Try West Bank Settlers in Israeli Military Court Just Like Palestinians

[Phoenall]

Not a legally binding article just recommendations and wishes, the Geneva conventions are law along with the IHL and they set out the ground rules. Now when the Palestinians learn to treat Israeli children in the manner they want their children treat then there might be a change in the attitudes

What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

NONE as they prefer to torture them, sexually abuse them slit their throats and then defile their bodies once they are dead. Or haven't you been reading the papers regarding the deaths of Israeli children at the hands of the Palestinians. Or is that the news of this is suppressed in the USA because Obama does not want Americans to see the truth about the Palestinians.

Exactly. None.

YEP because they brutally rape them, torture them and the murder them before defiling their dead bodies and dumping them like rubbish.

HOW WOULD YOU FEEL IF THE ISREALIS DID THAT TO PALESTINIAN CHILDREN ?

Nice deflection.

Please provide evidence that the Palestinians routinely brutally rape and torture and defile dead Israeli children, particularly those whom they hold in custody.

The 3 boys last year that started the war, the actions in Ramallah, the Fogel children, the boys lured into a cave etc. It is so common place that Saddam was buggered with an iron bar repeatedly on his way to the gallows, a Scots schoolboy was buggered repeatedly by a gang of muslims, then had his penis hacked of and thrust down his throat before being placed on a fire to burn to death. Why do you think so many Israeli's caught by the Palestinians are in closed coffins.

 

[Coyote]

No you haven't. You've posted a link to a lengthy article because you are either too lazy or the material supporting the claim doesn't exist.

Or because the number of articles in all 4 Geneva conventions that apply to the ongoing Israeli/Palestinian conflict would take up far too much room on this board. With the Geneva conventions you need to cross reference with all the articles so you arrive at the full picture, not just take one small part because it meets with your POV and claim that that is the only part that counts.

I shall wait upon your extensive cross referencing in order to provide a full picture of why Israel is allowed to abuse children in it's custody.

I gave you the means to see where you are wrong and my post would not alter your POV one iota. You are so set in your islamonazi hatred and racism that nothing short of your own being targeted will ever make you change.

Translation: you are unable to provide what you demand of others so you will resort to throwing monkey poo.

Please provide the text that gives the full picture of why Israel is allowed to abuse children in it's custody. You can do that, right?

No I gave you the means because it is against the rules to cut and paste the full set of documents, or did you forget that you reprimanded someone for that last week. Is that what you want so you can use your "hand of god" against the opposition and have them silenced. There are 5 Geneva conventions in all and they are very comprehensive and would take every bit of this boards bandwidth. So if you give your go ahead I will post them in full, agreed.

What part of it says Israel is allowed to abuse children held in military custody?

 

[Coyote]

No you haven't. You've posted a link to a lengthy article because you are either too lazy or the material supporting the claim doesn't exist.

Or because the number of articles in all 4 Geneva conventions that apply to the ongoing Israeli/Palestinian conflict would take up far too much room on this board. With the Geneva conventions you need to cross reference with all the articles so you arrive at the full picture, not just take one small part because it meets with your POV and claim that that is the only part that counts.

I shall wait upon your extensive cross referencing in order to provide a full picture of why Israel is allowed to abuse children in it's custody.

I gave you the means to see where you are wrong and my post would not alter your POV one iota. You are so set in your islamonazi hatred and racism that nothing short of your own being targeted will ever make you change.

Translation: you are unable to provide what you demand of others so you will resort to throwing monkey poo.

Please provide the text that gives the full picture of why Israel is allowed to abuse children in it's custody. You can do that, right?

First you need to show your evidence from unbiased and non partisan sources that this is common practise, and not a once in a lifetime action.

No you haven't. You've posted a link to a lengthy article because you are either too lazy or the material supporting the claim doesn't exist.

Or because the number of articles in all 4 Geneva conventions that apply to the ongoing Israeli/Palestinian conflict would take up far too much room on this board. With the Geneva conventions you need to cross reference with all the articles so you arrive at the full picture, not just take one small part because it meets with your POV and claim that that is the only part that counts.

I shall wait upon your extensive cross referencing in order to provide a full picture of why Israel is allowed to abuse children in it's custody.

I gave you the means to see where you are wrong and my post would not alter your POV one iota. You are so set in your islamonazi hatred and racism that nothing short of your own being targeted will ever make you change.

Translation: you are unable to provide what you demand of others so you will resort to throwing monkey poo.

Please provide the text that gives the full picture of why Israel is allowed to abuse children in it's custody. You can do that, right?

First you need to show your evidence from unbiased and non partisan sources that this is common practise, and not a once in a lifetime action.

I've shown it from a number of sources - most notably UNICEF. Do you consider everything to e biased?

 

[Coyote]

What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

NONE as they prefer to torture them, sexually abuse them slit their throats and then defile their bodies once they are dead. Or haven't you been reading the papers regarding the deaths of Israeli children at the hands of the Palestinians. Or is that the news of this is suppressed in the USA because Obama does not want Americans to see the truth about the Palestinians.

Exactly. None.

YEP because they brutally rape them, torture them and the murder them before defiling their dead bodies and dumping them like rubbish.

HOW WOULD YOU FEEL IF THE ISREALIS DID THAT TO PALESTINIAN CHILDREN ?

Nice deflection.

Please provide evidence that the Palestinians routinely brutally rape and torture and defile dead Israeli children, particularly those whom they hold in custody.

The 3 boys last year that started the war, the actions in Ramallah,

They were kidnapped by extremist criminals and shot. There is no evidence that they were raped. In return, extremist criminals in Israel kidnapped and burned alive a Palestinian youth.

the Fogel children,

The Fogel children were murdered by Palestinian criminals. They were not held or incarcerated by the Palestinian government. No evidence of rape.

the boys lured into a cave etc.

Don't know about that.

It is so common place that Saddam was buggered with an iron bar repeatedly on his way to the gallows, a Scots schoolboy was buggered repeatedly by a gang of muslims, then had his penis hacked of and thrust down his throat before being placed on a fire to burn to death. Why do you think so many Israeli's caught by the Palestinians are in closed coffins.

Lots of deflection here. Most notable - no evidence of rape, torture or defilement. The cases you provide (except the last one I don't know of) - are criminal acts by criminals.

So can you provide any examples of where Palestinian authorities have abused Israeli children in custody? We have plenty of evidence that this has occurred to Palestinian children.

 

[Jroc]

Coyote, Phoenall, et al,

It has been several years back since we've seriously discussed the "Children" (minors - un-emancipated) issue.

I think the lack of progress on this, and many similar issues, have been a result of a very intensive shift in the Israeli sympathy and frustration with the Hostile Arab Palestinian. The Israelis have been accused of being the belligerent Occupation Authority for so long, that the Israeli doesn't really care any more. OH, they won't do any real harm, but they are not going to treat the children much differently then a detention authority would in any other Arab Nation.

I often wondered, given the believe structure of the Jewish People, and the civil nature of the Israeli people in general, why the State of Israel did not build and staff a state-of-the-art, combination Protection and Detention Facility, Treatment and Youth Rehabilitation Center, Basic Education and Vocational Training Activity; for 2000 offenders. And offer an opportunity for apprenticeship programs and grants for college.

The Israelis could be the showcase for the entire region. By far, such a program would have some great rewards down the road, and the cost would be minimal, say as compared to the cost of a flight of F-16 ($15M each).

My conclusion has been that the Israelis believe that the Arab Palestinian would not appreciate an such move; and in fact would object.

Most Respectfully,
R

Rocco...I disagree with this, it's just excusing Israel's actions towards Palestinian minors. Israel is not some third world country. They are a nation constantly extolled as being a beacon of democracy and human rights in a region where both are scarce. Their treatment of minors in the military justice system is long standing, and a bit of a seamy underbelly, especially when compared to the treatment of Jewish juveniles for the same crimes.

When you say: OH, they won't do any real harm, but they are not going to treat the children much differently then a detention authority would in any other Arab Nation.

According reports and accounts, they do do real harm and they go against all accepted standards of law concerning the treatment of children. Sexual abuse and threats of sexual abuse? Physical abuse? One of the things pointed out is many cases that should normally be sent to a civil system (either Israeli or Palestinian) end up going through the military system where children are most likely to suffer abuse.

Wow, that's impressive, CAIR really provides you with enough propaganda don't they .....Paid shill




The Geneva conventions state that an occupying power will install a martial law that will treat the criminal elements of the occupied in the same manner as they would be expected to be treated by the nation to who the land belongs. In this case this would be Jordanian law and what ever that law dictates is the maximum the Israeli's can impose. So a copy of the Jordanian legal statutes from 1967 needs to be read and applied to the actions of the Israeli military police force.

What do the Geneva conventions state about the treatment of children? Or, did you skip over that when you "read them in full"? I'll do your work for you this time but I suspect it's not as simple as "just the Geneva Conventions" since there are also Israeli and Palestinian civil courts.

Special Protection Of Children During Armed Conflicts Under The Geneva Conventions Regime - [2001] ISILYBIHRL 2

XIII. Detention or Internment of Children
During an armed conflict children can be interned for security reasons or can be detained for violating the penal code.

It has been discussed above that members of the same family and in particular parents and children shall be lodged together in the same place of internment throughout the duration of their internment except when separation of temporary nature is necessitated for certain reasons. Internees may request that their children who are left at liberty without parental care shall be interned with them. Interned members of the same family shall be housed in the same premises and given separate accommodation from other internees together with facilities for leading a proper family life. (Art. 82, IV Gen. Con.) The Detaining Power shall provide maintenance for the support of those dependent on the internees (Art. 81, IV Gen. Con.). Children under fifteen years of age shall be given additional food, in proportion to their physiological needs (Art. 89, IV Gen. Con.). All possible facilities for the education of children shall be ensured. They shall be allowed to attend schools either within the place of internment or outside. Special playing grounds shall be reserved for children and young people.

XIV. Penal and Disciplinary Sanction and Release of Interned Child
Internees including children shall be subject to the laws in force in the territory in which they are detained. The authorities concerned shall take into consideration the age of internee while awarding disciplinary punishment.

The parties to the conflict shall release the internee as soon as possible. They shall endeavour, during the armed conflict, to conclude agreements for the release, the repatriation, the return to places of residence or the accommodation in a neutral country of certain classes of internees in particular children, pregnant women, and mothers with infants and young children among others (Art. 132 of IV Gen. Con.).

The detaining power has been given wide discretion in the matter of release of an internee. This discretion must be exercised liberally in the interest of respect for humanitarian principles. The children are to be specially benefited because of what children represent for the future of humanity. For the same reason, pregnant women, and mothers of infants and young children are also included in the special category of internees to be considered for release, repatriation and accommodation in a neutral country.

With regard to enlistment for work, it is prescribed that a protected person may not be compelled to work unless over the age of 18 years. (Art. 51 of IV Gen. Con.) Therefore the children under 18 years cannot be compelled to work during internment.
​

Children & Detention (from the ICRC):

International humanitarian law and human rights law and standards address a broad range of issues related to the specific needs of children. For example, their families should be notified when they are detained, they should be able to stay in contact with their family, they must be housed separately from adults (other than their own family members) and age-appropriate food, health care and time for physical exercise must be provided. Children should also have access to education and legal support, and oversight systems should be in place for children to lodge complaints. Children have a particular right to privacy, including at all stages of criminal proceedings, to protect them from the stigma of being associated with criminal activity or conflict. Their names, and any other information or images that could identify them should not appear in the public domain without their informed consent, and they should not be exposed to public curiosity.

In international armed conflicts, children with prisoner-of-war status are protected under the Third Geneva Convention and Additional Protocol I and cannot be prosecuted for taking part in hostilities, while child civilians are entitled to protection under the Fourth Geneva Convention and Additional Protocol I, including
when they are detained.

In non-international armed conflicts, children are protected by Article 3 common to the four Geneva Conventions of 1949, and by Additional Protocol II. Human rights law continues to apply in such situations, in addition to domestic law, and usefully complements the protections afforded to children under humanitarian law. The Convention on the Rights of the Child has been ratified by almost every country in the world.

This is a treaty ratified by Israel.

Jewish Settlers and Palestinians occupy the same territories, under occupation, yet are dealt with in completely different legal systems. It would seem that if the "Geneva Conventions" applied to one, it should apply to the other as well.

Palestinian Children Denied Education in Israeli Prisons - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East

UN Committee on Israeli practices concerned about treatment of Palestinian children in detention

“Witnesses informed the Committee that mistreatment of Palestinian children starts from the moment of detention,” said Ambassador Palitha T.B. Kohona, Permanent Representative of Sri Lanka to the UN in New York, and Chairperson of the Committee, at the end of a fact-finding visit to Amman, Cairo and the Gaza Strip.


“Large numbers are routinely detained. Children’s homes are surrounded by Israeli soldiers late at night, sound grenades are fired into the houses, doors are broken down, live shots are often fired; no warrant is presented,” he noted. “Children are tightly bound, blindfolded and forced into the backs of military vehicles.”


Ambassador Kohona explained that parents are not allowed to accompany the detainees, and that family members are insulted, intimidated and at times physically assaulted. According to witnesses, the detention and transfer of children can last for hours, and can often include stops in Israeli settlements, Israeli checkpoints and police or military bases.


“Children are not informed of their rights, including their right to legal representation and to not incriminate themselves,” he warned. In 63% of cases involving Palestinian children, according to testimony received, Israeli officials attempt to pressure them into becoming informants. “The Committee’s view is that this is an unacceptable practice, one that Israel must end immediately.”


“Reports of the interrogation of Palestinian children are of utmost concern to the Committee, as well as conditions of detention generally,” Ambassador Kohona stressed. “Palestinian children in detention are often denied family visits, denied access to legal representation, held in cells with adults, denied access to education, and -even at the age of 12- tried in Israeli military courts.”


“We were dismayed to hear that Israel continues its practice of sentencing children to prison, or to house arrest in homes other than their own families, in effect exiling them from their families,” he said. The Committee was informed by witnesses that there were 192 children in detention, 39 were under the age of 16.

The Committee was also shocked to learn that Israel puts Palestinian children in solitary confinement. “According to testimony received, Israel uses solitary confinement against 12% of Palestinian child detainees,” Ambassador Kohona noted. “This is especially troubling when one considers that Israel arrests about 500 to 700 Palestinian children every year.” ​

 

[Phoenall]

Or because the number of articles in all 4 Geneva conventions that apply to the ongoing Israeli/Palestinian conflict would take up far too much room on this board. With the Geneva conventions you need to cross reference with all the articles so you arrive at the full picture, not just take one small part because it meets with your POV and claim that that is the only part that counts.

I shall wait upon your extensive cross referencing in order to provide a full picture of why Israel is allowed to abuse children in it's custody.

I gave you the means to see where you are wrong and my post would not alter your POV one iota. You are so set in your islamonazi hatred and racism that nothing short of your own being targeted will ever make you change.

Translation: you are unable to provide what you demand of others so you will resort to throwing monkey poo.

Please provide the text that gives the full picture of why Israel is allowed to abuse children in it's custody. You can do that, right?

No I gave you the means because it is against the rules to cut and paste the full set of documents, or did you forget that you reprimanded someone for that last week. Is that what you want so you can use your "hand of god" against the opposition and have them silenced. There are 5 Geneva conventions in all and they are very comprehensive and would take every bit of this boards bandwidth. So if you give your go ahead I will post them in full, agreed.

What part of it says Israel is allowed to abuse children held in military custody?

All children or is it just Palestinian sensationalist propaganda that has no corroborative evidence ?

 

[Phoenall]

Or because the number of articles in all 4 Geneva conventions that apply to the ongoing Israeli/Palestinian conflict would take up far too much room on this board. With the Geneva conventions you need to cross reference with all the articles so you arrive at the full picture, not just take one small part because it meets with your POV and claim that that is the only part that counts.

I shall wait upon your extensive cross referencing in order to provide a full picture of why Israel is allowed to abuse children in it's custody.

I gave you the means to see where you are wrong and my post would not alter your POV one iota. You are so set in your islamonazi hatred and racism that nothing short of your own being targeted will ever make you change.

Translation: you are unable to provide what you demand of others so you will resort to throwing monkey poo.

Please provide the text that gives the full picture of why Israel is allowed to abuse children in it's custody. You can do that, right?

First you need to show your evidence from unbiased and non partisan sources that this is common practise, and not a once in a lifetime action.

Or because the number of articles in all 4 Geneva conventions that apply to the ongoing Israeli/Palestinian conflict would take up far too much room on this board. With the Geneva conventions you need to cross reference with all the articles so you arrive at the full picture, not just take one small part because it meets with your POV and claim that that is the only part that counts.

I shall wait upon your extensive cross referencing in order to provide a full picture of why Israel is allowed to abuse children in it's custody.

I gave you the means to see where you are wrong and my post would not alter your POV one iota. You are so set in your islamonazi hatred and racism that nothing short of your own being targeted will ever make you change.

Translation: you are unable to provide what you demand of others so you will resort to throwing monkey poo.

Please provide the text that gives the full picture of why Israel is allowed to abuse children in it's custody. You can do that, right?

First you need to show your evidence from unbiased and non partisan sources that this is common practise, and not a once in a lifetime action.

I've shown it from a number of sources - most notably UNICEF. Do you consider everything to e biased?

No you show it from Palestinian sources as that is where UNICEF got the details if you look

 

[Phoenall]

NONE as they prefer to torture them, sexually abuse them slit their throats and then defile their bodies once they are dead. Or haven't you been reading the papers regarding the deaths of Israeli children at the hands of the Palestinians. Or is that the news of this is suppressed in the USA because Obama does not want Americans to see the truth about the Palestinians.

Exactly. None.

YEP because they brutally rape them, torture them and the murder them before defiling their dead bodies and dumping them like rubbish.

HOW WOULD YOU FEEL IF THE ISREALIS DID THAT TO PALESTINIAN CHILDREN ?

Nice deflection.

Please provide evidence that the Palestinians routinely brutally rape and torture and defile dead Israeli children, particularly those whom they hold in custody.

The 3 boys last year that started the war, the actions in Ramallah,

They were kidnapped by extremist criminals and shot. There is no evidence that they were raped. In return, extremist criminals in Israel kidnapped and burned alive a Palestinian youth.

the Fogel children,

The Fogel children were murdered by Palestinian criminals. They were not held or incarcerated by the Palestinian government. No evidence of rape.

the boys lured into a cave etc.

Don't know about that.

It is so common place that Saddam was buggered with an iron bar repeatedly on his way to the gallows, a Scots schoolboy was buggered repeatedly by a gang of muslims, then had his penis hacked of and thrust down his throat before being placed on a fire to burn to death. Why do you think so many Israeli's caught by the Palestinians are in closed coffins.

Lots of deflection here. Most notable - no evidence of rape, torture or defilement. The cases you provide (except the last one I don't know of) - are criminal acts by criminals.

So can you provide any examples of where Palestinian authorities have abused Israeli children in custody? We have plenty of evidence that this has occurred to Palestinian children.

Now you change the criteria as you stated the Palestinians and not the Palestinian government,

The cases are Israeli children captured by Palestinian militia and abused, tortured and defiled in the name of islam

 

[Coyote]

Exactly. None.

YEP because they brutally rape them, torture them and the murder them before defiling their dead bodies and dumping them like rubbish.

HOW WOULD YOU FEEL IF THE ISREALIS DID THAT TO PALESTINIAN CHILDREN ?

Nice deflection.

Please provide evidence that the Palestinians routinely brutally rape and torture and defile dead Israeli children, particularly those whom they hold in custody.

The 3 boys last year that started the war, the actions in Ramallah,

They were kidnapped by extremist criminals and shot. There is no evidence that they were raped. In return, extremist criminals in Israel kidnapped and burned alive a Palestinian youth.

the Fogel children,

The Fogel children were murdered by Palestinian criminals. They were not held or incarcerated by the Palestinian government. No evidence of rape.

the boys lured into a cave etc.

Don't know about that.

It is so common place that Saddam was buggered with an iron bar repeatedly on his way to the gallows, a Scots schoolboy was buggered repeatedly by a gang of muslims, then had his penis hacked of and thrust down his throat before being placed on a fire to burn to death. Why do you think so many Israeli's caught by the Palestinians are in closed coffins.

Lots of deflection here. Most notable - no evidence of rape, torture or defilement. The cases you provide (except the last one I don't know of) - are criminal acts by criminals.

So can you provide any examples of where Palestinian authorities have abused Israeli children in custody? We have plenty of evidence that this has occurred to Palestinian children.

Now you change the criteria as you stated the Palestinians and not the Palestinian government,

The cases are Israeli children captured by Palestinian militia and abused, tortured and defiled in the name of islam

No. This is what I said:

What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

Only the Palestinian government authorities can arrest and/or detain people.

The specific cases you mentioned were individual terrorists/terrorist groups committing crimes. None of those crimes were "in the name of Islam" and you have provided no evidence of torture, defilement or rape.

So we are back to the original question which you have been dancing around: What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

 

[Coyote]

I shall wait upon your extensive cross referencing in order to provide a full picture of why Israel is allowed to abuse children in it's custody.

I gave you the means to see where you are wrong and my post would not alter your POV one iota. You are so set in your islamonazi hatred and racism that nothing short of your own being targeted will ever make you change.

Translation: you are unable to provide what you demand of others so you will resort to throwing monkey poo.

Please provide the text that gives the full picture of why Israel is allowed to abuse children in it's custody. You can do that, right?

No I gave you the means because it is against the rules to cut and paste the full set of documents, or did you forget that you reprimanded someone for that last week. Is that what you want so you can use your "hand of god" against the opposition and have them silenced. There are 5 Geneva conventions in all and they are very comprehensive and would take every bit of this boards bandwidth. So if you give your go ahead I will post them in full, agreed.

What part of it says Israel is allowed to abuse children held in military custody?

All children or is it just Palestinian sensationalist propaganda that has no corroborative evidence ?

No propoganda - there is plenty of corroborative evidence. If you dispute it - then disprove it. I've provided plenty of evidence from non-propoganda and non-Palestinian sources (UNICEF).

Again, you are ducking and dancing around a straight forward question. You claim the Geneva conventions allow this - show me what part of those conventions says Israel is allowed to abuse children held in military custody?

 

[Phoenall]

YEP because they brutally rape them, torture them and the murder them before defiling their dead bodies and dumping them like rubbish.

HOW WOULD YOU FEEL IF THE ISREALIS DID THAT TO PALESTINIAN CHILDREN ?

Nice deflection.

Please provide evidence that the Palestinians routinely brutally rape and torture and defile dead Israeli children, particularly those whom they hold in custody.

The 3 boys last year that started the war, the actions in Ramallah,

They were kidnapped by extremist criminals and shot. There is no evidence that they were raped. In return, extremist criminals in Israel kidnapped and burned alive a Palestinian youth.

the Fogel children,

The Fogel children were murdered by Palestinian criminals. They were not held or incarcerated by the Palestinian government. No evidence of rape.

the boys lured into a cave etc.

Don't know about that.

It is so common place that Saddam was buggered with an iron bar repeatedly on his way to the gallows, a Scots schoolboy was buggered repeatedly by a gang of muslims, then had his penis hacked of and thrust down his throat before being placed on a fire to burn to death. Why do you think so many Israeli's caught by the Palestinians are in closed coffins.

Lots of deflection here. Most notable - no evidence of rape, torture or defilement. The cases you provide (except the last one I don't know of) - are criminal acts by criminals.

So can you provide any examples of where Palestinian authorities have abused Israeli children in custody? We have plenty of evidence that this has occurred to Palestinian children.

Now you change the criteria as you stated the Palestinians and not the Palestinian government,

The cases are Israeli children captured by Palestinian militia and abused, tortured and defiled in the name of islam

No. This is what I said:

What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

Only the Palestinian government authorities can arrest and/or detain people.

The specific cases you mentioned were individual terrorists/terrorist groups committing crimes. None of those crimes were "in the name of Islam" and you have provided no evidence of torture, defilement or rape.

So we are back to the original question which you have been dancing around: What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

They were state sanctioned terrorists as shown by the fact the state pays them or their families a pension.

As I said NONE as they murder them rather than hold them in a cell. They know that they would be accused of kidnapping in the UN and that Israel would invade and destroy them to return the children

 

[Coyote]

Nice deflection.

Please provide evidence that the Palestinians routinely brutally rape and torture and defile dead Israeli children, particularly those whom they hold in custody.

The 3 boys last year that started the war, the actions in Ramallah,

They were kidnapped by extremist criminals and shot. There is no evidence that they were raped. In return, extremist criminals in Israel kidnapped and burned alive a Palestinian youth.

the Fogel children,

The Fogel children were murdered by Palestinian criminals. They were not held or incarcerated by the Palestinian government. No evidence of rape.

the boys lured into a cave etc.

Don't know about that.

It is so common place that Saddam was buggered with an iron bar repeatedly on his way to the gallows, a Scots schoolboy was buggered repeatedly by a gang of muslims, then had his penis hacked of and thrust down his throat before being placed on a fire to burn to death. Why do you think so many Israeli's caught by the Palestinians are in closed coffins.

Lots of deflection here. Most notable - no evidence of rape, torture or defilement. The cases you provide (except the last one I don't know of) - are criminal acts by criminals.

So can you provide any examples of where Palestinian authorities have abused Israeli children in custody? We have plenty of evidence that this has occurred to Palestinian children.

Now you change the criteria as you stated the Palestinians and not the Palestinian government,

The cases are Israeli children captured by Palestinian militia and abused, tortured and defiled in the name of islam

No. This is what I said:

What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

Only the Palestinian government authorities can arrest and/or detain people.

The specific cases you mentioned were individual terrorists/terrorist groups committing crimes. None of those crimes were "in the name of Islam" and you have provided no evidence of torture, defilement or rape.

So we are back to the original question which you have been dancing around: What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

They were state sanctioned terrorists as shown by the fact the state pays them or their families a pension.

As I said NONE as they murder them rather than hold them in a cell. They know that they would be accused of kidnapping in the UN and that Israel would invade and destroy them to return the children

The murderers of the Fogels were not "state sanctioned" anything. Neither were the killers of the kidnapped boys. They were common murderers.

According to Wikipedia:

The attack was harshly condemned by the United Nations, the Quartet on the Middle East, France, Germany, the United Kingdom, the United States, and many other governments, as well as the Palestinian Authority and a number of non-governmental organizations. Xinhua, the official press agency of the People's Republic of China, stated that the attack was praised by the Palestinian Islamic Jihad. The Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades stated that "the heroic operation is a natural response to the (Israeli) occupation crimes against our people in West Bank and Gaza Strip."[11] An opinion poll indicated that 63% of Palestinians opposed and about one-third supported the attack. One of the perpetrators of the murders was described as a "hero" and a "legend" by members of his family, during a weekly program.[12]​

Given that the PA strongly condemned it, and they are the governing authority there for the Palestinians, I seriously doubt that the murderer's families recieved any sort of pension.

How long are you going to continue to spin, weave and deflect?

So, the Palestinians hold no children in detention, have - as a government authority - abused no Israeli children in detention. Nor is there evidence they have raped, tortured etc any Israeli children being held in prison.

 

[Phoenall]

The 3 boys last year that started the war, the actions in Ramallah,

They were kidnapped by extremist criminals and shot. There is no evidence that they were raped. In return, extremist criminals in Israel kidnapped and burned alive a Palestinian youth.

the Fogel children,

The Fogel children were murdered by Palestinian criminals. They were not held or incarcerated by the Palestinian government. No evidence of rape.

the boys lured into a cave etc.

Don't know about that.

It is so common place that Saddam was buggered with an iron bar repeatedly on his way to the gallows, a Scots schoolboy was buggered repeatedly by a gang of muslims, then had his penis hacked of and thrust down his throat before being placed on a fire to burn to death. Why do you think so many Israeli's caught by the Palestinians are in closed coffins.

Lots of deflection here. Most notable - no evidence of rape, torture or defilement. The cases you provide (except the last one I don't know of) - are criminal acts by criminals.

So can you provide any examples of where Palestinian authorities have abused Israeli children in custody? We have plenty of evidence that this has occurred to Palestinian children.

Now you change the criteria as you stated the Palestinians and not the Palestinian government,

The cases are Israeli children captured by Palestinian militia and abused, tortured and defiled in the name of islam

No. This is what I said:

What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

Only the Palestinian government authorities can arrest and/or detain people.

The specific cases you mentioned were individual terrorists/terrorist groups committing crimes. None of those crimes were "in the name of Islam" and you have provided no evidence of torture, defilement or rape.

So we are back to the original question which you have been dancing around: What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

They were state sanctioned terrorists as shown by the fact the state pays them or their families a pension.

As I said NONE as they murder them rather than hold them in a cell. They know that they would be accused of kidnapping in the UN and that Israel would invade and destroy them to return the children

The murderers of the Fogels were not "state sanctioned" anything. Neither were the killers of the kidnapped boys. They were common murderers.

According to Wikipedia:

The attack was harshly condemned by the United Nations, the Quartet on the Middle East, France, Germany, the United Kingdom, the United States, and many other governments, as well as the Palestinian Authority and a number of non-governmental organizations. Xinhua, the official press agency of the People's Republic of China, stated that the attack was praised by the Palestinian Islamic Jihad. The Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades stated that "the heroic operation is a natural response to the (Israeli) occupation crimes against our people in West Bank and Gaza Strip."[11] An opinion poll indicated that 63% of Palestinians opposed and about one-third supported the attack. One of the perpetrators of the murders was described as a "hero" and a "legend" by members of his family, during a weekly program.[12]​

Given that the PA strongly condemned it, and they are the governing authority there for the Palestinians, I seriously doubt that the murderer's families recieved any sort of pension.

How long are you going to continue to spin, weave and deflect?

So, the Palestinians hold no children in detention, have - as a government authority - abused no Israeli children in detention. Nor is there evidence they have raped, tortured etc any Israeli children being held in prison.

The murdering scum were part of the ruling party making them state sanctioned murderers. They even admit that themselves. Of course the P.A. condemned it in the west, while giving the scum that did the murders a pension.

 

[Coyote]

They were kidnapped by extremist criminals and shot. There is no evidence that they were raped. In return, extremist criminals in Israel kidnapped and burned alive a Palestinian youth.

The Fogel children were murdered by Palestinian criminals. They were not held or incarcerated by the Palestinian government. No evidence of rape.

Don't know about that.

Lots of deflection here. Most notable - no evidence of rape, torture or defilement. The cases you provide (except the last one I don't know of) - are criminal acts by criminals.

So can you provide any examples of where Palestinian authorities have abused Israeli children in custody? We have plenty of evidence that this has occurred to Palestinian children.

Now you change the criteria as you stated the Palestinians and not the Palestinian government,

The cases are Israeli children captured by Palestinian militia and abused, tortured and defiled in the name of islam

No. This is what I said:

What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

Only the Palestinian government authorities can arrest and/or detain people.

The specific cases you mentioned were individual terrorists/terrorist groups committing crimes. None of those crimes were "in the name of Islam" and you have provided no evidence of torture, defilement or rape.

So we are back to the original question which you have been dancing around: What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

They were state sanctioned terrorists as shown by the fact the state pays them or their families a pension.

As I said NONE as they murder them rather than hold them in a cell. They know that they would be accused of kidnapping in the UN and that Israel would invade and destroy them to return the children

The murderers of the Fogels were not "state sanctioned" anything. Neither were the killers of the kidnapped boys. They were common murderers.

According to Wikipedia:

The attack was harshly condemned by the United Nations, the Quartet on the Middle East, France, Germany, the United Kingdom, the United States, and many other governments, as well as the Palestinian Authority and a number of non-governmental organizations. Xinhua, the official press agency of the People's Republic of China, stated that the attack was praised by the Palestinian Islamic Jihad. The Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades stated that "the heroic operation is a natural response to the (Israeli) occupation crimes against our people in West Bank and Gaza Strip."[11] An opinion poll indicated that 63% of Palestinians opposed and about one-third supported the attack. One of the perpetrators of the murders was described as a "hero" and a "legend" by members of his family, during a weekly program.[12]​

Given that the PA strongly condemned it, and they are the governing authority there for the Palestinians, I seriously doubt that the murderer's families recieved any sort of pension.

How long are you going to continue to spin, weave and deflect?

So, the Palestinians hold no children in detention, have - as a government authority - abused no Israeli children in detention. Nor is there evidence they have raped, tortured etc any Israeli children being held in prison.

The murdering scum were part of the ruling party making them state sanctioned murderers. They even admit that themselves. Of course the P.A. condemned it in the west, while giving the scum that did the murders a pension.

Prove they gave the Fogel murderers pensions.

Ted Bundy, was a member of the Republican Party who's murders spanned years when the Republicans were teh "ruling party". Does that mean Ted Bundy's murders were "state sanctioned"?

This is where you need to stop digging and admit that when it comes to Palestinian children arrested and incarcerated under military justice system, Israel is pretty effed up for a country that is supposed to be a leading democratic nation in that region. No one pretends that the Palestinians are.

These are children we're talking about.

 

[Phoenall]

Now you change the criteria as you stated the Palestinians and not the Palestinian government,

The cases are Israeli children captured by Palestinian militia and abused, tortured and defiled in the name of islam

No. This is what I said:

What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

Only the Palestinian government authorities can arrest and/or detain people.

The specific cases you mentioned were individual terrorists/terrorist groups committing crimes. None of those crimes were "in the name of Islam" and you have provided no evidence of torture, defilement or rape.

So we are back to the original question which you have been dancing around: What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

They were state sanctioned terrorists as shown by the fact the state pays them or their families a pension.

As I said NONE as they murder them rather than hold them in a cell. They know that they would be accused of kidnapping in the UN and that Israel would invade and destroy them to return the children

The murderers of the Fogels were not "state sanctioned" anything. Neither were the killers of the kidnapped boys. They were common murderers.

According to Wikipedia:

The attack was harshly condemned by the United Nations, the Quartet on the Middle East, France, Germany, the United Kingdom, the United States, and many other governments, as well as the Palestinian Authority and a number of non-governmental organizations. Xinhua, the official press agency of the People's Republic of China, stated that the attack was praised by the Palestinian Islamic Jihad. The Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades stated that "the heroic operation is a natural response to the (Israeli) occupation crimes against our people in West Bank and Gaza Strip."[11] An opinion poll indicated that 63% of Palestinians opposed and about one-third supported the attack. One of the perpetrators of the murders was described as a "hero" and a "legend" by members of his family, during a weekly program.[12]​

Given that the PA strongly condemned it, and they are the governing authority there for the Palestinians, I seriously doubt that the murderer's families recieved any sort of pension.

How long are you going to continue to spin, weave and deflect?

So, the Palestinians hold no children in detention, have - as a government authority - abused no Israeli children in detention. Nor is there evidence they have raped, tortured etc any Israeli children being held in prison.

The murdering scum were part of the ruling party making them state sanctioned murderers. They even admit that themselves. Of course the P.A. condemned it in the west, while giving the scum that did the murders a pension.

Prove they gave the Fogel murderers pensions.

Ted Bundy, was a member of the Republican Party who's murders spanned years when the Republicans were teh "ruling party". Does that mean Ted Bundy's murders were "state sanctioned"?

This is where you need to stop digging and admit that when it comes to Palestinian children arrested and incarcerated under military justice system, Israel is pretty effed up for a country that is supposed to be a leading democratic nation in that region. No one pretends that the Palestinians are.

These are children we're talking about.

You prove that they were not members of hamas or fatah and were sanctioned by the state to murder Israeli's.
Ted bundy was not sanctioned by the Republicans was he as you are trying to twist the facts. All hamas members follow the hamas charter that includes the words we will not rest until every Jew has been killed or driven away and Israel is destroyed.

 

[Coyote]

No. This is what I said:
Only the Palestinian government authorities can arrest and/or detain people.

The specific cases you mentioned were individual terrorists/terrorist groups committing crimes. None of those crimes were "in the name of Islam" and you have provided no evidence of torture, defilement or rape.

So we are back to the original question which you have been dancing around: What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

They were state sanctioned terrorists as shown by the fact the state pays them or their families a pension.

As I said NONE as they murder them rather than hold them in a cell. They know that they would be accused of kidnapping in the UN and that Israel would invade and destroy them to return the children

The murderers of the Fogels were not "state sanctioned" anything. Neither were the killers of the kidnapped boys. They were common murderers.

According to Wikipedia:

The attack was harshly condemned by the United Nations, the Quartet on the Middle East, France, Germany, the United Kingdom, the United States, and many other governments, as well as the Palestinian Authority and a number of non-governmental organizations. Xinhua, the official press agency of the People's Republic of China, stated that the attack was praised by the Palestinian Islamic Jihad. The Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades stated that "the heroic operation is a natural response to the (Israeli) occupation crimes against our people in West Bank and Gaza Strip."[11] An opinion poll indicated that 63% of Palestinians opposed and about one-third supported the attack. One of the perpetrators of the murders was described as a "hero" and a "legend" by members of his family, during a weekly program.[12]​

Given that the PA strongly condemned it, and they are the governing authority there for the Palestinians, I seriously doubt that the murderer's families recieved any sort of pension.

How long are you going to continue to spin, weave and deflect?

So, the Palestinians hold no children in detention, have - as a government authority - abused no Israeli children in detention. Nor is there evidence they have raped, tortured etc any Israeli children being held in prison.

The murdering scum were part of the ruling party making them state sanctioned murderers. They even admit that themselves. Of course the P.A. condemned it in the west, while giving the scum that did the murders a pension.

Prove they gave the Fogel murderers pensions.

Ted Bundy, was a member of the Republican Party who's murders spanned years when the Republicans were teh "ruling party". Does that mean Ted Bundy's murders were "state sanctioned"?

This is where you need to stop digging and admit that when it comes to Palestinian children arrested and incarcerated under military justice system, Israel is pretty effed up for a country that is supposed to be a leading democratic nation in that region. No one pretends that the Palestinians are.

These are children we're talking about.

You prove that they were not members of hamas or fatah and were sanctioned by the state to murder Israeli's.
Ted bundy was not sanctioned by the Republicans was he as you are trying to twist the facts. All hamas members follow the hamas charter that includes the words we will not rest until every Jew has been killed or driven away and Israel is destroyed.

You have provided no evidence that the Fogel murder was state sanctioned and instead, keep demanding I prove things in order to deflect while you ignore questions.

Where in the Geneva Conventions does it allow Israel to abuse children in it's custody?

 

[P F Tinmore]

Nice deflection.

Please provide evidence that the Palestinians routinely brutally rape and torture and defile dead Israeli children, particularly those whom they hold in custody.

The 3 boys last year that started the war, the actions in Ramallah,

They were kidnapped by extremist criminals and shot. There is no evidence that they were raped. In return, extremist criminals in Israel kidnapped and burned alive a Palestinian youth.

the Fogel children,

The Fogel children were murdered by Palestinian criminals. They were not held or incarcerated by the Palestinian government. No evidence of rape.

the boys lured into a cave etc.

Don't know about that.

It is so common place that Saddam was buggered with an iron bar repeatedly on his way to the gallows, a Scots schoolboy was buggered repeatedly by a gang of muslims, then had his penis hacked of and thrust down his throat before being placed on a fire to burn to death. Why do you think so many Israeli's caught by the Palestinians are in closed coffins.

Lots of deflection here. Most notable - no evidence of rape, torture or defilement. The cases you provide (except the last one I don't know of) - are criminal acts by criminals.

So can you provide any examples of where Palestinian authorities have abused Israeli children in custody? We have plenty of evidence that this has occurred to Palestinian children.

Now you change the criteria as you stated the Palestinians and not the Palestinian government,

The cases are Israeli children captured by Palestinian militia and abused, tortured and defiled in the name of islam

No. This is what I said:

What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

Only the Palestinian government authorities can arrest and/or detain people.

The specific cases you mentioned were individual terrorists/terrorist groups committing crimes. None of those crimes were "in the name of Islam" and you have provided no evidence of torture, defilement or rape.

So we are back to the original question which you have been dancing around: What Israeli children do the Palestinians hold in their prisons or in detention?

They were state sanctioned terrorists as shown by the fact the state pays them or their families a pension.

As I said NONE as they murder them rather than hold them in a cell. They know that they would be accused of kidnapping in the UN and that Israel would invade and destroy them to return the children

Pensions are prescribed by law for those who qualify.

They do not create their laws to conform to foreign name calling.

 

[P F Tinmore]

They were state sanctioned terrorists as shown by the fact the state pays them or their families a pension.

As I said NONE as they murder them rather than hold them in a cell. They know that they would be accused of kidnapping in the UN and that Israel would invade and destroy them to return the children

The murderers of the Fogels were not "state sanctioned" anything. Neither were the killers of the kidnapped boys. They were common murderers.

According to Wikipedia:

The attack was harshly condemned by the United Nations, the Quartet on the Middle East, France, Germany, the United Kingdom, the United States, and many other governments, as well as the Palestinian Authority and a number of non-governmental organizations. Xinhua, the official press agency of the People's Republic of China, stated that the attack was praised by the Palestinian Islamic Jihad. The Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades stated that "the heroic operation is a natural response to the (Israeli) occupation crimes against our people in West Bank and Gaza Strip."[11] An opinion poll indicated that 63% of Palestinians opposed and about one-third supported the attack. One of the perpetrators of the murders was described as a "hero" and a "legend" by members of his family, during a weekly program.[12]​

Given that the PA strongly condemned it, and they are the governing authority there for the Palestinians, I seriously doubt that the murderer's families recieved any sort of pension.

How long are you going to continue to spin, weave and deflect?

So, the Palestinians hold no children in detention, have - as a government authority - abused no Israeli children in detention. Nor is there evidence they have raped, tortured etc any Israeli children being held in prison.

The murdering scum were part of the ruling party making them state sanctioned murderers. They even admit that themselves. Of course the P.A. condemned it in the west, while giving the scum that did the murders a pension.

Prove they gave the Fogel murderers pensions.

Ted Bundy, was a member of the Republican Party who's murders spanned years when the Republicans were teh "ruling party". Does that mean Ted Bundy's murders were "state sanctioned"?

This is where you need to stop digging and admit that when it comes to Palestinian children arrested and incarcerated under military justice system, Israel is pretty effed up for a country that is supposed to be a leading democratic nation in that region. No one pretends that the Palestinians are.

These are children we're talking about.

You prove that they were not members of hamas or fatah and were sanctioned by the state to murder Israeli's.
Ted bundy was not sanctioned by the Republicans was he as you are trying to twist the facts. All hamas members follow the hamas charter that includes the words we will not rest until every Jew has been killed or driven away and Israel is destroyed.

You have provided no evidence that the Fogel murder was state sanctioned and instead, keep demanding I prove things in order to deflect while you ignore questions.

Where in the Geneva Conventions does it allow Israel to abuse children in it's custody?

 

[RoccoR]

Coyote, et al,

Of course there is no law, treaty or convention that approves "child abuse."

The 2013 Report titled "Children in Israeli Military Detention" is a is a set of 38 recommendations, under 14 headings, by the United Nations Children’s Fund (UNICEF).

First, let's not over sensationalize the scope and nature of the report, the recommendations or the allegations. At the core of the report is the 25 year old foundational document called The Convention on the Rights of the Child, --- of which Article 37, prohibits torture and other cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.

You prove that they were not members of hamas or fatah and were sanctioned by the state to murder Israeli's.
Ted bundy was not sanctioned by the Republicans was he as you are trying to twist the facts. All hamas members follow the hamas charter that includes the words we will not rest until every Jew has been killed or driven away and Israel is destroyed.

You have provided no evidence that the Fogel murder was state sanctioned and instead, keep demanding I prove things in order to deflect while you ignore questions.

Where in the Geneva Conventions does it allow Israel to abuse children in it's custody?[/QUOTE]
(THE ALLEGATION)

Section F: Conclusions ​

"Ill-treatment of Palestinian children in the Israeli military detention system appears to be widespread, systematic and institutionalized. This conclusion is based on the repeated allegations about such treatment over the past 10 years and the volume, consistency and persistence of these allegations. The review of cases documented through the monitoring and reporting mechanism on grave child rights violations, as well as interviews conducted by UNICEF with Israeli and Palestinian lawyers and Palestinian children, also support this conclusion.

The pattern of ill-treatment includes the arrests of children at their homes between midnight and 5:00 am by heavily armed soldiers; the practice of blindfolding children and tying their hands with plastic ties; physical and verbal abuse during transfer to an interrogation site, including the use of painful restraints; lack of access to water, food, toilet facilities and medical care; interrogation using physical violence and threats; coerced confessions; and lack of access to lawyers or family members during interrogation.

Treatment inconsistent with child rights continues during court appearances, including shackling of children; denial of bail and imposition of custodial sentences; and transfer of children outside occupied Palestinian territory to serve their sentences inside Israel. The incarceration isolates them from their families and interrupts their studies.

These practices are in violation of international law that protects all children against ill-treatment when in contact with law enforcement, military and judicial institutions.

The April 2010 announcement by Israeli military officials of changes to the hand-tying procedure is a positive development. So too is military order 1676 (September 2011), which introduced requirements for the police (though not the army) to notify parents about the arrest of their children and to inform children that they have the right to consult a lawyer. Further measures should be introduced to ensure the protection of children under military detention and compliance of the system with international norms and regulations, as well as to dissipate false allegations of misconduct by the authorities."​

(COMMENT)

All Human Rights (HR) champions, tend to over dramatize HR interest stories, and generally always advocate on the liberal side of the administration. Of the 19 different Human Rights organization that routinely file reports against Israel, but rarely against any Arab or Muslim State ( UN child rights committee publishes findings on States reviewed during its latest session: Eritrea, Mexico, Ghana, Honduras, Ethiopia, Netherlands, Lao PDR and Israel 10 June 2015), UNICEF is but one. Only about half of them are, by definition, Treaty-based bodies; in this case, Committee on the Rights of the Child (CRC). If you read the report, nowhere does it accuse the Israelis of child abuse in the classical sense. The report is actually an advocacy document on the development of police and judicial procedures and the course of action that should be taken. It openly admits that its position is in the best interest of the Children in Question and at Risk; and that Israel's position should be in the best interests of the child --- as a primary consideration. This is in contrast to the more far-reaching political and law enforcement and security considerations entailed as an element of tension between occupation law’s requirement and the child advocacy program for youthful offenders.

None of the 38 recommendations, under 14 headings, have anything to do with the lack of access to food and water, toilet facilities or medical care. And recommendation #1, while it mention the need for "(i) Israel acting in the best interests of the child shall be a primary consideration; acting in a (ii) Non-discrimination; (iii) Use of detention only as a measure of last resort; and implying that Israel should consider (iv) Alternatives to detention; and finally, UNICEF had the audacity to act as a legislative body and suggest (v) Diversion --- meaning that the youthful offenders under detention --- "should be channelled away from judicial proceedings."

In section G - Recommendations,

1. Compliance with international norms and regulations
• Military Order 1676 (September 2011), Further measures should be introduced to ensure the protection of children under military detention and compliance of the system with international norms and regulations, as well as to dissipate false allegations of misconduct by the authorities.

2. Notification
* The April 2010 announcement by Israeli military officials of changes to the hand-tying procedure is a positive development. So too is military order 1676 (September 2011), which introduced requirements for the police (though not the army) to notify parents about the arrest of their children and to inform children that they have the right to consult a lawyer.

3. Timing of arrests and arrest warrants
• Not addressed in the CRC.

4. Methods and instruments of restraint
• Not addressed in the CRC.

5. Strip searches
• Not addressed in the CRC.

6. Access to a lawyer
• This is addressed in the "Body of Principles for the Protection of All Persons under Any Form of Detention or Imprisonment" Adopted by General Assembly resolution 43/173 of 9 December 1988;" and the "International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights" General Assembly resolution 2200A (XXI) of 16 December 1966.

7. Judicial review of the arrest and detention
• What "ISRAELI LAW" says is: "The officer may delay the arraignment for an additional 24 hours for the same reason, provided that he/she explains his/her decision in writing and obtains the approval of the relevant approving authority. A delay of over 72 hours also requires the approval of the Head of the Investigations Department of the Israel Security Agency (ISA), or his/her deputy. In any case, the maximum delay should not exceed 96 hours from the time of arrest." However, this does not apply to a Military Court.

8. Medical examinations
• I saw no allegation that access to adequate medical care at all times war routinely denied.

9. Questioning or interrogation
• This is a matter for the courts to decide. The UNiCEF Report is attempting to measure the standard under Israeli Law. Not necessarily under the Geneva Code.

10. Solitary confinement
• Not addressed in the CRC. This is not torture, if properly administered. This is essentially putting the child in "time-out" zones and/or being "sent to your room." Solitary confinement is a corrections policy that need to be overseen by reasonable people. This is not a UNICEF issue unless the allegation is physical mistreatment or torture.

11. Confessional evidence
• Not addressed in the CRC. This is a matter for the courts to decide, not the UNICEF. Although it seems reasonable.

12. Bail and plea bargains
• Not addressed in the CRC.

13. Location of detention and access to relatives
• Granted, given reasonableness.

14. Accountability
• The UNICEF or the UN Special Rapporteur (OPT), are not competent to conduct any sort of Effective Investigation and Documentation of Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment even if the General Assembly Resolution on the Question of torture and other cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment (A/56/156) was binding and applicable. I find it unnecessary to question the integrity of the entirety of the Israeli system based on a small compilation of complaints in the decades in which the Palestinians have decided to institute a belligerent occupation.
​

All but three of the recommendations deal with the handling and administration of youthful offenders. It should be noted that the Convention on the Rights of the Child (CRC) does not address domestic or occupation law enforcement issues of youthful offenders. Israel has an obligation to "restore and ensure – as far as possible – public order and safety while respecting, unless absolutely prevented, the laws in force in the country.

Convention (IV) respecting the Laws and Customs of War on Land and its annex: Regulations concerning the Laws and Customs of War on Land. The Hague, 18 October 1907.

Article 43: The authority of the legitimate power having in fact passed into the hands of the occupant, the latter shall take all the measures in his power to restore, and ensure, as far as possible, public order and safety, while respecting, unless absolutely prevented, the laws in force in the country.
​

It is important to understand that, as the hostility of the Arab Palestinian in the occupied territories continues to grow, and the leadership and parental guidance embrace confrontation, the problem of juvenile delinquency will also grow. And the more the adult population chooses to advance the cause of jihad and armed struggle --- so will increase the probability that the young adult and adolescent will immolate that stance. The risk of confrontation will grow and there will be even more adverse events in the handling of such youthful offenders that are growing into a mature Hostile Arab Palestinian.

(EPILOG)

This UNICEF Report (2013) is based on information that is more than 5 years old. Even if the reader is totally anti-Israeli, they cannot overlook the improvements the Israelis made without regard to the release of these report.

The Israeli military order most relevant to this report is Military Order 1651. This order came into effect on 2 May 2010 and incorporates a number of previous military orders relating to children, including Military Order 132 (Adjudication of Juvenile Delinquents) and Military Order 1644 (Establishing a Juvenile Military Court). Military Order 1651 also contains the main jurisdictional provisions and specifies the main offences with which Palestinians, including children, who are living in areas under full Israeli control are charged, which were previously contained in Military Order 378 (Security Directives).

In September 2009, in response to documentation of the prosecution of children as young as in adult military courts, Israel established a juvenile military court.15 It is understood that this is the first and only juvenile military court in operation in the world. In fact, it uses the same facilities and court staff as the adult military court.
​

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

Coyote, et al,

Of course there is no law, treaty or convention that approves "child abuse."

The 2013 Report titled "Children in Israeli Military Detention" is a is a set of 38 recommendations, under 14 headings, by the United Nations Children’s Fund (UNICEF).

First, let's not over sensationalize the scope and nature of the report, the recommendations or the allegations. At the core of the report is the 25 year old foundational document called The Convention on the Rights of the Child, --- of which Article 37, prohibits torture and other cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.

You prove that they were not members of hamas or fatah and were sanctioned by the state to murder Israeli's.
Ted bundy was not sanctioned by the Republicans was he as you are trying to twist the facts. All hamas members follow the hamas charter that includes the words we will not rest until every Jew has been killed or driven away and Israel is destroyed.

You have provided no evidence that the Fogel murder was state sanctioned and instead, keep demanding I prove things in order to deflect while you ignore questions.

Where in the Geneva Conventions does it allow Israel to abuse children in it's custody?

(THE ALLEGATION)

Section F: Conclusions ​

"Ill-treatment of Palestinian children in the Israeli military detention system appears to be widespread, systematic and institutionalized. This conclusion is based on the repeated allegations about such treatment over the past 10 years and the volume, consistency and persistence of these allegations. The review of cases documented through the monitoring and reporting mechanism on grave child rights violations, as well as interviews conducted by UNICEF with Israeli and Palestinian lawyers and Palestinian children, also support this conclusion.

The pattern of ill-treatment includes the arrests of children at their homes between midnight and 5:00 am by heavily armed soldiers; the practice of blindfolding children and tying their hands with plastic ties; physical and verbal abuse during transfer to an interrogation site, including the use of painful restraints; lack of access to water, food, toilet facilities and medical care; interrogation using physical violence and threats; coerced confessions; and lack of access to lawyers or family members during interrogation.

Treatment inconsistent with child rights continues during court appearances, including shackling of children; denial of bail and imposition of custodial sentences; and transfer of children outside occupied Palestinian territory to serve their sentences inside Israel. The incarceration isolates them from their families and interrupts their studies.

These practices are in violation of international law that protects all children against ill-treatment when in contact with law enforcement, military and judicial institutions.

The April 2010 announcement by Israeli military officials of changes to the hand-tying procedure is a positive development. So too is military order 1676 (September 2011), which introduced requirements for the police (though not the army) to notify parents about the arrest of their children and to inform children that they have the right to consult a lawyer. Further measures should be introduced to ensure the protection of children under military detention and compliance of the system with international norms and regulations, as well as to dissipate false allegations of misconduct by the authorities."​

(COMMENT)

All Human Rights (HR) champions, tend to over dramatize HR interest stories, and generally always advocate on the liberal side of the administration. Of the 19 different Human Rights organization that routinely file reports against Israel, but rarely against any Arab or Muslim State ( UN child rights committee publishes findings on States reviewed during its latest session: Eritrea, Mexico, Ghana, Honduras, Ethiopia, Netherlands, Lao PDR and Israel 10 June 2015), UNICEF is but one. Only about half of them are, by definition, Treaty-based bodies; in this case, Committee on the Rights of the Child (CRC). If you read the report, nowhere does it accuse the Israelis of child abuse in the classical sense. The report is actually an advocacy document on the development of police and judicial procedures and the course of action that should be taken. It openly admits that its position is in the best interest of the Children in Question and at Risk; and that Israel's position should be in the best interests of the child --- as a primary consideration. This is in contrast to the more far-reaching political and law enforcement and security considerations entailed as an element of tension between occupation law’s requirement and the child advocacy program for youthful offenders.

None of the 38 recommendations, under 14 headings, have anything to do with the lack of access to food and water, toilet facilities or medical care. And recommendation #1, while it mention the need for "(i) Israel acting in the best interests of the child shall be a primary consideration; acting in a (ii) Non-discrimination; (iii) Use of detention only as a measure of last resort; and implying that Israel should consider (iv) Alternatives to detention; and finally, UNICEF had the audacity to act as a legislative body and suggest (v) Diversion --- meaning that the youthful offenders under detention --- "should be channelled away from judicial proceedings."

In section G - Recommendations,

1. Compliance with international norms and regulations
• Military Order 1676 (September 2011), Further measures should be introduced to ensure the protection of children under military detention and compliance of the system with international norms and regulations, as well as to dissipate false allegations of misconduct by the authorities.

2. Notification
* The April 2010 announcement by Israeli military officials of changes to the hand-tying procedure is a positive development. So too is military order 1676 (September 2011), which introduced requirements for the police (though not the army) to notify parents about the arrest of their children and to inform children that they have the right to consult a lawyer.

3. Timing of arrests and arrest warrants
• Not addressed in the CRC.

4. Methods and instruments of restraint
• Not addressed in the CRC.

5. Strip searches
• Not addressed in the CRC.

6. Access to a lawyer
• This is addressed in the "Body of Principles for the Protection of All Persons under Any Form of Detention or Imprisonment" Adopted by General Assembly resolution 43/173 of 9 December 1988;" and the "International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights" General Assembly resolution 2200A (XXI) of 16 December 1966.

7. Judicial review of the arrest and detention
• What "ISRAELI LAW" says is: "The officer may delay the arraignment for an additional 24 hours for the same reason, provided that he/she explains his/her decision in writing and obtains the approval of the relevant approving authority. A delay of over 72 hours also requires the approval of the Head of the Investigations Department of the Israel Security Agency (ISA), or his/her deputy. In any case, the maximum delay should not exceed 96 hours from the time of arrest." However, this does not apply to a Military Court.

8. Medical examinations
• I saw no allegation that access to adequate medical care at all times war routinely denied.

9. Questioning or interrogation
• This is a matter for the courts to decide. The UNiCEF Report is attempting to measure the standard under Israeli Law. Not necessarily under the Geneva Code.

10. Solitary confinement
• Not addressed in the CRC. This is not torture, if properly administered. This is essentially putting the child in "time-out" zones and/or being "sent to your room." Solitary confinement is a corrections policy that need to be overseen by reasonable people. This is not a UNICEF issue unless the allegation is physical mistreatment or torture.

11. Confessional evidence
• Not addressed in the CRC. This is a matter for the courts to decide, not the UNICEF. Although it seems reasonable.

12. Bail and plea bargains
• Not addressed in the CRC.

13. Location of detention and access to relatives
• Granted, given reasonableness.

14. Accountability
• The UNICEF or the UN Special Rapporteur (OPT), are not competent to conduct any sort of Effective Investigation and Documentation of Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment even if the General Assembly Resolution on the Question of torture and other cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment (A/56/156) was binding and applicable. I find it unnecessary to question the integrity of the entirety of the Israeli system based on a small compilation of complaints in the decades in which the Palestinians have decided to institute a belligerent occupation.
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All but three of the recommendations deal with the handling and administration of youthful offenders. It should be noted that the Convention on the Rights of the Child (CRC) does not address domestic or occupation law enforcement issues of youthful offenders. Israel has an obligation to "restore and ensure – as far as possible – public order and safety while respecting, unless absolutely prevented, the laws in force in the country.

Convention (IV) respecting the Laws and Customs of War on Land and its annex: Regulations concerning the Laws and Customs of War on Land. The Hague, 18 October 1907.

Article 43: The authority of the legitimate power having in fact passed into the hands of the occupant, the latter shall take all the measures in his power to restore, and ensure, as far as possible, public order and safety, while respecting, unless absolutely prevented, the laws in force in the country.
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It is important to understand that, as the hostility of the Arab Palestinian in the occupied territories continues to grow, and the leadership and parental guidance embrace confrontation, the problem of juvenile delinquency will also grow. And the more the adult population chooses to advance the cause of jihad and armed struggle --- so will increase the probability that the young adult and adolescent will immolate that stance. The risk of confrontation will grow and there will be even more adverse events in the handling of such youthful offenders that are growing into a mature Hostile Arab Palestinian.

(EPILOG)

This UNICEF Report (2013) is based on information that is more than 5 years old. Even if the reader is totally anti-Israeli, they cannot overlook the improvements the Israelis made without regard to the release of these report.

The Israeli military order most relevant to this report is Military Order 1651. This order came into effect on 2 May 2010 and incorporates a number of previous military orders relating to children, including Military Order 132 (Adjudication of Juvenile Delinquents) and Military Order 1644 (Establishing a Juvenile Military Court). Military Order 1651 also contains the main jurisdictional provisions and specifies the main offences with which Palestinians, including children, who are living in areas under full Israeli control are charged, which were previously contained in Military Order 378 (Security Directives).

In September 2009, in response to documentation of the prosecution of children as young as in adult military courts, Israel established a juvenile military court.15 It is understood that this is the first and only juvenile military court in operation in the world. In fact, it uses the same facilities and court staff as the adult military court.
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Most Respectfully,
R

...to restore, and ensure, as far as possible, public order and safety,...​

What public order and safety are they proporting to restore?