The Wall.

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by pegwinn, Dec 20, 2005.

  1. pegwinn
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    pegwinn Top of the Food Chain

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    Well I haven't heard anything new about birthright citizenship issue, but on the immigration front, Mexico is whining an awful lot about the rising anti-immigration stance. Figures, sending money to Mexico via illegal immigrants is likely in the top ten percent of the countries GDP.

    Check out this on the wall. Comments in boxes are mine.


    Mexican Ads Target U.S. Border Wall Plan
    Tuesday, December 20, 2005



    MEXICO CITY — The Mexican government, angered by a U.S. proposal to extend a wall along the border to keep out migrants, pledged Tuesday to block the plan and organize an international campaign against it.

    Facing a growing tide of anti-immigrant sentiment north of the border, the Mexican government has taken out ads urging Mexican workers to denounce rights violations in the United States. It also is hiring an American public relations firm to improve its image and counter growing U.S. concerns about immigration.


    Mexican President Vicente Fox denounced the U.S. measures, passed by the House of Representatives on Friday, as "shameful" and his foreign secretary, Luis Ernesto Derbez, echoed his complaints on Tuesday.

    "Mexico is not going to bear, it is not going to permit, and it will not allow a stupid thing like this wall," Derbez said.

    "What has to be done is to raise a storm of criticism, as is already happening, against this," he said, promising to turn the international community against the plan.

    Some stretches of the U.S.-Mexico border are already marked by fences, but in some heavily-trafficked sections walls have already been erected by the United States, often using 10-foot-high sections of military surplus steel. Those sections, which typically run several miles, can be found in southern Arizona and California.

    It's hard to underestimate the ill-feeling the proposal has generated in Mexico, where editorial pages are dominated by cartoons of Uncle Sam putting up walls bearing anti-Mexican messages.

    Many Mexicans, especially those who have spent time working in the U.S., feel the proposal is a slap in the face to those who work hard and contribute to the U.S. economy.

    Fernando Robledo, 42, of the western state of Zacatecas, says the proposals could stem migration and disrupt families by breaking cross-border ties.

    "When people heard this, it worried everybody, because this will affect everybody in some way, and their families," Robledo said. "They were incredulous. How could they do this, propose something like this?"

    Robledo, whose son and mother are U.S. citizens, predicted the measure "would unleash conflict within the United States" as small businesses fail for lack of workers.

    He said many Mexicans felt betrayed by the anti-immigrant sentiment.

    "We learned to believe in the United States. We have a binational life," he said of Zacatecas, a state that has been sending migrants north for more than a century. "It isn't just a feeling of rejection. It's against what we see as part of our life, our culture, our territory."

    The government is scrambling to fight on two fronts. On Monday, it announced it had hired Allyn & Company, a Dallas-based public relations company to help improve Mexico's image and stem the immigration backlash.

    "If people in the U.S. and Canada had an accurate view of the success of democracy, political stability and economic prosperity in Mexico, it would improve their views on specific bilateral issues like immigration and border security," Rob Allyn, president of the PR firm, told The Associated Press Tuesday.

    Jose Luis Soberanes, head of the government's National Human Rights Commission, suggested Mexico go further.

    "I would expect more energetic reactions from our authorities," Soberanes told local media. "It's preferable to have a more demanding government, more confrontation with the United States."

    Mexico has also said it is recruiting U.S. church, community and business groups to oppose the proposal.

    And the government has stepped up its defense of migrants, airing a series of radio spots here aimed at migrants returning home for the holidays.

    "Had a labor accident in the United States? You have rights ... Call," reads the ad, sponsored by Mexico's Foreign Relations Department, which has helped migrants bring compensation suits in the United States.

    The sense of dread connected with the measures is hardly restricted to Mexico. Immigrant advocacy and aid groups in the United States are worried about provisions of the House bill that upgrade unlawful presence in the United States from a civil offense to a felony.

    "It would have a horrific impact on immigrants right organizing and immigrant communities" in the United States, said Jennifer Allen of the Tucson, Ariz.-based Red de Accion Fronteriza.

    The mistaken belief that the proposals are a done deal — they must still be submitted to the Senate — have caused "just complete fear and shock" among some activists and immigrants, Allen said.

    The House bill, passed on a 239-182 vote, includes a proposal to build 700 miles of additional fence through parts of California, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas. It would also enlist military and local law enforcement to help stop illegal entrants and require employers to verify the legal status of their workers.

    Mexicans are outraged by the proposed measures, especially the extension of the border wall, which many liken to the Berlin Wall. Some are urging their government to fight it fiercely.

    "Our president should oppose that wall and make them stop it, at all costs," said Martin Vazquez, 26, at the Mexico City airport as he returned from his job as a hotel worker in Las Vegas. "More than just insulting, it's terrible."

    source
     
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  2. MtnBiker
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    MtnBiker Senior Member

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    Imagine if we took that approach with say Canada, basically calling them an annex of our country and their resources were really our resources.

    And the Mexican culture is not our culture! Perhaps the legal immigrants from that country should assimalite to our country and not the other way around.
     
  3. insein
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    insein Senior Member

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    was about to post the same thing. I think this issue is ridiculous. Just to illustrate how much so it is, try crossing into mexico illegally without a passport. See how long it takes for federalis to return you to the US.

    Fox is a retard. He knows whats at stake but he makes an assinine argument about it.
     
  4. Mr. P
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    Mr. P Senior Member

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    Didn’t we do this Alamo stuff already?
     
  5. sitarro
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    sitarro Gold Member Supporting Member

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    I got picked up by 3 Federalis in Tijuana one night because the moron I was with had thrown rocks off the bridge we walked across to get there. The owner of the imobile-home that the rocks hit had called them and pointed us out on the street. It did'nt help that I had been living in Del Mar for a month surfing everyday and had hair below my shoulders and a sunstreaked beard(1976).These greasy assholes threw us in their green and white Impala, never called in to headquarters and took us for a ride down a very dark, deserted dirt road. I had heard about the jail in Tijuana and really didn't want to go so I was trying to figure out how we were going to kill these 3 guys when they grabbed my wallet and started looking through it. He asked us if we had money for jail and I asked how much. He responded with "how much you got?". It cost me a 20(God was smiling down on me) and they brought us back to the border crossing and told us to stay out of Mexico. When I got within a few steps of the border I turned and flipped them off and let go of a number of expletives, I have not been back since and will not actively seek going ever again althought I always wanted to race in the Baja 1000 and I do like Don Julio Blanco Tequila.
    You know now that I think about it, I didn't have a passport and was never asked for it.
     
  6. Adam's Apple
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    Adam's Apple Senior Member

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    Here's an article by Rich Lowry on the "border fence=Berlin Wall" nonsense. What will they think up next?

    Tear Down This Analogy
    Insulting Berlin Wall comparisons.
    By Rich Lowry, National Review
    December 20, 2005

    Last week, the House of Representatives voted to establish a dictatorship in the United States and to prevent hopeless citizens from escaping it. That, at least, is what the casual listener might have concluded from the rhetoric mustered in opposition to the building of a better security fence on the U.S.-Mexico border.

    The Berlin Wall was the analogy of choice for opponents of the border-fence project, passed as part of an immigration-enforcement bill. Democrats invoked the analogy during the debate, and Mexico's Human Rights Commission denounced the "tendency to criminalize migration with a wall that calls to mind the Berlin Wall." We are a long way from Robert Frost and "good fences make good neighbors." Are the old East German secret police — the Stasi — about to be recommissioned to bring their skills at maintaining border obstacles to the Rio Grande?

    Hardly. There is an elementary moral distinction between a wall built to keep people out and one designed to keep people in. If West Berliners had been desperate to scale the wall to escape tyranny and take advantage of East Berlin's labor market and freedoms, there might be something to the Berlin Wall analogy. Of course, it was the opposite.

    This and other subtleties got lost. Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee (D., Texas), accused Republicans of offering "the old Berlin Wall, again separating the north from the south." Does she think the wall kept South Berliners from escaping into North Berlin? She went on to rewrite the history of the wall in a manner only the Politburo could appreciate, "It kept people out, and it kept people in." As if there was ever any danger of a mass exodus from West to East to take advantage of the workers' paradise.

    One columnist warned, recalling President Reagan's famous speech at the Brandenburg Gate, "The very possibility of a Mexican president someday standing at the Laredo Gate calling out 'Mr. President, tear down this wall,' should concern anyone with historical perspective." Reagan issued his challenge because he knew West Germany represented a better, more just form of government, one that people would vote in favor with their feet. A Mexican president would call for the elimination of a border fence knowing that his government is corrupt and incompetent, depending on the social and economic safety valve of migration to the north.

    for full article: http://www.nationalreview.com/lowry/lowry.asp
     
  7. insein
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    insein Senior Member

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    These douchebags dont get it do they? Either that or they are purposely misleading the public on this issue for their own political gain.

    Mexicans can still come to this country. Always have and always will be. This just channels them through the proper ports so we know who is here. The fence isnt keeping anyone from getting in and it certainly isnt stopping the mass exodus to the luxurious Mexican Empire. These politicians need to be slapped upside the head for their blatant ignorance.
     
  8. pegwinn
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    pegwinn Top of the Food Chain

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    Good point. Personally I would install an RFID chip in all illegals we caught. First offense is deportation with the option of coming back legally. Second offense is a chain gang somewhere in say....... the everglades?
     
  9. Annie
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    Annie Diamond Member

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    I've only heard negatives up until this on the fence and it's effectiveness, links at site:

    http://polipundit.com/index.php?p=11777

     

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