What constitutes offense?

[Avatar4321]

They have the support of your god. If you do not support them, you oppose your god.

They don't know my God let alone have His support.

 

[JBeukema]

They have the support of your god. If you do not support them, you oppose your god.

They don't know my God let alone have His support.

They are following his word as given to the prophets. You hate your god and disobey his commandments.

 

[Avatar4321]

I have no problem with people speaking their minds. I would not censor the people complaining. However, while someone may be within their rights to do something, it doesn't mean we necessarily have to approve of it. For example, many people might not approve of drinking alcohol- but they can still acknowledge your right to do so.

I was just struck by this article, not because I think some action should necessarily be taken. It's pretty much a moot point. But I was taken aback by the fact that locals were offended by a message not even directed at them. I don't understand where you get the idea that it called anyone stupid or unable to think for themselves. The message was simply Don't believe in God? You're not alone. A message to fellow atheists that there are others in Iowa who hold similar views and then a link to their website.

That's not the message that was on the sign. Sure the sign said that. But it also said:

"Iowa Athiests and

So yes, I support their right to boycott or complain. But I also have the right to call them out as intolerant, bigoted people full of unimaginable scorn if atheists sending a comforting message of support to other atheists offends them so greatly. If the mere acknowledgement of the existence of atheists is offensive to someone, they are a bigoted as any Klan member or neo-nazi, since the mere existence of certain groups is offensive to these people as well.

A comforting message of support? Please you think that's why they are advertising? Are athiests that insecure that they need comforting messages of support in order to follow through with their belief?? They placed the ad to piss off believers by calling them stupid, drum up interest in their website, and ultimately make a profit. Looks like they succeeded.

If a Jewish group bought an ad saying "Child of Israel, The Temple welcomes you", how would people view individuals who called and complained about this Jewish message and boycotted the bus. And how would they view the governor saying he was disturbed by it?

No one would be disturbed at all. But then the Jewish group wouldnt be insulting people on the advertisement.

 

[Avatar4321]

Did you actually look at the ad? Not sure how you came to that conclusion... at all.

I read the advertisement. Can't imagine why telling people they arent freely thinking unless they agree with them is at all offensive can you?

 

[Mr Mustard]

What constitutes offense?

Avatar trying to debate as though he's on the same mental level as everyone else.

 

[Intense]

Still don't see offense in the add. Atheists and Free Thinkers is the Name of the Web Site. I don't think they we're intending to be confrontational, just saying Hi, this is who we are, and where we are, and how we refer to ourselves. no reflection on anyone else.

 

[manifold]

Did you actually look at the ad? Not sure how you came to that conclusion... at all.

I read the advertisement. Can't imagine why telling people they arent freely thinking unless they agree with them is at all offensive can you?

Offense shouldn't require such hyperbole. This says more about you than the ad.

 

[JBeukema]

The message was simply Don't believe in God? You're not alone. A message to fellow atheists that there are others in Iowa who hold similar views and then a link to their website.

That's not the message that was on the sign. Sure the sign said that. But it also said:

"Iowa Athiests and

 

[Gudrid]

A comforting message of support? Please you think that's why they are advertising? Are athiests that insecure that they need comforting messages of support in order to follow through with their belief?? They placed the ad to piss off believers by calling them stupid, drum up interest in their website, and ultimately make a profit. Looks like they succeeded.

Wow, and I always thought the endless Jesus billboards I see were supposed to be a positive outreach message to those who believe in Jesus or might be interested in following Jesus. Even the ones warning people that not believing in Jesus means you're going to hell (like that wouldn't be construed as offensive to some). But I guess it's all about pissing people off and making a profit. How very naive I've been. Thanks for setting me straight.

 

[JBeukema]

A comforting message of support? Please you think that's why they are advertising? Are athiests that insecure that they need comforting messages of support in order to follow through with their belief?? They placed the ad to piss off believers by calling them stupid, drum up interest in their website, and ultimately make a profit. Looks like they succeeded.

Wow, and I always thought the endless Jesus billboards I see were supposed to be a positive outreach message to those who believe in Jesus or might be interested in following Jesus. Even the ones warning people that not believing in Jesus means you're going to hell (like that wouldn't be construed as offensive to some). But I guess it's all about pissing people off and making a profit. How very naive I've been. Thanks for setting me straight.

This is acceptable

​

but this is offensive

​

 

[mattskramer]

A comforting message of support? Please you think that's why they are advertising? Are athiests that insecure that they need comforting messages of support in order to follow through with their belief?? They placed the ad to piss off believers by calling them stupid, drum up interest in their website, and ultimately make a profit. Looks like they succeeded.

Wow, and I always thought the endless Jesus billboards I see were supposed to be a positive outreach message to those who believe in Jesus or might be interested in following Jesus. Even the ones warning people that not believing in Jesus means you're going to hell (like that wouldn't be construed as offensive to some). But I guess it's all about pissing people off and making a profit. How very naive I've been. Thanks for setting me straight.

This is acceptable

​

but this is offensive

​

Those signs are acceptable. The following signs are also acceptable.

Signs from GOD (Highway Signs)

I might not like them but they are acceptable in the sense that they should be allowed to stand. Freedom of speech to me means the freedom to post even those things that I might not like. It also includes the right to be wrong.

 

[N4mddissent]

That's not the message that was on the sign. Sure the sign said that. But it also said:

"Iowa Athiests and

Okay. I didn't realize you were ignorant of the word Freethinker. From dictionary.com

free⋅think⋅er  
–noun a person who forms opinions on the basis of reason, independent of authority or tradition, esp. a person whose religious opinions differ from established belief.

Origin:
1685–95; free + thinker

Synonyms:
skeptic, agnostic; atheist​

Freethinker is a word that has been used since the 17th century to refer to atheists, agnostics, and sometimes deists and others who do not accept traditional belief systems.
This is a common word used to be inclusive of many groups who may share similar views to atheists, but don't consider themselves atheists (like those who consider themselves agnostics). Furthermore, it was the name of the group, not the message on the sign.

A comforting message of support? Please you think that's why they are advertising? Are athiests that insecure that they need comforting messages of support in order to follow through with their belief?? They placed the ad to piss off believers by calling them stupid, drum up interest in their website, and ultimately make a profit. Looks like they succeeded.

Yes, a comforting message of support. Being an atheist in the deep rural south, I can attest to the fact that in some parts of America, being an atheists can definitely lead to a sense of isolation. You might have to keep your views to yourself, or perhaps you express them and find yourself suddenly a pariah in your own community. So yes, in evangelical America, a message to atheists reminding them that they are not as alone as they may feel, would be appreciated.

Please don't present yourself as so paranoid you think this ad was deliberately placed to piss off believers. It did not call anyone stupid. Although it perhaps could have called people ignorant if they were offended by the organization's name including the word "freethinkers" which has been commonly used to describe atheists and agnostics for over 300 years. And since the organization is a non-profit educational and outreach organization, your accusation of "making a profit" shows you willing to make baseless attacks without even doing a 30 second google search to find out if any facts at all support your claim.

No one would be disturbed at all. But then the Jewish group wouldnt be insulting people on the advertisement

And the atheist group was not insulting either. Except to perhaps, bigots.

 

[JBeukema]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to N4mddissent again.

 

[amrchaos]

but yelling at people god hates fags, and harassing people on the sidewalk of every city big and small isn't offensive.

theists make me sick with their flexible moral codes

Let us point out that the theists of Iowa may not be the Theists you are reciting.

 

[Ralph]

Recently, ads purchased by an atheist group in Iowa were placed on buses there. However, the bus company received so many complaints of people taking offense at the ads, they have now removed them. Even the governnor, Chet Culver, stated he was "disturbed" by the ads and could understand why others would be as well. Some people went so far as to refuse to ride the buses with the ads.

What message did the atheists put on the bus that was so offensive and caused so much resentment?

"Don't believe in God? You are not alone. " And then had a link to the website of Iowa atheists and freethinkers.

So, the existence of atheism inherent offends people? I'm curious how people, theists and atheists on this site feel about this situation. Do any theists here also find the ad offensive? Do you think the people were justified in their outrage and their successful effort to silence speech in this case?

At what point does offense begin? Obviously name-calling is offensive. Calling someone stupid or evil because of their beliefs, I believe most would see as over-the-line. But what about reasonable criticism of ideas? Is debate possible, or does taking the opposing stance in argument make you inherently offensive? And in the case presented here, is it unavoidable- since a reminder of the very existence of atheists seems offensive to enough people to force a company to refund money and "disturb" a governor?

I would also like to note the admirable statements and position by local conservative church leaders about the issue mentioned at the end of the article.

It's simply the hypocrisy of demanding that no one force any atheist to simply look upon Christian tradition in public which propagates atheism as contrary to God's will, while on the other hand demanding as a right of free speech the right to publicly denounce Christianity as inferior to the religion of human secularism. God does not have to be involved to make a religion out of any ideology. Both positions are based upon faith....any argument contrary to either position is based upon Subjective...NEGATIVE...speculation.

Thus what is being accomplished is ONE RELIGION is being endorsed by the Central Government and others that base their religion upon God instead of the HUMAN MIND are being told their belief breaches the 1st amendment, which clearly states that WE THE PEOPLE...ALL PEOPLE to include the atheist have freedom "OF" religion not freedom "FROM" religion. Thus when the Central Government favors one religion over another....it is the Government that has breached the 1st amendment...not WE THE PEOPLE. As it is CONGRESS that is forbidden from making ANY LAW in relation to religion....to include the RELIGION of the HUMAN MIND....not THE PEOPLE.

 

[Yukon]

The disturbing part of this is that it was the blind followers who pushed them to remove the ads, according to the article even some of the religious leaders said they should have been left alone and not removed.

It was Conservative people who did the complaining.

 

[KittenKoder]

The disturbing part of this is that it was the blind followers who pushed them to remove the ads, according to the article even some of the religious leaders said they should have been left alone and not removed.

It was Conservative people who did the complaining.

I didn't think you could know less about the US ... until I read this.

 

[JBeukema]

It's simply the hypocrisy of demanding that no one force any atheist to simply look upon Christian tradition in public

Nobody has demanded any such thing
​

the religion of human secularism.

Your ignorance and disingenuousness is astounding

​

God does not have to be involved to make a religion out of any ideology. Both positions are based upon faith.

Clearly, you know nothing of secular humanism
​

 

[xotoxi]

"What constitutes offense? "

I consider Tom Brady/Randy Moss/Wes Welker to be the definition of offense.

 

[manifold]

Just in case anyone is interested, the complaints about removing the signs were apparently worse again than the original complaints, and now DART is going to put them back.

Score one more for the free market!