PsychoMalarkey

[blu]

Moi?
Really? My kids would disagree, but they know me, and you don't. They were plenty random growing up. FYI, most of the interesting ones are.

well its the first thing that parents bring up when a non-parent makes a comment as if kids are some alien thing that can't be understood by having them in the families or studying science & psychology etc

Well, its hardly appropriate for you to infer I'm an unfit parent in response. Raising kids is a learning process. If you haven't tried it, you really don't have a whole hell of a lot to tell someone who has, and quite successfully I might add.

calling you unfit was out of line, although I do think that there should be required courses that every parent must take before the baby is born. part of this would be identifying common mental and physical disorders and knowing what to do if these are suspected

 

[Samson]

but I do think this shows why parenting courses should be required or strongly encouraged for new parents, especially younger ones. if a parent can't even being to deal with a kid who has disorders then I don't see why they should be parents in the first place

Well, NOT DEALING with a kid who has disorders, is different than imperfectly dealing with a kid who has disorders: You know damn well that these disorders don't manifest themselves overnight. Why do you expect that parents would instantly be able to appropriately deal with them?

 

[Samson]

I generally find that people who make comments like this are unfit to be parents in the first place. kids aren't some random species who can't be dealt with.

Moi?
Really? My kids would disagree, but they know me, and you don't. They were plenty random growing up. FYI, most of the interesting ones are.

Not for nothing, I have the same attitude towards those who conduct marriage counseling while honoring religious vows of celibacy. Been there, done that, got milk? No? I prefer to ask those who have, did, or do.

Are you talking to your evil twin?

 

[Barb]

Moi?
Really? My kids would disagree, but they know me, and you don't. They were plenty random growing up. FYI, most of the interesting ones are.

Not for nothing, I have the same attitude towards those who conduct marriage counseling while honoring religious vows of celibacy. Been there, done that, got milk? No? I prefer to ask those who have, did, or do.

why? do you really think humans are that complex and imaginative that they can't be put into a few different categories and broken down from there? as if someone needs to be in every situation they counsel in.

Yes, I do think humans are complex and imaginative, and for the situations I listed, hands on experience does lend more credence to the advice offered.

 

[blu]

but I do think this shows why parenting courses should be required or strongly encouraged for new parents, especially younger ones. if a parent can't even being to deal with a kid who has disorders then I don't see why they should be parents in the first place

Well, NOT DEALING with a kid who has disorders, is different than imperfectly dealing with a kid who has disorders: You know damn well that these disorders don't manifest themselves overnight. Why do you expect that parents would instantly be able to appropriately deal with them?

did I say doing it overnight? I said noticing the disorder, which means noticing a pattern of behavior which goes over long periods of time and won't change no matter how much a kid is spanked and punished.

 

[blu]

the people on the left & pharma are the ones who push drugs to fix any problem instead of dealing with the kid. for instance, during college i went to a counselor for anxiety and the first day he tried to offer me some meds and I told him that if he offered me meds again I would never come and I would do my best to destroy his reputation around the area. once he realized I was serious he started to do actual work and a few months later everything was fine. If I would have went with the drugs route, I would have had to be on them for life most likely and nothing of my thought process and ways of dealing with things would have changed.

Actually, you have no idea what may have happened.

At any rate, I don't know if you're assigning "on the left" to any defined group, or simply using it as an anology in describing "the opposite end of the spectrum. In either case, unless you have evidence that this could be a REAL problem, then perhaps you could find some wild-eyed member over in the Conspiracy Theory Forum that will argue the point.

i think the stats on how many kids are being prescribed ADD and similar meds, especially at younger and younger ages, is a good evidence of the problem

 

[Barb]

Moi?
Really? My kids would disagree, but they know me, and you don't. They were plenty random growing up. FYI, most of the interesting ones are.

Not for nothing, I have the same attitude towards those who conduct marriage counseling while honoring religious vows of celibacy. Been there, done that, got milk? No? I prefer to ask those who have, did, or do.

Are you talking to your evil twin?

No, just adding to the thought. Smarty-pants.

 

[Samson]

well its the first thing that parents bring up when a non-parent makes a comment as if kids are some alien thing that can't be understood by having them in the families or studying science & psychology etc

Well, its hardly appropriate for you to infer I'm an unfit parent in response. Raising kids is a learning process. If you haven't tried it, you really don't have a whole hell of a lot to tell someone who has, and quite successfully I might add.

calling you unfit was out of line, although I do think that there should be required courses that every parent must take before the baby is born. part of this would be identifying common mental and physical disorders and knowing what to do if these are suspected

You realise that 30% of Americans drop out of highschool.....and many the ones that do cannot find Canada on a Globe.....

Good luck teaching them how to distinguish SID's, or OCD, or ADD or any other mental disorder from a 14 year olds normal behaviour.

 

[Samson]

Not for nothing, I have the same attitude towards those who conduct marriage counseling while honoring religious vows of celibacy. Been there, done that, got milk? No? I prefer to ask those who have, did, or do.

Are you talking to your evil twin?

No, just adding to the thought. Smarty-pants.

That's a relief.....I thought you may be suffering from Multiple Personality Disorder, and I was gonna perscribe a cup of coffee...

 

[blu]

Well, its hardly appropriate for you to infer I'm an unfit parent in response. Raising kids is a learning process. If you haven't tried it, you really don't have a whole hell of a lot to tell someone who has, and quite successfully I might add.

calling you unfit was out of line, although I do think that there should be required courses that every parent must take before the baby is born. part of this would be identifying common mental and physical disorders and knowing what to do if these are suspected

You realise that 30% of Americans drop out of highschool.....and many the ones that do cannot find Canada on a Globe.....

Good luck teaching them how to distinguish SID's, or OCD, or ADD or any other mental disorder from a 14 year olds normal behaviour.

in a perfect world those people wouldn't be allowed to have kids

 

[Barb]

well its the first thing that parents bring up when a non-parent makes a comment as if kids are some alien thing that can't be understood by having them in the families or studying science & psychology etc

Well, its hardly appropriate for you to infer I'm an unfit parent in response. Raising kids is a learning process. If you haven't tried it, you really don't have a whole hell of a lot to tell someone who has, and quite successfully I might add.

calling you unfit was out of line, although I do think that there should be required courses that every parent must take before the baby is born. part of this would be identifying common mental and physical disorders and knowing what to do if these are suspected

Thank you for that.
Incidentally, there are pediatricians who are trained to look out for those things, and regular check ups to screen. I think parenting classes are a good thing, but also that you're expecting an awful lot from the general populace. People simply can't know everything, and that's why we have general practitioners and experts.

 

[Barb]

Are you talking to your evil twin?

No, just adding to the thought. Smarty-pants.

That's a relief.....I thought you may be suffering from Multiple Personality Disorder, and I was gonna perscribe a cup of coffee...

At this time of night, on my day off, it would tend to clash with the gin and juice.

 

[Samson]

but I do think this shows why parenting courses should be required or strongly encouraged for new parents, especially younger ones. if a parent can't even being to deal with a kid who has disorders then I don't see why they should be parents in the first place

Well, NOT DEALING with a kid who has disorders, is different than imperfectly dealing with a kid who has disorders: You know damn well that these disorders don't manifest themselves overnight. Why do you expect that parents would instantly be able to appropriately deal with them?

did I say doing it overnight? I said noticing the disorder, which means noticing a pattern of behavior which goes over long periods of time and won't change no matter how much a kid is spanked and punished.

No, but you seem to berate parents for using the only remedies they know on behaviours that are fairly common. This isn't irresponsible parenting. Only if a parent is realatively well educated, will they eventually say to themself, "wow, this is really weird, not a 'phase.' Perhaps I should visit a cite online, or a library, or the counselor at school, to admit that I don't know what the fuck I'm doing, and to discuss intelligent alternatives."

Of course, on your planet, I'm certain this happens all the time.

 

[Samson]

No, just adding to the thought. Smarty-pants.

That's a relief.....I thought you may be suffering from Multiple Personality Disorder, and I was gonna perscribe a cup of coffee...

At this time of night, on my day off, it would tend to clash with the gin and juice.

Yeah, its a little late for caffine.

 

[Barb]

calling you unfit was out of line, although I do think that there should be required courses that every parent must take before the baby is born. part of this would be identifying common mental and physical disorders and knowing what to do if these are suspected

You realise that 30% of Americans drop out of highschool.....and many the ones that do cannot find Canada on a Globe.....

Good luck teaching them how to distinguish SID's, or OCD, or ADD or any other mental disorder from a 14 year olds normal behaviour.

in a perfect world those people wouldn't be allowed to have kids

Kinda harsh there, don't you think?
I realize harsh is your thing, a purist and all...but give it some thought. By that reasoning, back in the days of agrarian societies, the peasantry as it were, perfectly loving if imperfectly educated people would not be ALLOWED to have children? How would you accomplish this? Forced sterilization, forced abortion?

 

[Samson]

calling you unfit was out of line, although I do think that there should be required courses that every parent must take before the baby is born. part of this would be identifying common mental and physical disorders and knowing what to do if these are suspected

You realise that 30% of Americans drop out of highschool.....and many the ones that do cannot find Canada on a Globe.....

Good luck teaching them how to distinguish SID's, or OCD, or ADD or any other mental disorder from a 14 year olds normal behaviour.

in a perfect world those people wouldn't be allowed to have kids

In a perfect world, people wouldn't need to have kids.

 

[blu]

Not for nothing, I have the same attitude towards those who conduct marriage counseling while honoring religious vows of celibacy. Been there, done that, got milk? No? I prefer to ask those who have, did, or do.

why? do you really think humans are that complex and imaginative that they can't be put into a few different categories and broken down from there? as if someone needs to be in every situation they counsel in.

Yes, I do think humans are complex and imaginative, and for the situations I listed, hands on experience does lend more credence to the advice offered.

unless you are psychotic or are on drugs/alcohol at the time of an event, if a psychologist knows your upbringing, past experience, mental ability, and a few other things they can pretty much predict every move you will make.

I can't find the link at the moment, but have emailed the friend who showed me it, and a scientist was able to build a finite state machine that mapped basically the exact behavior of children he observed at a daycare for only a short time.

 

[blu]

You realise that 30% of Americans drop out of highschool.....and many the ones that do cannot find Canada on a Globe.....

Good luck teaching them how to distinguish SID's, or OCD, or ADD or any other mental disorder from a 14 year olds normal behaviour.

in a perfect world those people wouldn't be allowed to have kids

In a perfect world, people wouldn't need to have kids.

yes but until you can order genetically created kids on the Internet, we should at least pull the reins on people

 

[Barb]

That's a relief.....I thought you may be suffering from Multiple Personality Disorder, and I was gonna perscribe a cup of coffee...

At this time of night, on my day off, it would tend to clash with the gin and juice.

Yeah, its a little late for caffine.

Tomorrow night, back on the graveyard shift, I'll be all but mainlining the stuff. Send me a script then.

 

[blu]

Well, NOT DEALING with a kid who has disorders, is different than imperfectly dealing with a kid who has disorders: You know damn well that these disorders don't manifest themselves overnight. Why do you expect that parents would instantly be able to appropriately deal with them?

did I say doing it overnight? I said noticing the disorder, which means noticing a pattern of behavior which goes over long periods of time and won't change no matter how much a kid is spanked and punished.

No, but you seem to berate parents for using the only remedies they know on behaviours that are fairly common. This isn't irresponsible parenting. Only if a parent is realatively well educated, will they eventually say to themself, "wow, this is really weird, not a 'phase.' Perhaps I should visit a cite online, or a library, or the counselor at school, to admit that I don't know what the fuck I'm doing, and to discuss intelligent alternatives."

Of course, on your planet, I'm certain this happens all the time.

again, parent education would fix most of this. and if the parent truly loved their kid then they would put away pride and talk to a counselor to get their kid(s) help.