Why Is Merely POINTING OUT Racism Worse Than ACTUAL Racism To So Many on The Right??

[catzmeow]

Great points.

I'd like to invite you to visit Harlem, NY and/or Williamsburg, NY (in Brooklyn) Lots of whites there.

Your post illustrates the various manifestations of racism as it relates to the South and the North...interesting.

I think NYC and its surrounding borroughs is kind of an exception to the general rule. NYC is just a melting pot, all over the place.

What I'm thinking about, primarily, are the rust belt cities, like Pittsburgh, or Cleveland, or Detroit, or areas with heavily segregated neighborhoods, like Boston or Philly.

Those places REALLY have their struggles with race, and they go on ALL THE TIME.

 

[Ravi]

"Southern Pride" Why am I thinking code phrase here?

Probably because you're a yankee who's never lived in the south.

I'm in the South. I believe it's a dog-whistle, aka "code phrase," for many.

Ditto.

 

[gallantwarrior]

I'm in the South. I believe it's a dog-whistle, aka "code phrase," for many.

Oh, I agree. It is for a certain percentage of people. But, so are code words like "Kenyan" and "Birth Certificate." The only people who appear to fixate on those terms are people who deeply resent having a black president.

However, taken as a stand alone statement, I don't believe it can accurately be used to determine what someone thinks about race. In fact, I'm generally inclined to cut people some degree of slack unless what they say is clear and overt...such as saying that "groups of blacks should be avoided." That's pretty clearly a racist statement. Southern pride...not so much.

At least where I live, there's a lot of hoopla about "Girls Raised in the South" (GRITS) and other southernisms.

I actually think that racism is less prevalent in my city than it is in a lot of places I've lived and worked. Here, when you see it, it tends to be overt, and not covert at all. But, I think that in my community, at least, it's more of an economic/class thing than it is a racial thing. People are bigoted (in fairly equal measure) against low class blacks and low class whites. And, People seem fairly supportive of black professionals and middle or upper income black families.

For instance, my city is 70% white, and but we have a black mayor, black police chief, and plenty of other black officials, including a ton of black principals and other administrators in predominantly white neighborhoods. I don't believe that the average racist down here would vote for a black mayor, truth be told, but in our last election, both candidates for mayor were black. You don't see that as much up north. You don't see black mayors...except in predominantly black communities. You don't see black chiefs...except in predominantly black communities.

It's a critical difference between the North and the South. Northerners tend to talk a good game about being non-racist, but they don't vote for black leaders and they don't want to live in integrated neighborhoods like we do down here.

Great points.

I'd like to invite you to visit Harlem, NY and/or Williamsburg, NY (in Brooklyn) Lots of whites there.

Your post illustrates the various manifestations of racism as it relates to the South and the North...interesting.

While they may be great points, they still ignore a significant part of racism, I.e. Whites are not the only group that may be racist. Where's the discussion about how racism is addressed when it raises it's ugly head in say, a black community?

 

[Rocko]

Probably because you're a yankee who's never lived in the south.

I'm in the South. I believe it's a dog-whistle, aka "code phrase," for many.

Ditto.

You say that because you are racist, who tries to compensate. Start being truthful, and maybe you'll be cured of your terrible affliction.

 

[Rocko]

Probably because you're a yankee who's never lived in the south.

I'm in the South. I believe it's a dog-whistle, aka "code phrase," for many.

Another butt-hurt RWer that's obsessed w/rep...

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fucking moron!

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I don't care about rep that much, but I know you do. That's why you always post your negs- hopeful for some sympathy reps.

Some of the dumbest and cruel people on this board have high rep. You're an example of the dumbest.

 

[Ravi]

I'm in the South. I believe it's a dog-whistle, aka "code phrase," for many.

Ditto.

You say that because you are racist, who tries to compensate. Start being truthful, and maybe you'll be cured of your terrible affliction.

I say it because I live in the South and Southern Pride has always been a code phrase.

It makes me laugh though, since I can't quite figure out why the South is proud of being traitorous losers.

 

[catzmeow]

While they may be great points, they still ignore a significant part of racism, I.e. Whites are not the only group that may be racist. Where's the discussion about how racism is addressed when it raises it's ugly head in say, a black community?

My husband owns a home in a 95% black neighborhood here (mostly blue-collar working class folks). He lived there for 3 years before we got married. His neighbors have been exceptionally pleasant to us. We've basically gutted and rehabbed the house from the floor up, including new wiring, plumbing, roof, drywall, etc. I don't think there's been a day we've been working when one of his neighbors hasn't either walked by or stopped by to say, "Hi" and ask us how the project has been going, and tell us how hard they've seen us working. Usually, they tell him how lucky he is to have me (when I'm all covered with dirt or paint, or have been up on the roof all day). They've brought him food from their gardens, watched his home when he's TDY for the military, called him when he had a burglary (several homes in the neighborhood were hit), and basically...acted like neighbors act.

Can you imagine it?

Personally, I've worked in predominantly black communities for a number of years. I've experienced a few isolated instances of racist comments (a few people have made a couple of stupid comments during training I've conducted, about my race, but in every case, have been chastized by their own co-workers for being idiots).

However, the overwhelming majority of people I've worked with, who are a mix of agency professionals and residents, have been incredibly warm and inviting to me. They've met me for dinner, invited me to their homes, and been extremely appreciative of the work I've done for them. I've shopped in neighborhood grocery stores, eaten in neighborhood restaurants, bought gas at neighborhood filling stations, etc. I've worked there in the daytime, and I've worked there at night. Zero problems of any significance. ZERO.

And, these are generally high crime areas.

So, what really makes me go, "hmmmm?" is the implication that black folks routinely mistreat white folks. I probably spend ten times as much time as the average white person does in predominantly black neighborhoods, and I've never been mistreated. I've gotten lost, and had to stop for directions. I've gone out and met with people in their homes. I've walked down neighborhood streets and talked to residents.

In general, people EVERYWHERE (white, black, and brown) have been polite to me, they smile at me, they talk to me, they make little jokes and I joke back. No one has ever stolen from me, threatened me, screamed at me, made rude comments, or anything of the like. And, I'm a woman. I'm a blond, petite woman with big boobs. So trust me, if someone was going to make a rude comment, I'm the perfect target.

I really don't know where you people spend your time that you have this impression that black harassment of whites is routine. It certainly hasn't been, for me, but then, I'm pretty pleasant in real life.

 

[catzmeow]

I say it because I live in the South and Southern Pride has always been a code phrase.

It makes me laugh though, since I can't quite figure out why the South is proud of being traitorous losers.

It is for some people, not necessarily all of them. I guess I try to give people the benefit of the doubt unless they're being overt. I frankly don't have time to figure it out, most of the time.

As far as Southern pride goes...people are proud of their roots. I get that. A lot of folks make assumptions on the basis of a person having an accent (I've seen it in action, because I have an extremely country-sounding accent), or being from the South. They assume that all Southerners are backwardass rednecks from BFE who are practicallly illiterate, live in trailers, and marry their cousins.

I mean, I've had people up north treat me like I'm a retarded child because of my accent. They usually figure out pretty quick that I'm not stupid merely because I sound southern. But, definitely, it's a prevailing assumption that isn't at all uncommon.

Hell, when I hear that someone is from Mississippi or Alabama or Arkansas, I make assumptions, too. Because, frankly, there are a lot of backward ass folks from those places, and I've encountered a ton of them.

It's not really that different from the Pittsburghers I've worked with who are super proud of being Pittsburghers, and have their little "Pittsburgherisms."

 

[Rocko]

Ditto.

You say that because you are racist, who tries to compensate. Start being truthful, and maybe you'll be cured of your terrible affliction.

I say it because I live in the South and Southern Pride has always been a code phrase.

It makes me laugh though, since I can't quite figure out why the South is proud of being traitorous losers.

Save the bullshit for yourself, because that's the only person your are convincing.


Just because one states they are proud of where they're from doesn't mean they are racist. They don't have to be proud of the South because of the racial history. You're really promoting ignorance and bias.

 

[Oldstyle]

Good to see that you're still playing the race card for all you're worth, Marc!

Funny how Barack Obama was going to be the President who fostered better relations between the races when he took office...yet here we are three years later with his supporters using "racism" as a tool to try and get him reelected.

Guess you don't have a choice though...it's not like he can run on his record.

 

[gallantwarrior]

You have often expressed the opinion that whites, and others, cannot possibly have any understanding of what blacks experience. I can grant that because none of us has the same experiences. Our experience with life can and does vary greatly depending on many factors. So, based on his life experience, what understanding can obama have for most blacks in this country? He was raised by white people, he is half white. He attended private schools abroad and in this country. He graduated from some of the most exclusive universities. His life has been anything but common as it relates to the typical black experience. Just how is obama any different than the white people you so dislike?

So now your route is to deny and/or diminish Obama's "blackness" and/or "black experience?"

Nice!

Why do you insist on denying his factual upbringing? Everything I just wrote is a fact, as presented to the public by obama himself. What is there in his actual upbringing that would lead you to believe that he has any more in common with the typical American black experience than most non-blacks, other than his preferred racial self-identification?

 

[MarcATL]

While they may be great points, they still ignore a significant part of racism, I.e. Whites are not the only group that may be racist. Where's the discussion about how racism is addressed when it raises it's ugly head in say, a black community?

Can you site any examples?

I'm in the South. I believe it's a dog-whistle, aka "code phrase," for many.

Another butt-hurt RWer that's obsessed w/rep...

Hi, you have received -103 reputation points from Rocko.
Reputation was given for this post.

Comment:
fucking moron!

Regards,
Rocko

Note: This is an automated message.

I don't care about rep that much, but I know you do. That's why you always post your negs- hopeful for some sympathy reps.

Some of the dumbest and cruel people on this board have high rep. You're an example of the dumbest.

I don't even GIVE neg reps, that's how much I'm concerned with it. I've stated multiple times that my goal is to simply bring LIGHT to the RW Cockaroaches pettiness. You guys, just like the Cockaroaches that you are, scramble away from the light by being vehemently opposed to and upset by my posting your neg reps.

Keep it up Cockaroach...

Great points.

I'd like to invite you to visit Harlem, NY and/or Williamsburg, NY (in Brooklyn) Lots of whites there.

Your post illustrates the various manifestations of racism as it relates to the South and the North...interesting.

I think NYC and its surrounding borroughs is kind of an exception to the general rule. NYC is just a melting pot, all over the place.

What I'm thinking about, primarily, are the rust belt cities, like Pittsburgh, or Cleveland, or Detroit, or areas with heavily segregated neighborhoods, like Boston or Philly.

Those places REALLY have their struggles with race, and they go on ALL THE TIME.

Seems to me that America has quite a bit of ways to go until it's "post racial" as some would have us believe. No?

 

[catzmeow]

Why do you insist on denying his factual upbringing? Everything I just wrote is a fact, as presented to the public by obama himself. What is there in his actual upbringing that would lead you to believe that he has any more in common with the typical American black experience than most non-blacks, other than his preferred racial self-identification?

One thing that does go unsaid about race in this country is that people's experiences of being a particular race vary greatly depending upon their income.

The single most predictive factor of criminal involvement is income. The experiences of growing up in poverty, with childhood exposure to family trauma and violence, attending substandard schools in a dangerous neighborhood...that's what influences criminal behavior.

Growing up rich and black beats the hell out of growing up white and poor.

 

[MarcATL]

You have often expressed the opinion that whites, and others, cannot possibly have any understanding of what blacks experience. I can grant that because none of us has the same experiences. Our experience with life can and does vary greatly depending on many factors. So, based on his life experience, what understanding can obama have for most blacks in this country? He was raised by white people, he is half white. He attended private schools abroad and in this country. He graduated from some of the most exclusive universities. His life has been anything but common as it relates to the typical black experience. Just how is obama any different than the white people you so dislike?

So now your route is to deny and/or diminish Obama's "blackness" and/or "black experience?"

Nice!

Why do you insist on denying his factual upbringing? Everything I just wrote is a fact, as presented to the public by obama himself. What is there in his actual upbringing that would lead you to believe that he has any more in common with the typical American black experience than most non-blacks, other than his preferred racial self-identification?

It didn't work in 2008, and it won't work in 2012. So, once again, keep it up.

 

[catzmeow]

Seems to me that America has quite a bit of ways to go until it's "post racial" as some would have us believe. No?

I think that whether you're post-racial or not depends on your income. If you're poor and black, it's goddamn hard. If you're wealthy and black, while you may occasionally confronted by an occasional unpleasant remark, at this point in time, your life trajectory is basically the same as it is for women: You can likely achieve success in any realm without being significantly hindered by your race (gender). Yes, discrimination does still exist, but you have advocates and the ability to fight it (and will most likely win).

If you're really a skilled black professional (or, as in my case, a skilled female professional), you can actually surpass folks, and what might once have been a hindrance can actually become an advantage in some fields/circles.

Overall, I think that America is much easier to navigate if you have funds. Americans, in general, treat you better if you have cash in your wallet than they do if you don't. And, it doesn't matter so much what your skin color or gender is, as long as you can pay your way.

And, if you're black (or female), but you have some financial resources, you will have multiple methods at your disposal to address any kind of discrimination and/or mistreatment.

If you're black, and you don't have those resources, you're shit outta luck.

That's my opinion, based upon what I've observed. Being black is considerably less difficult in this country if you have a college degree and a white collar job. Same with being female.

Thoughts?

 

[gallantwarrior]

While they may be great points, they still ignore a significant part of racism, I.e. Whites are not the only group that may be racist. Where's the discussion about how racism is addressed when it raises it's ugly head in say, a black community?

My husband owns a home in a 95% black neighborhood here (mostly blue-collar working class folks). He lived there for 3 years before we got married. His neighbors have been exceptionally pleasant to us. We've basically gutted and rehabbed the house from the floor up, including new wiring, plumbing, roof, drywall, etc. I don't think there's been a day we've been working when one of his neighbors hasn't either walked by or stopped by to say, "Hi" and ask us how the project has been going, and tell us how hard they've seen us working. Usually, they tell him how lucky he is to have me (when I'm all covered with dirt or paint, or have been up on the roof all day). They've brought him food from their gardens, watched his home when he's TDY for the military, called him when he had a burglary (several homes in the neighborhood were hit), and basically...acted like neighbors act.

Can you imagine it?

Personally, I've worked in predominantly black communities for a number of years. I've experienced a few isolated instances of racist comments (a few people have made a couple of stupid comments during training I've conducted, about my race, but in every case, have been chastized by their own co-workers for being idiots).

However, the overwhelming majority of people I've worked with, who are a mix of agency professionals and residents, have been incredibly warm and inviting to me. They've met me for dinner, invited me to their homes, and been extremely appreciative of the work I've done for them. I've shopped in neighborhood grocery stores, eaten in neighborhood restaurants, bought gas at neighborhood filling stations, etc. I've worked there in the daytime, and I've worked there at night. Zero problems of any significance. ZERO.

And, these are generally high crime areas.

So, what really makes me go, "hmmmm?" is the implication that black folks routinely mistreat white folks. I probably spend ten times as much time as the average white person does in predominantly black neighborhoods, and I've never been mistreated. I've gotten lost, and had to stop for directions. I've gone out and met with people in their homes. I've walked down neighborhood streets and talked to residents.

In general, people EVERYWHERE (white, black, and brown) have been polite to me, they smile at me, they talk to me, they make little jokes and I joke back. No one has ever stolen from me, threatened me, screamed at me, made rude comments, or anything of the like. And, I'm a woman. I'm a blond, petite woman with big boobs. So trust me, if someone was going to make a rude comment, I'm the perfect target.

I really don't know where you people spend your time that you have this impression that black harassment of whites is routine. It certainly hasn't been, for me, but then, I'm pretty pleasant in real life.

I wonder at the shock you would experience to discover that most neighborhoods are populated with decent people who take some care of their neighbors? White and black. You seem to be under the misconception that a black living in a predominantly white neighborhood similar to where you live would be abused by their neighbors. Not true. But again, we encounter the one-sided bigotry that comes when one focuses on only a small part of a larger problem.
There are boneheads in all ethnic, racial, and socio-economic groups. To judge and condemn an entire group based on the words and actions of a few is, by definition, racist.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

I have no idea if he's a racist. That's why I gave him the benefit of the doubt and said "almost all." I'm open to the possibility that he's one of the rare exceptions to the rule.

I live in the South, I've known quite a few people who've flown variations of the confederate flag in different ways. Several of them weren't racist, just socially inept and clueless about the impression they were making. In some families down here, having confederate ancestors is a big source of pride. People grow up with the confederate flag being flown or worn or put on their car, and may not realize that in most parts of the U.S., flying the stars and bars will give people the impression that you're a racist.

Plus, I was a Kappa Alpha little sister for four years in college. I'm pretty sure that the guys from that frat didn't realize how their adulation of all things confederate probably appeared to outsiders. I didn't either, at that point in my life. Flying the confederate flag wasn't all that uncommon in Missouri in that era.

So, I try not to prejudge.

However, on forums, the majority of people I've encountered who've made a big deal about using that symbol as their avatar have been racists. Not all, but definitely most.

I see no racism in flying the Confederate battle flag, as I've said many blacks fought bravely for the South. If others have a problem with it then they need to take a long hard look at themselves.

I don't know - I'm not black. I think that if I WERE black, a Confederate flag might be offensive to me. You know - slavery and all of that. Just sayin'

I will concede the fact that most blacks would find the flag offensive which only strengthens my case that most blacks are indeed racist.

Why would anyone be offended by slavery when slavery was done away with several generations ago. Why are they still claiming to be victims?

Hell listening to the likes of you, you'd think that the entirety of the African slaves traded came to the New World when in fact only a fraction of slaves were brought here.

Get a job and buy yourself a history book.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Amazon.com: Black Slaveowners: Free Black Slave Masters in South Carolina, 1790-1860 (9781570030376): Larry Koger: Books

Black Slave Owners Civil War Article by Robert M Grooms


According to federal census reports, on June 1, 1860 there were nearly 4.5 million Negroes in the United States, with fewer than four million of them living in the southern slaveholding states. Of the blacks residing in the South, 261,988 were not slaves. Of this number, 10,689 lived in New Orleans. The country's leading African American historian, Duke University professor John Hope Franklin, records that in New Orleans over 3,000 free Negroes owned slaves, or 28 percent of the free Negroes in that city.

Perhaps one day the black folks in this country will learn their history.

But I won't hold my breath.

ANd maybe one day you'll learn yours. Read the Cornerstone speech.

Don't need to. I educate myself, I don't listen to a speech and think it's the gospel.

 

[catzmeow]

I wonder at the shock you would experience to discover that most neighborhoods are populated with decent people who take some care of their neighbors?

Any "shock" expressed in my post was sarcastic.

You seem to be under the misconception that a black living in a predominantly white neighborhood similar to where you live would be abused by their neighbors.

Where did you read this statement in my post? I sure as hell didn't write it. Why don't you stop writing what you think I said, or what you want me to say, and focus on what I actually wrote?

The section of the community where I live is affluent and about 30% black. We don't have any racial issues, from what I've observed.

There are boneheads in all ethnic, racial, and socio-economic groups. To judge and condemn an entire group based on the words and actions of a few is, by definition, racist.

Well, duh.

 

[MarcATL]

While they may be great points, they still ignore a significant part of racism, I.e. Whites are not the only group that may be racist. Where's the discussion about how racism is addressed when it raises it's ugly head in say, a black community?

My husband owns a home in a 95% black neighborhood here (mostly blue-collar working class folks). He lived there for 3 years before we got married. His neighbors have been exceptionally pleasant to us. We've basically gutted and rehabbed the house from the floor up, including new wiring, plumbing, roof, drywall, etc. I don't think there's been a day we've been working when one of his neighbors hasn't either walked by or stopped by to say, "Hi" and ask us how the project has been going, and tell us how hard they've seen us working. Usually, they tell him how lucky he is to have me (when I'm all covered with dirt or paint, or have been up on the roof all day). They've brought him food from their gardens, watched his home when he's TDY for the military, called him when he had a burglary (several homes in the neighborhood were hit), and basically...acted like neighbors act.

Can you imagine it?

Personally, I've worked in predominantly black communities for a number of years. I've experienced a few isolated instances of racist comments (a few people have made a couple of stupid comments during training I've conducted, about my race, but in every case, have been chastized by their own co-workers for being idiots).

However, the overwhelming majority of people I've worked with, who are a mix of agency professionals and residents, have been incredibly warm and inviting to me. They've met me for dinner, invited me to their homes, and been extremely appreciative of the work I've done for them. I've shopped in neighborhood grocery stores, eaten in neighborhood restaurants, bought gas at neighborhood filling stations, etc. I've worked there in the daytime, and I've worked there at night. Zero problems of any significance. ZERO.

And, these are generally high crime areas.

So, what really makes me go, "hmmmm?" is the implication that black folks routinely mistreat white folks. I probably spend ten times as much time as the average white person does in predominantly black neighborhoods, and I've never been mistreated. I've gotten lost, and had to stop for directions. I've gone out and met with people in their homes. I've walked down neighborhood streets and talked to residents.

In general, people EVERYWHERE (white, black, and brown) have been polite to me, they smile at me, they talk to me, they make little jokes and I joke back. No one has ever stolen from me, threatened me, screamed at me, made rude comments, or anything of the like. And, I'm a woman. I'm a blond, petite woman with big boobs. So trust me, if someone was going to make a rude comment, I'm the perfect target.

I really don't know where you people spend your time that you have this impression that black harassment of whites is routine. It certainly hasn't been, for me, but then, I'm pretty pleasant in real life.

Lemme guess...you're on the physically attractive side...aren't you?

For real though, most of these RWers believe everything they see on da teevee and hear on da raydeeyo. The rest perhaps just base it on a few bad interactions in real life.