North Carolina approves amendment banning gay marriage

[SniperFire]

There are several things that can be taken from this:

1. The belief by the left that the "old timers" who are anti-gay marriage are dying out, is false.

2. The "conservatives" in NC don't understand "rule of law" vs "rule of man". This is not how the founding fathers envisioned this republic.

The founders didn't envision voting on the rights of others....in fact, far from it, which is why we are not a pure democracy.

This is one issue that separates real conservatives from social conservative busy bodies.

Which is exactly what I was saying.

The vast majority of conservatives believe that redefining the definition of marriage is not a 'right.'

 

[Ravi]

wasn't that a man and a woman situation?

Yep. But what also was struck down was voting on the rights of others.

I really don't understand how you consider yourself a conservative while agreeing that mob rule is an American ideal.

that's bullshit, mob rule dictates smokers can't smoke in public.. they've had their rights to smoke cigarettes curtailed,, did you scream about that?

As a matter of fact, yes.

 

[PredFan]

I got married in front of a JOP.. the fact remains though until this is a secular nation I don't think the Christians will vote for gay marriage.

Which is exactly why rights should never be put to a vote.

Do we really want a mob of bigots running the show?

Well then, we should cease all voting for Presidents, Senators and Congressmen.. some are anti gay marriage including the present one. he should not have the right to hold that view, in fact he should not be allowed to enter a voting booth.

There is a difference between voting away someone's liberties and voting for representation in government.

 

[WillowTree]

well all ya had to say was Yes,, I'm opposed to the EPA which is nothing but big government on parade.. They infringe on the rights of property owner to do with their purchased property as they choose.. that's clearly an infringement on the property owners rights and vewy un American and bigoted against minorities.

If you oppose the “big government” than I’m very shocked that you would NOT oppose this recent NC ban on same-sex marriage.

You oppose the government infringing on the rights of property owners, but seem not to care when government sets in stone strict rigid marital rules that the population must abide by.

Using our government to tell people explicitly who can and cannot marry (when it comes to two, consenting adults)? Big Government.

Do you support forms of Big Government when they support your own viewpoints, and oppose Big Government when they are against your own viewpoints?

.

Do you believe in States rights and the right to Vote? or do you not believe in the constitution.. which?

 

[Dr.Drock]

Yeah NC! Way to write discrimination into your Constitution. History will not treat you well...

Well get ready, because it's likely to happen in a lot of other states too.

This is why we vote...and Majority rules. And it's not discrimination...nobody said they can't live like they want, they just want to change something that should never be changed. Too bad, so sad...

Carol it's sad to read that you agree with the ability of the majority to vote away the rights of the minority.

It's basically the opposite of what this country was founded on.

 

[WillowTree]

Which is exactly why rights should never be put to a vote.

Do we really want a mob of bigots running the show?

Well then, we should cease all voting for Presidents, Senators and Congressmen.. some are anti gay marriage including the present one. he should not have the right to hold that view, in fact he should not be allowed to enter a voting booth.

There is a difference between voting away someone's liberties and voting for representation in government.

It's done every day,, am I at liberty to buy incandescent lightbulbs or not.

 

[PredFan]

What could be more american than the majority voting away the rights of minorities?

Some examples would be sushi, tacos, the wall of China, and the Beatles.

In this country, you cannot vote away rights. Apparently, as we've seen in NC, you can still vote away liberties, but no one has ever had their rights voted away.

There is a difference between rights and liberties.

 

[WillowTree]

Yeah NC! Way to write discrimination into your Constitution. History will not treat you well...

Well get ready, because it's likely to happen in a lot of other states too.

This is why we vote...and Majority rules. And it's not discrimination...nobody said they can't live like they want, they just want to change something that should never be changed. Too bad, so sad...

Carol it's sad to read that you agree with the ability of the majority to vote away the rights of the minority.

It's basically the opposite of what this country was founded on.

so anything a minority wants it gets. no questions asked

 

[SniperFire]

Yeah NC! Way to write discrimination into your Constitution. History will not treat you well...

Well get ready, because it's likely to happen in a lot of other states too.

This is why we vote...and Majority rules. And it's not discrimination...nobody said they can't live like they want, they just want to change something that should never be changed. Too bad, so sad...

Carol it's sad to read that you agree with the ability of the majority to vote away the rights of the minority.

The 'minority' has exactly the same right to marriage as anyone else.

 

[RDD_1210]

wasn't that a man and a woman situation?

Yep. But what also was struck down was voting on the rights of others.

I really don't understand how you consider yourself a conservative while agreeing that mob rule is an American ideal.

that's bullshit, mob rule dictates smokers can't smoke in public.. they've had their rights to smoke cigarettes curtailed,, did you scream about that?

Second hand smoke is an actual health concern. Is their second hand gay? How does two homosexuals getting married affect you or anyone else?

 

[SniperFire]

Well get ready, because it's likely to happen in a lot of other states too.

This is why we vote...and Majority rules. And it's not discrimination...nobody said they can't live like they want, they just want to change something that should never be changed. Too bad, so sad...

Carol it's sad to read that you agree with the ability of the majority to vote away the rights of the minority.

It's basically the opposite of what this country was founded on.

so anything a minority wants it gets. no questions asked

They simply DEMAND they get to redefine marriage for everybody.

F them a lot.

 

[Skull Pilot]

I got married in front of a JOP.. the fact remains though until this is a secular nation I don't think the Christians will vote for gay marriage.

Which is exactly why rights should never be put to a vote.

Do we really want a mob of bigots running the show?

Well then, we should cease all voting for Presidents, Senators and Congressmen.. some are anti gay marriage including the present one. he should not have the right to hold that view, in fact he should not be allowed to enter a voting booth.

He can certainly hold that view.

What one certainly cannot do is force his views on others by denying them the legal protections afforded to others.

 

[PredFan]

Okay my first question here about N.C. is why? you have DOMA, and a whole host of laws that already do that, So what? you don't have other legislative things to deal with, say like, creating jobs in your state rather than deal with issues like this? It seems like a lot of states, mine included have spent more time on social issues that have little to do with Government at the expense of it's citizens health and the welfare of it's economies, and more to do with what some deem is socially acceptable. Personally, when you allow Government to start passing Laws on defining what is clearly a social issue, then why stop there, why not pass laws for redheads, or blondes, or even for people who wear glasses on Sundays? See what I mean? there is a reason why the constitution thought some things were best left to "people" to decide for themselves and this is sure one of those things.

The difference myght be the 2nd part of the law that was passed in North Carolina. I'm not up to snuff on DOMA, but the NC law stops the legal privileges of all "other" forms of unions. That is the part that I have the most problem with. Apparently it wasn't enough for them to defend marriage, but they felt that they had to deny gays the ability to join in civil unions as well. Sad.

 

[SniperFire]

Yep. But what also was struck down was voting on the rights of others.

I really don't understand how you consider yourself a conservative while agreeing that mob rule is an American ideal.

that's bullshit, mob rule dictates smokers can't smoke in public.. they've had their rights to smoke cigarettes curtailed,, did you scream about that?

Second hand smoke is an actual health concern.

Sort of like AIDS.

 

[WillowTree]

Carol it's sad to read that you agree with the ability of the majority to vote away the rights of the minority.

It's basically the opposite of what this country was founded on.

so anything a minority wants it gets. no questions asked

They simply DEMAND they get to redefine marriage for everybody.

F them a lot.

I'd call that shoving their ideas down our throats wouldn't you?

 

[PredFan]

What could be more american than the majority voting away the rights of minorities?

Some examples would be sushi, tacos, the wall of China, and the Beatles.

Yeah, it's a pretty sad commentary on America.

Our kids are gonna wonder why our generation hated gays for no reason. On the plus side though rational humans are at least making progress in this area, 10 years ago gays couldn't get married anywhere.

Soon enough gays will be able to get married almost everywhere and people on both sides will be wondering why this was made into such a big deal.

And as a side note the "sanctity of marriage" died with the popularity of divorce.

Recent voting seems to disagree with your prediction. Even in California, the most progressive state in the union, the people voted against gay marriage. not that it's correct, but it flies in the face of your predictions.

 

[PredFan]

There is no valid reason, but not all of us live in North Carolina.

The only reason is homophobia, plain and simple.

But these days people don't have the integrity to admit their bigotry, but in their defense at least their lack of honesty shows they're ashamed of their bigotry. That they know it's wrong.

I can't wait til Christmas.. then you'll see bigotry in all it's glory.

Two wrongs do not make a right my friend.

 

[Skull Pilot]

The collective choice is that we shouldn't have universal health care. obamacare is more unpopular today than it was the day he signed it into law. The term Will of the People doesn't mean only liberal people.

When people like those in North Carolina vote to keep the state of matrimony between one man and one woman they aren't voting against homosexuals to live their lives as they see fit. They are voting to keep homosexuals from imposing an obligation to regard same sex marriages as normal relationships.

They are voting to deny legal contractual property rights benefits and privileges to some people and grant them to others.

In no other venue and for no other population would that denial of legal protection be acceptable.

There is nothing prohibiting gays or anyone else from entering into any contractual rights they choose. Contract rights are not impaired in the slightest.

Try and tell that gay who have had their right of medical proxy revoked by a family member of their partner.

Try telling that to a member of a same sex couple who can't list a partner as a beneficiary to a pension. How about leaving property without taxation to a partner?

There are many benefits of the marriage contract that are not afforded to those not married.

 

[SniperFire]

so anything a minority wants it gets. no questions asked

They simply DEMAND they get to redefine marriage for everybody.

F them a lot.

I'd call that shoving their ideas down our throats wouldn't you?

er, bad time for said analogy. LOL

 

[Dr.Drock]

Predfan you're correct, thanks for the correction.

WillowTree I'm sure there's some aspect of you that's a minority. Whether it be your background (maybe you're irish american, german american, who knows) or the particular denomination of christianity you're a part of. I'll defend your protection as a minority just as much as I would gay americans.