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The people fighting Gadfi asked the UN to help them, the UN voted to do so.
Its not crazy its what happened.
So in all the other countries where brutal governments have killed civilians none of civilian populations have asked for help?
Is that where you're taking your stand?
I'm sorry but when you send cruise missiles and fighter jets into a country and choose sides, you are in a war. We can disagree on this without cussing each other out.
It is not a war. It is a UN sanctioned intervention... specifically to stop Gaddafi from bombing the crap out of his own people. That is not war... it is intervention. There is no way to implement a 'no fly zone' (as authorized by the UN) without taking out the structures that Gadaffi needs to either:
a. strike at the UN forces
b. strike at his own people
This is not rocket science, it is rational thought.
I'm looking at differently from the perspective of a Military member, if I was a fighter pilot and you are asking me to fly over Libyan air space to risk my life and bomb the fucking shit out of them, it is a war to me.
He's got 60 days.
Technically he is REQUIRED to inform Congress BEFORE he uses military force or assets. He did not inform Congress. He has not asked for Congressional permission, he has not spoken at all to Congress about this.
How would you know if he's informed Congress or not? It's traditionally done in a letter, not an appearance.
Why do you assume that he didn't?
It is not a war. It is a UN sanctioned intervention... specifically to stop Gaddafi from bombing the crap out of his own people. That is not war... it is intervention. There is no way to implement a 'no fly zone' (as authorized by the UN) without taking out the structures that Gadaffi needs to either:
a. strike at the UN forces
b. strike at his own people
This is not rocket science, it is rational thought.
I'm looking at differently from the perspective of a Military member, if I was a fighter pilot and you are asking me to fly over Libyan air space to risk my life and bomb the fucking shit out of them, it is a war to me.
I'm with you Gravity, it's a war. I just heard on MSNBC that in fact one of our jets did go down, both pilots have been recovered. Of course the Pentagon is adamently declaring the jet was not shot down.. it was mechanical failure.. Yeah right. It is a war. an unconstitutional war because obie wan did not go to the congress.
Who gives a shit whether he informed congress! Thats the least important thing to worry about with this whole thing people!!!!!!!
We need to be discussing whether its the proper role of the U.S to be deciding who is in power and who is not of a sovereign nation.
I'm looking at differently from the perspective of a Military member, if I was a fighter pilot and you are asking me to fly over Libyan air space to risk my life and bomb the fucking shit out of them, it is a war to me.
I'm with you Gravity, it's a war. I just heard on MSNBC that in fact one of our jets did go down, both pilots have been recovered. Of course the Pentagon is adamently declaring the jet was not shot down.. it was mechanical failure.. Yeah right. It is a war. an unconstitutional war because obie wan did not go to the congress.
Its not rocket science we bombed Ghaddafis house and we are supporting the rebels to over throw him, we are in a war.
The people fighting Gadfi asked the UN to help them, the UN voted to do so.
Its not crazy its what happened.
I'm with you Gravity, it's a war. I just heard on MSNBC that in fact one of our jets did go down, both pilots have been recovered. Of course the Pentagon is adamently declaring the jet was not shot down.. it was mechanical failure.. Yeah right. It is a war. an unconstitutional war because obie wan did not go to the congress.
Its not rocket science we bombed Ghaddafis house and we are supporting the rebels to over throw him, we are in a war.
Yes sir, you are correct, it's far more than a UN sanctioned NO FLY zone. So much so that the Arab League has decided this is not what they opted in for.
Truth Matter walk us through the steps people need to take in order to warrant UN intervention, is it a signed petition? a notarized letter in a routing envelope?
As of right now, I have to say I'm against it. I've stated my reasons elsewhere.
I was just curious how we poll.
The people fighting Gadfi asked the UN to help them, the UN voted to do so.
Its not crazy its what happened.
Your claim that that distinguishes it from Iraq is what's crazy.
I recommend you do a quick read up on the Iraqi National Congress.
Truth Matter walk us through the steps people need to take in order to warrant UN intervention, is it a signed petition? a notarized letter in a routing envelope?
Maybe you organize a large umbrella group of various factions in your country, give it a name,
something like the Iraqi National Congress, and then compose a platform that calls for
"human rights and rule of law within a constitutional, democratic, and pluralistic Iraq; preservation of Iraq's territorial integrity, and complete compliance with international law, including United Nations resolutions relating to Iraq."
Then, of course, you go out and lobby for it.
Iraqi National Congress - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
But I guess according to TM, the motley crew of Libyans have done something significantly more substantive...
I'm looking at differently from the perspective of a Military member, if I was a fighter pilot and you are asking me to fly over Libyan air space to risk my life and bomb the fucking shit out of them, it is a war to me.
That is not what they are doing. If it was, it would be war. But they aren't, so it isn't. They are going after very specific targets. Those targets are legitimately authorized by the UN to create a 'no fly zone'. More importantly, the second part of that resolution gives consent for international forces to preemptively take out threats to civilians... and that is what they are doing.
Yesterday, a Brit mission was called off because there were civilians in the area. That mission would have gone ahead in a war... it did not.... because it ain't a war.
Wer not just creating a no fly zone though, we bombed Ghaddafis house and we are basically helping the rebels over throw him.
That is not what they are doing. If it was, it would be war. But they aren't, so it isn't. They are going after very specific targets. Those targets are legitimately authorized by the UN to create a 'no fly zone'. More importantly, the second part of that resolution gives consent for international forces to preemptively take out threats to civilians... and that is what they are doing.
Yesterday, a Brit mission was called off because there were civilians in the area. That mission would have gone ahead in a war... it did not.... because it ain't a war.
Wer not just creating a no fly zone though, we bombed Ghaddafis house and we are basically helping the rebels over throw him.
Back in '86, you mean? Because we haven't 'bombed Gaddafi's house' this time around.
The people fighting Gadfi asked the UN to help them, the UN voted to do so.
Its not crazy its what happened.
So in all the other countries where brutal governments have killed civilians none of civilian populations have asked for help?
Is that where you're taking your stand?
If the actions requested are seen as unworkable then what good are the actions?
You do what you CAN do and WHERE it can have the desired effect.
The UN may have failed to act in the past when they could have but that does not mean they should never act again.
This one is a no brainer that will work.
Ok thats 1 person, where is the official signed notarized letter from the Libyan people asking for US Cruise Missiles and fighter jets? there were several ex diplomats and ambassadors asking us to get involved in Iraq too, so that must jusify that right?
Fair enough. If that's the only thing that will convince you I will admit defeat.
I'm sorry but thats 1 man and I don't think he has the authority to speak for all the Libyan people.
