A discussion on the stability of the West Antarctic Ice Sheet (WAIS) and its consequences

[jc456]

The grounding line of the WAIS has been retreating for several years now. The bedrock on which the sheet rests is itself, below sea level due to the weight of the ice resting on it for many millennia, though the top of the sheet is many hundreds of feet above sea level. This article explains the mechanics of the glacier and the floating ice sheet and how and why the grounding line is retreating. A complete collapse of the sheet - the retreat of the grounding line to the geographical limits of the sheet - will raise global sea level by 3.3 meters (about eleven feet). Many scientists believe the collapse of the sheet is an irreversible process and the only question is time: how long it will take to happen. It could take a century. It could happen in less than a single year. A ten foot rise in global sea level over the course of one year would be a massively catastrophic event reminiscent of the flooding of the Black Sea through the Bosporus Straits, save on a much larger scale with millions more humans affected.

Guest post: How close is the West Antarctic ice sheet to a ‘tipping point’?

Between its east and west ice sheets and its peninsula, Antarctica holds enough ice to raise global sea levels by around 60m. The West Antarctic ice sheet (WAIS) is a relatively small part, containing an amount of ice equivalent to 3.3m of sea level rise. Yet, most of it sits in a precarious...

www.carbonbrief.org

no you never have a discussion. You're a baby and run away when challenged. why do you think anyone would discuss with you? you got no balls friend. If you really wanted a discussion, you'd answer all of the actual posts that are sent your way in all of your other nonsense threads.

 

[Crick]

Even YOU should know when you're having to stretch it thin. You have evidence for ONE active volcanic site, not 138 as you'd like to believe. The primary cause of the grounding line retreat under the WAIS is water warmed by the greenhouse effect acting on increased CO2 in the Earth's atmosphere..

 

[mamooth]

All flac has done is shown volcanoes -- almost all of them inactive -- exist under the ice in Antarctica, something which nobody ever disputed. He has provided zero evidence that recently some supermassive volcanic event happened there and caused the ice loss.

If flac's theory was correct, there would be direct evidence for it, in the form of torrents of relatively warm volcanic meltwater, just saturated with sulfur and other chemicals, not to mention the massive seismic activity. Given how closely we monitor those waters, that's not something that could go unnoticed. We don't see it, so it's not happening. End of story.

(This is where Flac gets more insulting to cover for the fact that he has no evidence to back up his claims, and that the actual evidence contradicts his claims. Please proceed.)

 

[Sunsettommy]

All flac has done is shown volcanoes -- almost all of them inactive -- exist under the ice in Antarctica, something which nobody ever disputed. He has provided zero evidence that recently some supermassive volcanic event happened there and caused the ice loss.

If flac's theory was correct, there would be direct evidence for it, in the form of torrents of relatively warm volcanic meltwater, just saturated with sulfur and other chemicals, not to mention the massive seismic activity. Given how closely we monitor those waters, that's not something that could go unnoticed. We don't see it, so it's not happening. End of story.

(This is where Flac gets more insulting to cover for the fact that he has no evidence to back up his claims, and that the actual evidence contradicts his claims. Please proceed.)

Wow your lie is one the biggest I have even seen in the forum because FLACALTENN POSTED the following right in this thread from POST 29 from the PDF link Crick posted.

Abstract​

Tectonic landforms reveal that the West Antarctic Ice Sheet (WAIS) lies atop a major volcanic rift system. However, identifying subglacial volcanism is challenging. Here we show geochemical evidence of a volcanic heat source upstream of the fast-melting Pine Island Ice Shelf, documented by seawater helium isotope ratios at the front of the Ice Shelf cavity. The localization of mantle helium to glacial meltwater reveals that volcanic heat induces melt beneath the grounded glacier and feeds the subglacial hydrological network crossing the grounding line. The observed transport of mantle helium out of the Ice Shelf cavity indicates that volcanic heat is supplied to the grounded glacier at a rate of ~ 2500 ± 1700 MW, which is ca. half as large as the active Grimsvötn volcano on Iceland. Our finding of a substantial volcanic heat source beneath a major WAIS glacier highlights the need to understand subglacial volcanism, its hydrologic interaction with the marine margins, and its potential role in the future stability of the WAIS.

LINK

=====

You should stop the lying and follow the research instead.

 

[mamooth]

Wow your lie is one the biggest I have even seen in the forum

You're getting dumber and weepier as time goes on. Is it due to senility, or is getting exposed over and over as cult moron wearing on your sanity?

My point was that there's zero evidence of any _new_ massive vulcanism in Antarctica, meaning any claims that massive new vulcanism is melting the ice are profoundly retarded claims.

In response, you quoted something that ... does not show any evidence of _new_ massive vulcanism. It just demonstrated that vulcanism exists, which everyone knows.

No, I won't try to dumb it down to the point that even you cult cranks could understand it, because you all could understand it, if you weren't so emotionally invested in being wrong.

 

[jc456]

You're getting dumber and weepier as time goes on. Is it due to senility, or is getting exposed over and over as cult moron wearing on your sanity?

My point was that there's zero evidence of any _new_ massive vulcanism in Antarctica, meaning any claims that massive new vulcanism is melting the ice are profoundly retarded claims.

In response, you quoted something that ... does not show any evidence of _new_ massive vulcanism. It just demonstrated that vulcanism exists, which everyone knows.

No, I won't try to dumb it down to the point that even you cult cranks could understand it, because you all could understand it, if you weren't so emotionally invested in being wrong.

you can't read I see. too fking funny. what a waste of oxygen you are.

 

[Old Rocks]

Did you miss all the work from 2016 on about mapping out ACTIVE VOLCANIC RIFTS under those glaciers footings? You must have.. Aint gonna be your guide or sherpa.. There's threads in this forum -- maybe 6 or 8 of them on this,.

Would be a fucking shame if we spent $31Trill "decarbonizing" the atmosphere and THEN discovered the MORE RATIONAL reason for those WAIS glaciers losing their shoreline footings..

Wouldn't it???

One of the dumber fucks chimes in. Iceland has an active rift right down the center. And it has plenty of ice. In fact, as soon as one of the vents covered in the iced area stops erupting, it is immediately covered in ice again. A glacier in the crater of Mt. St. Helens is cheek and jowl with an lava dome that is fuming every day, and the glacier is growing as fast as the dome. Just a bunch of dumb fucks here posting nonsense concerning that rift.

 

[Old Rocks]

Are you defending your Chinese Masters?

Look, none of you assholes can any longer say anything about anybody else along these lines. You have been kissing the ass of Putin along with the treasonous fat senile old orange clown ever since Helsinki. Now that ass you love to kiss is pushing us toward WW3. Thanks bunch guys.

 

[ding]

The Revenge of the Glaciers

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Look, none of you assholes can any longer say anything about anybody else along these lines. You have been kissing the ass of Putin along with the treasonous fat senile old orange clown ever since Helsinki. Now that ass you love to kiss is pushing us toward WW3. Thanks bunch guys.

Send us a selfie when you chain yourself to the Embassy of your CCP Masters

# countries Putin invaded while Trump was in the WH: 0
# countries Putin invaded while Biden was in the WH: 2 (so far)

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Did you see the table of PER CAPITA CO2 emissions in one of the other threads? China was seventh. Number One was the good ol' U S of A.

Per Capital your CCP Master are still a nuclear power, have a space program and spend tons of money buying US politicians.

The "per capita" metric is meaningless

 

[mamooth]

Per Capital your CCP Master

Say the one who has spent years down on his knees enthusiastically servicing commies.

are still a nuclear power, have a space program and spend tons of money buying US politicians.

And they're almost always Republicans. And you vote for them. We get it. Even your soul is red.

# countries Putin invaded while Trump was in the WH: 0
# countries Putin invaded while Biden was in the WH: 2 (so far)

That's because Trump promised to pull out of NATO in his second term, which would have just handed Putin everything he wants.

And you supported that. You always support what the commies want.

Now run along. Putin wants another coat of saliva applied, so your skills are needed.

By the way, are you happy about how Trump stopped arms imports to Ukraine unless they'd lie about Biden? And how he cancelled the Open Skies Treaty, making it much harder to monitor Russian aggression? I'm sure you are. If it helps the RepubliRussians, you love it.

 

[Old Rocks]

Wow your lie is one the biggest I have even seen in the forum because FLACALTENN POSTED the following right in this thread from POST 29 from the PDF link Crick posted.

Abstract​

Tectonic landforms reveal that the West Antarctic Ice Sheet (WAIS) lies atop a major volcanic rift system. However, identifying subglacial volcanism is challenging. Here we show geochemical evidence of a volcanic heat source upstream of the fast-melting Pine Island Ice Shelf, documented by seawater helium isotope ratios at the front of the Ice Shelf cavity. The localization of mantle helium to glacial meltwater reveals that volcanic heat induces melt beneath the grounded glacier and feeds the subglacial hydrological network crossing the grounding line. The observed transport of mantle helium out of the Ice Shelf cavity indicates that volcanic heat is supplied to the grounded glacier at a rate of ~ 2500 ± 1700 MW, which is ca. half as large as the active Grimsvötn volcano on Iceland. Our finding of a substantial volcanic heat source beneath a major WAIS glacier highlights the need to understand subglacial volcanism, its hydrologic interaction with the marine margins, and its potential role in the future stability of the WAIS.

LINK

=====

You should stop the lying and follow the research instead.

Well, what do you know, that volcano is located in an ice sheet.

And doesn't seem to be capable of doing any more than melting a hole in the ice.

Global Volcanism Program | Grímsvötn

Grímsvötn, Iceland's most frequently active volcano in recent history, lies largely beneath the vast Vatnajökull icecap. The caldera lake is covered by a 200-m-thick ice shelf, and only the southern rim of the 6 x 8 km caldera is exposed. The geothermal area in the caldera causes frequent...

volcano.si.edu

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Say the one who has spent years down on his knees enthusiastically servicing commies.


And they're almost always Republicans. And you vote for them. We get it. Even your soul is red.



That's because Trump promised to pull out of NATO in his second term, which would have just handed Putin everything he wants.

And you supported that. You always support what the commies want.

Now run along. Putin wants another coat of saliva applied, so your skills are needed.

By the way, are you happy about how Trump stopped arms imports to Ukraine unless they'd lie about Biden? And how he cancelled the Open Skies Treaty, making it much harder to monitor Russian aggression? I'm sure you are. If it helps the RepubliRussians, you love it.

You're intellectually vapid, a non-entity. Go troll elsewhere

# countries Putin invaded while Trump was in the WH: 0
# countries Putin invaded while Biden was in the WH: 2 (so far)

 

[Sunsettommy]

Well, what do you know, that volcano is located in an ice sheet.
View attachment 606213
And doesn't seem to be capable of doing any more than melting a hole in the ice.
View attachment 606215

Global Volcanism Program | Grímsvötn

Grímsvötn, Iceland's most frequently active volcano in recent history, lies largely beneath the vast Vatnajökull icecap. The caldera lake is covered by a 200-m-thick ice shelf, and only the southern rim of the 6 x 8 km caldera is exposed. The geothermal area in the caldera causes frequent...

volcano.si.edu

Your deflection is a massive sign of your desperation because you just ignored science research of Thwaities Glacial being melted from the BELOW the ice field which FlaCalTenn schooled you big time.

Meanwhile Thwaties is around 80 MILES wide and around 13,000 thick which is far bigger than the largest Icelandic glacier the comparison isn't even close.

You didn't refute anything here because you are so busy fighting the evidence given to you from the scientists who work there.

 

[jc456]

And they're almost always Republicans. And you vote for them. We get it. Even your soul is red.

can't make this up!!! Honestly, how can you look at yourself in a mirror after posting such nonsense. Name one republican. go ahead, I know you ignored the news on xiden and what he's paid. Need others?

 

[jc456]

Well, what do you know, that volcano is located in an ice sheet.
View attachment 606213
And doesn't seem to be capable of doing any more than melting a hole in the ice.
View attachment 606215

Global Volcanism Program | Grímsvötn

Grímsvötn, Iceland's most frequently active volcano in recent history, lies largely beneath the vast Vatnajökull icecap. The caldera lake is covered by a 200-m-thick ice shelf, and only the southern rim of the 6 x 8 km caldera is exposed. The geothermal area in the caldera causes frequent...

volcano.si.edu

explain what this has to do with Antarctica?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Post glacial warming.

Remember when that iceberg hit the Titanic? Broke off from the Arctic ice sheet.

....because of manmadeup global warming

 

[flacaltenn]

One of the dumber fucks chimes in. Iceland has an active rift right down the center. And it has plenty of ice. In fact, as soon as one of the vents covered in the iced area stops erupting, it is immediately covered in ice again. A glacier in the crater of Mt. St. Helens is cheek and jowl with an lava dome that is fuming every day, and the glacier is growing as fast as the dome. Just a bunch of dumb fucks here posting nonsense concerning that rift.

First your excuse to be a denier of these facts was based on Mt Saint Helens in some weird contorted misconstrued way. AND NOW your new red herring is Iceland and it's volcanic rifts.

AINT got NOTHING to do with proximity of "fire and ice". Its ALL got to do with making COASTAL GLACIERS SLIDE FASTER TOWARDS THE SEA. That's ice IN MOTION dummkopf. The issue at the WAISheet was ALWAYS the accelerated motion of those coastal glaciers, with one foot in the sea and the other rooted on solid ground, causing ice to go faster into the sea.

NOT about melting large volumes of ice, but "greasing the skids" so that was less friction and stable connection to the rock footer.. Dont need to melt a lot of ice, Just get intrusions and enough heat to RUIN the footing.

 

[ding]

First your excuse to be a denier of these facts was based on Mt Saint Helens in some weird contorted misconstrued way. AND NOW your new red herring is Iceland and it's volcanic rifts.

AINT got NOTHING to do with proximity of "fire and ice". Its ALL got to do with making COASTAL GLACIERS SLIDE FASTER TOWARDS THE SEA. That's ice IN MOTION dummkopf. The issue at the WAISheet was ALWAYS the accelerated motion of those coastal glaciers, with one foot in the sea and the other rooted on solid ground, causing ice to go faster into the sea.

NOT about melting large volumes of ice, but "greasing the skids" so that was less friction and stable connection to the rock footer.. Dont need to melt a lot of ice, Just get intrusions and enough heat to RUIN the footing.

It's super obvious that these guys are hammers looking for nails. The politicization of science is horrible and it starts with the ones who are trying to force consensus for political purposes.