Tim Tebow Super Bowl Ad May Be Based On Falsehood

[geauxtohell]

I think we all (men and women) are the final arbiters on what medical proceedures we will or won't undergo. We can have all sorts of reasons that we think are important enough to ignore medical advice, even if it costs us our lives. In the end, it is, and I think it should be, the patient who tells the doctor how to proceed and not the other way around.

I agree. As I said, I see the abortion issue as a patient autonomy issue. Patients have the right to refuse medical advice, even if it is detrimental to their health. As a student, I've seen patients refuse to take insulin, even though it is inevitably going to result in their early demise.

That being said, on the larger issue, I find it to be poor form for FOTF to run an ad where they advocate women ignoring medical advice. If it becomes an issue, I don't see how they won't get blow back from it.

In whatever decision making capacity I have into the matter, if I was given the choice between the chance that my wife would die or be seriously harmed versus carrying a baby to term, that would be a no brainer. (I realize that men have no legal rights to compel or prevent their wives from carrying a child, I just said that for perspective).

I would think that most men, would take the position that if they had to choose between the woman and the baby, they would choose the woman. I don't know too many men who would insist on a woman going through with a pregnancy if there were a serious threat to her life.

I don't think many women would either. I think Tebow's mom is the exception. If her placenta was truly abrupted, it was tremendiously risky for her to carry the baby to term.

The placenta, when exposed, has a ton of tissue factor in it that sets off the bodies clotting cascade so that you have thousands of microemboli going through your system. As if that wasn't bad enough, once you've exhausted the equillibrium of your clotting factors, the body can't stop any bleed and the real danger is that a person will hemorrhage and die of shock.

If that was truly the situation, she was pretty brave.

Placental abruption is a medical emergency that always calls for immediate intervention.*


*This statement made by a mediocre medical student and not a real doctor.

 

[dilloduck]

Illegal doesn't mean it can not happen. I'll wait until a better source other than HP presents information on this.

It's always an option; not taking it doesn't remove the option.

Does choice only apply if the woman opts for abortion? That's what I'm trying to understand here.

Opting to give birth is the weenie choice. You only are brave and independent if you opt to abort. Giving any credit to a woman who opts to give birth steals everyone elses thunder.

Weenies are part of why there is even a debate on this!!

You keep my weenie outta this !!

 

[CurveLight]

Opting to give birth is the weenie choice. You only are brave and independent if you opt to abort. Giving any credit to a woman who opts to give birth steals everyone elses thunder.

Weenies are part of why there is even a debate on this!!

You keep my weenie outta this !!

Don't think that would be difficult. Word is you once lost your weenie in a thimble. That came out of a Barbie Doll house.


(couldn't resist! Lol....you can't leave a set up like that and expect no response)

 

[Dr Gregg]

No surprising, most of the pro life arguments (I think anti-choice is more fitting of a name than pro life) are generally based on falsehoods. They just can't stand that people don't think the same as them, and they have to lie and twist things to make an argument. Not all, but many I've seen do this.

It's just incredible they would spend close to 3 million dollars on a 30 second commercial when that money could actually make an impact and help to reduce unwanted babies. Provide support for poor or teen mothers. BUt instead they just want to force people to live by their standards.

FoF is nuts, they will preach abstinence only is the way to go, which doesn't work and leads to unwanted pregnancies and probably more abortions, refusing to stand behind sex education that combines the two (birth control methods and abstinence).

yet another example of people not facing the realities of life, and nothing gets done.

 

[Dr Gregg]

Well I still don't understand the controversy. Why do the pro-CHOICE people flip the fuck out whenever someone CHOOSES life? Isn't that one of the "options" discussed at Planned Parenthood? Or maybe not...

/'

Nobody flips out when someone chooses life, its when they try to ram that decision down other people's throats like I'm pretty sure this commercial is going to do.

Most people would prefer to not have abortions, its not taken lightly.

 

[Dr Gregg]

Well I still don't understand the controversy. Why do the pro-CHOICE people flip the fuck out whenever someone CHOOSES life? Isn't that one of the "options" discussed at Planned Parenthood? Or maybe not...

Same reason that our local Pro choice bunch are busy trying to throw dirt on the story. They are NOT about choice unless that CHOICE is to abort. Anyone willing to choice life is just wrong and has to be brought to understand not to share those thoughts and feelings with impressionable women of any age. Better that they be taught that choice means having an abortion cause they don't want to get fat while carrying the baby.

This is exactly the type of lie I mentioned. Nobody promotes abortion, but they allow people to make their own reproductive choices, as many pro choice people probably wouldn't have an abortion. But I guess you can keep telling yourself that as to demonize people that have different opinions of you. Doesn't really bode well for your argument IMO

 

[chanel]

Well I still don't understand the controversy. Why do the pro-CHOICE people flip the fuck out whenever someone CHOOSES life? Isn't that one of the "options" discussed at Planned Parenthood? Or maybe not...

/'

Nobody flips out when someone chooses life, its when they try to ram that decision down other people's throats like I'm pretty sure this commercial is going to do.

Most people would prefer to not have abortions, its not taken lightly.

Oh really? Is that why the people at Planned Parenthood are prevented from using the word "baby"? Is that why the Planned Parenthood website state that there are generally no "long term effects"? Is that why CHILDREN can make that decision themselves?

I happen to be pro-choice. In fact I used to contribute to Planned Parenthood because I thought they were providing a needed service in preventing teen pregnancy. But they are not. They are a business just like any other who needs to maintain/expand their market to keep themselves solvent. Economics 101.

If Planned Parenthood can advertise in schools, I don't see any reason why these people can't advertise on T.V.

 

[rightwinger]

Well I still don't understand the controversy. Why do the pro-CHOICE people flip the fuck out whenever someone CHOOSES life? Isn't that one of the "options" discussed at Planned Parenthood? Or maybe not...

Same reason that our local Pro choice bunch are busy trying to throw dirt on the story. They are NOT about choice unless that CHOICE is to abort. Anyone willing to choice life is just wrong and has to be brought to understand not to share those thoughts and feelings with impressionable women of any age. Better that they be taught that choice means having an abortion cause they don't want to get fat while carrying the baby.

This is exactly the type of lie I mentioned. Nobody promotes abortion, but they allow people to make their own reproductive choices, as many pro choice people probably wouldn't have an abortion. But I guess you can keep telling yourself that as to demonize people that have different opinions of you. Doesn't really bode well for your argument IMO

You are right. Nobody promotes having an abortion....EVER
If Tebows mom can tell about how she was told that having a baby could kill her but she did it anyway and ended up with a Heisman winning QB as a son...what would be the outcry if the other side ran ads about women who didn't abort and ended up dying?

 

[chanel]

She wouldn't be famous. And what if the other side showed a commercial about a woman who died AFTER getting an abortion?

Nobody promotes having an abortion - EVER? Wrong.

When interviewed, many crisis pregnancy center counselors and volunteers working with post-abortive women say the remark they've heard most is: "I felt I had no choice." In a survey published by the American Family Association Journal in 2002:

•56% felt pressured by other people or circumstances.

•84% stated they would have chosen otherwise if different options had been presented.

•40% were still hoping for other options while at the abortion clinic in a confused state of mind, but didn't get any (abortion clinics are not required to present other choices in every state).

In Everett's Blood Money, she reveals being paid $25 for each abortion she sold when she worked for other clinics, and was impressed with the amount of money to be made. "We did not discuss alternatives to abortion, Everett said. "Our counselors were paid generously to sell a product, and that's what they did."

http://www.lydias-house.com/gpage6.html

 

[CurveLight]

She wouldn't be famous. And what if the other side showed a commercial about a woman who died AFTER getting an abortion?

Nobody promotes having an abortion - EVER? Wrong.

When interviewed, many crisis pregnancy center counselors and volunteers working with post-abortive women say the remark they've heard most is: "I felt I had no choice." In a survey published by the American Family Association Journal in 2002:

•56% felt pressured by other people or circumstances.

•84% stated they would have chosen otherwise if different options had been presented.

•40% were still hoping for other options while at the abortion clinic in a confused state of mind, but didn't get any (abortion clinics are not required to present other choices in every state).

In Everett's Blood Money, she reveals being paid $25 for each abortion she sold when she worked for other clinics, and was impressed with the amount of money to be made. "We did not discuss alternatives to abortion, Everett said. "Our counselors were paid generously to sell a product, and that's what they did."

Exploring 12 common myths about legal abortion

Gotta worthwhile source?

 

[chanel]

That's it. Not going to research a 2002 article, when then you'll ask for something more recent. Find conflicting stats and we can talk.

It doesn't matter what those numbers are. Rightwinger said it never happens.

 

[CurveLight]

That's it. Not going to research a 2002 article, when then you'll ask for something more recent. Find conflicting stats and we can talk.

It doesn't matter what those numbers are. Rightwinger said it never happens.

Homey don't play dat.

 

[Dr Gregg]

Well I still don't understand the controversy. Why do the pro-CHOICE people flip the fuck out whenever someone CHOOSES life? Isn't that one of the "options" discussed at Planned Parenthood? Or maybe not...

/'

Nobody flips out when someone chooses life, its when they try to ram that decision down other people's throats like I'm pretty sure this commercial is going to do.

Most people would prefer to not have abortions, its not taken lightly.

Oh really? Is that why the people at Planned Parenthood are prevented from using the word "baby"? Is that why the Planned Parenthood website state that there are generally no "long term effects"? Is that why CHILDREN can make that decision themselves?

I happen to be pro-choice. In fact I used to contribute to Planned Parenthood because I thought they were providing a needed service in preventing teen pregnancy. But they are not. They are a business just like any other who needs to maintain/expand their market to keep themselves solvent. Economics 101.

If Planned Parenthood can advertise in schools, I don't see any reason why these people can't advertise on T.V.

No, its because they use scientific terms, like embryo and fetus, since they are different than a born 'baby"

PP is a non profit organization, they offer cheap birth control options as well as other reproductive options. They don't push abortion, that's absurd, they let the patient decide wha'ts right for them. They can advertise on TV all they want, its just an incredible waste of money and their resources when they should be more focused on limiting abortions instead of trying to make it illegal, that's my point

From their website: If you are trying to decide if abortion is the right choice for you, you probably have many things to think about. Learning the facts about abortion may help you in making your decision. You may also want to learn more about parenting and adoption.

does that look like they are pushinb abortion? This is the type of lies and mudslinging garbage I'm talking about

 

[Anguille]

She wouldn't be famous. And what if the other side showed a commercial about a woman who died AFTER getting an abortion?

Nobody promotes having an abortion - EVER? Wrong.

When interviewed, many crisis pregnancy center counselors and volunteers working with post-abortive women say the remark they've heard most is: "I felt I had no choice." In a survey published by the American Family Association Journal in 2002:

•56% felt pressured by other people or circumstances.

•84% stated they would have chosen otherwise if different options had been presented.

•40% were still hoping for other options while at the abortion clinic in a confused state of mind, but didn't get any (abortion clinics are not required to present other choices in every state).

In Everett's Blood Money, she reveals being paid $25 for each abortion she sold when she worked for other clinics, and was impressed with the amount of money to be made. "We did not discuss alternatives to abortion, Everett said. "Our counselors were paid generously to sell a product, and that's what they did."

Exploring 12 common myths about legal abortion

lydia's house is pretty secretive about their mission and sponsors. None are listed.

The welcome page says this: "Lydia's House does not accept government grants or support that would prohibit us from teaching the Bible. We unashamedly teach that Jesus is the answer.'

 

[Dr Gregg]

She wouldn't be famous. And what if the other side showed a commercial about a woman who died AFTER getting an abortion?

Nobody promotes having an abortion - EVER? Wrong.

When interviewed, many crisis pregnancy center counselors and volunteers working with post-abortive women say the remark they've heard most is: "I felt I had no choice." In a survey published by the American Family Association Journal in 2002:

•56% felt pressured by other people or circumstances.

•84% stated they would have chosen otherwise if different options had been presented.

•40% were still hoping for other options while at the abortion clinic in a confused state of mind, but didn't get any (abortion clinics are not required to present other choices in every state).

In Everett's Blood Money, she reveals being paid $25 for each abortion she sold when she worked for other clinics, and was impressed with the amount of money to be made. "We did not discuss alternatives to abortion, Everett said. "Our counselors were paid generously to sell a product, and that's what they did."

Exploring 12 common myths about legal abortion

You call that a legit source, somebody made a website, it must be true. The opening page has a picture of somebody praying. yeah, I'm going to believe that crap from a clearly biased pro life website. Get real

 

[CurveLight]

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d.html/178-0454894-6789516?rn=0&a=0880705485&er=1]Blood Money: Getting Rich Off a Woman's Right to Choose:Amazon:Books[/ame]

 

[Dr Gregg]

Blood Money: Getting Rich Off a Woman's Right to Choose:Amazon:Books

anybody can write a book and spout their biases, there is no fact checking required, just look at palin's book

 

[CurveLight]

Blood Money: Getting Rich Off a Woman's Right to Choose:Amazon:Books

anybody can write a book and spout their biases, there is no fact checking required, just look at palin's book

Soon as you show where I claimed the book was accurate then your post will make sense. All I did was provide a reliable link the book does exist.

 

[bodecea]

Well I still don't understand the controversy. Why do the pro-CHOICE people flip the fuck out whenever someone CHOOSES life? Isn't that one of the "options" discussed at Planned Parenthood? Or maybe not...

Same reason that our local Pro choice bunch are busy trying to throw dirt on the story. They are NOT about choice unless that CHOICE is to abort. Anyone willing to choice life is just wrong and has to be brought to understand not to share those thoughts and feelings with impressionable women of any age. Better that they be taught that choice means having an abortion cause they don't want to get fat while carrying the baby.

This is exactly the type of lie I mentioned. Nobody promotes abortion, but they allow people to make their own reproductive choices, as many pro choice people probably wouldn't have an abortion. But I guess you can keep telling yourself that as to demonize people that have different opinions of you. Doesn't really bode well for your argument IMO

Exactly...if you were to believe the Clerk....funny tho that may sound, then Pro-Abortion folks would be haunting the obi-gyn wards trying to force people into getting abortion...maybe holding up signs of dead pregnant women and blocking obi-gyn clinics to force their view. Maybe even shooting a few obi-gyn doctors if they insist on continuing help women carry to term.

 

[CaféAuLait]

It appears his mother did not have a choice for two reasons. The first is it was illegal. The second is she had a position of no abortions. She couldn't make the choice to abort because abortion was not an option.
It will send the message that if you truly celebrate family then you will join the anti-Choice crowd and imply you really don't love life or your family.

All that being said. This has to be one of the dumbest fucking protests I've seen since prohibition.

Of course it was an option - an option recommended by her doctor - but it was an option that she did not choose.

Many people balk when 'pro-choice' is equated to 'pro-abortion' and yet . . . . when a woman is pregnant there are only two options, carry the pregnancy to term or abort. 'Anti-choice crowd'? Does choice only apply if the woman opts for abortion?

How was it an option if abortions were illegal? How was it an option if she had a position of no options?

It is still illegal today...

Just because it is 'illegal' does not mean they are not being done:

The Department of Health has created a program to address the complications of unsafe abortion, Prevention and Management of Abortion and its Complications. This program had been tested in 17 government-run hospitals by 2003. [3]

Abortion in the Philippines - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia