And You Wonder Why People Question Elections In The US

[Flopper]

U.S. Election Integrity Compares Poorly to Other Democracies

A 2019 report published by the Electoral Integrity Project, an independent project based out of Harvard University, found that U.S. elections from July 2012 through December 2018 rated "lower than any other long-established democracies and affluent societies." Each country in the index was given a score out of 100 based on assessments of the quality of each of its elections – including categories such as electoral laws, voter registration and voting process – one month after polls closed.
The U.S. score of 61 – the same score as Mexico and Panama – is the second-lowest among liberal democracies and much lower than other countries in the Americas region, including Costa Rica, Uruguay and Chile. Denmark, Finland and Norway are among the top-ranked countries in the index, all with scores in the 80s.


Wow, the US ranks right down there with Mexico and Panama, we should be soooo proud.

Your thoughts?

.

US is not rated highly not because of election fraud but because of suppression of voter rights, gerrymandering, misinformation campaigns, lack of cybersecurity, and undermine confidence in the electoral process.

 

[citygator]

This thread is about how our elections are conducted compared to other countries, not who is running.

This thread is a lame attempt to insinuate some world organization is questioning US election integrity. That is not what the report says. It says the integrity of our elections is impeccable but the strict access rules and manipulation of borders (aka gerrymandering) are world class bad. Saddle up and address it or this thread is bunk.

All States engage in jerrymandering, you just think it's bad in red States. And access should be strict. Name one other country that doesn't require proof of citizenship.

.

You haven’t addressed my point at all yet. The study you linked rated the security of elections as stellar. It’s the access to voting that is getting us low ratings as well as gerrymandering. It’s not what your suggesting. It is in fact the opposite of what you are suggesting.

 

[Batcat]

More irrefutable evidence will emerge in the next few months that the 2020 Presidential election was rigged. There already is plenty of evidence but the liberal media is employing their monkey philosophy when it encounters Democrat malfeasance.

The evidence is always just around the corner, it just never seems to arrive. Kinda like Trump's claims of illegals voting in 2016, he put together a commission that managed to find exactly nothing and quietly disbanded.

Does the "liberal media" include the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency (CISA) and Attorney General Barr?

Would that be the same agency that was clueless about the largest hack of government agencies in US history, for almost a year?

Nothing stays secret forever. 2016 was a long time ago and no major election fraud has come to light.

Actually evidence of voter fraud has emerged but is being ignored by the liberal media.

The US has probably never had an election without fraud but there has never been any hard evidence that a presidential result has been decided by fraud, certainly not in the last 100 years.

You don’t find evidence unless an honest, unbiased investigation occurs.

If we want to restore faith in our election system we need such an investigation. Of course if we do find evidence of election rigging somebody should go to prison. Unfortunately high ranking Democrats are above the rule of law.

 

[OKTexas]

U.S. Election Integrity Compares Poorly to Other Democracies

A 2019 report published by the Electoral Integrity Project, an independent project based out of Harvard University, found that U.S. elections from July 2012 through December 2018 rated "lower than any other long-established democracies and affluent societies." Each country in the index was given a score out of 100 based on assessments of the quality of each of its elections – including categories such as electoral laws, voter registration and voting process – one month after polls closed.
The U.S. score of 61 – the same score as Mexico and Panama – is the second-lowest among liberal democracies and much lower than other countries in the Americas region, including Costa Rica, Uruguay and Chile. Denmark, Finland and Norway are among the top-ranked countries in the index, all with scores in the 80s.


Wow, the US ranks right down there with Mexico and Panama, we should be soooo proud.

Your thoughts?

.

Between the electoral college, gerrymandering and voter suppression the Democratic process is seriously distorted. Things that as it happens is all supported by the GOP and I'm guessing you.

I invite you to read the actual study. And then explain to me how the findings are NOT an indictment about the Trump era?

It's either cynical or dumb to cite an article that not only doesn't support your own premise but actually directly contradicts what the GOP pursues as policy and you undoubtedly supports.

Here's what I actually support dumb ass.

1. Proof of citizenship to register to vote.
2. Photo ID for voting
3. Absentee voting should be rare and require a valid reason, with ID required.
4. Voter rolls should be verified every two years and names not verified should be removed.
5. Mass mail ballots should be outlawed, just like more than two dozen developed countries have done, because of the propensity for fraud.

Now tell the folks what you would object to and why.

.

I'm not the one citing a link that doesn't support any of these premises, but claims that it somehow supports my position. So. I'd be very careful of calling people a dumbass.

As to me objectimg

U.S. Election Integrity Compares Poorly to Other Democracies

A 2019 report published by the Electoral Integrity Project, an independent project based out of Harvard University, found that U.S. elections from July 2012 through December 2018 rated "lower than any other long-established democracies and affluent societies." Each country in the index was given a score out of 100 based on assessments of the quality of each of its elections – including categories such as electoral laws, voter registration and voting process – one month after polls closed.
The U.S. score of 61 – the same score as Mexico and Panama – is the second-lowest among liberal democracies and much lower than other countries in the Americas region, including Costa Rica, Uruguay and Chile. Denmark, Finland and Norway are among the top-ranked countries in the index, all with scores in the 80s.


Wow, the US ranks right down there with Mexico and Panama, we should be soooo proud.

Your thoughts?

.

Between the electoral college, gerrymandering and voter suppression the Democratic process is seriously distorted. Things that as it happens is all supported by the GOP and I'm guessing you.

I invite you to read the actual study. And then explain to me how the findings are NOT an indictment about the Trump era?

It's either cynical or dumb to cite an article that not only doesn't support your own premise but actually directly contradicts what the GOP pursues as policy and you undoubtedly supports.

Here's what I actually support dumb ass.

1. Proof of citizenship to register to vote.
2. Photo ID for voting
3. Absentee voting should be rare and require a valid reason, with ID required.
4. Voter rolls should be verified every two years and names not verified should be removed.
5. Mass mail ballots should be outlawed, just like more than two dozen developed countries have done, because of the propensity for fraud.

Now tell the folks what you would object to and why.

.

I'm not the one citing a link that doesn't support any of these premises, so I'd be careful of calling people a dumbass.

As to what I object to and why. I'll go over it point by point.

1. Is already being done. You have to state on your voter registration form that you are a citizen. Lying is a crime. Not only that but most state actively cross-reference the registration to information they have. PolitiFact | Do states verify citizenship of voters in federal elections?
So I don't object to it. I object to the idea that it's a problem in the US. Neither does your study say it is.

2. Millions of people, eligible voters DO NOT have a voter ID. FACT CHECK: Do Millions Of Americans Not Have Government Photo ID? - Conservative Daily News. On the other hand, despite actively searching for it states that have strict voter idea laws do not really have less voter fraud for as much as there is. In effect what you are saying is that you don't mind disenfranchising millions of Americans from voting because a few might take advantage of the lacks voter id laws and commit a felony. So yes I object to that. I object to the premise that a few hundred POTENTIAL cases of voter fraud warrant millions of people not being able to participate in Democracy. Something your link DOES support.

3. Why? A vote is a vote, is it not? Somehow, someone who doesn't go to a polling place personally is somehow not entitled to choose who they want to be as their leader?

4. Again, why. Many states cross-reference their voter rolls against one another and casting votes twice in itself is again... A felony. The fact of the matter is again, that despite people looking for it it is simply rare for people to vote twice. What isn't rare is for people to be lacks about things like replying to a summons to appear in a courthouse to confirm you are registered to vote. So you are again saying you are comfortable with disenfranchising people from voting in order to combat a problem that doesn't really exist.

5. And yet no court has been convinced and few are claiming massive fraud in this election cycle despite mass mail ballots in this cycle. What HAS happened is that this election cycle has seen a historic voter turnout despite there being a pandemic. More people participating means a more Democratic result, exactly what should be to point of the Democratic process.

Every single one of the points you support has as a net result that fewer eligible voters are capable of voting. And I'm talking about millions of voters. That is what your study asserts as being one of the reasons for the US scoring so badly as a Democracy.

So I just answered all of your points. Care to give a rebuttal that doesn't rely on name-calling?

Illegals are already criminals, and criminals never lie, right? The problem is when States try to ferret it out, they are sued by you commies. Also your assertions that people don't have ID or access to get FREE ID is bullshit. ID is required for so many other things, social services, buy alcohol, driving, getting credit ect. People have the ability to get ID.

Also attorneys in NV identified 3,500 people that voted in the State, by name and DOB, that no longer live in the State. They excluded military from their count. Will those people be prosecuted, I sincerely doubt it.

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How do you get from non-citizens to illegals? You do realize those things are not the same right? As for them being criminals, that's again a leap but most illegals don't want to draw attention to themselves by casting one vote in a US election. In fact find me one case where that happened?

CITIZENS WITHOUT PROOF (brennancenter.org)
U.S. GAO - Elections: Issues Related to State Voter Identification Laws [Reissued on February 27, 2015]
Microsoft Word - Study Release Final.docx (wisc.edu)
How many studies do you want that categorically states that there's a certain percentage of US citizens that lack photo ID?

As to Nevada. Nevada Judge Shoots Down 25 Trump Conspiracy Theories | Law & Crime (lawandcrime.com)
This is the problem you and by extension your fellow Trump supporters have. Not a single judge is supporting your assertions, regardless of political affiliation. This is also a function in a Democracy. That any allegations have to be proven before the courts. It does not matter what your "attorneys" claim. It matters what can be proven.

Your old arguments concerning voter ID don't hold water. Voter participation has increased proportionally across States with and without ID requirements. Also the lawyers I mentioned in NV are not affiliated with Trump or his campaign and their evidence has never been presented to a court as far as I know. So keep spewing your commie fantasies and I'll continue to laugh at you.

.

 

[OKTexas]

More irrefutable evidence will emerge in the next few months that the 2020 Presidential election was rigged. There already is plenty of evidence but the liberal media is employing their monkey philosophy when it encounters Democrat malfeasance.

The evidence is always just around the corner, it just never seems to arrive. Kinda like Trump's claims of illegals voting in 2016, he put together a commission that managed to find exactly nothing and quietly disbanded.

Does the "liberal media" include the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency (CISA) and Attorney General Barr?

Would that be the same agency that was clueless about the largest hack of government agencies in US history, for almost a year?

Nothing stays secret forever. 2016 was a long time ago and no major election fraud has come to light.

Got to love how you commies hedge your words, always throwing in little caveats, making your lies, "little white lies", in your eyes, instead of "whoppers". LMAO

Here's a clue commie, lies are lies.

.

 

[OKTexas]

This thread is about how our elections are conducted compared to other countries, not who is running.

This thread is a lame attempt to insinuate some world organization is questioning US election integrity. That is not what the report says. It says the integrity of our elections is impeccable but the strict access rules and manipulation of borders (aka gerrymandering) are world class bad. Saddle up and address it or this thread is bunk.

All States engage in jerrymandering, you just think it's bad in red States. And access should be strict. Name one other country that doesn't require proof of citizenship.

.

Gerrymandering is a non-partisan disgrace but I'm proud to say that we in Virginia passed an amendment saying the redistricting from the 2020 census will be done by a non-partisan committee. Sadly the Dems opposed it but, even though VA has turned Blue, the people voted in the amendment. Who's next America?

It won't matter who does it, the legislature will have to approve it and there will be suits to change it. That's just the way things are.

.

 

[OKTexas]

U.S. Election Integrity Compares Poorly to Other Democracies

A 2019 report published by the Electoral Integrity Project, an independent project based out of Harvard University, found that U.S. elections from July 2012 through December 2018 rated "lower than any other long-established democracies and affluent societies." Each country in the index was given a score out of 100 based on assessments of the quality of each of its elections – including categories such as electoral laws, voter registration and voting process – one month after polls closed.
The U.S. score of 61 – the same score as Mexico and Panama – is the second-lowest among liberal democracies and much lower than other countries in the Americas region, including Costa Rica, Uruguay and Chile. Denmark, Finland and Norway are among the top-ranked countries in the index, all with scores in the 80s.


Wow, the US ranks right down there with Mexico and Panama, we should be soooo proud.

Your thoughts?

.

Between the electoral college, gerrymandering and voter suppression the Democratic process is seriously distorted. Things that as it happens is all supported by the GOP and I'm guessing you.

I invite you to read the actual study. And then explain to me how the findings are NOT an indictment about the Trump era?

It's either cynical or dumb to cite an article that not only doesn't support your own premise but actually directly contradicts what the GOP pursues as policy and you undoubtedly supports.

Here's what I actually support dumb ass.

1. Proof of citizenship to register to vote.
2. Photo ID for voting
3. Absentee voting should be rare and require a valid reason, with ID required.
4. Voter rolls should be verified every two years and names not verified should be removed.
5. Mass mail ballots should be outlawed, just like more than two dozen developed countries have done, because of the propensity for fraud.

Now tell the folks what you would object to and why.

.

Why #3? It is one of the thinks marked as a shortcoming in electoral process. Anyone should be able to choose absentee.

I disagree, but, that is not mass mailings to voter rolls that are inadequately maintained. And it's not doing it like they did in GA this election, where the request and ballot are not signature verified with the registration and no ID is required.

.

 

[OKTexas]

U.S. Election Integrity Compares Poorly to Other Democracies

A 2019 report published by the Electoral Integrity Project, an independent project based out of Harvard University, found that U.S. elections from July 2012 through December 2018 rated "lower than any other long-established democracies and affluent societies." Each country in the index was given a score out of 100 based on assessments of the quality of each of its elections – including categories such as electoral laws, voter registration and voting process – one month after polls closed.
The U.S. score of 61 – the same score as Mexico and Panama – is the second-lowest among liberal democracies and much lower than other countries in the Americas region, including Costa Rica, Uruguay and Chile. Denmark, Finland and Norway are among the top-ranked countries in the index, all with scores in the 80s.


Wow, the US ranks right down there with Mexico and Panama, we should be soooo proud.

Your thoughts?

.

US is not rated highly not because of election fraud but because of suppression of voter rights, gerrymandering, misinformation campaigns, lack of cybersecurity, and undermine confidence in the electoral process.

Confidence in the electoral process should be questioned. When you have the media that are suppose to be holding politicians accountable to the people, becoming advocates for one side and putting out not just misinformation but pure propaganda, there can be no fair elections. Also voter suppression is a freaking myth, record turnouts in all States proves that.

.

 

[OKTexas]

This thread is about how our elections are conducted compared to other countries, not who is running.

This thread is a lame attempt to insinuate some world organization is questioning US election integrity. That is not what the report says. It says the integrity of our elections is impeccable but the strict access rules and manipulation of borders (aka gerrymandering) are world class bad. Saddle up and address it or this thread is bunk.

All States engage in jerrymandering, you just think it's bad in red States. And access should be strict. Name one other country that doesn't require proof of citizenship.

.

You haven’t addressed my point at all yet. The study you linked rated the security of elections as stellar. It’s the access to voting that is getting us low ratings as well as gerrymandering. It’s not what your suggesting. It is in fact the opposite of what you are suggesting.

See post #69.

.

 

[citygator]

This thread is about how our elections are conducted compared to other countries, not who is running.

This thread is a lame attempt to insinuate some world organization is questioning US election integrity. That is not what the report says. It says the integrity of our elections is impeccable but the strict access rules and manipulation of borders (aka gerrymandering) are world class bad. Saddle up and address it or this thread is bunk.

All States engage in jerrymandering, you just think it's bad in red States. And access should be strict. Name one other country that doesn't require proof of citizenship.

.

You haven’t addressed my point at all yet. The study you linked rated the security of elections as stellar. It’s the access to voting that is getting us low ratings as well as gerrymandering. It’s not what your suggesting. It is in fact the opposite of what you are suggesting.

See post #69.

.

Your OP is a lie. There is nothing in that report challenging election integrity. You did not read it and are dancing around like a drunk avoiding answering to it because you know I busted your lying ass. Keep dancing Jester.

 

[OKTexas]

This thread is about how our elections are conducted compared to other countries, not who is running.

This thread is a lame attempt to insinuate some world organization is questioning US election integrity. That is not what the report says. It says the integrity of our elections is impeccable but the strict access rules and manipulation of borders (aka gerrymandering) are world class bad. Saddle up and address it or this thread is bunk.

All States engage in jerrymandering, you just think it's bad in red States. And access should be strict. Name one other country that doesn't require proof of citizenship.

.

You haven’t addressed my point at all yet. The study you linked rated the security of elections as stellar. It’s the access to voting that is getting us low ratings as well as gerrymandering. It’s not what your suggesting. It is in fact the opposite of what you are suggesting.

See post #69.

.

Your OP is a lie. There is nothing in that report challenging election integrity. You did not read it and are dancing around like a drunk avoiding answering to it because you know I busted your lying ass. Keep dancing Jester.

Actually I did read it, but it was a point of reference to start a conversation, I'm not required to agree with all their conclusions. BTW, neither are you.

.

 

[MarathonMike]

The RWNJs are the only people questioning the validity of the November Election. They must, to remain a part of the impeached president trump's mindless cult.

Perhaps, given adequate time, some will recover.


.

Are MIT scientists Right Wing Nut Jobs who are part of "Trump's Cult"?

 

[Leo123]

U.S. Election Integrity Compares Poorly to Other Democracies

A 2019 report published by the Electoral Integrity Project, an independent project based out of Harvard University, found that U.S. elections from July 2012 through December 2018 rated "lower than any other long-established democracies and affluent societies." Each country in the index was given a score out of 100 based on assessments of the quality of each of its elections – including categories such as electoral laws, voter registration and voting process – one month after polls closed.
The U.S. score of 61 – the same score as Mexico and Panama – is the second-lowest among liberal democracies and much lower than other countries in the Americas region, including Costa Rica, Uruguay and Chile. Denmark, Finland and Norway are among the top-ranked countries in the index, all with scores in the 80s.


Wow, the US ranks right down there with Mexico and Panama, we should be soooo proud.

Your thoughts?

.

That's how Obama was elected....Fraud. The MSM is complicit as they promote the Democrat talking-point propaganda, 24/7,,,,,,

 

[forkup]

Voter participation has increased proportionally across States with and without ID requirements.

That's great. Show me the study that allows you to make that statement? I have backed up my claims so now it's your turn.

Also the lawyers I mentioned in NV are not affiliated with Trump or his campaign and their evidence has never been presented to a court as far as I know.

You think this statement helps you? A "lawyer" finds information and then chooses not to present it in a court of law? They have a name for something like this.... They call it "a claim" and everybody can claim anything they want, but it is no basis for prosecuting anybody.

So keep spewing your commie fantasies and I'll continue to laugh at you.

Go right ahead and laugh, being laughed at by someone who links a study that disagrees with their own position, who doesn't know theirs a difference between non-citizens and illegals, and who thinks that as long as someone says their a lawyer, any claim they make is enough reason to prosecute someone even when they don't present their case in a court of law is no great insult. In fact, to me, it seems to simply confirm an inability to argue the merit of their case.

 

[TheParser]

U.S. Election Integrity Compares Poorly to Other Democracies

A 2019 report published by the Electoral Integrity Project, an independent project based out of Harvard University, found that U.S. elections from July 2012 through December 2018 rated "lower than any other long-established democracies and affluent societies." Each country in the index was given a score out of 100 based on assessments of the quality of each of its elections – including categories such as electoral laws, voter registration and voting process – one month after polls closed.
The U.S. score of 61 – the same score as Mexico and Panama – is the second-lowest among liberal democracies and much lower than other countries in the Americas region, including Costa Rica, Uruguay and Chile. Denmark, Finland and Norway are among the top-ranked countries in the index, all with scores in the 80s.


Wow, the US ranks right down there with Mexico and Panama, we should be soooo proud.

Your thoughts?

.

Wow!

Harvard (Harvard!) would allow its name to be associated with such a report?

I predict some resignations are going to be demanded!

Why?

Because Harvard is now (proudly) a "liberal" institution.

It wants nothing to do with a report that could even suggest the possibility that there might have been fraud on November 3.

 

[Bobob]

U.S. Election Integrity Compares Poorly to Other Democracies

A 2019 report published by the Electoral Integrity Project, an independent project based out of Harvard University, found that U.S. elections from July 2012 through December 2018 rated "lower than any other long-established democracies and affluent societies." Each country in the index was given a score out of 100 based on assessments of the quality of each of its elections – including categories such as electoral laws, voter registration and voting process – one month after polls closed.
The U.S. score of 61 – the same score as Mexico and Panama – is the second-lowest among liberal democracies and much lower than other countries in the Americas region, including Costa Rica, Uruguay and Chile. Denmark, Finland and Norway are among the top-ranked countries in the index, all with scores in the 80s.


Wow, the US ranks right down there with Mexico and Panama, we should be soooo proud.

Your thoughts?

.

Only losers (and not all losers) question the integrity of our elections, even when the outcome is overwhelming.

 

[Camp]

The RWNJs are the only people questioning the validity of the November Election. They must, to remain a part of the impeached president trump's mindless cult.

Perhaps, given adequate time, some will recover.


.

Trump and his cult have tarnished America, but it's only temporary.

 

[forkup]

U.S. Election Integrity Compares Poorly to Other Democracies

A 2019 report published by the Electoral Integrity Project, an independent project based out of Harvard University, found that U.S. elections from July 2012 through December 2018 rated "lower than any other long-established democracies and affluent societies." Each country in the index was given a score out of 100 based on assessments of the quality of each of its elections – including categories such as electoral laws, voter registration and voting process – one month after polls closed.
The U.S. score of 61 – the same score as Mexico and Panama – is the second-lowest among liberal democracies and much lower than other countries in the Americas region, including Costa Rica, Uruguay and Chile. Denmark, Finland and Norway are among the top-ranked countries in the index, all with scores in the 80s.


Wow, the US ranks right down there with Mexico and Panama, we should be soooo proud.

Your thoughts?

.

Wow!

Harvard (Harvard!) would allow its name to be associated with such a report?

I predict some resignations are going to be demanded!

Why?

Because Harvard is now (proudly) a "liberal" institution.

It wants nothing to do with a report that could even suggest the possibility that there might have been fraud on November 3.

That's good because nothing in the study even suggests the possibility of voter fraud. What it does suggest is that questioning election results without a valid reason for doing so is harmful to Democracy. It suggests that voter suppression laws, gerrymandering and the electoral college are equally so. Read the study I would say.

 

[Captain Caveman]

Many wonder why conservatives lie about ‘fraud’ that doesn’t exist and ‘cheating’ absent any evidence – it’s likely because conservatives are so dishonest and so incessantly lie that they don’t know what the truth is anymore, or care.

You have a short memory, Russiangate nothingburger.

 

[Coyote]

U.S. Election Integrity Compares Poorly to Other Democracies

A 2019 report published by the Electoral Integrity Project, an independent project based out of Harvard University, found that U.S. elections from July 2012 through December 2018 rated "lower than any other long-established democracies and affluent societies." Each country in the index was given a score out of 100 based on assessments of the quality of each of its elections – including categories such as electoral laws, voter registration and voting process – one month after polls closed.
The U.S. score of 61 – the same score as Mexico and Panama – is the second-lowest among liberal democracies and much lower than other countries in the Americas region, including Costa Rica, Uruguay and Chile. Denmark, Finland and Norway are among the top-ranked countries in the index, all with scores in the 80s.


Wow, the US ranks right down there with Mexico and Panama, we should be soooo proud.

Your thoughts?

.

Wow!

Harvard (Harvard!) would allow its name to be associated with such a report?

I predict some resignations are going to be demanded!

Why?

Because Harvard is now (proudly) a "liberal" institution.

It wants nothing to do with a report that could even suggest the possibility that there might have been fraud on November 3.

But that is not what the report suggests.