Where ya at?

[antagon]

A conservative is suppose to be some one that holds to social traditions and uphold them.


Conservativism of today is something entirely different.

wtf? i remember when conservatism had something to do with the impact of government on the private sector through tax/fiscal policy and competition in the marketplace/share of the national product.

talk about entirely different.

If you are talking about low taxes and encouraging competition in the marketplace, that is what you call a Capitalists.

The belief in sound fiscal policy for the Government (such as a balanced budget to revenue outstripping spending) is refered to as Fiscal conservatism--mainly because this is the "tried and true method" of keeping a nation finances solvent.


By the way--a Fiscal Conservative might raise taxes. A capitalists always argues for tax cuts regardless of the situation.

youre right, fiscal. you didnt have to make that distiction until '98, '99. not in politics. anyone else remember that? something poisonous with that contract w/ america, maybe.

sure, GHWBush, the last fiscal conservative republican chief, raised taxes. clinton was a fiscal conservative by my measure and raised tax for some.

thats bollucks about capitalists and taxes. idiots argue for tax cuts no matter what. not true of me. im a big-league capitalist, but im into it with such hacks on other threads right now over tax-cut-conservatism.

adam smith argued the need for progressive tax. he's the capitalist.

 

[goldcatt]

I guess if I have to pick I'm a left-leaning independent overall, but the labels are way too simple. Of course labels always are!

i made it so ya got to pick, or not at all. thats life!

i think it lends to the inevitabilities of Decision Day, when the most important decision has just two real labels to support.

Not labels. Individuals. That's the problem, too many people just look at the labels. We ain't picking dog food here.

 

[antagon]

I guess if I have to pick I'm a left-leaning independent overall, but the labels are way too simple. Of course labels always are!

i made it so ya got to pick, or not at all. thats life!

i think it lends to the inevitabilities of Decision Day, when the most important decision has just two real labels to support.

Not labels. Individuals. That's the problem, too many people just look at the labels. We ain't picking dog food here.

interesting analogy. i remember during killer-puppyfood-gate virtually all the brands were made by the same sweatshop.

 

[Samson]

Heterosexual.

 

[mudwhistle]

Democrat, I support workers rights, programs that aid the needy, but I differ with my party on the abortion issue.

I think you're with the wrong party....Democrats want to take your right to a secret ballot away thus forcing you into unions....they don't help the needy...they just claim they do. Their programs are designed to keep the needy....in the need. They refuse to help them get out of the hole they're in. They give them just enough to take care of their present needs but they won't give them the help and the training to fend for themselves.

Abortion, Affirmative Action, Universal Health Care, Global Warming, all are wedge-issues they know are going to get a rise out of the right. Many of them don't even believe in themselves....but that doesn't stop them from using them to divide us.

And why anyone would support a party that wants to kill the unborn and the helpless but protect murderers and terrorists I cannot understand. That alone is enough for me not to be a Democrat.

 

[Immanuel]

Democrat, I support workers rights, programs that aid the needy, but I differ with my party on the abortion issue.

I think you're with the wrong party....Democrats want to take your right to a secret ballot away thus forcing you into unions....they don't help the needy...they just claim they do. Their programs are designed to keep the needy....in the need. They refuse to help them get out of the hole they're in. They give them just enough to take care of their present needs but they won't give them the help and the training to fend for themselves.

Abortion, Affirmative Action, Universal Health Care, Global Warming, all are wedge-issues they know are going to get a rise out of the right. Many of them don't even believe in themselves....but that doesn't stop them from using them to divide us.

And why anyone would support a party that wants to kill the unborn and the helpless but protect murderers and terrorists I cannot understand. That alone is enough for me not to be a Democrat.

I was with you right up until the highlighted point... I am pro-life and believe that the Democratic Parties stance on abortion is wrong, but you will play hell convincing me that there are more than just a handful of people, let along a "party", that wants to "kill the unborn and the helpless". Truthfully, I feel that this kind of rhetoric hurts the cause of the unborn and stymies any attempts to bring about a solution to this issue.

Immie

 

[Harry Dresden]

i am with whoever promises me the most at the time.....

 

[Palmbeachsooner]

< An Independent that is leaning so far right now he's about to fall over.

 

[mudwhistle]

Democrat, I support workers rights, programs that aid the needy, but I differ with my party on the abortion issue.

I think you're with the wrong party....Democrats want to take your right to a secret ballot away thus forcing you into unions....they don't help the needy...they just claim they do. Their programs are designed to keep the needy....in the need. They refuse to help them get out of the hole they're in. They give them just enough to take care of their present needs but they won't give them the help and the training to fend for themselves.

Abortion, Affirmative Action, Universal Health Care, Global Warming, all are wedge-issues they know are going to get a rise out of the right. Many of them don't even believe in themselves....but that doesn't stop them from using them to divide us.

And why anyone would support a party that wants to kill the unborn and the helpless but protect murderers and terrorists I cannot understand. That alone is enough for me not to be a Democrat.

I was with you right up until the highlighted point... I am pro-life and believe that the Democratic Parties stance on abortion is wrong, but you will play hell convincing me that there are more than just a handful of people, let along a "party", that wants to "kill the unborn and the helpless". Truthfully, I feel that this kind of rhetoric hurts the cause of the unborn and stymies any attempts to bring about a solution to this issue.

Immie

And that is why you may be able to rationalize your support of their party...because you don't see what their actions have done.

To date 40 million children have been murdered and the Democrats want it all paid for by our tax dollars.

They kiss up to our enemies.....even conspire with them against a sitting president like when they visited Saddam before the Iraq war, sucking up to Castro, or anyone else who hates this country. They impose ROEs on our troops that makes it next to impossible for them to win a unconventional war against insurgents in two different countries. Our enemies fight intentionally among the civilian populations and disguise themselves as civilians so we can't tell them apart, so our military is automatically at a disadvantage.

They turn it from a war into a police-action and order our G.I.s to read maranda rights to P.O.W.s.....something that is unheard of in the history of warfare. Now they want to bring to trial the planners of 9/11 a few blocks from where their plans came to fruition. It's an out and out insult.

I'm just scratching the surface here. There's too many other reasons for me not to support a party that uses a name that is a text-book misnomer. They don't even support Democracy. They need to call themselves the Socialist Party.

 

[Immanuel]

I think you're with the wrong party....Democrats want to take your right to a secret ballot away thus forcing you into unions....they don't help the needy...they just claim they do. Their programs are designed to keep the needy....in the need. They refuse to help them get out of the hole they're in. They give them just enough to take care of their present needs but they won't give them the help and the training to fend for themselves.

Abortion, Affirmative Action, Universal Health Care, Global Warming, all are wedge-issues they know are going to get a rise out of the right. Many of them don't even believe in themselves....but that doesn't stop them from using them to divide us.

And why anyone would support a party that wants to kill the unborn and the helpless but protect murderers and terrorists I cannot understand. That alone is enough for me not to be a Democrat.

I was with you right up until the highlighted point... I am pro-life and believe that the Democratic Parties stance on abortion is wrong, but you will play hell convincing me that there are more than just a handful of people, let along a "party", that wants to "kill the unborn and the helpless". Truthfully, I feel that this kind of rhetoric hurts the cause of the unborn and stymies any attempts to bring about a solution to this issue.

Immie

And that is why you may be able to rationalize your support of their party...because you don't see what their actions have done.

To date 40 million children have been murdered and the Democrats want it all paid for by our tax dollars.

They kiss up to our enemies.....even conspire with them against a sitting president like when they visited Saddam before the Iraq war, sucking up to Castro, or anyone else who hates this country. They impose ROEs on our troops that makes it next to impossible for them to win a unconventional war against insurgents in two different countries. Our enemies fight intentionally among the civilian populations and disguise themselves as civilians so we can't tell them apart, so our military is automatically at a disadvantage.

They turn it from a war into a police-action and order our G.I.s to read rights to P.O.W.s.....something that is unheard of in the history of warfare. Now they want to bring to trial the planners of 9/11 a few blocks from where their plans came to fruition. It's an out and out insult.

I'm just scratching the surface here. There's too many other reasons for me not to support a party that uses a name that is a text-book misnomer. They don't even support Democracy. They need to call themselves the Socialist Party.

I can tell you have not been reading along. I do not support their party nor do I support the GOP which despite their rhetoric is as pro-choice as the Democratic Party.

For the record, the count in unborn deaths since Roe was "decided" is more like 50 million and those are only the counted ones. Since abortions are not regulated and abortionists do not need to report abortions for all we know it could be 100 million or more... but, thanks to both parties, we will never know. As for us paying for it, I don't see the GOP giving a rat's ass about that situation either.

As for those insurgents in those two countries, it was President Bush that put us in an unwinnable position. Unfortunately, the war on terror is as big of a joke as the war on drugs. Both are unwinnable. We'll never know if or when terrorism is defeated because we'll never know that the next attack is not minutes away.

And you stated that Democrats "want to kill the unborn". You have given no proof of such a malicious statement. To think that anyone would like the idea of abortion is terrible. Come on when was the last time you talked to a pro-choice person and they said they were for abortions? I mean actually talked to them, listened to them and discussed the issue sans name-calling. They have a different view on the role government should play in the abortion debate than we do, but, I don't know a one of them, politician or private citizen that supports abortion as you indicate.

Get real, mudwhistle, the people are not the enemy. The enemy is the politicians and the political system that has been corrupted. Listen for a change and in this case you will find that a whole hell of a lot of pro-choicers are as pro-life as you are.

Immie

 

[mudwhistle]

I was with you right up until the highlighted point... I am pro-life and believe that the Democratic Parties stance on abortion is wrong, but you will play hell convincing me that there are more than just a handful of people, let along a "party", that wants to "kill the unborn and the helpless". Truthfully, I feel that this kind of rhetoric hurts the cause of the unborn and stymies any attempts to bring about a solution to this issue.

Immie

And that is why you may be able to rationalize your support of their party...because you don't see what their actions have done.

To date 40 million children have been murdered and the Democrats want it all paid for by our tax dollars.

They kiss up to our enemies.....even conspire with them against a sitting president like when they visited Saddam before the Iraq war, sucking up to Castro, or anyone else who hates this country. They impose ROEs on our troops that makes it next to impossible for them to win a unconventional war against insurgents in two different countries. Our enemies fight intentionally among the civilian populations and disguise themselves as civilians so we can't tell them apart, so our military is automatically at a disadvantage.

They turn it from a war into a police-action and order our G.I.s to read rights to P.O.W.s.....something that is unheard of in the history of warfare. Now they want to bring to trial the planners of 9/11 a few blocks from where their plans came to fruition. It's an out and out insult.

I'm just scratching the surface here. There's too many other reasons for me not to support a party that uses a name that is a text-book misnomer. They don't even support Democracy. They need to call themselves the Socialist Party.

I can tell you have not been reading along. I do not support their party nor do I support the GOP which despite their rhetoric is as pro-choice as the Democratic Party.

For the record, the count in unborn deaths since Roe was "decided" is more like 50 million and those are only the counted ones. Since abortions are not regulated and abortionists do not need to report abortions for all we know it could be 100 million or more... but, thanks to both parties, we will never know. As for us paying for it, I don't see the GOP giving a rat's ass about that situation either.

As for those insurgents in those two countries, it was President Bush that put us in an unwinnable position. Unfortunately, the war on terror is as big of a joke as the war on drugs. Both are unwinnable. We'll never know if or when terrorism is defeated because we'll never know that the next attack is not minutes away.

And you stated that Democrats "want to kill the unborn". You have given no proof of such a malicious statement. To think that anyone would like the idea of abortion is terrible. Come on when was the last time you talked to a pro-choice person and they said they were for abortions? I mean actually talked to them, listened to them and discussed the issue sans name-calling. They have a different view on the role government should play in the abortion debate than we do, but, I don't know a one of them, politician or private citizen that supports abortion as you indicate.

Get real, mudwhistle, the people are not the enemy. The enemy is the politicians and the political system that has been corrupted. Listen for a change and in this case you will find that a whole hell of a lot of pro-choicers are as pro-life as you are.

Immie

Look at my signature. Nothing is unwinnable. Only a defeatist [Democrat] thinks that way. If they would fight for the security of this nation like they constantly fight to secure their power then I think we could kick some serious ass. But they refuse to.

Supporting taxpayer funded abortions is by definition tantamount to supporting the killing of the unborn and in favor of forcing those of us who don't into paying for it against our will. Sorry if I can't sugar-coat it for you.

Yes, politicians are corrupt. But continuing to reelect them means you don't really want change. And the GOP jettisons those that are exposed as being corrupt while the Dems celebrate theirs.

I never said you support every element on the Dem platform but you still support them so you're just as responsible for them as those who do.

 

[antagon]

not quite due for a full timeline installment, but with 69 comments, 32 votes, none have landed squarely with the GOP less than 3/100.

i suspect this reflects former republicans' embarassment.

could also be the wisdom of disloyalty favoring the right.

dunno.

 

[mudwhistle]

not quite due for a full timeline installment, but with 69 comments, 32 votes, none have landed squarely with the GOP less than 3/100.

i suspect this reflects former republicans' embarassment.

could also be the wisdom of disloyalty favoring the right.

dunno.

I think it means that those who usually support the GOP are more honest and more demanding of their representatives.

If you're happy with the Democrats then you really don't expect much from them....or you're a mean, evil, dishonest fuck like they are.

 

[antagon]

not quite due for a full timeline installment, but with 69 comments, 32 votes, none have landed squarely with the GOP less than 3/100.

i suspect this reflects former republicans' embarassment.

could also be the wisdom of disloyalty favoring the right.

dunno.

I think it means that those who usually support the GOP are more honest and more demanding of their representatives.

If you're happy with the Democrats then you really don't expect much from them....or you're a mean, evil, dishonest fuck like they are.

 

[Immanuel]

And that is why you may be able to rationalize your support of their party...because you don't see what their actions have done.

To date 40 million children have been murdered and the Democrats want it all paid for by our tax dollars.

They kiss up to our enemies.....even conspire with them against a sitting president like when they visited Saddam before the Iraq war, sucking up to Castro, or anyone else who hates this country. They impose ROEs on our troops that makes it next to impossible for them to win a unconventional war against insurgents in two different countries. Our enemies fight intentionally among the civilian populations and disguise themselves as civilians so we can't tell them apart, so our military is automatically at a disadvantage.

They turn it from a war into a police-action and order our G.I.s to read rights to P.O.W.s.....something that is unheard of in the history of warfare. Now they want to bring to trial the planners of 9/11 a few blocks from where their plans came to fruition. It's an out and out insult.

I'm just scratching the surface here. There's too many other reasons for me not to support a party that uses a name that is a text-book misnomer. They don't even support Democracy. They need to call themselves the Socialist Party.

I can tell you have not been reading along. I do not support their party nor do I support the GOP which despite their rhetoric is as pro-choice as the Democratic Party.

For the record, the count in unborn deaths since Roe was "decided" is more like 50 million and those are only the counted ones. Since abortions are not regulated and abortionists do not need to report abortions for all we know it could be 100 million or more... but, thanks to both parties, we will never know. As for us paying for it, I don't see the GOP giving a rat's ass about that situation either.

As for those insurgents in those two countries, it was President Bush that put us in an unwinnable position. Unfortunately, the war on terror is as big of a joke as the war on drugs. Both are unwinnable. We'll never know if or when terrorism is defeated because we'll never know that the next attack is not minutes away.

And you stated that Democrats "want to kill the unborn". You have given no proof of such a malicious statement. To think that anyone would like the idea of abortion is terrible. Come on when was the last time you talked to a pro-choice person and they said they were for abortions? I mean actually talked to them, listened to them and discussed the issue sans name-calling. They have a different view on the role government should play in the abortion debate than we do, but, I don't know a one of them, politician or private citizen that supports abortion as you indicate.

Get real, mudwhistle, the people are not the enemy. The enemy is the politicians and the political system that has been corrupted. Listen for a change and in this case you will find that a whole hell of a lot of pro-choicers are as pro-life as you are.

Immie

Look at my signature. Nothing is unwinnable. Only a defeatist [Democrat] thinks that way. If they would fight for the security of this nation like they constantly fight to secure their power then I think we could kick some serious ass. But they refuse to.

Supporting taxpayer funded abortions is by definition tantamount to supporting the killing of the unborn and in favor of forcing those of us who don't into paying for it against our will. Sorry if I can't sugar-coat it for you.

Yes, politicians are corrupt. But continuing to reelect them means you don't really want change. And the GOP jettisons those that are exposed as being corrupt while the Dems celebrate theirs.

I never said you support every element on the Dem platform but you still support them so you're just as responsible for them as those who do.

I support them? I haven't voted for a Dem President since Carter. I haven't voted for a Dem Senator in... I don't know if I ever have and I'm pretty happy with my Republican Rep, Adam Putnam.

I don't support Taxpayer funded abortions or any abortions at all. I am simply smart enough to know that outlawing abortions wont end abortions. I am also, unlike you, fully aware of the fact that most Democrats are people just like you and I. Most Democrats are not politicians. They have their issues that they support and those that they don't support and have decided that the Democratic Party does a better job of lying to them than the Republican Party does. Most Democrats don't like abortion any more than you or I do. I am also certain that the way to working out this problem is not by acting like an ass with those of whom you are opposed. The way to working out a solution to the millions of lives stolen every year is to have a dialogue with those who support it, but we can't do that because Republicans want their pro-life base to remain stupid and think that all Democrats thrive on the stealing of lives of unborn children and now the elderly. Meanwhile, the Democrats want their base to believe that all conservatives are bound and determined to keep all women barefoot and pregnant.

The GOP doesn't jettison its members who are exposed as being corrupt anymore than the DP and the GOP protect those who they know are corrupt the same way the Pope protects priestly pedophiles. The GOP is no better the the Democratic Party and the sooner you and the other partisan hacks that back them figure this out, the better this country will be. I didn't vote for McCain... bet you did. I'm sure you were more than happy to move him from Capital Hill to the White House even though he is as corrupt as the rest of them.

As for the war, we will and have definitely kicked some ass and will continue to do so, but there will be no "winning" this war. You'll never know when terrorism is defeated. How long after an attack do we wait? One Year... Five... Seven... Ten... Twenty-Five? How in God's name are we ever going to know that there is not some terrorist bastard, just waiting for us to drop our guard? Militarily they don't have a prayer, but they don't have to play military games. All they have to do is sit back and wait. You can't kick ass if you don't know who they are.

The point that I was making is that the Democratic Party is made up of people just like you and I. Those people don't like abortion any more than you do. They are just as misguided as you are when you support a party that says "We're Pro-Life, Vote for Us." But when given the opportunity doesn't do jack shit about abortion. Bush sat on his ass for 8 years and didn't do a damned thing about the issue, but he was more than happy to accept the votes and cash of the ignorant ones who continued to vote Republican because the Republican Party is Pro-life. Bah!

You go ahead and continue to support your pro-choice party. Be my guest. As long as you vote for them, you are part of the problem not the solution.

Immie

 

[mudwhistle]

I can tell you have not been reading along. I do not support their party nor do I support the GOP which despite their rhetoric is as pro-choice as the Democratic Party.

For the record, the count in unborn deaths since Roe was "decided" is more like 50 million and those are only the counted ones. Since abortions are not regulated and abortionists do not need to report abortions for all we know it could be 100 million or more... but, thanks to both parties, we will never know. As for us paying for it, I don't see the GOP giving a rat's ass about that situation either.

As for those insurgents in those two countries, it was President Bush that put us in an unwinnable position. Unfortunately, the war on terror is as big of a joke as the war on drugs. Both are unwinnable. We'll never know if or when terrorism is defeated because we'll never know that the next attack is not minutes away.

And you stated that Democrats "want to kill the unborn". You have given no proof of such a malicious statement. To think that anyone would like the idea of abortion is terrible. Come on when was the last time you talked to a pro-choice person and they said they were for abortions? I mean actually talked to them, listened to them and discussed the issue sans name-calling. They have a different view on the role government should play in the abortion debate than we do, but, I don't know a one of them, politician or private citizen that supports abortion as you indicate.

Get real, mudwhistle, the people are not the enemy. The enemy is the politicians and the political system that has been corrupted. Listen for a change and in this case you will find that a whole hell of a lot of pro-choicers are as pro-life as you are.

Immie

Look at my signature. Nothing is unwinnable. Only a defeatist [Democrat] thinks that way. If they would fight for the security of this nation like they constantly fight to secure their power then I think we could kick some serious ass. But they refuse to.

Supporting taxpayer funded abortions is by definition tantamount to supporting the killing of the unborn and in favor of forcing those of us who don't into paying for it against our will. Sorry if I can't sugar-coat it for you.

Yes, politicians are corrupt. But continuing to reelect them means you don't really want change. And the GOP jettisons those that are exposed as being corrupt while the Dems celebrate theirs.

I never said you support every element on the Dem platform but you still support them so you're just as responsible for them as those who do.

I support them? I haven't voted for a Dem President since Carter. I haven't voted for a Dem Senator in... I don't know if I ever have and I'm pretty happy with my Republican Rep, Adam Putnam.

I don't support Taxpayer funded abortions or any abortions at all. I am simply smart enough to know that outlawing abortions wont end abortions. I am also, unlike you, fully aware of the fact that most Democrats are people just like you and I. Most Democrats are not politicians. They have their issues that they support and those that they don't support and have decided that the Democratic Party does a better job of lying to them than the Republican Party does. Most Democrats don't like abortion any more than you or I do. I am also certain that the way to working out this problem is not by acting like an ass with those of whom you are opposed. The way to working out a solution to the millions of lives stolen every year is to have a dialogue with those who support it, but we can't do that because Republicans want their pro-life base to remain stupid and think that all Democrats thrive on the stealing of lives of unborn children and now the elderly. Meanwhile, the Democrats want their base to believe that all conservatives are bound and determined to keep all women barefoot and pregnant.

The GOP doesn't jettison its members who are exposed as being corrupt anymore than the DP and the GOP protect those who they know are corrupt the same way the Pope protects priestly pedophiles. The GOP is no better the the Democratic Party and the sooner you and the other partisan hacks that back them figure this out, the better this country will be. I didn't vote for McCain... bet you did. I'm sure you were more than happy to move him from Capital Hill to the White House even though he is as corrupt as the rest of them.

As for the war, we will and have definitely kicked some ass and will continue to do so, but there will be no "winning" this war. You'll never know when terrorism is defeated. How long after an attack do we wait? One Year... Five... Seven... Ten... Twenty-Five? How in God's name are we ever going to know that there is not some terrorist bastard, just waiting for us to drop our guard? Militarily they don't have a prayer, but they don't have to play military games. All they have to do is sit back and wait. You can't kick ass if you don't know who they are.

The point that I was making is that the Democratic Party is made up of people just like you and I. Those people don't like abortion any more than you do. They are just as misguided as you are when you support a party that says "We're Pro-Life, Vote for Us." But when given the opportunity doesn't do jack shit about abortion. Bush sat on his ass for 8 years and didn't do a damned thing about the issue, but he was more than happy to accept the votes and cash of the ignorant ones who continued to vote Republican because the Republican Party is Pro-life. Bah!

You go ahead and continue to support your pro-choice party. Be my guest. As long as you vote for them, you are part of the problem not the solution.

Immie

If you support the Democrats then you support their platform.

Republicans aren't so much against abortion but against funding it with taxpayer funds.

There are extremist who are members of the party that want to eliminate abortions altogether but I am not one of those and I don't support candidates that do.

I'm no hack. I also couldn't look the other way while my party destroys the economy and sells us out to our enemies. That's what being a Democrat is.

California's economy has been ruined by the left....so is New Jersey's and New York's and Michigan's and Ohio's. Everywhere Democrats are in the majority hardships soon follow for the voters. They have no incentive to improve our lot because statistically they know that if you become self-sufficient you won't need their entitlement programs and by that reckoning you won't need them. So they want to take what you have and put you in the same boat as the poor that depends on them.

When it comes to war against thugs and murderers......giving up like you want to do will only make them worse. So the best thing to do is treat them as ruthlessly as they would treat us. But you can't stomach that. So I suggest you leave it to those who can and stay the fuck out of the way.

 

[antagon]

republicans often blame democrats for legislating charity, rather than affecting it personally. immie makes a case for the same over the abortion issue and republicans.

 

[antagon]

wake up this morning and the dynamics have smoothed out a bit.... initiating timeline....

thru the 1st 24 voters....

I'm a proud Republican!

I'm a Republican alright, but I dont like my party's direction.

I'm an independent voter, but I'm leaning to the Right.

I'm an independent voter, but I'm leaning to the Left.

I'm a Democrat alright, but i dont like my party's direction.

I'm a proud Democrat!

I'm a member of a third party (Libertarian, Independent, Socialist, Green, Constitution...)

0 - 1 - 8 - 5 - 1 - 4 - 5, respectively, thats rightward indy's leading with a third of the action.

id venture to pigeon-hole the third partisans in with them in a red/blue world, but dare not editorialize any further.... but thats bout 54%... ok no further.

... for now.

50 comments, 24 votes. <--- wont editorialize that either. just the facts

77 comments, 35 votes.

1 - 4 - 11 - 6 - 1 - 4 - 8

well, 1 republican is proud about their condition. the right-bent indys hold their third proportion, roughly. i suspect that third-pary folks are largely libertarians, with a few dropping their votes there to obstain from the big show.

 

[mudwhistle]

wake up this morning and the dynamics have smoothed out a bit.... initiating timeline....

thru the 1st 24 voters....

I'm a proud Republican!

I'm a Republican alright, but I dont like my party's direction.

I'm an independent voter, but I'm leaning to the Right.

I'm an independent voter, but I'm leaning to the Left.

I'm a Democrat alright, but i dont like my party's direction.

I'm a proud Democrat!

I'm a member of a third party (Libertarian, Independent, Socialist, Green, Constitution...)

0 - 1 - 8 - 5 - 1 - 4 - 5, respectively, thats rightward indy's leading with a third of the action.

id venture to pigeon-hole the third partisans in with them in a red/blue world, but dare not editorialize any further.... but thats bout 54%... ok no further.

... for now.

50 comments, 24 votes. <--- wont editorialize that either. just the facts

77 comments, 35 votes.

1 - 4 - 11 - 6 - 1 - 4 - 8

well, 1 republican is proud about their condition. the right-bent indys hold their third proportion, roughly. i suspect that third-pary folks are largely libertarians, with a few dropping their votes there to obstain from the big show.

What I see is alot of angry folks out there. Alot of people that want more out of their government, not settle for the lessor of two evils.

Liberals will always vote Democrat. They think that voting for them means they care. Democrats historically used to be full of bigots and old farts [They still are]. Now the Dems play on Liberal's heart strings by saying they want to give us all free health care and save the Polar Bear [Their latest wedge-issues]. Well, anyone with any sense knows that nothing is free and the greatest threat to Polar Bears.....is other Polar Bears.

 

[Immanuel]

Look at my signature. Nothing is unwinnable. Only a defeatist [Democrat] thinks that way. If they would fight for the security of this nation like they constantly fight to secure their power then I think we could kick some serious ass. But they refuse to.

Supporting taxpayer funded abortions is by definition tantamount to supporting the killing of the unborn and in favor of forcing those of us who don't into paying for it against our will. Sorry if I can't sugar-coat it for you.

Yes, politicians are corrupt. But continuing to reelect them means you don't really want change. And the GOP jettisons those that are exposed as being corrupt while the Dems celebrate theirs.

I never said you support every element on the Dem platform but you still support them so you're just as responsible for them as those who do.

I support them? I haven't voted for a Dem President since Carter. I haven't voted for a Dem Senator in... I don't know if I ever have and I'm pretty happy with my Republican Rep, Adam Putnam.

I don't support Taxpayer funded abortions or any abortions at all. I am simply smart enough to know that outlawing abortions wont end abortions. I am also, unlike you, fully aware of the fact that most Democrats are people just like you and I. Most Democrats are not politicians. They have their issues that they support and those that they don't support and have decided that the Democratic Party does a better job of lying to them than the Republican Party does. Most Democrats don't like abortion any more than you or I do. I am also certain that the way to working out this problem is not by acting like an ass with those of whom you are opposed. The way to working out a solution to the millions of lives stolen every year is to have a dialogue with those who support it, but we can't do that because Republicans want their pro-life base to remain stupid and think that all Democrats thrive on the stealing of lives of unborn children and now the elderly. Meanwhile, the Democrats want their base to believe that all conservatives are bound and determined to keep all women barefoot and pregnant.

The GOP doesn't jettison its members who are exposed as being corrupt anymore than the DP and the GOP protect those who they know are corrupt the same way the Pope protects priestly pedophiles. The GOP is no better the the Democratic Party and the sooner you and the other partisan hacks that back them figure this out, the better this country will be. I didn't vote for McCain... bet you did. I'm sure you were more than happy to move him from Capital Hill to the White House even though he is as corrupt as the rest of them.

As for the war, we will and have definitely kicked some ass and will continue to do so, but there will be no "winning" this war. You'll never know when terrorism is defeated. How long after an attack do we wait? One Year... Five... Seven... Ten... Twenty-Five? How in God's name are we ever going to know that there is not some terrorist bastard, just waiting for us to drop our guard? Militarily they don't have a prayer, but they don't have to play military games. All they have to do is sit back and wait. You can't kick ass if you don't know who they are.

The point that I was making is that the Democratic Party is made up of people just like you and I. Those people don't like abortion any more than you do. They are just as misguided as you are when you support a party that says "We're Pro-Life, Vote for Us." But when given the opportunity doesn't do jack shit about abortion. Bush sat on his ass for 8 years and didn't do a damned thing about the issue, but he was more than happy to accept the votes and cash of the ignorant ones who continued to vote Republican because the Republican Party is Pro-life. Bah!

You go ahead and continue to support your pro-choice party. Be my guest. As long as you vote for them, you are part of the problem not the solution.

Immie

If you support the Democrats then you support their platform.

Republicans aren't so much against abortion but against funding it with taxpayer funds.

There are extremist who are members of the party that want to eliminate abortions altogether but I am not one of those and I don't support candidates that do.

I'm no hack. I also couldn't look the other way while my party destroys the economy and sells us out to our enemies. That's what being a Democrat is.

California's economy has been ruined by the left....so is New Jersey's and New York's and Michigan's and Ohio's. Everywhere Democrats are in the majority hardships soon follow for the voters. They have no incentive to improve our lot because statistically they know that if you become self-sufficient you won't need their entitlement programs and by that reckoning you won't need them. So they want to take what you have and put you in the same boat as the poor that depends on them.

When it comes to war against thugs and murderers......giving up like you want to do will only make them worse. So the best thing to do is treat them as ruthlessly as they would treat us. But you can't stomach that. So I suggest you leave it to those who can and stay the fuck out of the way.

Your problem is that you seem to think that just because a person is registered as a member of a particular party, it means that they are a partisan hack. Not everyone, in fact, most Americans are not hacks. They belong to one party or another simply because they feel that they need to be a part of a party and in many states, you pretty much are forced into one party or the other in order to vote in primary election, my state is one of those states. However, I think most people simply chose the party that their parents were members of and wouldn't dream of changing parties. Some will change parties for instance if they are pro-life and grew up with Democratic parents, but typically they adopt their parent's party and go about their merry ways.

Yes, you are a partisan hack. Your very words condemn you:

California's economy has been ruined by the left....so is New Jersey's and New York's and Michigan's and Ohio's. Everywhere Democrats are in the majority hardships soon follow for the voters. They have no incentive to improve our lot because statistically they know that if you become self-sufficient you won't need their entitlement programs and by that reckoning you won't need them. So they want to take what you have and put you in the same boat as the poor that depends on them.

Blame it all on the other guys... that is what a hack is. You are a hack.

And one more thing, we are talking about citizens of the United States not the corrupt bastards living in Washington dictating to the rest of us.

republicans often blame democrats for legislating charity, rather than affecting it personally. immie makes a case for the same over the abortion issue and republicans.

Isn't that about the size of things?

Immie