100,000 people shot in the US per year! Good guy saving lives?

[pismoe]

The whole entire world agrees that america has a gun problem. Till you meet the gun nuts in the US and their idiotic explanations:

"Guns don't kill people"....Yes they do, other countries don't have them...hence they have less murders per capita.
"We need them to fight tyrannical government"....You telling me that you have a chance vs Tanks, Tomahawks and F35s ? LOL
"Is in our constitution" that piece of paper that was written 300 years ago? wake up we live in the 21st century, and your forefathers ain't god or Jesus.

The dumbest people ever assembled in one country are the gun lovers.

All these wonderful countries with free healthcare and no guns, but not one of you on the left will ever lift a finger to move to one of these great places.

The whole world agrees America has a gun problem? Great, then let the rest of the world STF out of our country. We like it just the way it is less the Democrats of course.

That's like saying all Americans voted for Trump while in reality is the opposite. Gun ban will happen in this country is a matter of time.

A very long time. But like I said, you don't move to one of these countries that have these bans. Why not?

America is a great place partly because we are armed. We have the ability to defend ourselves against attackers.

The whole entire world agrees that america has a gun problem. Till you meet the gun nuts in the US and their idiotic explanations:

"Guns don't kill people"....Yes they do, other countries don't have them...hence they have less murders per capita.
"We need them to fight tyrannical government"....You telling me that you have a chance vs Tanks, Tomahawks and F35s ? LOL
"Is in our constitution" that piece of paper that was written 300 years ago? wake up we live in the 21st century, and your forefathers ain't god or Jesus.

The dumbest people ever assembled in one country are the gun lovers.

The whole entire world agrees that america has a gun problem. Till you meet the gun nuts in the US and their idiotic explanations:

"Guns don't kill people"....Yes they do, other countries don't have them...hence they have less murders per capita.
"We need them to fight tyrannical government"....You telling me that you have a chance vs Tanks, Tomahawks and F35s ? LOL
"Is in our constitution" that piece of paper that was written 300 years ago? wake up we live in the 21st century, and your forefathers ain't god or Jesus.

The dumbest people ever assembled in one country are the gun lovers.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- the above words that i quote are the words and thinking of an imported ' arab' of some type . He claims to be a ' berber' in some previous thread . ------------------------- they weren't YOUR ForeFathers Issa !!

Lol I'm arab/berber/subsaharian and iberian .
What's your input about the subject again?

---------------------------------------------------- simply that YOU third worlders are a Danger to American Freedoms , RIGHTS and Liberty and that you and ilk should not be imported into the USA because you are dangerous to those American RIGHTS , Liberties and Freedoms Issa . You think and vote like a 'berber' rather than an America Issa .

You are a proud racist.

------------------------------------------- incorrect Issa, i object to your 'unamerican' thinking in the scheme of things in the USA . We Americans have had a fine Nation , the most prosperous , strongest and Freest Nation in the history of the world . We should not let in third world beggars and imports into the USA to change the USA RIGHTS , Freedoms and Liberties. As i have asked previously , what have 'berbers' [third worlders] ever done in 'berberland' except admire their ATLAS Mountains that God created Issa .

 

[pismoe]

and mostly , i use YOU as an example of 'un American' people with 'un American' thinking that should not be imported into the USA . I use YOU as an example Issa .

 

[Daryl Hunt]

and further thought , might be taxpayer paid or retired public servant like a lot of other big shot 'veterans' , retired 'generals' are doing as members of the 'giffords' gun control group . Not sure but this comment is a way to spread the news that as well as your KIDS and Children and taxpayer paid public school teachers many military veterans are working against American gun owners . ------------ just a comment !!

You hit it on right on the head. I am retired Military. I know WAR. I know what the weapons can do in the right and the wrong hands. I own weapons. I don't use the word Ban like many of you do since that's a fallacy. I do use the word regulation which is the true word to use. You can't ban guns. Never going to happen. But we can have common sense firearms laws. Many, like me, have been in lawless areas and have seen the misery where weapons cause wholesale murder and mayhem. An AK is a right of passage. You have a grevience with your neighbor, don't talk it out, shoot it out. Make more widows and orphans. The ONLY thing standing between a Vicious animal and a Civilized man is laws. Nothing more.

No, I am not against MOST of the people. I am against those that want a lawless land. I've seen it and want no part of it.

 

[ph3iron]

Sounds like a Saturday in Chicago.

Try Memphis, worse than the regurgitated chicago

 

[ph3iron]

and further thought , might be taxpayer paid or retired public servant like a lot of other big shot 'veterans' , retired 'generals' are doing as members of the 'giffords' gun control group . Not sure but this comment is a way to spread the news that as well as your KIDS and Children and taxpayer paid public school teachers many military veterans are working against American gun owners . ------------ just a comment !!

You hit it on right on the head. I am retired Military. I know WAR. I know what the weapons can do in the right and the wrong hands. I own weapons. I don't use the word Ban like many of you do since that's a fallacy. I do use the word regulation which is the true word to use. You can't ban guns. Never going to happen. But we can have common sense firearms laws. Many, like me, have been in lawless areas and have seen the misery where weapons cause wholesale murder and mayhem. An AK is a right of passage. You have a grevience with your neighbor, don't talk it out, shoot it out. Make more widows and orphans. The ONLY thing standing between a Vicious animal and a Civilized man is laws. Nothing more.

No, I am not against MOST of the people. I am against those that want a lawless land. I've seen it and want no part of it.

As they say"if you are not smart enough to get a real job, join the military, great socialist benefits"

 

[pismoe]

there you go , thanks for the reply . Retired military , peoples kids and children , lefties , hilary and 'mrobamas' people and all of them taxpayer paid Public Servants that think they are SPECIAL working against Americans eh . Are you working with the taxpayer paid and retired 'generals' and 'gabby' and that bald headed astronaut to neuter Americans RIGHTS Daryl ??

 

[pismoe]

LOTS of people were military and they know war so your claim to fame is worth nothing Daryl .

 

[pismoe]

and as a note , check out the 'GIFFORDS' gun control group . Click around a bit but many of the Military big shots , many 'generals' , policy makers , politicians and retired heads of Agencies are all for taking the AR15 and i assume other efficient and effective guns from Americans . Check out GIFFORDS and click around a bit if you want to be informed .

 

[pismoe]

and further thought , might be taxpayer paid or retired public servant like a lot of other big shot 'veterans' , retired 'generals' are doing as members of the 'giffords' gun control group . Not sure but this comment is a way to spread the news that as well as your KIDS and Children and taxpayer paid public school teachers many military veterans are working against American gun owners . ------------ just a comment !!

You hit it on right on the head. I am retired Military. I know WAR. I know what the weapons can do in the right and the wrong hands. I own weapons. I don't use the word Ban like many of you do since that's a fallacy. I do use the word regulation which is the true word to use. You can't ban guns. Never going to happen. But we can have common sense firearms laws. Many, like me, have been in lawless areas and have seen the misery where weapons cause wholesale murder and mayhem. An AK is a right of passage. You have a grevience with your neighbor, don't talk it out, shoot it out. Make more widows and orphans. The ONLY thing standing between a Vicious animal and a Civilized man is laws. Nothing more.

No, I am not against MOST of the people. I am against those that want a lawless land. I've seen it and want no part of it.

As they say"if you are not smart enough to get a real job, join the military, great socialist benefits"

------------------------------------------------------------- and i like the MILITARY but i just don't like them being viewed as having Special Knowledge of Taxpayer RIGHTS , Freedoms and Liberties . --- Coalitions - Giffords --- see the 'veterans coalition' .

 

[Pop23]

And still we await a solution that will make criminals obey laws and the suicidal not find away to commit suicide, with or without an AR-15.

 

[pismoe]

and further thought , might be taxpayer paid or retired public servant like a lot of other big shot 'veterans' , retired 'generals' are doing as members of the 'giffords' gun control group . Not sure but this comment is a way to spread the news that as well as your KIDS and Children and taxpayer paid public school teachers many military veterans are working against American gun owners . ------------ just a comment !!

You hit it on right on the head. I am retired Military. I know WAR. I know what the weapons can do in the right and the wrong hands. I own weapons. I don't use the word Ban like many of you do since that's a fallacy. I do use the word regulation which is the true word to use. You can't ban guns. Never going to happen. But we can have common sense firearms laws. Many, like me, have been in lawless areas and have seen the misery where weapons cause wholesale murder and mayhem. An AK is a right of passage. You have a grevience with your neighbor, don't talk it out, shoot it out. Make more widows and orphans. The ONLY thing standing between a Vicious animal and a Civilized man is laws. Nothing more.

No, I am not against MOST of the people. I am against those that want a lawless land. I've seen it and want no part of it.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Dad and Uncles were in War [ww2] and maybe others on this board were also in War . Last thing they'd work to do is to disarm , regulate guns for Americans because they understood the purpose of the Second Amendment . Heck my Dad bought Military Surplus guns at the local hardware store by just going in and looking around and then leaving after a CASH Exchange with so called Weapons of War . Most all my kid friends had veteran Fathers and most of my Male school teachers were ww2 or Korean Vets Daryl !!

 

[2aguy]

It has to do with the Cult that adopted it as the weapon of choice. Let's face it, there are a few others out there as deadly but look less benign. But the "Cult" adopted the AR style and that is what is being used. You will note that the high body counts weren't being done when it was regulated like an automatic weapon. It was only after it was released that the cults started using it and the body count went up. You really can't argue with that one. We really can't do much about the "Cult" except to pick up the pieces afterwards but we can about their weapon of choice.

Rifles of any kind are used in about 2% of all murders the AR itself is used in even less than 2% of all murders

If the AR is , as you say, the weapon of choice for murderers then many more than less than 2% of all murders would be committed with the AR

You are skirting the fact that the AR is used for the Mass Shootings alone. It's the weapon of choice. A Student can't really have much of a Mass School Shooting with a handgun of any kind. Besides, the body count will not be high enough. He will be going for the record. And right now, that record is 58 dead. Some people see how many hoops they can shoot. Some see how many hamburgers they can eat. These sick puppies see how many people they can kill in the least amount of time. Unlike the other two, this is a one "Shot" thing so they plan to do it right the first time. So they pick the most capable weapon they can find and that is the AR and for the same reasons that it was adopted in the US Military. It's light, easy to handle, reliable, has just enough power to do the job, the ammo is light and you can carry a lot of it. Oh, and they think it looks cool. So they go for the record. Murdering 58 in a matter of minutes takes an almost genius to do it and these people think they are geniuses. Luckily, most are bagged before they can get into place. But it takes just a couple to get into place for them to go for the record. So we do what we can to minimize body counts. That's about all we can do before the fact.

"You are skirting the fact that the AR is used for the Mass Shootings alone. It's the weapon of choice. A Student can't really have much of a Mass School Shooting with a handgun of any kind"?? This shows you are a victim of the hysteria and media manipulation.

Just to clarify, the single deadliest school shooting we have had was accomplished by a man with 2 handguns. The man, with no training at all, murdered 32 people in 2 locations with a pair of handguns. The idea that the AR is somehow the "perfect killing machine" is nonsense. The VaTech shooter never would have been able to pull of the high body count with an AR. The concealability of handguns makes them far more useful to such a shooter than an AR.

As for them being a genius, that is nonsense. The Las Vegas shooter managed such a high body count, mainly, because of a bumpstock which allowed him to mimic a fully automatic weapon. The accuracy is crap. But when firing into crowds, accuracy is not an issue. Charles Whitman managed to kill 16 people, mostly with a bolt action rifle. One of the things that kept the body count from being much higher is that civilians started shooting back at Whitman before the police arrived.

In the last decade or so, there have been half a dozen mass or school shootings where an AR was used. There are an estimated 5 to 8 million of them owned by private citizens in the US. The rifle is not the problem.

But the reason they put their energy into the AR-15 civilian rifle can already be seen........they now target it as a semi automatic weapon.....not just the old "assault weapon" tag they used to use. If they can ban the AR-15 civilian rifle because it is a semi automatic rifle, they can come back and demand all semi automatic weapons be banned, which they screamed for at the CNN Townhall and at the D.C. march......

There you go with the term "Ban" again. Start using the term "Regulate" and you won't sound like a complete idiot and maybe we might listen to you a bit more.

It is ban.....they will use regulations to ban guns for normal people.......just like a constrictor snake, squeezing the life out of the 2nd Amendment, one law, one tax, one new rule at time...until only the rich and politically connected can afford the time and money to get through the red tape to own a gun, let alone carry one....

We saw you morons on the CNN Townhall screaming to ban all semi automatic rifles....and carrying the Repeal the 2nd Amendment signs at the D.C. rally and that idiot who was pretending to be a Justice on the Supreme Court, who took an oath to protect and defend the Constitution, calling on repealing the 2nd Amendment....

 

[2aguy]

"You are skirting the fact that the AR is used for the Mass Shootings alone. It's the weapon of choice. A Student can't really have much of a Mass School Shooting with a handgun of any kind"?? This shows you are a victim of the hysteria and media manipulation.

Just to clarify, the single deadliest school shooting we have had was accomplished by a man with 2 handguns. The man, with no training at all, murdered 32 people in 2 locations with a pair of handguns. The idea that the AR is somehow the "perfect killing machine" is nonsense. The VaTech shooter never would have been able to pull of the high body count with an AR. The concealability of handguns makes them far more useful to such a shooter than an AR.

As for them being a genius, that is nonsense. The Las Vegas shooter managed such a high body count, mainly, because of a bumpstock which allowed him to mimic a fully automatic weapon. The accuracy is crap. But when firing into crowds, accuracy is not an issue. Charles Whitman managed to kill 16 people, mostly with a bolt action rifle. One of the things that kept the body count from being much higher is that civilians started shooting back at Whitman before the police arrived.

In the last decade or so, there have been half a dozen mass or school shootings where an AR was used. There are an estimated 5 to 8 million of them owned by private citizens in the US. The rifle is not the problem.

You are missing the point. It's not about the weapon at all. It's about the body count. The last 2 would be shooters both stated that they were after the record. The Record stands at 58. You can't get that record with a Van, running a car into a crowd, shooting handguns and more. You can only get that record with mulitiple ARs with lots of ammo in a dense crowd of people. And where do you find that dense a crowd? It's about the body count. I don't expect you to understand that. But I imagine that any Grunt from Nam understands that. That is how each battle was reported. Not ground taken, but body counts usually. These sickos want to hold the record much like the kid going for the record for the most hoops shot without a miss. We understand and support the hoop shooter and support his fascination but his sport doesn't have a body count along with it. The sickos will keep trying to break the body count record and the only way they see to do it is with the AR. What is wrong with raising the age limit to buyiing an AR to 21 years since the ones that that keep doing the school shootings are under 21 for the most part. If you take away the easy access of the main tool that they think they need then you at least minimize the body count. And if you have an under 21 try and buy an AR, that is a red flag and the authorities can react to it and maybe stop a shooting all the way.

The average age of mass shooters, 33-34. So raising the age to 21 does nothing......and they can always get the gun illegally...you know, like the Columbine shooter, or the Sandy Hook shooter......did you try thinking before you posted?


No, you can surpass that record with a rental truck...

The Vegas shooter used 2 rifles, firing over 1,000 rounds of ammo into a tightly packed crowd of over 22,000 people from a concealed and fortified position.

He killed 58.

A muslim terrorist with a rental truck killed 86 in 5 minutes.

-------

Then you have this......in France where fully automatic rifles and 30 round magazines are already completely illegal, yet 7 terrorists on government terrorist watch lists, a few even convicted criminals, easily got the fully automatic rifles and 30 round magazines...

7 terrorists attacked the Bataclan concert and rampaged through Paris......using bombs too.....

And they murdered 130 people....they were each armed with fully automatic military rifles and 30 round magazines...all outlawed in France by the way...

130 divided by 7 = 18.57 people per rifle ( including killed by bombs, so technically they didn't even murder 18 with rifles...).... 413 injured

the one muslim attacker attacker using a rental truck murdered 86 people all by himself....

Even fully automatic military rifles with 30 round magazines are not as deadly as rental trucks.......

18.57 with fully automatic military rifles and 30 round magazines....( not all of the people were murdered with guns, they also used bombs.....)

86 with a rental truck... 458 injured

In the United States, the record stands at 58. You can dance around that all you want but that's the record the last to would be shooters said they were going for.

And the actual record of people killed is by a rental truck in Nice, France......86...more than any mass shooter in the United States in 35 years of mass shootings.....and more than the entire count in every year of mass shootings except for 2017....

And lawn mowers have killed more people each year than mass shooters in the United States in the last 35 years except for 2017.....

Knives kill more people than all rifles do....and they murder more people every year than all mass shooting casualties in 35 years...over 1,600 people every single year versus 795 mass public shooting casualties over 35 years...

You have no rational argument for any of your demands on law abiding gun owners.

In the United States, the procurement of the materials to make that explosive device of that quantity would put you on the radar so fast it would make your head explode. The Exploding Van is a no go.

And we are talking about Mass Shootings in the US from 2007 and up. Stay focused for a change. And get that imagination in check. What can we do to either prevent or keep the body count down in the UNITED STATES for our Mass Shootings.

Nothing you have suggested would do anything to prevent criminals or mass shooters from doing whatever they want.

 

[WinterBorn]

The idea that one particular gun is inherently evil is ridiculous. The AR is not some weapon of mass slaughter. There are just under 10k murders a year (on average) where a firearm is used. All rifles combined total around 300. Handguns account for exponentially more murders. But the hype over ARs with this "Why do you want to murder children?" bullshit is insanity.

I liked my AR. It was fun at the range, useful in removing coyote, and a very accurate rifle. I replaced it after a few years, not because of some nonsense about saving children, but because I was offered an excellent price for it. I bought my current varmint gun and optics with some cash leftover.

It has to do with the Cult that adopted it as the weapon of choice. Let's face it, there are a few others out there as deadly but look less benign. But the "Cult" adopted the AR style and that is what is being used. You will note that the high body counts weren't being done when it was regulated like an automatic weapon. It was only after it was released that the cults started using it and the body count went up. You really can't argue with that one. We really can't do much about the "Cult" except to pick up the pieces afterwards but we can about their weapon of choice.

Rifles of any kind are used in about 2% of all murders the AR itself is used in even less than 2% of all murders

If the AR is , as you say, the weapon of choice for murderers then many more than less than 2% of all murders would be committed with the AR

You are skirting the fact that the AR is used for the Mass Shootings alone. It's the weapon of choice. A Student can't really have much of a Mass School Shooting with a handgun of any kind. Besides, the body count will not be high enough. He will be going for the record. And right now, that record is 58 dead. Some people see how many hoops they can shoot. Some see how many hamburgers they can eat. These sick puppies see how many people they can kill in the least amount of time. Unlike the other two, this is a one "Shot" thing so they plan to do it right the first time. So they pick the most capable weapon they can find and that is the AR and for the same reasons that it was adopted in the US Military. It's light, easy to handle, reliable, has just enough power to do the job, the ammo is light and you can carry a lot of it. Oh, and they think it looks cool. So they go for the record. Murdering 58 in a matter of minutes takes an almost genius to do it and these people think they are geniuses. Luckily, most are bagged before they can get into place. But it takes just a couple to get into place for them to go for the record. So we do what we can to minimize body counts. That's about all we can do before the fact.

"You are skirting the fact that the AR is used for the Mass Shootings alone. It's the weapon of choice. A Student can't really have much of a Mass School Shooting with a handgun of any kind"?? This shows you are a victim of the hysteria and media manipulation.

Just to clarify, the single deadliest school shooting we have had was accomplished by a man with 2 handguns. The man, with no training at all, murdered 32 people in 2 locations with a pair of handguns. The idea that the AR is somehow the "perfect killing machine" is nonsense. The VaTech shooter never would have been able to pull of the high body count with an AR. The concealability of handguns makes them far more useful to such a shooter than an AR.

As for them being a genius, that is nonsense. The Las Vegas shooter managed such a high body count, mainly, because of a bumpstock which allowed him to mimic a fully automatic weapon. The accuracy is crap. But when firing into crowds, accuracy is not an issue. Charles Whitman managed to kill 16 people, mostly with a bolt action rifle. One of the things that kept the body count from being much higher is that civilians started shooting back at Whitman before the police arrived.

In the last decade or so, there have been half a dozen mass or school shootings where an AR was used. There are an estimated 5 to 8 million of them owned by private citizens in the US. The rifle is not the problem.

You are missing the point. It's not about the weapon at all. It's about the body count. The last 2 would be shooters both stated that they were after the record. The Record stands at 58. You can't get that record with a Van, running a car into a crowd, shooting handguns and more. You can only get that record with mulitiple ARs with lots of ammo in a dense crowd of people. And where do you find that dense a crowd? It's about the body count. I don't expect you to understand that. But I imagine that any Grunt from Nam understands that. That is how each battle was reported. Not ground taken, but body counts usually. These sickos want to hold the record much like the kid going for the record for the most hoops shot without a miss. We understand and support the hoop shooter and support his fascination but his sport doesn't have a body count along with it. The sickos will keep trying to break the body count record and the only way they see to do it is with the AR. What is wrong with raising the age limit to buyiing an AR to 21 years since the ones that that keep doing the school shootings are under 21 for the most part. If you take away the easy access of the main tool that they think they need then you at least minimize the body count. And if you have an under 21 try and buy an AR, that is a red flag and the authorities can react to it and maybe stop a shooting all the way.

I have no problem with raising the age to 21 for semi-auto centerfire rifles. But if you think that will make a difference you have either been fooled by the people who want that or simply haven't done much research.

There have only been a handful of school or mass shootings with AR15s.

The Parkland shooter would likely have had to find another way to get his rifle or use another type of gun. Although, contrary to what you seem to think, that may not have changed the body count. The shooter at the VaTech mass shooting (age 23) killed 32 people with a pair of semi-auto handguns. And he had had no training.

The Sandy Hook shooter was 20 years old. But he did not buy the guns he used. They belonged to his mother, who was an avid shooter. So the age limit would not have changed that at all.

The shooter in the Aurora CO theater shooting was 25.

The shooter in the Pulse Nightclub shooting was 29.

The shooter at the Texas church was 26.

The shooter in Las Vegas was 64.

So of the shooters who killed more than 10 people with an AR, 2 were under 21 and 4 were over 21. And one of those under 21 did not buy the gun himself. So raising the age limit to 21 would have only stopped 1 of the shooters out of 6.

As for the body count, only the Las Vegas shooter killed more than the VaTech shooter did with a pair of handguns. You claim they can't get that record shooting handguns? And yet, 32 victims at VaTech show the AR is not the only way to get a high body count.

And while I despise the rankings of murders by body counts, the highest murder body count in a single event far exceeds anything done by an AR or any other shooting. Timothy McVeigh murdered 168 people without shooting a single one.


You have said several times that I do not understand or that I am ignoring the facts. The truth is, you are the one who does not understand and who ignores the facts. Your claims that high body counts are only possible with ARs is laughably false. Your claim that it is men under 21 who keep doing the shootings is wrong.

 

[WinterBorn]

Rifles of any kind are used in about 2% of all murders the AR itself is used in even less than 2% of all murders

If the AR is , as you say, the weapon of choice for murderers then many more than less than 2% of all murders would be committed with the AR

You are skirting the fact that the AR is used for the Mass Shootings alone. It's the weapon of choice. A Student can't really have much of a Mass School Shooting with a handgun of any kind. Besides, the body count will not be high enough. He will be going for the record. And right now, that record is 58 dead. Some people see how many hoops they can shoot. Some see how many hamburgers they can eat. These sick puppies see how many people they can kill in the least amount of time. Unlike the other two, this is a one "Shot" thing so they plan to do it right the first time. So they pick the most capable weapon they can find and that is the AR and for the same reasons that it was adopted in the US Military. It's light, easy to handle, reliable, has just enough power to do the job, the ammo is light and you can carry a lot of it. Oh, and they think it looks cool. So they go for the record. Murdering 58 in a matter of minutes takes an almost genius to do it and these people think they are geniuses. Luckily, most are bagged before they can get into place. But it takes just a couple to get into place for them to go for the record. So we do what we can to minimize body counts. That's about all we can do before the fact.

Not skirting anything I use murders which includes all those that occur in mass shootings.

Unlike you I don't think it's somehow worse to be killed in a ass shooting than outside of a mass shooting.

Once again, it is the hype and media manipulation that has people clamoring to ban a weapon that is used to murder so rarely.

In the last 10 years there have probably been an average of 10k gun related murders. Around 300 of those were committed by a rifle of any kind. But somehow, banning legal gun owners from owning an AR will "fix" everything.

---------------------------------------------------- the UN-Constitutional Gun Banners want the AR and similar Banned because they understand the efficiency and effectiveness of the AR and and other Guns [example M1A]. The goal is to NEUTER Americans same as most of the worlds people have been NEUTERED .

How about stop with the "Banned" BS. No one wants to ban the AR. Just regulate them. Make it so that you have to be 21 or older to purchase it. Make it so that you have to do a background check to purchase it no matter where you buy it. Reduce the mag size to 15 shots or less. Not Ban. Regulate. You Gun Nutbags just want to keep instilling fear. Well, Gunbag, we fear you more than the criminal.

While you may not have said you want the AR15 banned, don't pretend that there is not a major push for such a ban. Your claim that no one wants to ban the AR is either ignorant or an outright lie. I'll let you pick which.

 

[WinterBorn]

Rifles of any kind are used in about 2% of all murders the AR itself is used in even less than 2% of all murders

If the AR is , as you say, the weapon of choice for murderers then many more than less than 2% of all murders would be committed with the AR

You are skirting the fact that the AR is used for the Mass Shootings alone. It's the weapon of choice. A Student can't really have much of a Mass School Shooting with a handgun of any kind. Besides, the body count will not be high enough. He will be going for the record. And right now, that record is 58 dead. Some people see how many hoops they can shoot. Some see how many hamburgers they can eat. These sick puppies see how many people they can kill in the least amount of time. Unlike the other two, this is a one "Shot" thing so they plan to do it right the first time. So they pick the most capable weapon they can find and that is the AR and for the same reasons that it was adopted in the US Military. It's light, easy to handle, reliable, has just enough power to do the job, the ammo is light and you can carry a lot of it. Oh, and they think it looks cool. So they go for the record. Murdering 58 in a matter of minutes takes an almost genius to do it and these people think they are geniuses. Luckily, most are bagged before they can get into place. But it takes just a couple to get into place for them to go for the record. So we do what we can to minimize body counts. That's about all we can do before the fact.

"You are skirting the fact that the AR is used for the Mass Shootings alone. It's the weapon of choice. A Student can't really have much of a Mass School Shooting with a handgun of any kind"?? This shows you are a victim of the hysteria and media manipulation.

Just to clarify, the single deadliest school shooting we have had was accomplished by a man with 2 handguns. The man, with no training at all, murdered 32 people in 2 locations with a pair of handguns. The idea that the AR is somehow the "perfect killing machine" is nonsense. The VaTech shooter never would have been able to pull of the high body count with an AR. The concealability of handguns makes them far more useful to such a shooter than an AR.

As for them being a genius, that is nonsense. The Las Vegas shooter managed such a high body count, mainly, because of a bumpstock which allowed him to mimic a fully automatic weapon. The accuracy is crap. But when firing into crowds, accuracy is not an issue. Charles Whitman managed to kill 16 people, mostly with a bolt action rifle. One of the things that kept the body count from being much higher is that civilians started shooting back at Whitman before the police arrived.

In the last decade or so, there have been half a dozen mass or school shootings where an AR was used. There are an estimated 5 to 8 million of them owned by private citizens in the US. The rifle is not the problem.

You are missing the point. It's not about the weapon at all. It's about the body count. The last 2 would be shooters both stated that they were after the record. The Record stands at 58. You can't get that record with a Van, running a car into a crowd, shooting handguns and more. You can only get that record with mulitiple ARs with lots of ammo in a dense crowd of people. And where do you find that dense a crowd? It's about the body count. I don't expect you to understand that. But I imagine that any Grunt from Nam understands that. That is how each battle was reported. Not ground taken, but body counts usually. These sickos want to hold the record much like the kid going for the record for the most hoops shot without a miss. We understand and support the hoop shooter and support his fascination but his sport doesn't have a body count along with it. The sickos will keep trying to break the body count record and the only way they see to do it is with the AR. What is wrong with raising the age limit to buyiing an AR to 21 years since the ones that that keep doing the school shootings are under 21 for the most part. If you take away the easy access of the main tool that they think they need then you at least minimize the body count. And if you have an under 21 try and buy an AR, that is a red flag and the authorities can react to it and maybe stop a shooting all the way.

The average age of mass shooters, 33-34. So raising the age to 21 does nothing......and they can always get the gun illegally...you know, like the Columbine shooter, or the Sandy Hook shooter......did you try thinking before you posted?


No, you can surpass that record with a rental truck...

The Vegas shooter used 2 rifles, firing over 1,000 rounds of ammo into a tightly packed crowd of over 22,000 people from a concealed and fortified position.

He killed 58.

A muslim terrorist with a rental truck killed 86 in 5 minutes.

-------

Then you have this......in France where fully automatic rifles and 30 round magazines are already completely illegal, yet 7 terrorists on government terrorist watch lists, a few even convicted criminals, easily got the fully automatic rifles and 30 round magazines...

7 terrorists attacked the Bataclan concert and rampaged through Paris......using bombs too.....

And they murdered 130 people....they were each armed with fully automatic military rifles and 30 round magazines...all outlawed in France by the way...

130 divided by 7 = 18.57 people per rifle ( including killed by bombs, so technically they didn't even murder 18 with rifles...).... 413 injured

the one muslim attacker attacker using a rental truck murdered 86 people all by himself....

Even fully automatic military rifles with 30 round magazines are not as deadly as rental trucks.......

18.57 with fully automatic military rifles and 30 round magazines....( not all of the people were murdered with guns, they also used bombs.....)

86 with a rental truck... 458 injured

In the United States, the record stands at 58. You can dance around that all you want but that's the record the last to would be shooters said they were going for.

Then go for the shooters. That is where the problem lies.

 

[WinterBorn]

It has to do with the Cult that adopted it as the weapon of choice. Let's face it, there are a few others out there as deadly but look less benign. But the "Cult" adopted the AR style and that is what is being used. You will note that the high body counts weren't being done when it was regulated like an automatic weapon. It was only after it was released that the cults started using it and the body count went up. You really can't argue with that one. We really can't do much about the "Cult" except to pick up the pieces afterwards but we can about their weapon of choice.

Rifles of any kind are used in about 2% of all murders the AR itself is used in even less than 2% of all murders

If the AR is , as you say, the weapon of choice for murderers then many more than less than 2% of all murders would be committed with the AR

You are skirting the fact that the AR is used for the Mass Shootings alone. It's the weapon of choice. A Student can't really have much of a Mass School Shooting with a handgun of any kind. Besides, the body count will not be high enough. He will be going for the record. And right now, that record is 58 dead. Some people see how many hoops they can shoot. Some see how many hamburgers they can eat. These sick puppies see how many people they can kill in the least amount of time. Unlike the other two, this is a one "Shot" thing so they plan to do it right the first time. So they pick the most capable weapon they can find and that is the AR and for the same reasons that it was adopted in the US Military. It's light, easy to handle, reliable, has just enough power to do the job, the ammo is light and you can carry a lot of it. Oh, and they think it looks cool. So they go for the record. Murdering 58 in a matter of minutes takes an almost genius to do it and these people think they are geniuses. Luckily, most are bagged before they can get into place. But it takes just a couple to get into place for them to go for the record. So we do what we can to minimize body counts. That's about all we can do before the fact.

"You are skirting the fact that the AR is used for the Mass Shootings alone. It's the weapon of choice. A Student can't really have much of a Mass School Shooting with a handgun of any kind"?? This shows you are a victim of the hysteria and media manipulation.

Just to clarify, the single deadliest school shooting we have had was accomplished by a man with 2 handguns. The man, with no training at all, murdered 32 people in 2 locations with a pair of handguns. The idea that the AR is somehow the "perfect killing machine" is nonsense. The VaTech shooter never would have been able to pull of the high body count with an AR. The concealability of handguns makes them far more useful to such a shooter than an AR.

As for them being a genius, that is nonsense. The Las Vegas shooter managed such a high body count, mainly, because of a bumpstock which allowed him to mimic a fully automatic weapon. The accuracy is crap. But when firing into crowds, accuracy is not an issue. Charles Whitman managed to kill 16 people, mostly with a bolt action rifle. One of the things that kept the body count from being much higher is that civilians started shooting back at Whitman before the police arrived.

In the last decade or so, there have been half a dozen mass or school shootings where an AR was used. There are an estimated 5 to 8 million of them owned by private citizens in the US. The rifle is not the problem.

But the reason they put their energy into the AR-15 civilian rifle can already be seen........they now target it as a semi automatic weapon.....not just the old "assault weapon" tag they used to use. If they can ban the AR-15 civilian rifle because it is a semi automatic rifle, they can come back and demand all semi automatic weapons be banned, which they screamed for at the CNN Townhall and at the D.C. march......

There you go with the term "Ban" again. Start using the term "Regulate" and you won't sound like a complete idiot and maybe we might listen to you a bit more.

Perhaps you need to get a bit more information before you start correcting people. You have posted nonsense already.

Maybe this will help:

Florida senate approved AR-15 ban for 15 minutes before rescinding it

Highlights: Students Call for Action Across Nation; Florida Lawmakers Fail to Take Up Assault Rifle Bill

Gubernatorial candidate Dennis Kucinich calls for statewide ban on AR-15-style weapons

White House steps up push for assault weapons ban

Feinstein renews effort to ban assault weapons

Rep. Payne, Jr. Joins Push for Assault Weapons Ban | Congressman Donald Payne, Jr.

Interfaith leaders, youths to push for assault rifle ban



So spare us your claims that no one is pushing for a ban. I said before that your claim was made out of ignorance or as an outright lie. Now you have been educated. So future claims will simply be a lie.

 

[WinterBorn]

You are missing the point. It's not about the weapon at all. It's about the body count. The last 2 would be shooters both stated that they were after the record. The Record stands at 58. You can't get that record with a Van, running a car into a crowd, shooting handguns and more. You can only get that record with mulitiple ARs with lots of ammo in a dense crowd of people. And where do you find that dense a crowd? It's about the body count. I don't expect you to understand that. But I imagine that any Grunt from Nam understands that. That is how each battle was reported. Not ground taken, but body counts usually. These sickos want to hold the record much like the kid going for the record for the most hoops shot without a miss. We understand and support the hoop shooter and support his fascination but his sport doesn't have a body count along with it. The sickos will keep trying to break the body count record and the only way they see to do it is with the AR. What is wrong with raising the age limit to buyiing an AR to 21 years since the ones that that keep doing the school shootings are under 21 for the most part. If you take away the easy access of the main tool that they think they need then you at least minimize the body count. And if you have an under 21 try and buy an AR, that is a red flag and the authorities can react to it and maybe stop a shooting all the way.

The average age of mass shooters, 33-34. So raising the age to 21 does nothing......and they can always get the gun illegally...you know, like the Columbine shooter, or the Sandy Hook shooter......did you try thinking before you posted?


No, you can surpass that record with a rental truck...

The Vegas shooter used 2 rifles, firing over 1,000 rounds of ammo into a tightly packed crowd of over 22,000 people from a concealed and fortified position.

He killed 58.

A muslim terrorist with a rental truck killed 86 in 5 minutes.

-------

Then you have this......in France where fully automatic rifles and 30 round magazines are already completely illegal, yet 7 terrorists on government terrorist watch lists, a few even convicted criminals, easily got the fully automatic rifles and 30 round magazines...

7 terrorists attacked the Bataclan concert and rampaged through Paris......using bombs too.....

And they murdered 130 people....they were each armed with fully automatic military rifles and 30 round magazines...all outlawed in France by the way...

130 divided by 7 = 18.57 people per rifle ( including killed by bombs, so technically they didn't even murder 18 with rifles...).... 413 injured

the one muslim attacker attacker using a rental truck murdered 86 people all by himself....

Even fully automatic military rifles with 30 round magazines are not as deadly as rental trucks.......

18.57 with fully automatic military rifles and 30 round magazines....( not all of the people were murdered with guns, they also used bombs.....)

86 with a rental truck... 458 injured

In the United States, the record stands at 58. You can dance around that all you want but that's the record the last to would be shooters said they were going for.

And the actual record of people killed is by a rental truck in Nice, France......86...more than any mass shooter in the United States in 35 years of mass shootings.....and more than the entire count in every year of mass shootings except for 2017....

And lawn mowers have killed more people each year than mass shooters in the United States in the last 35 years except for 2017.....

Knives kill more people than all rifles do....and they murder more people every year than all mass shooting casualties in 35 years...over 1,600 people every single year versus 795 mass public shooting casualties over 35 years...

You have no rational argument for any of your demands on law abiding gun owners.

In the United States, the procurement of the materials to make that explosive device of that quantity would put you on the radar so fast it would make your head explode. The Exploding Van is a no go.

And we are talking about Mass Shootings in the US from 2007 and up. Stay focused for a change. And get that imagination in check. What can we do to either prevent or keep the body count down in the UNITED STATES for our Mass Shootings.

Stop supplying SSRI's (antidepressants) to those under the age of 21 would be ONE HULLUVA START.

Thank you!! Its funny how the actual lunatics are never responsible. Blame goes to an inanimate object.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Rifles of any kind are used in about 2% of all murders the AR itself is used in even less than 2% of all murders

If the AR is , as you say, the weapon of choice for murderers then many more than less than 2% of all murders would be committed with the AR

You are skirting the fact that the AR is used for the Mass Shootings alone. It's the weapon of choice. A Student can't really have much of a Mass School Shooting with a handgun of any kind. Besides, the body count will not be high enough. He will be going for the record. And right now, that record is 58 dead. Some people see how many hoops they can shoot. Some see how many hamburgers they can eat. These sick puppies see how many people they can kill in the least amount of time. Unlike the other two, this is a one "Shot" thing so they plan to do it right the first time. So they pick the most capable weapon they can find and that is the AR and for the same reasons that it was adopted in the US Military. It's light, easy to handle, reliable, has just enough power to do the job, the ammo is light and you can carry a lot of it. Oh, and they think it looks cool. So they go for the record. Murdering 58 in a matter of minutes takes an almost genius to do it and these people think they are geniuses. Luckily, most are bagged before they can get into place. But it takes just a couple to get into place for them to go for the record. So we do what we can to minimize body counts. That's about all we can do before the fact.

Not skirting anything I use murders which includes all those that occur in mass shootings.

Unlike you I don't think it's somehow worse to be killed in a ass shooting than outside of a mass shooting.

Once again, it is the hype and media manipulation that has people clamoring to ban a weapon that is used to murder so rarely.

In the last 10 years there have probably been an average of 10k gun related murders. Around 300 of those were committed by a rifle of any kind. But somehow, banning legal gun owners from owning an AR will "fix" everything.

---------------------------------------------------- the UN-Constitutional Gun Banners want the AR and similar Banned because they understand the efficiency and effectiveness of the AR and and other Guns [example M1A]. The goal is to NEUTER Americans same as most of the worlds people have been NEUTERED .

How about stop with the "Banned" BS. No one wants to ban the AR. Just regulate them. Make it so that you have to be 21 or older to purchase it. Make it so that you have to do a background check to purchase it no matter where you buy it. Reduce the mag size to 15 shots or less. Not Ban. Regulate. You Gun Nutbags just want to keep instilling fear. Well, Gunbag, we fear you more than the criminal.

You keep saying there is no intent to ban.

If you make a law nobody can have an AR until the age of 21, you did ban that weapon from them.

If you make a law for a 15 round magazine maximum, you did ban all higher capacity magazines.

You can't have "regulation" without banning something.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

The idea that one particular gun is inherently evil is ridiculous. The AR is not some weapon of mass slaughter. There are just under 10k murders a year (on average) where a firearm is used. All rifles combined total around 300. Handguns account for exponentially more murders. But the hype over ARs with this "Why do you want to murder children?" bullshit is insanity.

I liked my AR. It was fun at the range, useful in removing coyote, and a very accurate rifle. I replaced it after a few years, not because of some nonsense about saving children, but because I was offered an excellent price for it. I bought my current varmint gun and optics with some cash leftover.

It has to do with the Cult that adopted it as the weapon of choice. Let's face it, there are a few others out there as deadly but look less benign. But the "Cult" adopted the AR style and that is what is being used. You will note that the high body counts weren't being done when it was regulated like an automatic weapon. It was only after it was released that the cults started using it and the body count went up. You really can't argue with that one. We really can't do much about the "Cult" except to pick up the pieces afterwards but we can about their weapon of choice.

Rifles of any kind are used in about 2% of all murders the AR itself is used in even less than 2% of all murders

If the AR is , as you say, the weapon of choice for murderers then many more than less than 2% of all murders would be committed with the AR

You are skirting the fact that the AR is used for the Mass Shootings alone. It's the weapon of choice. A Student can't really have much of a Mass School Shooting with a handgun of any kind. Besides, the body count will not be high enough. He will be going for the record. And right now, that record is 58 dead. Some people see how many hoops they can shoot. Some see how many hamburgers they can eat. These sick puppies see how many people they can kill in the least amount of time. Unlike the other two, this is a one "Shot" thing so they plan to do it right the first time. So they pick the most capable weapon they can find and that is the AR and for the same reasons that it was adopted in the US Military. It's light, easy to handle, reliable, has just enough power to do the job, the ammo is light and you can carry a lot of it. Oh, and they think it looks cool. So they go for the record. Murdering 58 in a matter of minutes takes an almost genius to do it and these people think they are geniuses. Luckily, most are bagged before they can get into place. But it takes just a couple to get into place for them to go for the record. So we do what we can to minimize body counts. That's about all we can do before the fact.

"You are skirting the fact that the AR is used for the Mass Shootings alone. It's the weapon of choice. A Student can't really have much of a Mass School Shooting with a handgun of any kind"?? This shows you are a victim of the hysteria and media manipulation.

Just to clarify, the single deadliest school shooting we have had was accomplished by a man with 2 handguns. The man, with no training at all, murdered 32 people in 2 locations with a pair of handguns. The idea that the AR is somehow the "perfect killing machine" is nonsense. The VaTech shooter never would have been able to pull of the high body count with an AR. The concealability of handguns makes them far more useful to such a shooter than an AR.

As for them being a genius, that is nonsense. The Las Vegas shooter managed such a high body count, mainly, because of a bumpstock which allowed him to mimic a fully automatic weapon. The accuracy is crap. But when firing into crowds, accuracy is not an issue. Charles Whitman managed to kill 16 people, mostly with a bolt action rifle. One of the things that kept the body count from being much higher is that civilians started shooting back at Whitman before the police arrived.

In the last decade or so, there have been half a dozen mass or school shootings where an AR was used. There are an estimated 5 to 8 million of them owned by private citizens in the US. The rifle is not the problem.

You are missing the point. It's not about the weapon at all. It's about the body count. The last 2 would be shooters both stated that they were after the record. The Record stands at 58. You can't get that record with a Van, running a car into a crowd, shooting handguns and more. You can only get that record with mulitiple ARs with lots of ammo in a dense crowd of people. And where do you find that dense a crowd? It's about the body count. I don't expect you to understand that. But I imagine that any Grunt from Nam understands that. That is how each battle was reported. Not ground taken, but body counts usually. These sickos want to hold the record much like the kid going for the record for the most hoops shot without a miss. We understand and support the hoop shooter and support his fascination but his sport doesn't have a body count along with it. The sickos will keep trying to break the body count record and the only way they see to do it is with the AR. What is wrong with raising the age limit to buyiing an AR to 21 years since the ones that that keep doing the school shootings are under 21 for the most part. If you take away the easy access of the main tool that they think they need then you at least minimize the body count. And if you have an under 21 try and buy an AR, that is a red flag and the authorities can react to it and maybe stop a shooting all the way.

Okay, so if we make these restrictions you suggest, and the next mass killer only kills 23 people instead of 33, would you consider that acceptable?