...and Democratic?

[Challenger]

I 've just come across this Israel moves to outlaw Palestinian political parties in the Knesset Jonathan Cook the View from Nazareth and am intrigued by this paragraph which prompts me to ask a question

"Balad has been under threat at previous general elections. The Central Elections Committee, a body representing the major political parties, has repeatedly voted to ban it from running. Each time the decision has been overturned on appeal to the Supreme Court."

My question is, is having a committee of all the major political parties, able to prevent another political party from running in elections, fundamentally undemocratic?

I've never come across this before, it seems to me the equivalent of my own Conservative, Labour, and Liberal Democrat parties ganging up to prevent say UKIP or the Green party from standing in UK elections.

 

[Daniyel]

Liberman Balad party supports Hamas has no place in Knesset after Qatar trip

Unfortunately many abuse democracy, the answer to your question is generally yes, but supreme court will now be restricted due to the intervention in politics.

 

[Daniyel]

Its a very interesting subject by itself, regardless of who's involved it is a very complicated question.
Banning a minority representative is both most and least democratic step at once.. I really like to see more comments on this one, but back to the conflict - Balad made some very bad moves so I agree with banning the members for being elected because they abuse their position in terms of risking life and betrayal, security of person comes first and obviously above every democratic right.

 

[Challenger]

This gets me, how can you abuse the democratic process? If people are prepared to vote for you you should be allowed to participate. Sinn Fein's relationship to the Provisional IRA was the same as Hamas is to the Al-Qassam Brigades, yet they were allowed to participate in the political process in th UK. It troubles me that any country claiming to be democratic can allow a "committee" of its major political parties, ban their political opponents from standing. In the UK, extreme far-right parties like the National Front and Britain First can have a platform to make their case to the electorate as can the far-left Communist Party.

 

[Challenger]

Its a very interesting subject by itself, regardless of who's involved it is a very complicated question.
Banning a minority representative is both most and least democratic step at once.. I really like to see more comments on this one, but back to the conflict - Balad made some very bad moves so I agree with banning the members for being elected because they abuse their position in terms of risking life and betrayal, security of person comes first and obviously above every democratic right.

My question is not about the behaviour of individual party members and I agree that irresponsible behaviour should be censured, but the process of banning political parties in general.

 

[Kondor3]

This gets me, how can you abuse the democratic process?...

Adolf Hitler and his National Socialists are an extreme and well-documented example of abuse of the democratic process.

Utilizing the mechanisms of state politics to undermine the existence and character of that same state.

Some countries call such a thing 'sedition', at a minimum, and treason, at worst.

The banning of political parties deemed dangerous or detrimental to both nation and people is not a new concept, and is, apparently, far more widely practiced than one might think at first glance.

Here is a link to a little light reading on the subject...

Category Banned political parties - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

No reasonably objective outside observer is ever glad to see such a ban going into effect, but it seems best to delve deeper into the reasoning (survival, public order, etc.) before throwing brickbats.

Large numbers of countries... friend, foe and in-between... do this from time to time.

No point in singling-out Israel, without some considerable exploration of how and why and how frequently this is done in other countries.

...In the UK, extreme far-right parties like the National Front and Britain First can have a platform to make their case to the electorate as can the far-left Communist Party...

The UK is not surrounded on three sides by hostile (or historically or potentially hostile) nations nor does the UK contain an embedded hostile population segment living a stone's throw away, therefore the UK does not face the same existential pressures. Apples and Oranges, I'm afraid.

 

[Phoenall]

I 've just come across this Israel moves to outlaw Palestinian political parties in the Knesset Jonathan Cook the View from Nazareth and am intrigued by this paragraph which prompts me to ask a question

"Balad has been under threat at previous general elections. The Central Elections Committee, a body representing the major political parties, has repeatedly voted to ban it from running. Each time the decision has been overturned on appeal to the Supreme Court."

My question is, is having a committee of all the major political parties, able to prevent another political party from running in elections, fundamentally undemocratic?

I've never come across this before, it seems to me the equivalent of my own Conservative, Labour, and Liberal Democrat parties ganging up to prevent say UKIP or the Green party from standing in UK elections.

Not at all, you would not like to see Golden Dawn putting up for election in the P.A. Well this is the same thing no palestinian party should be allowed to put up for election to the knesset, they have nothing to do with Israel. What next hamas putting up for election in Washington, or Fatah putting up in the UK.

Get it out of your head that palestine has any chance of influencing Israeli elections because Israel legally occupies the west bank .

 

[Phoenall]

This gets me, how can you abuse the democratic process? If people are prepared to vote for you you should be allowed to participate. Sinn Fein's relationship to the Provisional IRA was the same as Hamas is to the Al-Qassam Brigades, yet they were allowed to participate in the political process in th UK. It troubles me that any country claiming to be democratic can allow a "committee" of its major political parties, ban their political opponents from standing. In the UK, extreme far-right parties like the National Front and Britain First can have a platform to make their case to the electorate as can the far-left Communist Party.

So I can put up in palestine for election on a deport all Jews platform and you would not see it as strange or undemocratic. The palestinian parties are not Israeli, they come from palestine and have no right to put themselves up for election in Israel, just as no Israeli party has the right to put up for election to the P.A.

You mentioned the UK and political parties being banned from standing for election, well it happens and it was the neo marxist Labour party that started it by arresting politicians hoping to have them convicted and subsequently banned from westminster.

 

[Phoenall]

Its a very interesting subject by itself, regardless of who's involved it is a very complicated question.
Banning a minority representative is both most and least democratic step at once.. I really like to see more comments on this one, but back to the conflict - Balad made some very bad moves so I agree with banning the members for being elected because they abuse their position in terms of risking life and betrayal, security of person comes first and obviously above every democratic right.

My question is not about the behaviour of individual party members and I agree that irresponsible behaviour should be censured, but the process of banning political parties in general.

So you want the Golden dawn to stand for election in the UK, or the far right neo nazi parties of Hungary and Poland. Think long and hard about why these parties are not allowed to stand for election and you will suddenly see your own ANTISEMETISM in demanding foriegn political parties be allowed to stand in Israel.

 

[Challenger]

This gets me, how can you abuse the democratic process? If people are prepared to vote for you you should be allowed to participate. Sinn Fein's relationship to the Provisional IRA was the same as Hamas is to the Al-Qassam Brigades, yet they were allowed to participate in the political process in th UK. It troubles me that any country claiming to be democratic can allow a "committee" of its major political parties, ban their political opponents from standing. In the UK, extreme far-right parties like the National Front and Britain First can have a platform to make their case to the electorate as can the far-left Communist Party.

So I can put up in palestine for election on a deport all Jews platform and you would not see it as strange or undemocratic. The palestinian parties are not Israeli, they come from palestine and have no right to put themselves up for election in Israel, just as no Israeli party has the right to put up for election to the P.A.

You mentioned the UK and political parties being banned from standing for election, well it happens and it was the neo marxist Labour party that started it by arresting politicians hoping to have them convicted and subsequently banned from westminster.

I was under the impression that these parties represent the Israeli-Arab population, nothing to do with Palestine or the P.A. As for the UK, care to provide evidence of these alleged instances of political parties being banned from standing? I couldn't find any.

 

[Challenger]

Its a very interesting subject by itself, regardless of who's involved it is a very complicated question.
Banning a minority representative is both most and least democratic step at once.. I really like to see more comments on this one, but back to the conflict - Balad made some very bad moves so I agree with banning the members for being elected because they abuse their position in terms of risking life and betrayal, security of person comes first and obviously above every democratic right.

My question is not about the behaviour of individual party members and I agree that irresponsible behaviour should be censured, but the process of banning political parties in general.

So you want the Golden dawn to stand for election in the UK, or the far right neo nazi parties of Hungary and Poland. Think long and hard about why these parties are not allowed to stand for election and you will suddenly see your own ANTISEMETISM in demanding foriegn political parties be allowed to stand in Israel.

As you've just said, "The palestinian parties are not Israeli, they come from palestine and have no right to put themselves up for election in Israel, just as no Israeli party has the right to put up for election to the P.A." the parties you mention are not U.K. political parties so I would not expect them to be able to take part in our political process. Anyway we have equivalents in UKIP, NF, BNP and BF and I have no objections to them standing, I just won't vote for them.

 

[Challenger]

This gets me, how can you abuse the democratic process?...

Adolf Hitler and his National Socialists are an extreme and well-documented example of abuse of the democratic process.

Utilizing the mechanisms of state politics to undermine the existence and character of that same state.

Some countries call such a thing 'sedition', at a minimum, and treason, at worst.

The banning of political parties deemed dangerous or detrimental to both nation and people is not a new concept, and is, apparently, far more widely practiced than one might think at first glance.

Here is a link to a little light reading on the subject...

Category Banned political parties - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

No reasonably objective outside observer is ever glad to see such a ban going into effect, but it seems best to delve deeper into the reasoning (survival, public order, etc.) before throwing brickbats.

Large numbers of countries... friend, foe and in-between... do this from time to time.

No point in singling-out Israel, without some considerable exploration of how and why and how frequently this is done in other countries.

...In the UK, extreme far-right parties like the National Front and Britain First can have a platform to make their case to the electorate as can the far-left Communist Party...

The UK is not surrounded on three sides by hostile (or historically or potentially hostile) nations nor does the UK contain an embedded hostile population segment living a stone's throw away, therefore the UK does not face the same existential pressures. Apples and Oranges, I'm afraid.

It's not the banning itself, but the methodology,

 

[Penelope]

Its double standard, their participation is only dependent on agreement and for looks. Its the same here In the US, if someone wants to be able to talk or get on a committee in Wash when in congress, they had better suck up to Israel, or they will just be taking up space, which many do. The Israel gov is pro Israel.

 

[Phoenall]

This gets me, how can you abuse the democratic process? If people are prepared to vote for you you should be allowed to participate. Sinn Fein's relationship to the Provisional IRA was the same as Hamas is to the Al-Qassam Brigades, yet they were allowed to participate in the political process in th UK. It troubles me that any country claiming to be democratic can allow a "committee" of its major political parties, ban their political opponents from standing. In the UK, extreme far-right parties like the National Front and Britain First can have a platform to make their case to the electorate as can the far-left Communist Party.

So I can put up in palestine for election on a deport all Jews platform and you would not see it as strange or undemocratic. The palestinian parties are not Israeli, they come from palestine and have no right to put themselves up for election in Israel, just as no Israeli party has the right to put up for election to the P.A.

You mentioned the UK and political parties being banned from standing for election, well it happens and it was the neo marxist Labour party that started it by arresting politicians hoping to have them convicted and subsequently banned from westminster.

I was under the impression that these parties represent the Israeli-Arab population, nothing to do with Palestine or the P.A. As for the UK, care to provide evidence of these alleged instances of political parties being banned from standing? I couldn't find any.

If they are palestinian political parties then they cant represent Israeli concerns. It is all in the name. The arab muslims in Israel are arab Israeli muslims and not arab palestinian muslims as that shows they do not want to live in Israel. Would you accept a Pakistani muslim claiming British citizenship to declare himself a pakistani muslim and not a British muslim ?

 

[Phoenall]

This gets me, how can you abuse the democratic process? If people are prepared to vote for you you should be allowed to participate. Sinn Fein's relationship to the Provisional IRA was the same as Hamas is to the Al-Qassam Brigades, yet they were allowed to participate in the political process in th UK. It troubles me that any country claiming to be democratic can allow a "committee" of its major political parties, ban their political opponents from standing. In the UK, extreme far-right parties like the National Front and Britain First can have a platform to make their case to the electorate as can the far-left Communist Party.

So I can put up in palestine for election on a deport all Jews platform and you would not see it as strange or undemocratic. The palestinian parties are not Israeli, they come from palestine and have no right to put themselves up for election in Israel, just as no Israeli party has the right to put up for election to the P.A.

You mentioned the UK and political parties being banned from standing for election, well it happens and it was the neo marxist Labour party that started it by arresting politicians hoping to have them convicted and subsequently banned from westminster.

I was under the impression that these parties represent the Israeli-Arab population, nothing to do with Palestine or the P.A. As for the UK, care to provide evidence of these alleged instances of political parties being banned from standing? I couldn't find any.

BNP for starters when the neo marxists arrested members who were due to stand for election on trumped up charges, held for questioning and then placed under house arrest until after the election. Then we had the refusal of the neo marxist to represent the people who had elected them when they refused to debate any issues if a duly elected BNP member was present in the chamber. Bans in all but name.

 

[Lipush]

I 've just come across this Israel moves to outlaw Palestinian political parties in the Knesset Jonathan Cook the View from Nazareth and am intrigued by this paragraph which prompts me to ask a question

"Balad has been under threat at previous general elections. The Central Elections Committee, a body representing the major political parties, has repeatedly voted to ban it from running. Each time the decision has been overturned on appeal to the Supreme Court."

My question is, is having a committee of all the major political parties, able to prevent another political party from running in elections, fundamentally undemocratic?

I've never come across this before, it seems to me the equivalent of my own Conservative, Labour, and Liberal Democrat parties ganging up to prevent say UKIP or the Green party from standing in UK elections.

Are you familiar with the Israeli law?

Unless you are, this opinion of yours is irrelevant.

 

[Daniyel]

We both start from a different points, democracy isn't the best governing method there is, it is only a default option, and you can see that the democratic ideas are shared all over the world and implemented differently, the terms 'Democratic' and 'Democracy' might help you understand the difference.
I Might not put it the best way but I'll try:
Democratic is circling more about Socialistic, Democracy is circling more about the general principles.

 

[Daniyel]

docmauser1 et al,
Here is Dr.Mordecai Kedar and Said Abulafia talking about this very specific issue regarding also the Arab Spring, take a look its a very interesting discussion.

 

[Challenger]

I 've just come across this Israel moves to outlaw Palestinian political parties in the Knesset Jonathan Cook the View from Nazareth and am intrigued by this paragraph which prompts me to ask a question

"Balad has been under threat at previous general elections. The Central Elections Committee, a body representing the major political parties, has repeatedly voted to ban it from running. Each time the decision has been overturned on appeal to the Supreme Court."

My question is, is having a committee of all the major political parties, able to prevent another political party from running in elections, fundamentally undemocratic?

I've never come across this before, it seems to me the equivalent of my own Conservative, Labour, and Liberal Democrat parties ganging up to prevent say UKIP or the Green party from standing in UK elections.

Are you familiar with the Israeli law?

Unless you are, this opinion of yours is irrelevant.

I'm familiar with several Israeli laws, which one are you referring to? Oh and I'm not stating an opinion, I was asking an honest question, if you don't want to provide any constructive information, please ignore this thread; it's not for you.

 

[Lipush]

How about the Knesset basic law? Are you familiar with it?

And don'tt try and outsmart me, please. Your sarcasm regarding our democratic movement is driven from ignorancy to the law.

No state allows political parties to go against its constitution, no state should allow it.