Tolerance: Allowing people to be who and what they are.

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by Foxfyre, Jan 1, 2014.

  1. Foxfyre
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    Foxfyre Eternal optimist Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    The topic is tolerance in government, in politics, in society, in the workplace, in media, in living our lives, in participating as members at USMB.

    This can be a whole new discussion or a continuation of one started in the Politics thread but alas was not able to stay on topic there.

    I am not so interested in discussing what we should tolerate or allow of what people DO that affects others physically or materially--those things that require contribution or participation by others.

    I am interested in discussing tolerance for what people THINK, BELIEVE, and/or who people ARE that requires no contribution or participation by others--that does not affect others in any way. Allowing people to be what and who they are even if we disagree with them or dislike them intensely.

    That kind of tolerance seems to be in short supply in modern day American society--I don't know whether it is better in other developed countries or not. There seems to be a compulsion to punish people physically and/or materially--even to the point of trying to destroy people entirely--if we don't like something they say or they express a belief we don't share.

    We see it manifested in the media every day, expressed in Congress, expressed by the President, expressed by angry mobs or mobilization by powerful organizations to go after somebody, and even in neg reps at USMB for no other reason than somebody expressed a point of view or opinion that another member doesn't share. And it is not an exclusively partisan phenomenon as we see it manifested both from the left and the right.

    I think it is a dangerous trend that could cost us most or all of our unalienable rights and liberties if we don't nip this in the bud.

    What do you think?
     
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2014
  2. Asclepias
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    Asclepias Work Hard Play Hard

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    I think that true tolerance is an idea that will never be achieved. It simply is against human nature. No one is going to be tolerant of say someone wishing to oppress them. They are going to do everything in their power to nip that sort of thinking in the bud.

    Before there is action there is a thought. If people with certain thoughts that are detrimental to society as a whole are allowed a platform, they can and will influence others to take up those same thoughts. A good example of that is Hitler. People were tolerant of Hitler and look what happened.
     
  3. Mac1958
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    Mac1958 Diamond Member

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    .

    I agree completely that the current climate is fraught with dangers. My take on it is that it's a cultural issue. We've become a terribly narcissistic society - and I do mean us, Americans, specifically - and there are examples and causes all around us.

    Examples like the Selfie Generation -- hey, have I coined a phrase? Kids all want to be internet celebrities; the proliferation of reality teevee that makes superstars out of people with no discernible talent; cell phones that allow kids to take literally thousands and thousands of pictures of themselves. As for adults, we listen to people like Limbaugh and Levin and Maddow and Schultz and we want to be just as one-sided and closed-minded as they are.

    Worse, it all feeds on itself.

    As a result of this cultural narcissism, civility is viewed as some kind of capitulation, intolerance is viewed as strength. When we have a significant part of the society that literally does not want to hear opposing views, when they literally want to punish a person for expressing their views, we have a real problem.

    If I'm right and it's a cultural issue, it can only be reversed through the culture. By leaders from multiple walks of life who are brave and strong enough to fight against it. I don't see anyone like that on the horizon.

    .
     
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    Last edited: Jan 1, 2014
  4. Mojo2
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    Mojo2 Gold Member

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    I watched a video recently that was so spot on and explained the answer to your subject so well that I felt compelled to post a link to it here as well as posting it as the featured subject matter of it's own thread.

    The video is full of information and I am in the middle of watching it a second time, it is so good.

    Here is a link to it.

    Once you watch it you should have an answer to your question.

    Really.

    It's THAT good!


     
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    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 18, 2014
  5. Derideo_Te
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    Derideo_Te Je Suis Charlie

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    Intolerance is nothing new. It is only in the past year that the law banning someone from marrying the consenting adult of their choice was partially overturned and states still have the ability to be intolerant on that issue. So as far as a trend goes this is just another blip on the chart. Overall there is a trend towards greater tolerance but it isn't happening overnight.

    As far as the intolerance towards holding a bigoted position goes that won't go away either. And even it when it does it will simply be replaced by a different one because there are some who are so insecure they need some way to make themselves feel "superior" to others. This is a part of human nature and try as we might it will take far longer to "evolve" than any of us will be around to observe.

    When it comes to being "dangerous" I don't see it that way at all. Short of censorship freedom of speech is the bigots best friend. And no, I don't advocate censorship because the appropriate response to bigotry is public ridicule in my opinion. We the People shape our own society to reflect who we are. Demographics show that we are changing into a more diverse and accepting society than before. Yes, there are throwbacks and reactionaries and ugly incidents because no change is without turmoil. But it is all part of the process.

    We the People have a sound basis for our society and I have no doubt that if we were to fall into a coma and waken 100 years hence we would find that while superficial appearances will be different (just as they were 100 years ago) society will still be much as it ever was. And yes, bigotry will still exist only it will probably have dwindled to just treating Atheists as outcasts.
     
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  6. Derideo_Te
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    Derideo_Te Je Suis Charlie

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    :lmao: that anyone could actually swallow that kind of partisan drivel! :cuckoo:
     
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  7. Dont Taz Me Bro
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    Dont Taz Me Bro USMB Mod Staff Member Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    In my own observations, those who scream tolerance the most tend to be the worst offenders.
     
  8. Asclepias
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    Asclepias Work Hard Play Hard

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    Is it even possible to be tolerant of intolerant people?
     
  9. Derideo_Te
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    Derideo_Te Je Suis Charlie

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    Yes!

    I ignore them right here in the USMB.

    They can spout off as much as they like and I have no problem with it whatsoever. In fact I support their right to do so. I tolerate their intolerance because their freedom and mine are indivisible.
     
  10. Asclepias
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    How would you feel if someone on here influenced a person to kill a school full of say Asians because you were tolerant of their view and ignored them? What if your voice in opposition was the lone reason that person decided not to do it?
     

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