World Wide Civil Unrest - World War III?

[LibocalypseNow]

No.

 

[Bill Angel]

So what is it? We're supporting the Egyptian government? We're supporting the uprising?
...
So are we making the same mistake now by undercutting the existing leadership of Egypt in hopes a democratic government will be installed? Or are the headlines suggesting we back the current leadership correct? If the current leadership is ousted, history suggests that we may wind up with a worse devil unfriendly to the U.S. and hostile to Israel.

No wonder the world is watching with horror and intense interest.

Since 1948 the USA has contributed 70 Billion dollars in foreign aid to Egypt.
It's stunning to think it's possible that a change of regime in Egypt (in the near future) could lead to a repudiation of the total US investment/assistance to that country.

 

[CoolBreeze]

End of timer? No it is not the end of thim, it is the beginning of a new age. What we are witnessing are the birth pangs. However, there will be harder times than we are experiancing now before it gets better. ythose who survive will be the ones who reconize the signs and are able to prepare themselves. The ubrest has not started here yet but it will. Witht the massive debt that the government has accumilated and can not pay back, the will start cutting services. First the powers will start laying off police and fire services, than social services and social security. The worst things get the more the government will cut and the more they cut the worst it will get. The only ones that will be protected and have anything are the politicians, becayse they will be the only ones with the money to purchase what they need.

 

[Trajan]

Axelrod: Obama 'Directly Confronted' Mubarak for Past 2 Years 'To Get Ahead of This'...

he did? I was wondering when the re-modeling would begin.

Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:00am EDT

WASHINGTON Aug 18 (Reuters) - Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak visits Washington this week for the first time in six years for talks with U.S. President Barack Obama, who hopes to restart the Middle East peace process.

Here are some questions and answers about Mubarak's visit to the U.S. capital.

WHAT IS THE SIGNIFICANCE OF THE VISIT?

The visit is expected to warm Cairo's already improving relations with Washington, as the Obama administration looks to Egypt to help his push toward an Israeli-Palestinian peace plan and grapples with Iran's growing influence in the Middle East.

Egypt is a staunch regional ally of the United States, which has provided it with billions of dollars of military and other aid since it became the first Arab state to sign a peace deal with Israel in 1979.

But relations were chilled during the administration of Obama's predecessor, George W. Bush, over Bush's Middle East policies, invasion of Iraq and criticism of Egypt's human rights record.

Mubarak contrasts Obama favorably with Bush and the two leaders will now have met three times in as many months. On Tuesday, Obama holds a private meeting with Mubarak in the Oval Office, then an expanded meeting and a working lunch.

more at-

Q+A-Egypt's Mubarak visits Washington | Reuters

 

[Samson]

So what is it? We're supporting the Egyptian government? We're supporting the uprising?
...
So are we making the same mistake now by undercutting the existing leadership of Egypt in hopes a democratic government will be installed? Or are the headlines suggesting we back the current leadership correct? If the current leadership is ousted, history suggests that we may wind up with a worse devil unfriendly to the U.S. and hostile to Israel.

No wonder the world is watching with horror and intense interest.

Since 1948 the USA has contributed 70 Billion dollars in foreign aid to Egypt.
It's stunning to think it's possible that a change of regime in Egypt (in the near future) could lead to a repudiation of the total US investment/assistance to that country.

Yes who would have imagined that our government could waste so much money.

 

[EriktheRed]

A review of history in the early 20th century shows general civil unrest.

Widespread unemployment, unstable money supplies and other resources, and general disatisfaction with unresponsive authoritarian government led to increasing pockets of unrest in Europe, most especially Germany, in the Communist countries, and led to overthrow of governments resulting in even more oppressive regime seizing power. Economies were destablized; currencies were put at risk; and opportunistic nations looked for ways to capitalize on the unrest.

Result: World War I and World War II.

Now we see riots in Barcelona, in France, growing unrest in the UK, in Albania, and now in the Middle East with widespread government protests in Egypt and Jordan who, not insignificantly, are the only allies Israel has in that area.

Today oil is rising drastically and the markets are plunging as investors scramble to protect their assets in the fact of a possible civil war in Egypt alone.

And we have North Korea, China, Iran, Venezuela, and a few other places, all friendly to each other, and none the true friend of the Western World possibly looking for ways to capitalize on the unrest. Certainly Hamas and Hezbollah are watching and will likely make a move if they feel that world attention is diverted from Israel.

Are we moving to the brink of World War III?

World War III will come and its will be much different than the 3 previous ones. Its will be Islam vs Christianity! I see it starting Europe, including Russia. There is a ginormous culture clash between the Native European and Muslims. Its the worst in Russia.
(1) Russia:
25% and growing by leaps and bounds are Muslim in Russia. Ethnic violence is increasing 10 fold, esp with every Chechan terrorist attack. When Muslim population gets to 40% would could be as early as 2025. Serbian/Kosovo style genocidal war will be underway. The West, including America will sit by and allows this condemning it from the sidelines, because they don't want to risk a nuclear war with Russia. Muslims around the world will be outraged. Russia who is has more than enough oil reserves can't be effected by an oil embargo. In fact, Europe is reliant on them for oil and natural gas.

(2) China:
For a while China has wanted to get rid of their pain in the butt Muslim separatist. Seeing how the West including the US did nothing to Russia. Then start their own ethnic cleansing campaign.

(3) Europe:
The Muslim world gets more radical. They start to blame all Europeans for the slaughter of Muslims in Russia and China. They demand more thinks like Sharia law. Ethnic violence becomes rambid..

(4) Muslims Nuclear Sneak Attack:
Islamofacist develop nukes with the assistance of Pakistan, Nuclear Iran, Iraq, Turkey, Jordan, Libya, Tunsia, Saudi Arabia and Egypt (all these countries developed the bomb after Iran was allowed to develop one in 2012). Nuclear suicide bombs smack the West, China and Russia hard!

(5) Then the War is on

Maybe you can hook up with this guy:


Michigan Cops: Army Vet Threatened Mosques At Bar, Found With Explosives Outside Islamic Center | TPMMuckraker

 

[Foxfyre]

Non sequitur much, Erik?

It was interesting watching some of the commentary from Hillary Clinton to John Bolton and others who are in the midst of this situation or who have special expertise in evaluating it.

Even some of the mainstream media is now looking at some right moves made by President Bush--some the same moves our apologist in chief apologized for on his worldwide apology tour in 2009.

The Investors' Daily isn't a 100% objective source, but here they are condensing the rhetoric I am hearing bits and pieces from in a lot of places the last couple of days:

Editorial: Will Obama Lose Egypt?
01/28/2011

An Ally Imperiled: What Egyptians are demonstrating against, whether they know it or not, is socialism. What they — and we — could end up with is another Iran. Is President Obama repeating Carter's Shah betrayal?

Revolutions are like fires. They can make life better, or they can destroy.

Three decades ago, Iran — after being saved from Soviet dominance by the U.S. in 1953 — traded in the flawed autocratic rule of the Shah for the bloodthirsty Islamist fanaticism of the Ayatollah Khomeini.

At the time, Jimmy Carter's presidency was, in the name of "human rights," on the side of the Islamists — with U.N. Ambassador Andrew Young going so far as to call Khomeini "some kind of saint."

Does the Obama administration realize the difference between freedom-based revolutions and violent overthrows that will help jihadists?

In 2009, the Egyptian daily Almasry Alyoum reported that President Obama secretly met in Washington that year with representatives of Egypt's jihadist Muslim Brotherhood, the Hamas ally that, while banned, dominates the opposition in the country.

Obama also chose Egypt as the locale for his ill-conceived Muslim outreach speech in June 2009.

As Newsweek's Jonathan Alter points out in his White House-friendly book on the president's first year, "The Promise," "Obama never said the words 'terrorism,' 'terrorist,' or 'war on terror'" in the speech, because "the t-word had become inflammatory to Muslims" and the "faster way to the hearts and minds of a Muslim audience was to talk about the tensions between Islam and the West in a different key."

Bet the president didn't think he was planting the seeds of today's protests in Egypt. But what does he expect when he goes to a country in a decades-long police-enforced state of emergency, with tens of thousands of political prisoners, and announces that "you must maintain your power through consent, not coercion"?

He may have awakened a sleeping giant. Too bad the Iranian people didn't receive the same favor a year and a half ago when they were protesting in the streets against a regime that makes Egypt look Jeffersonian by comparison.
More here:
Editorial: Will Obama Lose Egypt? - Investors.com

Because a huge percentage of crude oil passes through the Suez Canal in order to avoid the alternate 10,000 mile trip to the West, unrest in Egypt or anywhere in the Middle East that could threaten that waterway always sends oil prices higher. We're looking at possible $100/barrel oil this week and corresponding $4/gallon gasoline.

But most importantly, Egypt is the strongest Arab ally the USA and the West and Israel have in the Middle East, If it goes the way of Iran and becomes hostile to the West and/or Irsael, the possibility of war is escalated.

Will Obama make the same mistake Carter made and lose Egypt as Carter lost Iran?

 

[Foxfyre]

The mess in Egypt and elsewhere has been somewhat eclipsed by the big storm today, but nevertheless the beat goes on via headlines from Drudge today:

Mubarak vows to hang on until election...

TODAY: 'Obama urges Mubarak not to run again'...

SUNDAY: Hillary says 'We're not advocating any specific outcome'...

Muslim B'hood: 'Prepare for war with Israel'...

Netanyahu fears Islamist takeover...

Fistfights, police demanding bribes at jammed Cairo airport...

'It's an absolute zoo'...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tunisia synagogue set on fire by arsonists...
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IMF WARNS OF WAR...

This really is a big deal everybody, because if ANYBODY attacks Israel and Israel asks for help, we are bound by treaty to assist.

And then it is anybody's guess who - or how many nations - would become involved.

 

[Ropey]

I keep saying that the possibility could be quite good. These are young and intelligent people who have to spend almost half their income (if they work) for food.

This is why Mubaraks new appointee mentioned grain lines. I see a very good chance for a secular outcome. Look at all the reporters. Look at the place.

It looks very good to this old man.

 

[Foxfyre]

I keep saying that the possibility could be quite good. These are young and intelligent people who have to spend almost half their income (if they work) for food.

This is why Mubaraks new appointee mentioned grain lines. I see a very good chance for a secular outcome. Look at all the reporters. Look at the place.

It looks very good to this old man.

I hope you're right Ropey.

This morning there were mixed messages coming out of Egypt, but the scuttlebutt was that Mubarek had agreed to go ahead and step down. And he would turn the government over to a high ranking group in the military rather than to anybody in the existing government? This is very much in opposition to the Egyptian constitution.

So it's anybody's guess what it means if this in fact happens.

 

[rikules]

Well, if one believes in the Bible, then we are headed towards a very distinct future that has been spoken of already.

And with each year that passes, more and more of those thousands year old speakings become reality. Left wing atheists still deny this. Yet, predicted events keep becoming real history.

that's some god you've got....

KNOWS that the world is going to fall apart

KNOWS that millions/billions will suffer and die


yet won't lift a finger to help?


what is he, too busy helping green bay beat pittsburgh to bother with death and destruction?

what an irresponsible lazy shiftless ruthless rotten god you've got

I hope he burns in his own hell

 

[Foxfyre]

If ya'll could fight out the God issue on some other thread, I would really, REALLY appreciate it.

Meanwhile, I'm going to keep bumping this thread until the crisis passes or we move to the next phase, whichever comes first.

According to experts on TV tonight--and I do question whether some of them know any more than anybody else re this stuff--tomorrow will be the day it all comes to a head one way or the other.

The question is, if the people physically threaten those in government, will the military side with them? Or with the government.

 

[Foxfyre]

Okay, as of this morning, the Egyptian military has accomplished a mostly bloodless coup, or at least Mubarek has relinquished the reins of government to military leaders.

The early announcements have been that those military leaders pledge to honor the peace treaty with Israel. But as we have seen again and again, 'early announcements' often turn out to be not all that reliable.

The Muslim Brotherhood is still there and is not ruled out as a factor in the next elections whether those will be in September as previously planned or will be stepped up due to circumstances.

I wish I felt we were out of the woods on this one. But I don't have much confidence yet.

 

[BenMarbleMD]

FYI-WWIII is a HOLY WAR with the JudeoChristians vs. Islam and it began on 091101

 

[Foxfyre]

FYI-WWIII is a HOLY WAR with the JudeoChristians vs. Islam and it began on 091101

That perhaps is a component in the worldwide unrest that we seem to be experiencing. Maybe it has always been this way with parts of the world in disarray and in turmoil--maybe we just get faster and better news reporting now, but it just seems to be more widespread.

I am not convinced that the Egypt situation is resolved yet. And now there are protests in Iran again.

For good? Or not?

I'm watching.

 

[Foxfyre]

Today. . . .

Protesters are still milling around in Egypt wondering what happens next.
New protests in Bahrain and Tehran.
A mini war of its own brewing in Wisconsin has the media's full attention today.

 

[GHook93]

FYI-WWIII is a HOLY WAR with the JudeoChristians vs. Islam and it began on 091101

I think Ben is right. I think 9/11 was the starting point. But it will get to full out war over the next 10 years. The ever growing Muslim minority throughout Europe, Russia and India are becoming more belligerent! The Arab nations with moderate yet corrupt leaders are getting tossed out and will soon be replaced with Islamic Iranian type leaders. Soon Iran will get the bomb. Shortly after that Egypt, Turkey, Ironically Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Yemen, Libya, Algeria, Morocco etc will have the bomb.

The Muslims minority in Europe, Russia, China and India will keep screaming we are being repressed. We are being repressed. It won't be time before one of these rogue Muslim nations gives the bomb to a sleeper cell in Europe, Russia, China or India and then bomb! I just hope obama is NOT the President when the first bomb goes off!

 

[Foxfyre]

So if we go with the perception that WWIII is to be a radical Islamofacist Muslim war against the rest of us, who wins?

And which side do peaceful Muslims join, if any?

 

[GHook93]

So if we go with the perception that WWIII is to be a radical Islamofacist Muslim war against the rest of us, who wins?

The West of course!

And which side do peaceful Muslims join, if any?

Which side did the peaceful Germans and Japanese fight on?

Athough this war will be different it will be a Holy War!

 

[Ropey]

I hope and pray that the Egyptians concentrate on raising living standards, raising employment and enjoying freedoms.

Yet the problem remains, that there is no money for improving the economy and there is more likely to be frustration than prosperity. Middle East governments that cannot deliver the goods provide scapegoats instead.

I pray, but I see the works on the ground. Right now, it's movement all over. Saudi Arabia sees the Shia in Yemen and Bahrain creating a crab-like encroachment and is heavily in motion in the arena. As is Iran who is also on the move. Iran has been somewhat shackled in attack outside of its borders, but now it's got some real free rein in the arena and I believe weapons in Syria are now being transferred to Lebanon.

Israel is in between a Shia and Sunni Movement. This is why Sunni Man is against the Bahrain uprising and the Yemeni uprising.

That's the Shia majority (Iran) in both countries and in a Democracy, that's the end of Sunni control of both countries. Iran still has a seat in its parliament for the 'recalcitrant' Bahrain to re-enter.

So, a world war? Not to my view. A middle east war? Likely sooner or later something will erupt now that the controls are off the spigots and the vast population increases in the last thirty years of Western payments can not be supported by the Arab countries.

Why no problems in Syria?

Syria’s population is predominantly Sunni, but the backbone of the regime is drawn from the minority Alawite community, an offshoot of the Shiite sect. Many do not know this. Deaths will come swiftly to any uprising there. This is why Iran and Syria are partners.