Nationalism.

Nonsense.

The real problem is that support of the Zionist regime is kind of incompatible with liberal principles.

Now, back in the bad old days (1981-85) when I was a campus conservative because I didn't know any better, we had this pompous Jewish kid who felt like he needed to suck up to black students in a student debate by decrying the horrors of Apartheid. To which I hit him with, "Well, how is that any different than what the Israelis do to the Palestinians?" (I should point out that every year at my campus, we'd have the annual huge demonstrations around Israeli independence day, where the Jewish kids would reserve the big meeting hall and the Arab kids would all stand outside and protest.)

Well, this guy was flummoxed, because he really couldn't come up with an answer. Sure, Israel is a democracy, for Jews. Just like South Africa was a Democracy, for white people.

It's funny how you have the temerity to label other people Nazis.

Nobody talked about Nazis... your reading comprehension must be poor. But since you brought it up...

How is what the Zionists are doing to the Palestinians any different than what the Nazis did to the rest of Europe?

That's why he wants Islamic terrorists to kill them all.

He has dreams of seeing Hitler's Final Solution implemented fully.

Actually, we are already seeing younger Israelis wanting to emigrate, because living in a police state isn't any more fun for them as it is for the Palestinians.

Israel's New Exodus

The "Startup Nation" is experiencing a massive brain drain—and the problem is only getting worse.

www.newsweek.com

It's why the Zionists are scouring the Former Soviet Republics for any Jews they can find.

 

[JoeB131]

So, you do not believe Jews have any right to self determination.

Do you believe Japanese should have no self determination? French? Brazilians? Is there any OTHER ethnicity you seek to deny the ability to determine their own destiny?

Okay, let's look at that comparison. Japan has been occupied by Japanese pretty much for all of their recorded history... Palestine has only been settled by European Jews for the last 75 years.

So the Japanese DID actually try to make other parts of Asia Japanese - Korea, Taiwan, Manchuria. They suppressed native languages and cultures, committed awful atrocities against anyone who resisted... and the world finally said enough is enough. We don't pay as much attention to that part of WWII as we do the European Part, because the Koreans and Chinese don't run Hollywood. (We all know who does.)

The FUNDEMENTAL LIE of Zionism has been "A land without a people for a people without a land". Except the land of Palestine HAD people on it. People who have been forcibly displaced from their homes and live under the Zionist Boot.

 

[JoeB131]

If I have to take a side in the middle east conflict, i take the side of Israel. They are the nation with a western style democracy. They are the ones willing to live in peace with their belligerent neighbors.

Western style Democracy for Jews.
Just like South Africa was western style democracy for White People. Or the old Jim Crow south, but if the Republicans have their way, we will be having the New Jim Crow South.

And this is why the Zionist Entity has such a friend in the United States while it is becoming a pariah in the rest of the world.

 

[JoeB131]

Actual intellectuals are not as monumentally ignorant as you.

The Zionist movement was and continues to be a secular movement and the State of Israel is by no means a theocracy. The Knesset includes Arabs as well as Jews among its membership.

Your knowing absolutely nothing at all sure doesn't preclude you from acting like you do, though, does it?

Except those Arab delegates aren't allowed to become part of any ruling coalition, and the vast majority of Palestinians are disenfranchised.

Palestinians are not an ethnicity. They are simply a group of Arabs who were encouraged to call themselves "Palestinian" at the behest of an Egyptian terrorist as a response to the Arab loss during the 6 day war.

But, yes, Arabs deserve self determination and already enjoy such via the no fewer than the 22 states they currently control. Unlike Israel, though, most of these states also mandate a state religion, which Israel does not.

Well, you'd be wrong again. The Palestinian Liberation Organization was founded in 1964. THREE YEARS before the Six Day War. It suceeded other Palestinian organizations such as the All Palestine Protectorate.

It's also foolish to say that "Arabs" are a monolithic group any more than "Hispanics" are. They are all different nations with different histories. It's like saying it's okay that we annex Mexico because Hispanics still control Columbia.

 

[Coyote]

It's also foolish to say that "Arabs" are a monolithic group any more than "Hispanics" are. They are all different nations with different histories. It's like saying it's okay that we annex Mexico because Hispanics still control Columbia.

I agree with this part, which is why I reject the frequent arguement that so and so already have a bunch of countries….as if that should determine one’s right to self determination.