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It's a moot point because democrats would have never held such a thing as the debt ceiling hostage, republicans either before the teapublicans joined congress and felt empowered to use terrorist tactics to get what they wanted. As a debt reduction measure it is an abject failure as a political weapon it is much like a ABomb in that it is too potentially devastating to the country at large to leave in the hands of people would use it as a first strike.
Obviously republicans are only doing it because democrats are in power, but that doesn't answer my question.
How many other aspects of the legislative would you be okay transferring to the executive just because you don't like the way the legislative is handling it? If the legislative isn't doing their job that's a problem with the people, who keep voting these dumb shits back into power while they have an approval rating of about 17%. It's no reason to grant the president more power. I don't care who the president is, that's a slippery slope I don't even want to approach.
Well then the solution is to get rid of the dangerous and useless policy altogether like every other country in the world then no one can use it for a weapon. There are much safer ways to gain political leverage in this country than trying to default on our debts.
Obama May Veto His Tax Proposal if Not Granted Power to Raise Debt Ceiling
by Tony Lee
Obama May Veto His Tax Proposal if Not Granted Power to Raise Debt Ceiling
6 Dec 2012
On Wednesday, President Barack Obama indicated that having unlimited powers to raise the debt ceiling without Congresss approval may be more important to him than raising taxes -- and he may veto his own tax hike proposal to take the country over the fiscal cliff if he does not get his ultimate wish.
Addressing corporate CEOs at the Business Roundtable, Obama said using the debt ceiling as leverage to get more spending cuts was a bad strategy for America and it is a game I will not play.
According to The Hill, Obama also told the business leaders that they should not accept going through another round of debt-ceiling negotiations like the one in 2011.
Das Feurher has spoken.
At first I was against it, not just for Obama, but for any President....but then on another thread Kissmy mentioned that it was not the president that is spending the money that raising the debt ceiling would have to cover. It is CONGRESS who is responsible for the spending that requires the debt ceiling to be raised, NOT the President....and if congress can't do their job and reign in spending then the country and the president should not be held hostage by them for money that THEY, CONGRESS has already spent....if you owe money, you PAY YOUR BILLS, (this is the moral thing to do, period) whether you have to put one of your bills on a credit card or not, pay it....
THEN, those of us in the stock market with our retirements and so forth won't be subject to this roller coaster of ups and downs that CONGRESS has put us in....
And CONGRESS will be solely responsible for the debt ceiling rise for their spending, will be under the microscope for the debt ceiling rise and their lack of management, and these stupid GAMES that congress is playing and shuffling of blame congress is trying to pass off on to the president for their OWN SPENDING will cease.....and HOPEFULLY congress will do their jobs....
Which congress?
At first I was against it, not just for Obama, but for any President....but then on another thread Kissmy mentioned that it was not the president that is spending the money that raising the debt ceiling would have to cover. It is CONGRESS who is responsible for the spending that requires the debt ceiling to be raised, NOT the President....and if congress can't do their job and reign in spending then the country and the president should not be held hostage by them for money that THEY, CONGRESS has already spent....if you owe money, you PAY YOUR BILLS, (this is the moral thing to do, period) whether you have to put one of your bills on a credit card or not, pay it....
THEN, those of us in the stock market with our retirements and so forth won't be subject to this roller coaster of ups and downs that CONGRESS has put us in....
And CONGRESS will be solely responsible for the debt ceiling rise for their spending, will be under the microscope for the debt ceiling rise and their lack of management, and these stupid GAMES that congress is playing and shuffling of blame congress is trying to pass off on to the president for their OWN SPENDING will cease.....and HOPEFULLY congress will do their jobs....
Which congress?
the one that passed the bush tax cuts.
At first I was against it, not just for Obama, but for any President....but then on another thread Kissmy mentioned that it was not the president that is spending the money that raising the debt ceiling would have to cover. It is CONGRESS who is responsible for the spending that requires the debt ceiling to be raised, NOT the President....and if congress can't do their job and reign in spending then the country and the president should not be held hostage by them for money that THEY, CONGRESS has already spent....if you owe money, you PAY YOUR BILLS, (this is the moral thing to do, period) whether you have to put one of your bills on a credit card or not, pay it....
THEN, those of us in the stock market with our retirements and so forth won't be subject to this roller coaster of ups and downs that CONGRESS has put us in....
And CONGRESS will be solely responsible for the debt ceiling rise for their spending, will be under the microscope for the debt ceiling rise and their lack of management, and these stupid GAMES that congress is playing and shuffling of blame congress is trying to pass off on to the president for their OWN SPENDING will cease.....and HOPEFULLY congress will do their jobs....
Which congress?
the one that passed the bush tax cuts.
Which congress?
the one that passed the bush tax cuts.
If that is the case, why are we going into the fifth year without a budget from Congress? Democrats in the Senate from 2008 to the present have refused to agree on a fiscal budget and have blocked any efforts from Congress to pass a balanced budget. We can all thank Nancy Reid for that.
Obama May Veto His Tax Proposal if Not Granted Power to Raise Debt Ceiling
by Tony Lee
Obama May Veto His Tax Proposal if Not Granted Power to Raise Debt Ceiling
6 Dec 2012
On Wednesday, President Barack Obama indicated that having unlimited powers to raise the debt ceiling without Congresss approval may be more important to him than raising taxes -- and he may veto his own tax hike proposal to take the country over the fiscal cliff if he does not get his ultimate wish.
the one that passed the bush tax cuts.
If that is the case, why are we going into the fifth year without a budget from Congress? Democrats in the Senate from 2008 to the present have refused to agree on a fiscal budget and have blocked any efforts from Congress to pass a balanced budget. We can all thank Nancy Reid for that.
no. you can thank the teatards who refused to send anything rational because they think compromise means we do what they want.
now maybe if they'll get out of the way a deal can be struck now.
Which congress?
the one that passed the bush tax cuts.
If that is the case, why are we going into the fifth year without a budget from Congress? Democrats in the Senate from 2008 to the present have refused to agree on a fiscal budget and have blocked any efforts from Congress to pass a balanced budget. We can all thank Nancy Reid for that.
If that is the case, why are we going into the fifth year without a budget from Congress? Democrats in the Senate from 2008 to the present have refused to agree on a fiscal budget and have blocked any efforts from Congress to pass a balanced budget. We can all thank Nancy Reid for that.
no. you can thank the teatards who refused to send anything rational because they think compromise means we do what they want.
now maybe if they'll get out of the way a deal can be struck now.
No deal will be struck with Obama saying give me congressional powers.
The buck doesn't stop with congress. Obama apparently still doesn't know how to lead.
Obama May Veto His Tax Proposal if Not Granted Power to Raise Debt Ceiling
by Tony Lee
Obama May Veto His Tax Proposal if Not Granted Power to Raise Debt Ceiling
6 Dec 2012
On Wednesday, President Barack Obama indicated that having unlimited powers to raise the debt ceiling without Congresss approval may be more important to him than raising taxes -- and he may veto his own tax hike proposal to take the country over the fiscal cliff if he does not get his ultimate wish.
Addressing corporate CEOs at the Business Roundtable, Obama said using the debt ceiling as leverage to get more spending cuts was a bad strategy for America and it is a game I will not play.
According to The Hill, Obama also told the business leaders that they should not accept going through another round of debt-ceiling negotiations like the one in 2011.
Das Feurher has spoken.
It's a moot point because democrats would have never held such a thing as the debt ceiling hostage, republicans either before the teapublicans joined congress and felt empowered to use terrorist tactics to get what they wanted. As a debt reduction measure it is an abject failure as a political weapon it is much like a ABomb in that it is too potentially devastating to the country at large to leave in the hands of people would use it as a first strike.
Never? Are you sure about that?
when other than after the 2010 elections has anyone ever treated the debt ceiling as anything but an administrative act?
It's a moot point because democrats would have never held such a thing as the debt ceiling hostage, republicans either before the teapublicans joined congress and felt empowered to use terrorist tactics to get what they wanted. As a debt reduction measure it is an abject failure as a political weapon it is much like a ABomb in that it is too potentially devastating to the country at large to leave in the hands of people would use it as a first strike.
Obviously republicans are only doing it because democrats are in power, but that doesn't answer my question.
How many other aspects of the legislative would you be okay transferring to the executive just because you don't like the way the legislative is handling it? If the legislative isn't doing their job that's a problem with the people, who keep voting these dumb shits back into power while they have an approval rating of about 17%. It's no reason to grant the president more power. I don't care who the president is, that's a slippery slope I don't even want to approach.
Well then the solution is to get rid of the dangerous and useless policy altogether like every other country in the world then no one can use it for a weapon. There are much safer ways to gain political leverage in this country than trying to default on our debts.
no. you can thank the teatards who refused to send anything rational because they think compromise means we do what they want.
now maybe if they'll get out of the way a deal can be struck now.
No deal will be struck with Obama saying give me congressional powers.
The buck doesn't stop with congress. Obama apparently still doesn't know how to lead.
someone's got to make congress do what they're supposed to. boehner seems singularly incapable of it.
so assume i might agree with you... (although I don't in this instance) ... how do we assure that the radical right of the GOP doesn't do what they did the last time the debt ceiling came up?
they need to do their job.
now... i might do things differently... i might bring an emergency action before the supreme court to compel congress to do what it has to do and meet it's obligation to lift the debt ceiling on the basis that it's money previously authorized BY THEM.
the problem then arises that this particular supreme court would probably decline to hear the case as a purely political matter...
so then what?
it's easy to say "lead"...
when you're not the one dealing with a bunch of petulent extremists.
Both Houses....Senate and house of representatives!At first I was against it, not just for Obama, but for any President....but then on another thread Kissmy mentioned that it was not the president that is spending the money that raising the debt ceiling would have to cover. It is CONGRESS who is responsible for the spending that requires the debt ceiling to be raised, NOT the President....and if congress can't do their job and reign in spending then the country and the president should not be held hostage by them for money that THEY, CONGRESS has already spent....if you owe money, you PAY YOUR BILLS, (this is the moral thing to do, period) whether you have to put one of your bills on a credit card or not, pay it....
THEN, those of us in the stock market with our retirements and so forth won't be subject to this roller coaster of ups and downs that CONGRESS has put us in....
And CONGRESS will be solely responsible for the debt ceiling rise for their spending, will be under the microscope for the debt ceiling rise and their lack of management, and these stupid GAMES that congress is playing and shuffling of blame congress is trying to pass off on to the president for their OWN SPENDING will cease.....and HOPEFULLY congress will do their jobs....
Which congress?
At first I was against it, not just for Obama, but for any President....but then on another thread Kissmy mentioned that it was not the president that is spending the money that raising the debt ceiling would have to cover. It is CONGRESS who is responsible for the spending that requires the debt ceiling to be raised, NOT the President....and if congress can't do their job and reign in spending then the country and the president should not be held hostage by them for money that THEY, CONGRESS has already spent....if you owe money, you PAY YOUR BILLS, (this is the moral thing to do, period) whether you have to put one of your bills on a credit card or not, pay it....
THEN, those of us in the stock market with our retirements and so forth won't be subject to this roller coaster of ups and downs that CONGRESS has put us in....
And CONGRESS will be solely responsible for the debt ceiling rise for their spending, will be under the microscope for the debt ceiling rise and their lack of management, and these stupid GAMES that congress is playing and shuffling of blame congress is trying to pass off on to the president for their OWN SPENDING will cease.....and HOPEFULLY congress will do their jobs....
Obviously republicans are only doing it because democrats are in power, but that doesn't answer my question.
How many other aspects of the legislative would you be okay transferring to the executive just because you don't like the way the legislative is handling it? If the legislative isn't doing their job that's a problem with the people, who keep voting these dumb shits back into power while they have an approval rating of about 17%. It's no reason to grant the president more power. I don't care who the president is, that's a slippery slope I don't even want to approach.
Well then the solution is to get rid of the dangerous and useless policy altogether like every other country in the world then no one can use it for a weapon. There are much safer ways to gain political leverage in this country than trying to default on our debts.
The real solution is to stop spending more money than we have.
At first I was against it, not just for Obama, but for any President....but then on another thread Kissmy mentioned that it was not the president that is spending the money that raising the debt ceiling would have to cover. It is CONGRESS who is responsible for the spending that requires the debt ceiling to be raised, NOT the President....and if congress can't do their job and reign in spending then the country and the president should not be held hostage by them for money that THEY, CONGRESS has already spent....if you owe money, you PAY YOUR BILLS, (this is the moral thing to do, period) whether you have to put one of your bills on a credit card or not, pay it....
THEN, those of us in the stock market with our retirements and so forth won't be subject to this roller coaster of ups and downs that CONGRESS has put us in....
And CONGRESS will be solely responsible for the debt ceiling rise for their spending, will be under the microscope for the debt ceiling rise and their lack of management, and these stupid GAMES that congress is playing and shuffling of blame congress is trying to pass off on to the president for their OWN SPENDING will cease.....and HOPEFULLY congress will do their jobs....
Which congress?
the one that passed the bush tax cuts.
the one that passed the bush tax cuts.
If that is the case, why are we going into the fifth year without a budget from Congress? Democrats in the Senate from 2008 to the present have refused to agree on a fiscal budget and have blocked any efforts from Congress to pass a balanced budget. We can all thank Nancy Reid for that.
The budget process has become an impossible situation since it became the central political gripe of the republican party, not that we need an omnibus spending bill any more than a debt ceiling, entire political careers hang in the balance over what has become a self defeating process initially intended to get spending under control. The deficit hawks need to quit setting their sights so high trying to recklessly accomplish in a single term what a responsible government might be able to accomplish in twenty years.
no. you can thank the teatards who refused to send anything rational because they think compromise means we do what they want.
now maybe if they'll get out of the way a deal can be struck now.
No deal will be struck with Obama saying give me congressional powers.
The buck doesn't stop with congress. Obama apparently still doesn't know how to lead.
someone's got to make congress do what they're supposed to. boehner seems singularly incapable of it.
so assume i might agree with you... (although I don't in this instance) ... how do we assure that the radical right of the GOP doesn't do what they did the last time the debt ceiling came up?
they need to do their job.
now... i might do things differently... i might bring an emergency action before the supreme court to compel congress to do what it has to do and meet it's obligation to lift the debt ceiling on the basis that it's money previously authorized BY THEM.
the problem then arises that this particular supreme court would probably decline to hear the case as a purely political matter...
so then what?
it's easy to say "lead"...
when you're not the one dealing with a bunch of petulent extremists.
