America Is Done Pretending About Meat

[Concerned American]

Thing is, I love animals too. I've spent far more time in my life eating vegetables than she has. I've grown my own veggies from seed. I just don't judge others by their choices, even hunting--- while I refrain from killing animals myself, I don't judge others because they choose to do so for food or sport.

It is all about choice, but in BC's world, there would be no choice.

You described me to a T. I have vegetables--from seed-- starting in my basement at this moment. I am an admitted omnivore. But when I told her that, her response was "No, you're not." The height of arrogance.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

All we ask is that you eat what you want, and don't tell me I can't make a different choice.

You know you live in America right?

All we ask is that if you're against abortion, don't have one. But don't tell me I can't make a different choice

 

[toobfreak]

Thanks! And that sounds delicious. That's something I've been wanting to make recently, I just gotta get the ingredients.

I actually buy these big family sized Stouffer's lasagna party trays for $13-$15. Enough for four-six meals. Actually quite good. They make several kinds but I like the vegetable lasagna best.

As for what you said about culling animals humanely... I see that very differently now. Not only does that not take place (especially in factory farms, where over 95% of meat comes from) but the way I see it is.... when it's completely unnecessary to eat an animal in the first place, then the genuinely humane thing is to let them live, and not take away the one thing that is most important them....their life. I mean, the word humane basically means compassion. So I think that respecting their will to live is more compassionate than killing them in a slightly less brutal way.

Well, I get that. And I'd be the first person to suggest that dolphins and whales might actually be smarter than us, just not in any technological, tool-making way. Still, most animals (cattle, etc.) are rather limited in their awareness, so it becomes a personal choice whether to eat them or not. If it can be done humanely without fear and pain, the more the merrier, but eliminating meat and going full vege is an inconvenience and a problem for me. Most places do not offer a wide buffet of 100% animal-free foods.

But if that is your thing and are willing and able to create a broad diet for yourself that is 100% animal free, this is a personal choice In cannot knock, so long as it is up to the individual.

ITMT, the world is packing away meat by the ton and is not likely to change anytime soon.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

Or that eating plants makes you morally superior, plants are living!

Another idiot equating a carrot with a dog or cat

 

[toobfreak]

You described me to a T. I have vegetables--from seed-- starting in my basement at this moment. I am an admitted omnivore. But when I told her that, her response was "No, you're not." The height of arrogance.

I miss gardening. I used to have a raised bed garden with containers too, and in the Spring, had a whole flotilla of vegetable coming up downstairs in peat pots grown from seed under automatic lighting.

Great fun growing your own plants from seed, planting them, seeing them grow and produce fruit.

You have not lived until you pulled a fresh carrot from the soil and ate it fresh. Like candy--- sweet, crunchy. Bears no resemblance to the woody, chewy taste of the carrots in the supermarket.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

Among other things, I snack on a lot of pumpkin seeds. Because you asked.....
8 oz steak = 45 grams protein
8 oz pumpkin seeds = 80 grams of protein

 

[Carl in Michigan]

Where do you get off trying to tell anyone else what they should or shouldn't eat. If you want to eat bean curd, more power to you, IDGAF. It is the height of arrogance for you to think that you somehow have the right to tell me what I can consume.

You know you're arguing in a public messageboard where people will express opinions you don't like don't you???

It is the height of arrogance to tell another person what opinions they are NOT ALLOWED to express here, don't you???

 

[Carl in Michigan]

It's okay, that would never pass the USDA inspection. Nice try

Cute that you trust government employees to look out for you

 

[Carl in Michigan]

We're not here telling you what to eat. Quite the contrary, I think if you review this thread you'll find that I said, "IDGAF what you eat." busybody.

Again with the pro abortion argument

 

[buttercup]

Once again, you are not getting it. WE are the people who are discussing with you. WE are omnivores. IDGAF what your propaganda says. I eat plants and animals for my sustanance. You can talk until you're blue in the face but I will be eating my diet regardless. I've told you to enjoy your diet, why, pray tell, are you so intent on convincing me to change mine? It is either, 1, you are slow or 2, you are a democrat SJW intent on forcing your ideals on others.

You keep posting to me while claiming that you don't want to hear what I have to say on this topic. I've been replying to your posts... not posting to you. So if you really don't want to hear a different POV, just put me on ignore, problem solved!

 

[Concerned American]

You have not lived until you pulled a fresh carrot from the soil and ate it fresh. Like candy--- sweet, crunchy. Bears no resemblance to the woody, chewy taste of the carrots in the supermarket.

Agreed. I find that radishes have lost their flavor as well. I really miss a great tasting tomato. Conglomerates have engineered the flavor out of tomatoes you find in the stores these days. They are beautiful to look at but totally lacking in flavor. I love fresh tomato sandwiches, but you can't find a flavorful tomato anymore. That is why I grow my own. Some have great flavor but it is even getting tough to grow them too. No flavor.

 

[gipper]

Very nice essay..hit quite a few nails on the head. The gist of it is simple...for most of us, the plant-based diet was more about social compulsion and less about actual desire.

I used the Yahoo link to get around the Atlantic paywall.

America Is Done Pretending About Meat

Plant-based eating has lost its appeal.

www.yahoo.com

A few snippets..it's a longish essay:

Making America healthy again, it seems, starts with a double cheeseburger and fries. Earlier this month, Health Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. visited a Steak ’n Shake in Florida and shared a meal with Fox News’s Sean Hannity. The setting was no accident: Kennedy has praised the fast-food chain for switching its cooking oil from seed oil, which he falsely claims causes illness, to beef tallow. “People are raving about these french fries,” Kennedy said after eating one, before commending other restaurants that fry with beef tallow: Popeyes, Buffalo Wild Wings, Outback Steakhouse.

To put it another way, if you order fries at Steak ’n Shake, cauliflower wings at Buffalo Wild Wings, or the Bloomin’ Onion at Outback, your food will be cooked in cow fat. For more than a decade, cutting down on meat and other animal products has been idealized as a healthier, more ethical way to eat. Guidelines such as “Eat Food. Not Too Much. Mostly Plants” may have disproportionately appealed to liberals in big cities, but the meat backlash has been unavoidable across the United States. The Obama administration passed a law to limit meat in school lunches; more recently, meat alternatives such as Impossible Burger and Beyond Meat have flooded grocery-store shelves, and fast-food giants are even serving them up in burgers and nuggets. It all heralded a future that seemed more tempeh than tomahawk steak: “Could this be the beginning of the end of meat?” wrote The New York Times in 2022.

Now the goal of eating less meat has lost its appeal. A convergence of cultural and nutritional shifts, supercharged by the return of the noted hamburger-lover President Donald Trump, has thrust meat back to the center of the American plate. It’s not just MAGA bros and MAHA moms who resist plant-based eating. A wide swath of the U.S. seems to be sending a clear message: Nobody should feel bad about eating meat.
Many people are relieved to hear it. Despite all of the attention on why people should eat less meat—climate change, health, animal welfare—Americans have kept consuming more and more of it. From 2014 to 2024, annual per capita meat consumption rose by nearly 28 pounds, the equivalent of roughly 100 chicken breasts. One way to make sense of this “meat paradox,” as the ethicist Peter Singer branded it in The Atlantic in 2023, is that there is a misalignment between how people want to eat and the way they actually do. The thought of suffering cows releasing methane bombs into the atmosphere pains me, but I love a medium-rare porterhouse.

Many health experts believe seed oils are unhealthy.

 

[buttercup]

Many health experts believe seed oils are unhealthy.

As of now, I don't completely buy all the alarmism about seed oils.

This video is one of the reasons why I haven't jumped on that bandwagon...

 

[Carl in Michigan]

AAnd I say that as both a big animal lover

You're not an animal lover. You may love the few animals whose unique personalities you've gotten to know, but you DESPISE with every bite the unfortunate ones that you love about as much as the stalk of wheat that was harvested to make your toast.

 

[Concerned American]

You keep posting to me while claiming that you don't want to hear what I have to say on this topic.

Whatever are you talking about? I have responded to you as you have responded to me. The difference is you have done nothing but preach your beliefs on me. I have been very clear that I am not trying to influence your beliefs but you haven't responded in kind. I think the bottom line is, you, like most vegans don't feel you are getting the attention you deserve as is evidenced by the lack of vegan restaurants or those that provide vegan options. That is unfortunate but a product of the free market. If there were enough people who desired a vegan diet those venues would exist. If you desire that, open your own. You don't owe me any explanations and I don't desire any. Nor do I desire preaching about my dietary choices or your theocratic choices.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

 

[Concerned American]

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Gee, I think you're sitting next to your twin that is waiting for a valid argument for it.

 

[buttercup]

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SO true!

 

[Concerned American]

Again with the pro abortion argument

This is the second post you've made with this nonsense. If you are trying to equate the killing of animals for food to abortion, you are a sick individual and before you climb up on your moralistic high horse that all life is sacred, then so are the lives of plants. BTW, I would challenge you to find ANYWHERE that I advocate for the murder of any human being.

 

[Concerned American]

Among other things, I snack on a lot of pumpkin seeds. Because you asked.....
8 oz steak = 45 grams protein
8 oz pumpkin seeds = 80 grams of protein

Good, I'm glad you enjoy your pumpkin seeds. Beans are another great source as is tofu. Not nearly as satisfying as perfectly grilled filet though.