School drops the Pledge of Allegiance

[BrianH]

Tradition is fine. It shouldn't be legislated by Blue Laws because not all of us share the same religion. Everyone should be able to choose if it's something we'd close our business for or not. So, if you choose to close shop. Cool. More power to ya. But if I want *my* business closed on Saturday, but opened on Sunday, that should be ok, too. That way we all tolerate each other.

Well that's the way it is now. Business owners can and do stay open on Sundays if they wish. I used to work for NAPA and my boss had his store open on Sundays. He eventually had to close because most people around here didn't do jack on Sundays and it cost more for him to stay open and pay us than to just close up shop. But I do agree with you. It's all about toleration.

 

[Shogun]

Except that... marriage IS a right.

You don't get to choose the laws you agree with......

indeed, to the LEGAL degree for which we observe marriage, jill. Go use that bullshit on the court after the guy who likes to fuck bicycles and hamsters doesn't get a license. The legislation extends marriage to ONE MAN AND ONE WOMAN. Don't blame me for that.. It's democracy in action.

 

[Shogun]

Well that's the way it is now. Business owners can and do stay open on Sundays if they wish. I used to work for NAPA and my boss had his store open on Sundays. He eventually had to close because most people around here didn't do jack on Sundays and it cost more for him to stay open and pay us than to just close up shop. But I do agree with you. It's all about toleration.

Which is totally different than the STATE coming in and closing his store and telling him to fucking deal with it, eh?

 

[Ravi]

Shog, the Supreme Court ruled that marriage is a right. You are once again being inconsistent...on one hand citing them for agreeing with you (if that's even true) and on the other discounting their judgment on the constitutional validity of a law.

 

[Ravi]

Bicycles and hamsters can't consent.

Bicycles?

 

[Shogun]

Shog, the Supreme Court ruled that marriage is a right. You are once again being inconsistent...on one hand citing them for agreeing with you (if that's even true) and on the other discounting their judgment on the constitutional validity of a law.

the supreme court didn't rule that marriage is a right extended to anyone, ravi. We don't let polygamist make that same arguement. similarly, assuming that marriage observations extends to gays is aqbout as silly as using the interstate commerce clause as a cure all.


and, im not being inconsistant. Hell, if anything IM the only one in this thread whose had his eye on the fucking ball despite my own personal opinions of gay marriage.

 

[Shogun]

Bicycles and hamsters can't consent.

Bicycles?

how do you know? Can you speak Hamsterese? do you KNOW that an inanimate object CAN'T love?

 

[BrianH]

Yet, HOW does the first amendment validate FORCING a minority to observe the dogma of the majority? It doesn't. And telling people just to "deal with it" isn't a valid answer. YOU may not give a damn but plenty of us do. If you can't fathom how offensive it is to have patriotism paired with dogma then, AGAIN, let's put the fucking koran on court houses and see how long it takes for christians to freak the fuck out.

WHO'S FORCING YOU TO SAY "Under God"? And like I said, when Chrisitians become the minority, then they'll have to frickin deal with whatever the majority votes for. That's how a democracy works. ANd if they freak out then they're just as intolerant and ignorant as you are.

a business can make it's own decision. FORCING a business to close on Sunday and telling customers that they can drive to the next secular county just doesn't float. In fact, it pretty much illustrates the stupidity of your position.

No one said they're forced...what is it with you and "forcing things"


an ahteist ON A FUCKING PORCH is hardly even REMOTELY close to a kid in a fucking classroom, eh? Do kids get the option of walking inside when the thumping comes out? Do kids get the chance to state THEIR OWN beliefs? NO? Then I guess your incessant wrangling of logic is failing you today, isnt' it?

To answer your questions....my wife had an atheist kid in the classroom. He voiced his opinion several times and was not discriminated against because of it. He didn't say the pledge, and no one forced him to. He did not participate in classroom parties or anything that was against what he did or did not believe. He didn't participate in the Valentine's Day party either. He was not punished or forced to do anything. Schools have now gone to moment of silences to accomodate people that have something similar to your belief (Without the hatred). Now the students stand in silence, and if the believers want to pray to themselves, they can.

As far as stating beliefs, kids are now discouraged from "stating their beliefs" in a school setting due to intolerant and beligerant atheist who can't stand the fact that the majority of Americans are Christian, and that their children have to go to school with them. A kids sits in a classroom and not forced to say "under God" or the pledge of allegance is analogous with the porch scenario. Atheist have the same rights that anyone else has, can live in a neighborhood regardless of their belief, but are not forced to participate in community activities such as church and the observance of holidays. It's the same concept whether you like it or not.

But, truly, Im still having a good ole guffaw at the idea that taking out god from the pledge is keeping christians from worshipping the loward. THAT has got to be one of the dumbest things I've read on this forum all week. I mean, hell, ALL WE NEED TO DO IS GET THE MAJORITY TO VOTE TO REPLACE THE BILL OF RIGHTS WITH THE TEN COMMANDMENTS, apparently.. right, ya dumb bastard? I mean, of COURSE since it was added before I was born then everyone else should just fucking deal, right? THATS how we rationalized racism too, eh? Why rock the fucking boat, yes? A clear history of dogma junkies hellbent on injecting christianity into the pledge may sit well with you but, AS PER THE FUCKING ARTICLE, score one for the good guys.


beyotch.

LOL is that all you got. "Beyotch?" LOL. I'm going to piss myself now. It's called toleration dumbass. You should learn it sometime. No one is forcing you to do anything. This country has bigger problems than a couple of words in a pledge. If you don't like it, don't say "under God" it's as simple as that. No one is forcing you to, and no one is sitting in little Jimmy's class and forcing him to say a prayer or say the pledge. Let's whine about a pointless 60 year old play on words. Beyotch...lol

 

[Annie]

how do you know? Can you speak Hamsterese? do you KNOW that an inanimate object CAN'T love?

http://www.textfiles.com/sex/sex-cars.faq

 

[Shogun]

LOL is that all you got. "Beyotch?" LOL. I'm going to piss myself now. It's called toleration dumbass. You should learn it sometime. No one is forcing you to do anything. This country has bigger problems than a couple of words in a pledge. If you don't like it, don't say "under God" it's as simple as that. No one is forcing you to, and no one is sitting in little Jimmy's class and forcing him to say a prayer or say the pledge. Let's whine about a pointless 60 year old play on words. Beyotch...lol

NOT with a BILL OF RIGHTS that specifically addresses this VERY issue, cockgobbler (like that one better?) A majority cant disregard the first fucking amendment JUST BECAUSE the majoirty of Americans identify with Christianity. I don't know what kind of fucked up civics courses you took but you might wanna go get your money back.

and, YES, kids ARE forced to observe christianity EVERY TIME they are FORCED to pair their alliegence with christianity. Indeed, "bigger problems" than racism too, right? BIGGER PROBLEMS than womens suffrage? It's not "as simple as that" any more than black people can just ignore employers CALLING THEM SHIFTY *******. I mean, NO ONE is forcing blacks to work for racists, right buddy? And, if the MAJORITY wants to let hiring managers use words like darky and coon then African AMERICANS can just "get over it", eh?


you logic looks like it's taken a few rounds of birdshot, dude. Would you like to ignore the posted fucking federal amendment again perhaps? Im still not done laughing at the assumption that telling christians that they CANT use the federal gov for prothetising amounts to restricting THEIR religion. THATS a fucking belly laugh and a half, dude.

 

[Shogun]

ps.

whooptyfuckingdo.. YOUR WIFE sure is the standard by which everyone behaves, right? What is the FIRST thing that statistics and the scientific method would say about what you are basing your goofy fucking opinion on? I've got history on my side, buddy. Maybe thats not as impressive as some personal non sequiter but hey..

 

[BrianH]

NOT with a BILL OF RIGHTS that specifically addresses this VERY issue, cockgobbler (like that one better?) A majority cant disregard the first fucking amendment JUST BECAUSE the majoirty of Americans identify with Christianity. I don't know what kind of fucked up civics courses you took but you might wanna go get your money back.

and, YES, kids ARE forced to observe christianity EVERY TIME they are FORCED to pair their alliegence with christianity. Indeed, "bigger problems" than racism too, right? BIGGER PROBLEMS than womens suffrage? It's not "as simple as that" any more than black people can just ignore employers CALLING THEM SHIFTY *******. I mean, NO ONE is forcing blacks to work for racists, right buddy? And, if the MAJORITY wants to let hiring managers use words like darky and coon then African AMERICANS can just "get over it", eh?


you logic looks like it's taken a few rounds of birdshot, dude.

Yes I do like that one better. No one is FORCING them to observe jack shit. Does the teacher stand over the kid and say " Say under God or you faill, you better say it? Say it!". NO. No one is forcing anything. The rest is just ranting. I've gotten used to your style. I'm shooting buckshot today holmes. Or maybe I'll throw some BBB your way.

No one is disregarding the Bill of Rights. Until the Supreme Court rules otherwise, it's perfectly Constitutional.

 

[BrianH]

ps.

whooptyfuckingdo.. YOUR WIFE sure is the standard by which everyone behaves, right? What is the FIRST thing that statistics and the scientific method would say about what you are basing your goofy fucking opinion on? I've got history on my side, buddy. Maybe thats not as impressive as some personal non sequiter but hey..

Like I said, until the Supreme Court decides otherwise, I'm right and your wrong. No ones rights are being infringed upon.

 

[manifold]

If I started the best flames poll right now, Soggy would win in a landslide!

Shifty *******!

In the NBA they're known as crafty veterans.




Who am I kidding, he's gonna win in a landslide no matter what.

 

[Shogun]

Like I said, until the Supreme Court decides otherwise, I'm right and your wrong. No ones rights are being infringed upon.

Actually, court opinons don't make anyone "right" about anything. Again, you might wanna go kick your civics teacher in the balls for failing you this bad.


Rights, and constitutional amendment ARE being infringed. If you don't think they are significant then so be it. Plenty didn't think slavery was a big deal either. Like I said, go read the fucking amendment instead of your wifes work drama.

 

[Shogun]

If I started the best flames poll right now, Soggy would win in a landslide!

Shifty *******!

In the NBA they're known as crafty veterans.




Who am I kidding, he's gonna win in a landslide no matter what.

Hey, you know, BRIAN says that blacks should just "gET OVER IT". THEY are not being discriminated against since, you know, the MAJORITY enjoys the vocab. We've got bigger issues to tackle, RIGHT BRI BRI? Hey, at least that seperate water fount and shitter in the basement is AVAILABLE!




MAJORITY RULES, right buddy?

 

[Shogun]

Yes I do like that one better. No one is FORCING them to observe jack shit. Does the teacher stand over the kid and say " Say under God or you faill, you better say it? Say it!". NO. No one is forcing anything. The rest is just ranting. I've gotten used to your style. I'm shooting buckshot today holmes. Or maybe I'll throw some BBB your way.

No one is disregarding the Bill of Rights. Until the Supreme Court rules otherwise, it's perfectly Constitutional.

yes, they ARE forced to observe when HAVING TO PAIR PATRIOTISM WITH CHRISTIANITY. I know I konw.. they can just block out the memory and there is no harm, no foul




You haven't shot your first load in this thread, dude. Again, the bill of rights is PLAINLY WRITTEN. If you want to think that it is "hindering" christians to not use a federal oath then so be it. Imean, we can't ALL have your wife's work examples to pull insight from.

 

[Shogun]

Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.


After the service concluded, Docherty had opportunity to converse with Eisenhower about the substance of the sermon. The President expressed his enthusiastic concurrence with Docherty’s view, and the very next day, Eisenhower had the wheels turning in Congress to incorporate Docherty’s suggestion into law. On February 8, 1954, Rep. Charles Oakman (R-Mich.), introduced a bill to that effect. On Lincoln’s birthday, four days later, Oakman made the following speech on the floor of the House:

Last Sunday, the President of the United States and his family occupied the pew where Abraham Lincoln worshipped. The pastor, the Reverend George M. Docherty, suggested the change in our Pledge of Allegiance that I have offered [as a bill]. Dr. Docherty delivered a wise sermon. He said that as a native of Scotland come to these shores he could appreciate the pledge as something more than a hollow verse taught to children for memory. I would like to quote from his words. He said, 'there was something missing in the pledge, and that which was missing was the characteristic and definitive factor in the American way of life.' Mr. Speaker, I think Mr. Docherty hit the nail square on the head.

Pledge of Allegiance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


you are as wrong as the day is long, dude. I hate to scare you away with historic facts when, you know, your wife's work gossip is just like channeling Thomas Jefferson's ghost.

 

[MsWikia]

Is it that hard to believe that not everybody in America LOVES IT? ADORES IT? WANTS TO MAKE A PLEDGE TO IT? And you might say, well leave! Where are people going to go? This is the land of the free, so why force people to salute or say a pledge to a flag?



I sometimes sit down during the national anthem if I don't feel like participating, i.e. at a baseball game.


On a side note, the "N" word bothers me. I want to say more but I am refraining!

 

[BrianH]

Hey, you know, BRIAN says that blacks should just "gET OVER IT". THEY are not being discriminated against since, you know, the MAJORITY enjoys the vocab. We've got bigger issues to tackle, RIGHT BRI BRI? Hey, at least that seperate water fount and shitter in the basement is AVAILABLE!




MAJORITY RULES, right buddy?

How many blacks do you know today that are dealing with Jim Crow laws or being discriminated against? Not many. Unless of course you want to adopt Larkinn's "Some racism isn't bad" routine. And if they are, it's against he law already. You're referring to something that hasn't happened in 45 years. We haven't had separate facilities in a long time...you're history teacher should join my civics teacher.