Zone1 A Question For Pro-Choicers

[alang1216]

Not sure how one can deny it. The universe is self aware and has been made manifest by mind.

I'm not sure how anyone can make such a claim. Does self-aware mean there is an intelligence guiding it or is it self-aware like a molecule that can form a crystal base on its geometry?

 

[initforme]

That's the mother's responsibility, along with that of the child's father.

And if neither takes responsibility it IS on the taxpayers until the kid is 18.

 

[alang1216]

So did you disagree with my answer? Because you were unusually silent after I answered your question. Can an MRI be used to measure brain activity through experiments? Do you consider that to be science?

Profoundly so. (I was, until today, on vacation/holiday and restricted to occasional connectivity on a phone.) MRIs are certainly science and someday may allow us to read minds but I doubt they will ever allow us to determine if a thought is higher or lower on the evolutionary ladder.

 

[alang1216]

MRI.

Like the one used in the experiment you dismissed.

How is using an MRI to measure responses in the brain to stimuli not science?

MRIs are definately science but I think you give them too much credit. One day they might read thoughts but today they measure crude brain activity. It doesn't seem like they could measure the 'evolution' of Obama's brain.

To study the brain “in action,” researchers use a specialized form of brain imaging known as task-based functional MRI (task-fMRI), which shows how the brain responds to stimuli. While this technique can reveal much about the general workings of the average human brain, new research indicates that task-fMRI lacks the reliability to predict individual behavior or how a person might respond to mental-health therapies.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

MRIs are definately [sic] science but I think you give them too much credit. One day they might read thoughts but today they measure crude brain activity. It doesn't seem like they could measure the 'evolution' of Obama's brain.

A toxicology analysis might be more useful, there.

 

[ding]

The BB does appear to have created our universe and particles are created in pairs but it didn't create every particle we see today so not every particle was entangled at one time.

So which particles that "we see today" were not created from the big bang?

 

[ding]

Having an answer is fine, IF it is the right answer. I'm fine with saying that I don't the answer.

Then you probably shouldn't be arguing against things you don't know about. You have literally dismissed the ideas of Wald, Eddington,Von Weizsacker and Pauli for no good reason other than it goes against your preconceived worldview. You dismissed it as metaphysics when it's not.

"If I say, with Eddington, “the stuff of the world is mind‑stuff,” that has a metaphysical ring. But if I say that ultimate reality is expressed in the solutions of the equations of quantum mechanics, quantum electrodynamics, and quantum field theory -- that sounds like good, modern physics. Yet what are those equations, indeed what is mathematics, but mind‑stuff? -- virtually the ultimate in mind‑stuff and for that reason deeply mysterious." George Wald

 

[ding]

I'm not sure how anyone can make such a claim. Does self-aware mean there is an intelligence guiding it or is it self-aware like a molecule that can form a crystal base on its geometry?

I can make that claim because you and I are literally part of the universe and we are self aware.

 

[ding]

Profoundly so. (I was, until today, on vacation/holiday and restricted to occasional connectivity on a phone.) MRIs are certainly science and someday may allow us to read minds but I doubt they will ever allow us to determine if a thought is higher or lower on the evolutionary ladder.

I'm not sure how you can profoundly disagree with my answer and accept that MRI's can be used as a scientific investigation tool. You are literally contradicting yourself in the same post.

I am equally amazed that you think consciousness - which are basically thoughts - can't evolve.

 

[ding]

MRIs are definately science but I think you give them too much credit. One day they might read thoughts but today they measure crude brain activity. It doesn't seem like they could measure the 'evolution' of Obama's brain.

To study the brain “in action,” researchers use a specialized form of brain imaging known as task-based functional MRI (task-fMRI), which shows how the brain responds to stimuli. While this technique can reveal much about the general workings of the average human brain, new research indicates that task-fMRI lacks the reliability to predict individual behavior or how a person might respond to mental-health therapies.

The only credit I gave them was the credit they were due. You on the other hand dismissed them without good reason.

 

[alang1216]

So which particles that "we see today" were not created from the big bang?

Solar wind, photons, neutrinos, cosmic rays, etc.

 

[alang1216]

I can make that claim because you and I are literally part of the universe and we are self aware.

Was the universe self-aware for the 13 billion years before there were multicell animals on Earth?

 

[alang1216]

I'm not sure how you can profoundly disagree with my answer and accept that MRI's can be used as a scientific investigation tool. You are literally contradicting yourself in the same post.

It is a scientific tool but I don't believe it was used scientifically in this case.

I am equally amazed that you think consciousness - which are basically thoughts - can't evolve.

Thoughts, attitudes, beliefs, opinions, values, etc. can all change but I fail to see how they can 'evolve'. Is there some selection pressure on them that I fail to see?

 

[ding]

Was the universe self-aware for the 13 billion years before there were multicell animals on Earth?

No idea what other self aware beings it produced or when but it is an intelligence creating machine.

 

[ding]

It is a scientific tool but I don't believe it was used scientifically in this case.


Thoughts, attitudes, beliefs, opinions, values, etc. can all change but I fail to see how they can 'evolve'. Is there some selection pressure on them that I fail to see?

I guess it’s beyond you ability to comprehend then.

 

[HeyNorm]

do you not understand that raising a child in unbearable circumstances or even below the poverty line, or as the result of incestual or rape sex, can be impossible for a woman?
let alone getting the dad to stick around..

So you advocate killing the poor?

Damn!

 

[HeyNorm]

The argument, rationale and position of the left is that you are not a baby until you are born. Until you are born, you are a fetus, even if medically viable outside the womb. And that fetuses therefore have no human rights until born, so, abortion is justified, because basically, young leftist women are pigs and sluts who just want to whore around getting laid, so need a convenient rationale to justify dropping the child when they get knocked up so they can get right back to sleeping around.

And imagine the men that would have anything to do with a woman that thinks so little of herself as to kill her offspring?

I don’t know, somehow I’ve been able to only produce children with someone I loved and she knew I would protect both her AND our children with my life.

Not really a difficult task to accomplish if you have a sound mind.

 

[alang1216]

No idea what other self aware beings it produced or when but it is an intelligence creating machine.

Pretty bold statement considering we don't know of any other self aware beings it produced in its 13+ billion year history.

 

[alang1216]

I guess it’s beyond you ability to comprehend then.

Insulting me is easier than answering my question I see.

 

[ding]

Insulting me is easier than answering my question I see.

It's not an insult. It's a statement of fact. For you to deny that consciousness did indeed involve and continues to evolve is to deny evolution itself. Consciousness did indeed involve unless of course you belief life went from non-self aware single cell organisms to highly complex, self aware beings magically. Apparently this was beyond your level to comprehend. Because if you did comprehend it then it would be much simpler to see that everything continues to evolve. All aspects of evolution; stellar, chemical and biological continue to evolve. Consciousness is most certainly a stage of the evolution of space and time. The most important one. It's when the universe literally became self aware. So for you to fail to acknowledge this self evident fact can only be because it is beyond your ability to comprehend it. So it wasn't an insult. It was a factual statement.