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1946: The Mistranslation That Shifted Culture.

beautress

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We'll have to disagree about everything you wrote. I'm sure you can't back it up so really it would be just you making claims. Christianity did invent anti-Semitism so it's interesting that you infer they were somehow guilty of something? Killing Christ? What did they do to get expelled from England?
No, the people of Rome invaded and conquered Jewish holy lands before Christ was born in Bethlehem. Before that, the Egyptians forgot that a Jewish ancestor was given practical leadership by the Pharoah in the seven years of famine. Joseph was one of twelve brothers of their father, Jacob who was in later life called Israel. Many years after Joseph died the children of Israel were enslaved by Egyptian decree. They turned their fear and hatred of Israelis into slaves for years until Moses convinced Pharoah to let his people go. That was literally thousands of years ago.

Please reverse your opinion that Christians started bigotry against Jews wnel Christ and 100% of his followers were descendants of Israel, to the best of my knowledge. Christianity started (as predicted by Isiah the prophet) near year zero or ideally 2021 years heretofore. Egyptians were beating the snot out of Jews in their slave state, and they abhored them for not marrying outside of their nation even during times they could have used some freedom.

I think most people who post here know that and I'm trying to reflect my readings as best I can when I only know what I read sans being a theologian. I did teach church school classes within the parameters of the curriculums handed to me by education administrators in the church of my fathers, and I love the Good book and read a little at vespers at night. It helps me to keep a perspective when in discission.

Well, promises to keep. My regards.
 

alang1216

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You got squat except arguments from silence; the West doucmented a lot of their history, Jews, muslims, Africans, Asians didn't.
You should read some history, you seem woefully ignorant of it.

You're just a warped brainwashed tool who is just fine with the whitey bashing and Jesus hating nonsense. Witch burnings, tossing faggots in bogs, etc. all pagan cultural pastimes, along with human sacrifices, genocides, and everything else under the sun.
I don't hate, period. Unfortunately, facts can be uncomfortable for those that wish to bury them. Human sacrifice is a very old tradition and Christians can be proud they condemned it. Of course they did burn the occasional heretic at the stake.

As for Jew, they were famous for their soldiers marching into the West with their Muslim brothers in arms, into Spain, against Constantinople, raiding Italy, even sacking Rome in 816 A.D. or thereabouts, and of course screwing over the Xians in Alexandria and every other city in Islam.
Jews were welcome in Muslim countries as people of the book. Christian countries were not so welcoming. The First Crusade was against Jews, not Muslims.

In England, like elsewhere in western European cities, They were invited in to help loot the peasants and handle foreign trade; when that declined the got invited out, it's that simple.
They were not prohibited by their religion to make loans and finance the Christian countries. They were generally prohibited from owning land and entering many other businesses.

They self-segregated, and they despised the goy.
Google 'ghetto'.

They didn't have their 'Enlightenment' until; the late 18th and early 19th Century; untul then they were pretty much no different than their Muslim brothers, not trustworthy at all and purposely arrogant and petty towards most other peoples not in their tribe. their problems were nearly all self-inflicted, from Roman times right up to modern times, and some still are. I don't 'infer' anything, their own history and historians record and report this.
The anti-semitism runs strong in this one.

Try reading something once in a while besides racist Orthodox and Hasedic rubbish propaganda.
Not necessary, I only have to read the NT.
 

alang1216

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First off, thanks for the thoughtful post. I disagree with much of it but I appreciate you taking the time to respond and for being polite and respectful. Hopefully I'll live up to that too. Although I'm not a Christian, I find devout Christians to be fine and honest people.

No, the people of Rome invaded and conquered Jewish holy lands before Christ was born in Bethlehem. Before that, the Egyptians forgot that a Jewish ancestor was given practical leadership by the Pharoah in the seven years of famine. Joseph was one of twelve brothers of their father, Jacob who was in later life called Israel. Many years after Joseph died the children of Israel were enslaved by Egyptian decree. They turned their fear and hatred of Israelis into slaves for years until Moses convinced Pharoah to let his people go. That was literally thousands of years ago.
I don't think archeology supports the Biblical version of the Exodus. I tend to think of it as a creation myth based very loosely on oral traditions.

Please reverse your opinion that Christians started bigotry against Jews wnel Christ and 100% of his followers were descendants of Israel, to the best of my knowledge.
Jews were the original followers of Jesus but Christians could never convert Jews in large numbers. Christianity would probably have vanished if not for Paul's conversion of Pagans.

Christianity started (as predicted by Isiah the prophet) near year zero or ideally 2021 years heretofore. Egyptians were beating the snot out of Jews in their slave state, and they abhored them for not marrying outside of their nation even during times they could have used some freedom.
Not sure any of that is factual.

I think most people who post here know that and I'm trying to reflect my readings as best I can when I only know what I read sans being a theologian. I did teach church school classes within the parameters of the curriculums handed to me by education administrators in the church of my fathers, and I love the Good book and read a little at vespers at night. It helps me to keep a perspective when in discission.

Well, promises to keep. My regards.
Your facts may be debatable, your faith and honesty is not.
 

beautress

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First off, thanks for the thoughtful post. I disagree with much of it but I appreciate you taking the time to respond and for being polite and respectful. Hopefully I'll live up to that too. Although I'm not a Christian, I find devout Christians to be fine and honest people.


I don't think archeology supports the Biblical version of the Exodus. I tend to think of it as a creation myth based very loosely on oral traditions. 90s


Jews were the original followers of Jesus but Christians could never convert Jews in large numbers. Christianity would probably have vanished if not for Paul's conversion of Pagans.


Not sure any of that is factual.


Your facts may be debatable, your faith and honesty is not.


First off, thanks for the thoughtful post. I disagree with much of it but I appreciate you taking the time to respond and for being polite and respectful. Hopefully I'll live up to that too. Although I'm not a Christian, I find devout Christians to be fine and honest people.


I don't think archeology supports the Biblical version of the Exodus. I tend to think of it as a creation myth based very loosely on oral traditions.


Jews were the original followers of Jesus but Christians could never convert Jews in large numbers. Christianity would probably have vanished if not for Paul's conversion of Pagans.


Not sure any of that is factual.


Your facts may be debatable, your faith and honesty is not.
Well ya got me there on facts. I was reading a lot and for some reason, I read a book entitled "From the Tablets of Sumer" back in 1965 for an Art History class at Chaffey College. The book ignited in me an interest in ancient History in that part of the world, and I got so focused on the subject it lowered most of my grades in other classes. I don't remember the names of authors nor the titles of the other books I would cluster around me like a hen with little chicks, but one of the books I read discussed that an Egyptian mosaic? picture? heiroglyph? with cuneiform printing that the author said was proof that the Egyptians were punishing? persecuting? beating? Hebrew slaves, and from the past, I got the impression that some people found that the story of Moses had actually been verified by this and other archaeologists that found sundry bits and pieces in artworks in stone and dye, paints, or tinted stones that hinted that the story of Moses was true. So pardon my memory, but my belief that the Children of Israel (aka Jacob) somewhere along the line following Joseph's job of helping the Pharoah get through many years of drought and many years after Joseph died, Moses joined the Royal family when his mom placed her infant son in a basket she hoped a childless Egyptian woman would find and raise Moses, since a decree went out to kill all the Israelite newborn sons under the age of two.

Another thing about the children of Israel is that they treasured stories about their ancestors to a science and practiced memorizing stories so well they could tell historical facts acurately even if they could not read and write. Their legends may be just as accurate as a xerox machine. Parents pushed for their sons to recite the torah verbatim in the same words their great greats recited exactly as generations back to Adam and Eve. The reason that makes sense to me is that to this day the best practioners of the law are very often people who learned it well from parents for their entire youth. How could we fail to not at least acknowledge that our Hebrew brethren who speak a language that has remained close to its origin thousands of years ago? How could we not expect them to marry within the parameters of synagogue education? I can't and my protestant heritage goes back further than when my ancestor Will S arrived at Plymouth Rock around 1619.

I just don't get it about anti-semitism. I don't get it at all. They make a concerted try at following their laws without offending laws of the states. They teach their children not only thrift, but charity as well just like us. One of them, Haim Solomon, loaned the Continental Congeress money to feed, clothe, and shoe General Washington's barefoot army. Well formerly barefoot that is. And when things couldn't get any worse, Haim went broke but didn't quit his passion for funding General Washington's faithful caring for his fighters. Haim went to New York City, rounded up 5 or 6 of his generous friends whom he persuaded to fund the Continental revolutionary war because then they'd never have to go back to mean Europe who persecuted Jews even back then. With the money Haim Solomon raised, General Washington and his fed-clothed-and shoed men rocked right straight into the British strongholds and cleaned their clocks. A far better version than my memory of Haim Solomon is better told in Arthur Schleisinger's wonderful book An Almanac of American History. The book is divided into years so I'm guessing the story would be found in the Revolutionary War years which may have started in the mid 1770s and into the early 1780's. I love that book!
 
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alang1216

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Well ya got me there on facts. I was reading a lot and for some reason, I read a book entitled "From the Tablets of Sumer" back in 1965 for an Art History class at Chaffey College. The book ignited in me an interest in ancient History in that part of the world, and I got so focused on the subject it lowered most of my grades in other classes. I don't remember the names of authors nor the titles of the other books I would cluster around me like a hen with little chicks, but one of the books I read discussed that an Egyptian mosaic? picture? heiroglyph? with cuneiform printing that the author said was proof that the Egyptians were punishing? persecuting? beating? Hebrew slaves, and from the past, I got the impression that some people found that the story of Moses had actually been verified by this and other archaeologists that found sundry bits and pieces in artworks in stone and dye, paints, or tinted stones that hinted that the story of Moses was true.
I'm not aware of any Egyptian reference to Jews as slaves, though I'm sure there were some, I doubt an entire people were enslaved. The first Egyptian reference to Israel is a monument to the conquest and destruction of the Kingdom of Israel in Palestine, well after the time of the Exodus. Israel is only one of many states mentioned and appears nothing special.

We may never know if there was a Moses (an Egyptian name BTW) but his basket ride was certainly fictional, taken from more ancient stories of other kings in other lands.

So pardon my memory, but my belief that the Children of Israel (aka Jacob) somewhere along the line following Joseph's job of helping the Pharoah get through many years of drought and many years after Joseph died, Moses joined the Royal family when his mom placed her infant son in a basket she hoped a childless Egyptian woman would find and raise Moses, since a decree went out to kill all the Israelite newborn sons under the age of two.
Again hard to believe it is more than myth although a Pharaoh sometime after Ramses II did lose a young son. Might have been the birth of one of the plagues?

Another thing about the children of Israel is that they treasured stories about their ancestors to a science and practiced memorizing stories so well they could tell historical facts acurately even if they could not read and write. Their legends may be just as accurate as a xerox machine. Parents pushed for their sons to recite the torah verbatim in the same words their great greats recited exactly as generations back to Adam and Eve. The reason that makes sense to me is that to this day the best practioners of the law are very often people who learned it well from parents for their entire youth. How could we fail to not at least acknowledge that our Hebrew brethren who speak a language that has remained close to its origin thousands of years ago? How could we not expect them to marry within the parameters of synagogue education? I can't and my protestant heritage goes back further than when my ancestor Will S arrived at Plymouth Rock around 1619.
Most of the OT was written during the Babylonian exile, centuries after Exodus. I'm sure stories of the Exodus were told and retold but which stories made it into the OT was decided by one group.

I just don't get it about anti-semitism. I don't get it at all.
Mathew 27:
When Pilate saw that he was getting nowhere, but that instead an uproar was starting, he took water and washed his hands in front of the crowd. "I am innocent of this man's blood," he said. "It is your responsibility!"
All the people answered, "Let his blood be on us and on our children!"
 

beautress

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I'm not aware of any Egyptian reference to Jews as slaves, though I'm sure there were some, I doubt an entire people were enslaved. The first Egyptian reference to Israel is a monument to the conquest and destruction of the Kingdom of Israel in Palestine, well after the time of the Exodus. Israel is only one of many states mentioned and appears nothing special.

We may never know if there was a Moses (an Egyptian name BTW) but his basket ride was certainly fictional, taken from more ancient stories of other kings in other lands.


Again hard to believe it is more than myth although a Pharaoh sometime after Ramses II did lose a young son. Might have been the birth of one of the plagues?


Most of the OT was written during the Babylonian exile, centuries after Exodus. I'm sure stories of the Exodus were told and retold but which stories made it into the OT was decided by one group.


Mathew 27:
When Pilate saw that he was getting nowhere, but that instead an uproar was starting, he took water and washed his hands in front of the crowd. "I am innocent of this man's blood," he said. "It is your responsibility!"
All the people answered, "Let his blood be on us and on our children!"
The only people who were there making certain Christ would suffer in a barbaric nailing his hands and feet to a large, splinterFilled cross were pharisees. Christ forgave all his adversaries as they threw stones, spears, and acidic vinegars on his dying body. He was in mortal pain and suffering when he prayed these words spoken in the people's languages, "Father forgive them, for they know not what they do." People may not realize it, but in so saying our Lord was revealing the foundation of the Kingdom of God. Those who know this and believe in the goodness of God knows that God is the most caring, forgiving spirit his creations could ever hope to be blessed with. Again I am not a theologian, I'm just a person who loves God more every day. All judgments and vengeance are his, not ours. He is a perfect one and as he told Moses, he is who he is. His kingdom is available to those who fear only him. His goodness makes my heart dance to his music.

I believe that God greatly loved his creation mankind and I also think God didn't make no junk. :thup:
 

DudleySmith

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You should read some history, you seem woefully ignorant of it.
[/QUOTE]

Take your own advice.
I don't hate, period. Unfortunately, facts can be uncomfortable for those that wish to bury them. Human sacrifice is a very old tradition and Christians can be proud they condemned it. Of course they did burn the occasional heretic at the stake.
[/QUOTE]

Actually it was mostly pagan peasants, but you wouldn't know that, being pretty ignorant. And, there were maybe 12,000 such burnings, not 'millions', and other crimes were subsumed under 'witchcraft' like poisoning, which would be the method of choice for murdering a husband, and there geographcial patterns to them as well. Very few were burned in the strongly Catholic countries like Spain and the Papal states, for instance, but a lot in Germany and along the French and Germanic countries' border regions, i.e. the regions far less strongly influenced by Christianity.
Jews were welcome in Muslim countries as people of the book. Christian countries were not so welcoming. The First Crusade was against Jews, not Muslims.
[/QUOTE]

LOL Jews were Muslim allies, western Europeans resisted them.
They were not prohibited by their religion to make loans and finance the Christian countries. They were generally prohibited from owning land and entering many other businesses.
[/QUOTE]

And so? They were foreigners, and chose to remain so.

Google 'ghetto'.
[/QUOTE]

Jews demanded to be segregated; they didn't want to be tainted by close association with the commoners; they were the King's Jews.


The anti-semitism runs strong in this one.[/qupte]

lol rubbish. Historical facts all, and you would have to call a lot of Jewish scholar 'antisemitic', since they are the primary sources.


Not necessary, I only have to read the NT.
[/QUOTE]

then maybe you should read it; apparently you haven't.
 
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DudleySmith

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Jews were the original followers of Jesus but Christians could never convert Jews in large numbers. Christianity would probably have vanished if not for Paul's conversion of Pagans.

Rubbish. Paul preached in the synagogues through out his travels and most converts were Jewish. The Babylonian Jews were fanatic racists and developed extremely exclusive 'racial purity' laws by Jesus's day, and alienated the vast majority of Jews. There was a large diaspora of these 'tainted' Jews all over the Roman and Persian empires as well as in Jerusalem, Galilee, and Samaria and other nearby regions. The conversion of Gentiles came later, after the expulsions and murders of Christians from the synagogues by the 'orthodox' cultists. these murders continued right up to the Muslim conquests, and beyond when they joined with the Muslims to attack western European peoples for the next 1,300 hundred years, the reason most Europeans never trusted them. Even these days they're joining their New Best Friends Forever in massacring Armenians, something they supported when Kemal was mass murdering Greeks and Armenians in his rampages.



Many of them are fine with genocides against Christian countries, they just yell 'antisemitism' when they get called on their own history of committing them and supporting them. The so-called 'Orthodox' of the post exilic 'Judaism' is not the Judaism of Moses, it's a self-serving racist cult of Babylonian con artists that was made up in the 2nd Century A.D. by a few lunatic pharisees.
 
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It goes on about how the bible was mistranslated to put the word "homosexual" in the bible, when it wasn't meant to be in there.



One thing that amazes me is people who say their church is accepting.

I'm like really? Just go into a church you claim is accepting dressed as a girl or with a partner of the same gender and see how fast they kick you out the door and come back to me with your claims of accepting.
That is correct furry friend. Sex was not Sodom's sin. O - howl - no. It was vexing people with filthy, unfriendly, conversation. Yip, yip, yep. 2 Peter 2:7 - 8 KJV. The worst that Sodomites wanted to do to Lot, had nothing to do with sex. God did not rescue Lot from a sexual encounter.
 
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metalwolf

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That is correct furry friend. Sex was not Sodom's sin. O - howl - no. It was vexing people with filthy, unfriendly, conversation. Yip, yip, yep. 2 Peter 2:7 - 8 KJV. The worst that Sodomites wanted to do to Lot, had nothing to do with sex. God did not rescue Lot from a sexual encounter.


And here is a passage that so many christians ignore.


Like i see many christians fighting against LGBT, but i never see them spending most of their money to help build homeless shelters.

Helping the poor is something that Jesus did say.

I think many christians will be surprised when Jesus comes back and he says they never helped the poor or homeless.

There is a big homeless crisis in our nation.
 
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Study: 60% of Homeless Shelter Beds Are Provided Through Faith-Based Organizations​



Atheists and faggots: 0

Faggots do still love to spread diseases around, though, they excel at mindless self-indulgence and narcissism. That's why the AIDS crisis decimated so many of the psychos after all, and they still lead the wolrd in new HIV infections, syphilis, drug resistant staph infections, hepatitis, etc. In fact 'Gay Pride Month' has an automatic Hepatitis epidemic warning from WHO every year; nasty little mentally ill shits.
 
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metalwolf

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Study: 60% of Homeless Shelter Beds Are Provided Through Faith-Based Organizations​



Atheists and faggots: 0

Faggots do still love to spread diseases around, though, they excel at mindless self-indulgence and narcissism. That's why the AIDS crisis decimated so many of the psychos after all, and they still lead the wolrd in new HIV infections, syphilis, drug resistant staph infections, hepatitis, etc. In fact 'Gay Pride Month' has an automatic Hepatitis epidemic warning from WHO every year; nasty little mentally ill shits.


I wonder if you're a closet case.

I heard the more someone hates gay people, the more likely they are to be gay or had a gay experience.

Just read about Ted Haggard who spoke against gay people, but had secret gay sex.
 

DudleySmith

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I wonder if you're a closet case.

I heard the more someone hates gay people, the more likely they are to be gay or had a gay experience.

Just read about Ted Haggard who spoke against gay people, but had secret gay sex.

Too bad only morons fall back on fake reverse psychology bullshit when they get proven to be liars. You're just a sick degenerate, and there is just no way you can hide that fact. All you faggots like to pretend everybody else is as sick as you are. You constantly babble bullshit about yourselves and your propaganda nonsense and then snivel when you get called on any of it. It takes maybe a minute to refute any of your lies, so don't get all impressed with yourself.
 
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metalwolf

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Too bad only morons fall back on fake reverse psychology bullshit when they get proven to be liars. You're just a sick degenerate, and there is just no way you can hide that fact. All you faggots like to pretend everybody else is as sick as you are. You constantly babble bullshit about yourselves and your propaganda nonsense and then snivel when you get called on any of it. It takes maybe a minute to refute any of your lies, so don't get all impressed with yourself.

Or you could be a Nazi.
 

surada

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Well ya got me there on facts. I was reading a lot and for some reason, I read a book entitled "From the Tablets of Sumer" back in 1965 for an Art History class at Chaffey College. The book ignited in me an interest in ancient History in that part of the world, and I got so focused on the subject it lowered most of my grades in other classes. I don't remember the names of authors nor the titles of the other books I would cluster around me like a hen with little chicks, but one of the books I read discussed that an Egyptian mosaic? picture? heiroglyph? with cuneiform printing that the author said was proof that the Egyptians were punishing? persecuting? beating? Hebrew slaves, and from the past, I got the impression that some people found that the story of Moses had actually been verified by this and other archaeologists that found sundry bits and pieces in artworks in stone and dye, paints, or tinted stones that hinted that the story of Moses was true. So pardon my memory, but my belief that the Children of Israel (aka Jacob) somewhere along the line following Joseph's job of helping the Pharoah get through many years of drought and many years after Joseph died, Moses joined the Royal family when his mom placed her infant son in a basket she hoped a childless Egyptian woman would find and raise Moses, since a decree went out to kill all the Israelite newborn sons under the age of two.

Another thing about the children of Israel is that they treasured stories about their ancestors to a science and practiced memorizing stories so well they could tell historical facts acurately even if they could not read and write. Their legends may be just as accurate as a xerox machine. Parents pushed for their sons to recite the torah verbatim in the same words their great greats recited exactly as generations back to Adam and Eve. The reason that makes sense to me is that to this day the best practioners of the law are very often people who learned it well from parents for their entire youth. How could we fail to not at least acknowledge that our Hebrew brethren who speak a language that has remained close to its origin thousands of years ago? How could we not expect them to marry within the parameters of synagogue education? I can't and my protestant heritage goes back further than when my ancestor Will S arrived at Plymouth Rock around 1619.

I just don't get it about anti-semitism. I don't get it at all. They make a concerted try at following their laws without offending laws of the states. They teach their children not only thrift, but charity as well just like us. One of them, Haim Solomon, loaned the Continental Congeress money to feed, clothe, and shoe General Washington's barefoot army. Well formerly barefoot that is. And when things couldn't get any worse, Haim went broke but didn't quit his passion for funding General Washington's faithful caring for his fighters. Haim went to New York City, rounded up 5 or 6 of his generous friends whom he persuaded to fund the Continental revolutionary war because then they'd never have to go back to mean Europe who persecuted Jews even back then. With the money Haim Solomon raised, General Washington and his fed-clothed-and shoed men rocked right straight into the British strongholds and cleaned their clocks. A far better version than my memory of Haim Solomon is better told in Arthur Schleisinger's wonderful book An Almanac of American History. The book is divided into years so I'm guessing the story would be found in the Revolutionary War years which may have started in the mid 1770s and into the early 1780's. I love that book!


There is zero evidence for Exodus.
 

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Pagans celebrate both. Christians don't.

Christians burned thousands of witches.

Who Burned the Witches? - Catholic Education Resource …
Image
For example, historians have now realized that witch-hunting was not primarily a medieval phenomenon. It peaked in the 17th century, during the rationalist age of Descartes, Newton, and St. Vincent de Paul. Persecuting suspected witches was not an elite plot against the poor; n…


The Witch-Hunter's Baedeker Witches Meanwhile, witch-hunters' manuals multiplied, most notably the infamous Malleus Maleficarum (Hammer of Witches), published in 1486. Its authors, Jacob Sprenger and Heinrich Kraemer, were experienced Dominican inquisitors who had burned 48 witches in one diocese alone and had obtained a papal bull a…
 

surada

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No, the people of Rome invaded and conquered Jewish holy lands before Christ was born in Bethlehem. Before that, the Egyptians forgot that a Jewish ancestor was given practical leadership by the Pharoah in the seven years of famine. Joseph was one of twelve brothers of their father, Jacob who was in later life called Israel. Many years after Joseph died the children of Israel were enslaved by Egyptian decree. They turned their fear and hatred of Israelis into slaves for years until Moses convinced Pharoah to let his people go. That was literally thousands of years ago.

Please reverse your opinion that Christians started bigotry against Jews wnel Christ and 100% of his followers were descendants of Israel, to the best of my knowledge. Christianity started (as predicted by Isiah the prophet) near year zero or ideally 2021 years heretofore. Egyptians were beating the snot out of Jews in their slave state, and they abhored them for not marrying outside of their nation even during times they could have used some freedom.

I think most people who post here know that and I'm trying to reflect my readings as best I can when I only know what I read sans being a theologian. I did teach church school classes within the parameters of the curriculums handed to me by education administrators in the church of my fathers, and I love the Good book and read a little at vespers at night. It helps me to keep a perspective when in discission.

Well, promises to keep. My regards.

Isaiah never mentions Jesus or Christianity. He was talking about Israel.
 

surada

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Witch trials in the early modern period - Wikipedia

Peak of the trials: 1560–1630

Decline of the trials: 1650–1750

Witch trials by country or region

Prosecutions for the crime of witchcraft reached a highpoint from 1580 to 1630 during the Counter-Reformation and the European wars of religion, when an estimated 50,000 people were...........
 

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