Ron Paul: End Federal Student Loans

[Polk]

Two Clinton Error root causes of this:
(1) The Federally back student loan program: This allowed banks to give student loans without a cosigner, without a credit check, without any requirement, other than you go to school. The banks handed these out like candy and the colleges jacked up tuition prices like no product has even done in history!

Note: Obaminationcare now made the loans come directly from the government, so student loan increase the deficit!

Student loans always increased the deficit. The federal government was also liable for the loans. All the recent change did was remove the banks as a middle man skimming money off the top.

(2) Clinton and Gingrich making Student Loan Non-dischargable (Then GWB making private one's non-dischargable): This was the even bigger catayst. Even a philosophy major hoping to make $20K a year could get saddled with $70K in loans. They were all treated the same.


College tuition and student loans are a bubble that is bursting and its an issue where status quo is unacceptable!

I know what the Ron Paul haters will say about this, but listen to what he is say, he makes a TON of sense here!

Ron Paul defends eventual end to federal student loans – CNN Political Ticker - CNN.com Blogs

Republican presidential candidate Ron Paul said Sunday his proposed plan to phase out federal student loans would lower the costs of a college education, making it more affordable for those wanting to attend.

“Anybody who’s ambitious enough will get to go to college,” Paul said on CNN’s “State of the Union.”

The Texas congressman, who is making his third presidential bid, said federally funded education assistance raises the price of education while not improving the caliber, a cycle that will “backfire.”

Paul’s plan would eliminate the Department of Education but keep the features that handle student loans for the time being, ensuring there are no cuts to those currently receiving assistance or who will in the near future.

In a USA Today editorial Friday, Paul said eventually transitioning away from government-backed student aid would “give us better educational opportunities at a better price.”

“Why should people who are laborers who never get to go to college, why should they be taxed to send some of us through college?” Paul said Sunday on CNN. “So it’s not even a fair system when it works. But obviously it doesn’t work and that’s why it’s coming to an end.”

Paul has long advocated for cuts in spending and the national debt while calling for numerous government agencies to shut their doors and a renewed emphasis on individual responsibility. His responsibility platform also extends to education, he said.

“The responsibility is on the individual and the family to take care of their needs, not the federal bureaucracy. It just doesn’t work,” Paul said.

When asked if he would agree that some people in the United States “need federal help,” Paul told CNN Chief Political Correspondent Candy Crowley that there are “always some needs, the market isn’t perfect.”

“It will not be perfect, but what we have now is this catastrophic

The problem with Paul's idea is that it would effectively freeze a large portion of the population out of college. It's impossible to have any sort of equality of opportunity when you shut off any ability for the poor to better themselves.

 

[Polk]

Every American boy who grew up in the 20th century acknowleged the fact that he would have to serve in the US Military for a couple of years. Elvis was even drafted. We didn't get an elistment bonus but we got the GI Bill and we took advantage of it. Today's kids whine about a big student loan but they wouldn't give up two years to serve in the Military.

I agree

We need alternative ways to fund higher education. I support the GI bill as well as expanding to those students who give up time for community service.

The private sector needs to stand up also. They are the ones who benefit from college graduates the most. We need more internship programs, more industry sponsored scholarships, company sponsored students, student debt payment programs

I agree, we need to support education at all levels. But part of the problem with higher education was the skyrocketing costs. I mean they are paying teachers $250K and giving them insane pensions. That needs to go. No more tenure. No more allowing these PUBLIC institutions the ability to waste money on nonsensical shit!

College in the 80s and early 90s used to be expensive but affordable. A working child could put themself through college. Then came federal students loans, then came the Clinton era make student loans non-dischargable. After those two moves, the cost of college skyrocketed. Going to small shit colleges now costs $30k-$40K a year. That is sick and insulting!

If that was the case, why didn't we see tuition skyrocketing in the 70s and 80s, since federal student loans existed at that time as well.

 

[Polk]

Ron Paul: End Federal Student Loans

That's great for him now that his kids are all grown and out of school....

It may have been good enough for me and mine, but not for thee and thine.

 

[Polk]

Anybody who is ambitious enough will get to go to college.....Ron Paul

Typical rightwing blame the victim if you can't afford $40,000 tuition without a loan

Not all colleges cost 40K a year and who says you can't go to college part time while you are working?

You may not realize it, but you're effectively arguing for a caste system.

 

[uscitizen]

Anybody who is ambitious enough will get to go to college.....Ron Paul

Typical rightwing blame the victim if you can't afford $40,000 tuition without a loan

Not all colleges cost 40K a year and who says you can't go to college part time while you are working?

You may not realize it, but you're effectively arguing for a caste system.

That is the inevitable result of unfettered capitalism.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Yes, living beyond means both personally and as a coutnry is a much better system than hardwork, and living within the means available.

That isn't a caste system. That is exactly how I put myself through college and I come from a very poor family. Hand outs do not make people responsible and the federal student loan program is filled with waste and fraud. It's a terrible program fiscally, like every federal government program. It fucks up the true market and leads to waste, as per usual.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Caste systems mean people can not move through social/economic classes by marriage, work or otherwise. Leaving the market to work does not create that system and the idea of even bringing it up is ridiculous. No one is saying peopel with littel to no inherit means can not rise above. It simply takes more work and wiser choices.

It isn't a shut out and a creation of inpenetrable social class structures. Laughable.

 

[editec]

Of course if there were NO student loans colleges probably wouldn't cost as much.

The other outcome of that scenario would be that most people wouldn't be able to get a higher education.

Metaphorically speaking that puts our society on the horns of a dilemmia, doesn't it?

We need a highly educated workforce but we do not want to pay for it.

It's interesting that you say college costs would go down, but then say that "most" people wouldn't be able to get a higher education.

Interesting and probably true, too.

Demand would go down ergo, one has to assume that costs would decline, too.

And while declining costs will help some people get to school on their own, most people won't be able to foot their tuition desite the lower costs.

This makes no sense.

No, it makes sense. Basically conflicting forces will only negate each other so much, but not, I think, enough to make college affordable to most people.

10k used to put people through school.

Oh not in a mighty long time.

Any hard working person can sacrifice and save 10k if they really want to get a higher ed.

Oh okay, so you think that if there are no student loans the cost of going to college will go down to $2500 a year?

That would be nice, wouldn't it?

So you have to wait until you're a little older than 18. So what.

I see your point but I don't think you've really thought this question through realistically.


I think what is much more likely to happen is that a whole lotta schools will greatly reduce their size as fewer and fewer Americans even try to go to college.

Like you I think the price would stop climbing so much faster than inflation, (like you I suspect prices would come down) but I doubt very much the cost will go down such that a WORKING FAMILY can really afford the tuition.

 

[Polk]

Caste systems mean people can not move through social/economic classes by marriage, work or otherwise. Leaving the market to work does not create that system and the idea of even bringing it up is ridiculous. No one is saying peopel with littel to no inherit means can not rise above. It simply takes more work and wiser choices.

It isn't a shut out and a creation of inpenetrable social class structures. Laughable.

Oligopoly is the natural state of most markets. Even in a highly regulated society such as our own, six movie studios control 90% of the domestic film market and four carriers control 90% of the mobile phone market.

The same is true here. Getting rid of federal aid to students will result in a system where elite universities are not filled with the best and brightest minds society has to offer, but filled with those who have parents that can write the biggest check. Some of the very best schools (Harvard, Yale, Princeton, etc.) have endowments large enough to be able to provide 100% aid, but that's not true for most institutions.

Claiming people can work their way through college while working part-time results in a huge reduction in human welfare. The result is that the poor will only have second-rate educational opportunities (not to disparage community colleges and trade schools, but they're not of the same academic caliber as the Ivies) and it will take them a long time to reach them (pretty big difference between getting your BA at 22 and getting it at 26).

 

[Skull Pilot]

People can get college degrees without taking loans.

It might take a little longer but so what. I didn't finish my first bachelor's until I was 25 because I was working and only going to school part time. I made up for some time by taking summer courses and there were a couple of semesters where I didn't take any classes but i bought the texts for the classes I was going to take and read them so when I took the class I was already ahead of the game.

So to say that people won't be able to get a degree unless the government guarantees student loans is complete and utter bullshit.

 

[Douger]

If college were cheap they'd have to bring back the draft.If jobs were plentiful they'd have to bring back the draft. Understand yet ?

 

[chanel]

Oh brother.

Consumer bureau chief Richard Cordray said Congress should consider modifying a 2005 law that, except in rare circumstances, prohibits discharging private student loans through bankruptcy.

Expanding the concept to federal loans would be politically controversial given that it would likely result in taxpayer losses, and Republicans have expressed reservations.

Private lenders warn that the suggested change could drive up interest rates, since the risk of losses would increase. They argue that bankruptcy provides too big a temptation for students to walk away from their debt obligations because, unlike homeowners, for example, many students lack major assets.

Obama Administration Backs Bankruptcy Option for Some Student Debt - WSJ.com

FYI - WSJ posted a correction. This did not come from the WH.

Comments?

 

[squeeze berry]

maybe students should put up some collateral before taking out a loan?

 

[chanel]

They don't have any. That's the problem. And the argument is that knowledge is not tangible. They can't take that back. They could take away their diploma or deny transcripts but we know that would never happen. So what we will see is another bailout. And then others will ask. "where's my cookie?" and they will bail. And then rates will go up and the bubble will finally burst. This is a bad bad idea IMHO. I'm actually surprised it didn't come from Obama.

 

[jillian]

Note: He is not talking about ending private student loans. Does he have a point? I think he does since two federal moves happen in the late 90s (Clinton years) college tuition has skyrocketed! College used to be expensive but affordable. Now its astromically expensive and unaffordable!

Two Clinton Error root causes of this:
(1) The Federally back student loan program: This allowed banks to give student loans without a cosigner, without a credit check, without any requirement, other than you go to school. The banks handed these out like candy and the colleges jacked up tuition prices like no product has even done in history!

Note: Obaminationcare now made the loans come directly from the government, so student loan increase the deficit!

(2) Clinton and Gingrich making Student Loan Non-dischargable (Then GWB making private one's non-dischargable): This was the even bigger catayst. Even a philosophy major hoping to make $20K a year could get saddled with $70K in loans. They were all treated the same.


College tuition and student loans are a bubble that is bursting and its an issue where status quo is unacceptable!

I know what the Ron Paul haters will say about this, but listen to what he is say, he makes a TON of sense here!

Ron Paul defends eventual end to federal student loans – CNN Political Ticker - CNN.com Blogs

Republican presidential candidate Ron Paul said Sunday his proposed plan to phase out federal student loans would lower the costs of a college education, making it more affordable for those wanting to attend.

“Anybody who’s ambitious enough will get to go to college,” Paul said on CNN’s “State of the Union.”


The Texas congressman, who is making his third presidential bid, said federally funded education assistance raises the price of education while not improving the caliber, a cycle that will “backfire.”

Paul’s plan would eliminate the Department of Education but keep the features that handle student loans for the time being, ensuring there are no cuts to those currently receiving assistance or who will in the near future.

In a USA Today editorial Friday, Paul said eventually transitioning away from government-backed student aid would “give us better educational opportunities at a better price.”

“Why should people who are laborers who never get to go to college, why should they be taxed to send some of us through college?” Paul said Sunday on CNN. “So it’s not even a fair system when it works. But obviously it doesn’t work and that’s why it’s coming to an end.”

Paul has long advocated for cuts in spending and the national debt while calling for numerous government agencies to shut their doors and a renewed emphasis on individual responsibility. His responsibility platform also extends to education, he said.

“The responsibility is on the individual and the family to take care of their needs, not the federal bureaucracy. It just doesn’t work,” Paul said.

When asked if he would agree that some people in the United States “need federal help,” Paul told CNN Chief Political Correspondent Candy Crowley that there are “always some needs, the market isn’t perfect.”

“It will not be perfect, but what we have now is this catastrophic

Yeah, keep 'me stupid.....

Then maybe they won't know what an idiot Ron Paul is

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Note: He is not talking about ending private student loans. Does he have a point? I think he does since two federal moves happen in the late 90s (Clinton years) college tuition has skyrocketed! College used to be expensive but affordable. Now its astromically expensive and unaffordable!

Two Clinton Error root causes of this:
(1) The Federally back student loan program: This allowed banks to give student loans without a cosigner, without a credit check, without any requirement, other than you go to school. The banks handed these out like candy and the colleges jacked up tuition prices like no product has even done in history!

Note: Obaminationcare now made the loans come directly from the government, so student loan increase the deficit!

(2) Clinton and Gingrich making Student Loan Non-dischargable (Then GWB making private one's non-dischargable): This was the even bigger catayst. Even a philosophy major hoping to make $20K a year could get saddled with $70K in loans. They were all treated the same.


College tuition and student loans are a bubble that is bursting and its an issue where status quo is unacceptable!

I know what the Ron Paul haters will say about this, but listen to what he is say, he makes a TON of sense here!

Ron Paul defends eventual end to federal student loans – CNN Political Ticker - CNN.com Blogs

Republican presidential candidate Ron Paul said Sunday his proposed plan to phase out federal student loans would lower the costs of a college education, making it more affordable for those wanting to attend.

“Anybody who’s ambitious enough will get to go to college,” Paul said on CNN’s “State of the Union.”


The Texas congressman, who is making his third presidential bid, said federally funded education assistance raises the price of education while not improving the caliber, a cycle that will “backfire.”

Paul’s plan would eliminate the Department of Education but keep the features that handle student loans for the time being, ensuring there are no cuts to those currently receiving assistance or who will in the near future.

In a USA Today editorial Friday, Paul said eventually transitioning away from government-backed student aid would “give us better educational opportunities at a better price.”

“Why should people who are laborers who never get to go to college, why should they be taxed to send some of us through college?” Paul said Sunday on CNN. “So it’s not even a fair system when it works. But obviously it doesn’t work and that’s why it’s coming to an end.”

Paul has long advocated for cuts in spending and the national debt while calling for numerous government agencies to shut their doors and a renewed emphasis on individual responsibility. His responsibility platform also extends to education, he said.

“The responsibility is on the individual and the family to take care of their needs, not the federal bureaucracy. It just doesn’t work,” Paul said.

When asked if he would agree that some people in the United States “need federal help,” Paul told CNN Chief Political Correspondent Candy Crowley that there are “always some needs, the market isn’t perfect.”

“It will not be perfect, but what we have now is this catastrophic

Yeah, keep 'me stupid.....

Then maybe they won't know what an idiot Ron Paul is

Yeah, except that young people and college students make up what is probably a majority of Ron Paul's base of support.

So good one.

 

[jillian]

Government backed student loans were given without inquiry into credit worthiness or family finances. In exchange, they are non-discharge able in bankruptcy.

Can I presume that if student loans were no longer backed by the government, they'd be discharge able in bankruptcy like any other debt to a corporate concern?

Or will they want special dispensation?

Or worse, will they no longer get student loans if their families are poor or have financial problems?

Yeah, let's gobsck to the days before the new deal.

Sad

 

[elvis]

Note: He is not talking about ending private student loans. Does he have a point? I think he does since two federal moves happen in the late 90s (Clinton years) college tuition has skyrocketed! College used to be expensive but affordable. Now its astromically expensive and unaffordable!

Two Clinton Error root causes of this:
(1) The Federally back student loan program: This allowed banks to give student loans without a cosigner, without a credit check, without any requirement, other than you go to school. The banks handed these out like candy and the colleges jacked up tuition prices like no product has even done in history!

Note: Obaminationcare now made the loans come directly from the government, so student loan increase the deficit!

(2) Clinton and Gingrich making Student Loan Non-dischargable (Then GWB making private one's non-dischargable): This was the even bigger catayst. Even a philosophy major hoping to make $20K a year could get saddled with $70K in loans. They were all treated the same.


College tuition and student loans are a bubble that is bursting and its an issue where status quo is unacceptable!

I know what the Ron Paul haters will say about this, but listen to what he is say, he makes a TON of sense here!

Yeah, keep 'me stupid.....

Then maybe they won't know what an idiot Ron Paul is

Yeah, except that young people and college students make up what is probably a majority of Ron Paul's base of support.

So good one.

and they're all naive...

hopefully not as naive as you though.

 

[jillian]

Note: He is not talking about ending private student loans. Does he have a point? I think he does since two federal moves happen in the late 90s (Clinton years) college tuition has skyrocketed! College used to be expensive but affordable. Now its astromically expensive and unaffordable!

Two Clinton Error root causes of this:
(1) The Federally back student loan program: This allowed banks to give student loans without a cosigner, without a credit check, without any requirement, other than you go to school. The banks handed these out like candy and the colleges jacked up tuition prices like no product has even done in history!

Note: Obaminationcare now made the loans come directly from the government, so student loan increase the deficit!

(2) Clinton and Gingrich making Student Loan Non-dischargable (Then GWB making private one's non-dischargable): This was the even bigger catayst. Even a philosophy major hoping to make $20K a year could get saddled with $70K in loans. They were all treated the same.


College tuition and student loans are a bubble that is bursting and its an issue where status quo is unacceptable!

I know what the Ron Paul haters will say about this, but listen to what he is say, he makes a TON of sense here!

Yeah, keep 'me stupid.....

Then maybe they won't know what an idiot Ron Paul is

Yeah, except that young people and college students make up what is probably a majority of Ron Paul's base of support.

So good one.

You mean a base of support that's single digits?

I wouldnt sweat it too much since those people don't constitute the majority of students.

And besides, someone has to be at th bottom of the class, *shrug*

But don't feel badly, Ralph Nader, another idiot, had some support among students, too.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Yeah, keep 'me stupid.....

Then maybe they won't know what an idiot Ron Paul is

Yeah, except that young people and college students make up what is probably a majority of Ron Paul's base of support.

So good one.

You mean a base of support that's single digits?

I wouldnt sweat it too much since those people don't constitute the majority of students.

And besides, someone has to be at th bottom of the class, *shrug*

But don't feel badly, Ralph Nader, another idiot, had some support among students, too.

Nonsense.