Tim Tebow Super Bowl Ad May Be Based On Falsehood

[Queen]

I disagree. She had the "option" of an abortion. The fact that she chose not to exercise that option is her decision and the reason(s) that she made that choice is/are immaterial.

Also, you don't know what they are trying to say. You have not seen the ad. Until we do, we only have the protest groups outrage at the fact that Mrs Tebow chose life.

Immie

OMG do you people even care a little about the truth?

She had no OPTION of an abortion.

Not in the Phillipines.

Abortion under any circumstance is ILLEGAL there.

 

[Immanuel]

I disagree. She had the "option" of an abortion. The fact that she chose not to exercise that option is her decision and the reason(s) that she made that choice is/are immaterial.

Also, you don't know what they are trying to say. You have not seen the ad. Until we do, we only have the protest groups outrage at the fact that Mrs Tebow chose life.

Immie

OMG do you people even care a little about the truth?

She had no OPTION of an abortion.

Not in the Phillipines.

Abortion under any circumstance is ILLEGAL there.

OMG! Is your head buried in the frigging sand. She had an option. It would have been an illegal abortion, but the option was there.

You guys are always claiming that not given the option of a legal abortion, women will chose the illegal option and die. Now, you want to say there is no illegal option for convenience sake?

Immie

 

[code1211]

I never heard of this tebow guy and can't help but wonder why anyone gives a flying fuck about what he says enough to warrant multiple threads

He's a college quarterback. A pretty good one.

This qualifies him as an expert on most topics.

This is why Jeanine Garofalo is qualified to vomit opinions on anything in front of a camera and why Nancy Pelosi is suddenly a medical expert.

We live in a society that cannot distinguish between wisdom and fame.

No, we live in a society that has never seen wisdom so alll we have to rely on is fame.

We've seen it. Usually it's contained in our humor. Mark Twain and Will Rogers come to mind.

 

[Zoom-boing]

I will comment when you respect the conversation. Kind of silly to ignore simple questions and put words in others mouths and expect a response.

This is what you just did with me. As noted above, you said 'I'm saying you're trying to equate the unborn with the born'. YOU put words into MY mouth. I did answer your question, again, as noted above.

Explain your scrambled eggs/dancing chicken analogy cause I don't know what you mean by it.

OMG It's not hard to understand.

You say a cluster of cells in a uterus is a child.

Do you think that when you order eggs for breakfast you're going to get a chicken dinner?

No, I didn't. If you had bothered to read my posts I said that what grows inside of a woman is human life. Note the conversation I had earlier with CL, below.

You're trying to equate the unborn with the born. If you order scrambled eggs for breakfast are you asking for dancing chickens?

Are you saying that what grows inside of a woman isn't human? Isn't life?

No that isn't what I'm saying. I'm saying you're trying to equate the unborn with the born. If you order scrambled eggs for breakfast are you asking for dancing chickens?
What is your answer?

CL put words into my mouth - as you just did - saying I was equating the unborn (scrambled eggs) with the born (dancing chicken). No, I wasn't. You and CL need to go back and actually read what I've posted.

I'll reiterate my point again for the both of you.

A six week old fetus is not the same as a 6 week old birthed baby is not the same as a 6 year old child is not the same as a 60 year old.

From conception to death humans develop, grow, change. But the commonality in a 6 week old fetus to a 60 year old is that they are both human life. Different stages of human life? To be sure, but human life none the less.

 

[blu]

I knew the liberal vampires would try to bring this poor kid down

keep talking, it will backfire right in your stupid abortion loving faces.

no one has to bring him down, he already sucks both on and off the field. he will have 1 or 2 years top in the nfl.

 

[blu]

Simply because it is illegal in the Philippines does not mean that it does not happen. My Gosh! Maybe the Pro-choice lobbyists have been lying to us all along. They tell us that before Roe women went to the back alleys to get illegal abortions and that if Roe is overturned it will happen all over again.
Are you claiming that is a lie?
Immie

The problem is pure deception. They tried to say she didn't abort purely out of a moral conviction and we now know that is not true. Her choice was based on 6 in one hand and half a dozen in the other. A back door abortion would have been no less risky than continuing the pregnancy. She's looking like a WMD Palin reject that got tedowed by common sense.

his parents were Christian missionaries. She was not going to have an abortion for any reason. She is not a liar.

learn2read. she said it was suggested to abort him, and that is under dispute

 

[beowolfe]

Because abortion under any circumstance has been illegal in the Philippines since 1930 and is punishable by a six-year prison term, Allred says she finds it hard to believe that doctors would have recommended the procedure.

Oh yes, I believe everything Gloria Allred says.

Isn't she one who continually claimed that if abortion were made illegal again we would go back to "doctors" performing back alley abortions? That would insinuate that a doctor would recommend an abortion and do so in a presumably unhealthy environment... i.e. a back alley.

Why would she even think that the same thing would not happen in the Philippines?

The attorney, who has represented a roster of famous clients, claims she will lodge a complaint with the FCC and FTC "if this ad airs and fails to disclose that abortions were illegal at the time Ms. Tebow made her choice," according to RadarOnline.

Who cares if they point out that abortions were illegal in the Philippines at the time? What difference does that make? If the ad is true then someone recommended that Mrs. Tebow have an abortion and she chose life instead. Now, Allred and crew want to make her out to be a devil for doing so? How frigging sick can Allred be?

It makes no difference whether or not the abortion was legal.

Oh and does this mean that Tim Tebow cannot be President? Was he born in the Philippines? Do we have a birth certificate for him? Tell me it is not a Hawaiin Birth Certificate... please!

Immie

I think you're missing the point. I'm not a Gloria Allred fan, but what she's hypothosizing is that if abortions were illegal in the Phillipiines at the time, that it would have been unlikely a Phillipine doctor who grew up with the restrictions would recommend an abortion. Not having checked if Allred is correct on the Phillipine restriction, I wouldn't jump to support nor reject her premise. Instead of having a 'knee jerk' reaction to her, I'm going to check to see if she is correct.

 

[Avatar4321]

You're trying to equate the unborn with the born. If you order scrambled eggs for breakfast are you asking for dancing chickens?

Are you saying that what grows inside of a woman isn't human? Isn't life?

No that isn't what I'm saying. I'm saying you're trying to equate the unborn with the born. If you order scrambled eggs for breakfast are you asking for dancing chickens?
What is your answer?

I guess that depends. Do you tend to scamble fertilized eggs? or are you civilized like the rest of us.

 

[beowolfe]

Because abortion under any circumstance has been illegal in the Philippines since 1930 and is punishable by a six-year prison term, Allred says she finds it hard to believe that doctors would have recommended the procedure.

Oh yes, I believe everything Gloria Allred says.

Isn't she one who continually claimed that if abortion were made illegal again we would go back to "doctors" performing back alley abortions? That would insinuate that a doctor would recommend an abortion and do so in a presumably unhealthy environment... i.e. a back alley.

Why would she even think that the same thing would not happen in the Philippines?

The attorney, who has represented a roster of famous clients, claims she will lodge a complaint with the FCC and FTC "if this ad airs and fails to disclose that abortions were illegal at the time Ms. Tebow made her choice," according to RadarOnline.

Who cares if they point out that abortions were illegal in the Philippines at the time? What difference does that make? If the ad is true then someone recommended that Mrs. Tebow have an abortion and she chose life instead. Now, Allred and crew want to make her out to be a devil for doing so? How frigging sick can Allred be?

It makes no difference whether or not the abortion was legal.

Oh and does this mean that Tim Tebow cannot be President? Was he born in the Philippines? Do we have a birth certificate for him? Tell me it is not a Hawaiin Birth Certificate... please!

Immie

I think you're missing the point. I'm not a Gloria Allred fan, but what she's hypothosizing is that if abortions were illegal in the Phillipiines at the time, that it would have been unlikely a Phillipine doctor who grew up with the restrictions would recommend an abortion. Not having checked if Allred is correct on the Phillipine restriction, I wouldn't jump to support nor reject her premise. Instead of having a 'knee jerk' reaction to her, I'm going to check to see if she is correct.

I'm unable to quickly very the 1930 date, but abortions are indeed illegal in the Phillipines. Does that mean that some doctor in a Phillipino hospital didn't suggest she have an abortion? No. It doesn't mean that. However, if it happened, it does appear the doctor was taking a big risk.

 

[CurveLight]

Someone earlier said $2.5 million and that it could have been put to better use actually helping people in need. Geez, if I am not mistaken it was you. If so, you would be right.

Immie

That was me.

Ah hell! I'm not going to say that YOU were right. At least not twice in one day. Your head might begin to swell.

Immie

Ask around....it can't possibly swell anymore! Lol.

 

[Immanuel]

Because abortion under any circumstance has been illegal in the Philippines since 1930 and is punishable by a six-year prison term, Allred says she finds it hard to believe that doctors would have recommended the procedure.

Oh yes, I believe everything Gloria Allred says.

Isn't she one who continually claimed that if abortion were made illegal again we would go back to "doctors" performing back alley abortions? That would insinuate that a doctor would recommend an abortion and do so in a presumably unhealthy environment... i.e. a back alley.

Why would she even think that the same thing would not happen in the Philippines?

The attorney, who has represented a roster of famous clients, claims she will lodge a complaint with the FCC and FTC "if this ad airs and fails to disclose that abortions were illegal at the time Ms. Tebow made her choice," according to RadarOnline.

Who cares if they point out that abortions were illegal in the Philippines at the time? What difference does that make? If the ad is true then someone recommended that Mrs. Tebow have an abortion and she chose life instead. Now, Allred and crew want to make her out to be a devil for doing so? How frigging sick can Allred be?

It makes no difference whether or not the abortion was legal.

Oh and does this mean that Tim Tebow cannot be President? Was he born in the Philippines? Do we have a birth certificate for him? Tell me it is not a Hawaiin Birth Certificate... please!

Immie

I think you're missing the point. I'm not a Gloria Allred fan, but what she's hypothosizing is that if abortions were illegal in the Phillipiines at the time, that it would have been unlikely a Phillipine doctor who grew up with the restrictions would recommend an abortion. Not having checked if Allred is correct on the Phillipine restriction, I wouldn't jump to support nor reject her premise. Instead of having a 'knee jerk' reaction to her, I'm going to check to see if she is correct.

I followed some links. It appears that she is correct about abortion being illegal in the Philippines. According to pro-choice lobbyists, it should not matter that abortion is illegal as we have all been told that if abortions are illegal women will go to the back alleys to get what they need.

Immie

 

[CurveLight]

Are you saying that what grows inside of a woman isn't human? Isn't life?

No that isn't what I'm saying. I'm saying you're trying to equate the unborn with the born. If you order scrambled eggs for breakfast are you asking for dancing chickens?
What is your answer?

I guess that depends. Do you tend to scamble fertilized eggs? or are you civilized like the rest of us.

Irony in glimmer. Those who claim to be the most pro life are the fastest to avoid it.

 

[Immanuel]

Oh yes, I believe everything Gloria Allred says.

Isn't she one who continually claimed that if abortion were made illegal again we would go back to "doctors" performing back alley abortions? That would insinuate that a doctor would recommend an abortion and do so in a presumably unhealthy environment... i.e. a back alley.

Why would she even think that the same thing would not happen in the Philippines?



Who cares if they point out that abortions were illegal in the Philippines at the time? What difference does that make? If the ad is true then someone recommended that Mrs. Tebow have an abortion and she chose life instead. Now, Allred and crew want to make her out to be a devil for doing so? How frigging sick can Allred be?

It makes no difference whether or not the abortion was legal.

Oh and does this mean that Tim Tebow cannot be President? Was he born in the Philippines? Do we have a birth certificate for him? Tell me it is not a Hawaiin Birth Certificate... please!

Immie

I think you're missing the point. I'm not a Gloria Allred fan, but what she's hypothosizing is that if abortions were illegal in the Phillipiines at the time, that it would have been unlikely a Phillipine doctor who grew up with the restrictions would recommend an abortion. Not having checked if Allred is correct on the Phillipine restriction, I wouldn't jump to support nor reject her premise. Instead of having a 'knee jerk' reaction to her, I'm going to check to see if she is correct.

I'm unable to quickly very the 1930 date, but abortions are indeed illegal in the Phillipines. Does that mean that some doctor in a Phillipino hospital didn't suggest she have an abortion? No. It doesn't mean that. However, if it happened, it does appear the doctor was taking a big risk.

As would she, if she had taken that option.

It seems to me, because I am not denying the fact of back alley abortions when abortion is illegal, that doctors take that risk for the right price.

Also, according to the articles, everyone is assuming that it was a doctor that advised her of the option, and maybe it was. It might also have been a nurse. I'll wait to see the ad itself.

Several good points have been brought up about this ad from what I would call the "other" side. I've mixed feelings on the ad itself, but not the right of FotF to broadcast it.

Immie

 

[Anguille]

Tim Tebow Super Bowl Ad May Be Based On Falsehood


bwhahahaha. I hope this is real just to make tebow look dumber than he already does

 

[beowolfe]

I can see scenarios in my mind that would show how it could have happened and how it probably did not happen.

1. A Phillipino doctor sympathetic to a woman's right to choose, saw an American woman with a distressed pregancy. Since she was in the Phillipines, he could have assumed that she had money and could afford it and suggested it. I thnk this scenario would depend on the doctor not knowing she was a christian missionary.

2. There is no way a Phillipino doctor would recommend an abortion to an American christian missionary IF he knew she was a missionary. He would be taking the risk of being turned in to the authorities since abortion was illegal at the time.

2.

 

[geauxtohell]

I can see scenarios in my mind that would show how it could have happened and how it probably did not happen.

1. A Phillipino doctor sympathetic to a woman's right to choose, saw an American woman with a distressed pregancy. Since she was in the Phillipines, he could have assumed that she had money and could afford it and suggested it. I thnk this scenario would depend on the doctor not knowing she was a christian missionary.

2. There is no way a Phillipino doctor would recommend an abortion to an American christian missionary IF he knew she was a missionary. He would be taking the risk of being turned in to the authorities since abortion was illegal at the time.

2.

Or

3. "You will die if we don't terminate your pregnancy, too bad you are in the Phillipines were it is illegal, but if you fly back to the states, the Doctors will tell you the same thing."

I am not so quick to call Tebow's mom a liar. In fact, I don't see it as terribly germane to the issue. What I do see as germane is FOTF advocating that women ignore medical advice.

I don't see why that hasn't been brought up.

 

[geauxtohell]

The fact is that there are two parts of the "pro-choice" movement.

You have the people who profit from abortion, Planned Parenthood, Gloria Allred, NOW, NARAL, Emily's List etc. These are the people who could almost be termed Pro-abortion.

But, then you have the vast majority of pro-choice people. These are the people who do not profit from the procedure but look at the issue and whether or not they would ever consider the option of abortion, believe that the decision lies solely with the pregnant mother and that this is not something that the government should interfere with in any way whatsoever.

To claim that this second group is "pro-abortion" is not only wrong but detrimental to the cause of defending life. It is no less wrong than claiming that the pro-life movement is "anti-choice".

Immie

On that note, I see the "pro-life" movement as being similar with two distinct groups.

There are those that are truly "pro-life" and oppose any form of destruction of life, to include the death penalty and un-necessary war. I would put the Catholic Church in that catagory.

Then there are those who are simply "anti-abortion" and could give a flip about anything but that issue. I put FOTF in that catagory. For that group, I really think the abortion issue is simply a means to assimilate money and power.

Case in point, there is nothing "pro-life" about this guy.

Activist Roeder convicted of abortion provider's murder - CNN.com

He is a fucking assassin. Pure and simple.

 

[beowolfe]

I can see scenarios in my mind that would show how it could have happened and how it probably did not happen.

1. A Phillipino doctor sympathetic to a woman's right to choose, saw an American woman with a distressed pregancy. Since she was in the Phillipines, he could have assumed that she had money and could afford it and suggested it. I thnk this scenario would depend on the doctor not knowing she was a christian missionary.

2. There is no way a Phillipino doctor would recommend an abortion to an American christian missionary IF he knew she was a missionary. He would be taking the risk of being turned in to the authorities since abortion was illegal at the time.

2.

Or

3. "You will die if we don't terminate your pregnancy, too bad you are in the Phillipines were it is illegal, but if you fly back to the states, the Doctors will tell you the same thing."

I am not so quick to call Tebow's mom a liar. In fact, I don't see it as terribly germane to the issue. What I do see as germane is FOTF advocating that women ignore medical advice.

I don't see why that hasn't been brought up.

I think we all (men and women) are the final arbiters on what medical proceedures we will or won't undergo. We can have all sorts of reasons that we think are important enough to ignore medical advice, even if it costs us our lives. In the end, it is, and I think it should be, the patient who tells the doctor how to proceed and not the other way around. Which is why I'm pro choice.

 

[geauxtohell]

I can see scenarios in my mind that would show how it could have happened and how it probably did not happen.

1. A Phillipino doctor sympathetic to a woman's right to choose, saw an American woman with a distressed pregancy. Since she was in the Phillipines, he could have assumed that she had money and could afford it and suggested it. I thnk this scenario would depend on the doctor not knowing she was a christian missionary.

2. There is no way a Phillipino doctor would recommend an abortion to an American christian missionary IF he knew she was a missionary. He would be taking the risk of being turned in to the authorities since abortion was illegal at the time.

2.

Or

3. "You will die if we don't terminate your pregnancy, too bad you are in the Phillipines were it is illegal, but if you fly back to the states, the Doctors will tell you the same thing."

I am not so quick to call Tebow's mom a liar. In fact, I don't see it as terribly germane to the issue. What I do see as germane is FOTF advocating that women ignore medical advice.

I don't see why that hasn't been brought up.

I think we all (men and women) are the final arbiters on what medical proceedures we will or won't undergo. We can have all sorts of reasons that we think are important enough to ignore medical advice, even if it costs us our lives. In the end, it is, and I think it should be, the patient who tells the doctor how to proceed and not the other way around.

I agree. As I said, I see the abortion issue as a patient autonomy issue. Patients have the right to refuse medical advice, even if it is detrimental to their health. As a student, I've seen patients refuse to take insulin, even though it is inevitably going to result in their early demise.

That being said, on the larger issue, I find it to be poor form for FOTF to run an ad where they advocate women ignoring medical advice. If it becomes an issue, I don't see how they won't get blow back from it.

In whatever decision making capacity I have into the matter, if I was given the choice between the chance that my wife would die or be seriously harmed versus carrying a baby to term, that would be a no brainer. (I realize that men have no legal rights to compel or prevent their wives from carrying a child, I just said that for perspective).

 

[beowolfe]

Or

3. "You will die if we don't terminate your pregnancy, too bad you are in the Phillipines were it is illegal, but if you fly back to the states, the Doctors will tell you the same thing."

I am not so quick to call Tebow's mom a liar. In fact, I don't see it as terribly germane to the issue. What I do see as germane is FOTF advocating that women ignore medical advice.

I don't see why that hasn't been brought up.

I think we all (men and women) are the final arbiters on what medical proceedures we will or won't undergo. We can have all sorts of reasons that we think are important enough to ignore medical advice, even if it costs us our lives. In the end, it is, and I think it should be, the patient who tells the doctor how to proceed and not the other way around.

I agree. As I said, I see the abortion issue as a patient autonomy issue. Patients have the right to refuse medical advice, even if it is detrimental to their health. As a student, I've seen patients refuse to take insulin, even though it is inevitably going to result in their early demise.

That being said, on the larger issue, I find it to be poor form for FOTF to run an ad where they advocate women ignoring medical advice. If it becomes an issue, I don't see how they won't get blow back from it.

In whatever decision making capacity I have into the matter, if I was given the choice between the chance that my wife would die or be seriously harmed versus carrying a baby to term, that would be a no brainer. (I realize that men have no legal rights to compel or prevent their wives from carrying a child, I just said that for perspective).

I would think that most men, would take the position that if they had to choose between the woman and the baby, they would choose the woman. I don't know too many men who would insist on a woman going through with a pregnancy if there were a serious threat to her life.