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The Bloomberg administration has quietly begun charging rent to homeless families who live in publicly run shelters but have income from jobs.
The new policy is based on a 1997 state law that was not enforced until last week, when shelter operators across the city began requiring residents to pay a certain portion of their income. The amount varies based on factors that include family size and what shelter is being used, but should not exceed 50 percent of a familys income, a state official said.
Vanessa Dacosta, who earns $8.40 an hour as a cashier at Sbarro, received a notice under her door several weeks ago informing her that she had to give $336 of her approximately $800 per month in wages to the Clinton Family Inn, a shelter in Hells Kitchen where she has lived since March.
Its not right, said Ms. Dacosta, a single mother of a 2-year-old who said she spends nearly $100 a week on child care. I pay my baby sitter, I buy diapers, and Im trying to save money so I can get out of here. I dont want to be in the shelter forever.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/09/nyregion/09shelters.html?_r=1
DOMESTIC VIOLENCE EMERGENCY SHELTER* [FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]There are 2,084 domestic violence emergency shelter beds citywide, a 35% increase since January 2002. [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]*Statistics provided by the Human Resources Administration [/FONT][/FONT]DOMESTIC VIOLENCE CALLS FOR ASSISTANCE*
[FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]Police responded to 234,988 domestic violence incidents in 2008; this averages to over 600 incidents per day. In addition, NYPDs Domestic Violence Unit conducted 72,463 home visits in 2008, a 93% increase since 2002. [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]As of 12/31/2008, the Citys Domestic Violence Hotline advocates answered 134,903 calls in 2008, averaging 370 calls per day; 123,409 calls were answered in 2007, averaging 338 calls per day.[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]* Statistics provided by NYPD and Safe Horizon[/FONT][/FONT]
http://www.nyc.gov/html/ocdv/downloads/pdf/2008_Fact Sheet_updated.pdf
OMG, the HOUSING MARKET is responsibile for domestic violence, false accusations of domestic violence, and divorce in America! I should have known.The lack of affordable housing in New York problem is a fairly good example that disproves the theory that the market can solve all social ills.
The market can solve many problems and often does. The market is an engine which creates wealth.
But social ills are not the concern of the market.
So if the market blindly causes social problems in order to satisfy its mandate to make as much profit as possible, the market is perfectly sanguine if it actually CREATES social problems, too.
It is the business of goverment to keep society going such that the market and the people in it can continue to do what they do.
Without government there can be no market.
Without some kind of market, no government can thrive, either
It's a symbiotic relationship these two apparently conflicting entities are forever locked in.
When we get confused and think government should act like the market, society does less well than it could.
When we get confused and think government should become the market, society also does less well that it could.
Finding that balance between market forces and the political forces is always going be something that we tinker with.
In this case, the government is trying to act like the market.
It is becoming a landlord and I think we all suspect that the government won't do that very well.
But the market completely failed those people, too, didn't it?
The market could not create housing for people working for too little money (also a market function) so the government stepped in to mitigate that social problem.
Are those people going to get their money's worth with the government acting as a landlord?
I rather doubt it.
Is what they are getting better than what the market was willing to give them?
You bet it is.
The market couldn't give them anything, could it?
0OMG, the HOUSING MARKET is responsibile for domestic violence, false accusations of domestic violence, and divorce in America! I should have known.The lack of affordable housing in New York problem is a fairly good example that disproves the theory that the market can solve all social ills.
The market can solve many problems and often does. The market is an engine which creates wealth.
But social ills are not the concern of the market.
So if the market blindly causes social problems in order to satisfy its mandate to make as much profit as possible, the market is perfectly sanguine if it actually CREATES social problems, too.
It is the business of goverment to keep society going such that the market and the people in it can continue to do what they do.
Without government there can be no market.
Without some kind of market, no government can thrive, either
It's a symbiotic relationship these two apparently conflicting entities are forever locked in.
When we get confused and think government should act like the market, society does less well than it could.
When we get confused and think government should become the market, society also does less well that it could.
Finding that balance between market forces and the political forces is always going be something that we tinker with.
In this case, the government is trying to act like the market.
It is becoming a landlord and I think we all suspect that the government won't do that very well.
But the market completely failed those people, too, didn't it?
The market could not create housing for people working for too little money (also a market function) so the government stepped in to mitigate that social problem.
Are those people going to get their money's worth with the government acting as a landlord?
I rather doubt it.
Is what they are getting better than what the market was willing to give them?
You bet it is.
The market couldn't give them anything, could it?
You gotta be kidding me. I was giving you the benefit of the doubt using "HOUSING" market, in my reply to your attempt to derail this thread. I think you've gone completely nutz if your trying to imply that the financial markets are responsibile for the subject matter of this thread.0OMG, the HOUSING MARKET is responsibile for domestic violence, false accusations of domestic violence, and divorce in America! I should have known.The lack of affordable housing in New York problem is a fairly good example that disproves the theory that the market can solve all social ills.
The market can solve many problems and often does. The market is an engine which creates wealth.
But social ills are not the concern of the market.
So if the market blindly causes social problems in order to satisfy its mandate to make as much profit as possible, the market is perfectly sanguine if it actually CREATES social problems, too.
It is the business of goverment to keep society going such that the market and the people in it can continue to do what they do.
Without government there can be no market.
Without some kind of market, no government can thrive, either
It's a symbiotic relationship these two apparently conflicting entities are forever locked in.
When we get confused and think government should act like the market, society does less well than it could.
When we get confused and think government should become the market, society also does less well that it could.
Finding that balance between market forces and the political forces is always going be something that we tinker with.
In this case, the government is trying to act like the market.
It is becoming a landlord and I think we all suspect that the government won't do that very well.
But the market completely failed those people, too, didn't it?
The market could not create housing for people working for too little money (also a market function) so the government stepped in to mitigate that social problem.
Are those people going to get their money's worth with the government acting as a landlord?
I rather doubt it.
Is what they are getting better than what the market was willing to give them?
You bet it is.
The market couldn't give them anything, could it?
It is?
News to me, NO.
Why do you think the housing market is responsible for domestic violence, false accusations of domestic violence, and divorce in America?
I think you're wrong about that.
You gotta be kidding me. I was giving you the benefit of the doubt using "HOUSING" market, in my reply to your attempt to derail this thread.0OMG, the HOUSING MARKET is responsibile for domestic violence, false accusations of domestic violence, and divorce in America! I should have known.
It is?
News to me, NO.
Why do you think the housing market is responsible for domestic violence, false accusations of domestic violence, and divorce in America?
I think you're wrong about that.I wasn't trying to derail the thread, NO.
I was merely augmenting it.
I think you've gone completely nutz if your trying to imply that the financial markets are responsibile for the subject matter of this thread.
How many millionaires women do youy suppose are accusing their men of domestic violence so they can get a bed at a shelter, do you suppose, NO?
The fact that NY homeless centers are charging rent from the working homeless is but a secondary concern to me. The real concern to ME is that men are FALSELY being accused of domestic violence by their estranged spouse so they can get a FREE RIDE at a DV shelter.
Yeah I can see why that would bother you.
Domestic violence shelters are well aware that some women are trying to scam the system by telling them that they're victims of DV.
Did you know that?
How would you like to be falsely accused of domestic violence, Ed?
Already happened once, sport. It's infuriating but the event didn't go anywhere due to the fact that there was no evidence to support the false accusation.
And that happened in Massacusetts, too...a place KNOWN for getting it wrong when it comes to DV.
In the family court system all a woman has to do is make the allegation of domestic violence, disproving that allegation is on the accused.
I think you're misinformed about that.
Not that I'm a big fan of family courts, but it takes more than a mere allegation to get charged with DV.
If there's absolutely no evidence to support the charge, and the cops arrest somebody anyway, something's definitely not right.
And in that case it's probably not the law, but the application of that law by the cops.
Thats how our unconstitutional family court system works, Ed.
Like I already said, family courts face nearly impossible odds of getting it right.
I've known men who were screwed in DV and custody cases AND women who were totally screwed by them, too.
Were it up to me, I'd forego all the police and court systems by simply gathering a posse of men and pounding the ever loving crap out of any man who beats his women.
But of course such a drastic short circuiting of the legal process by mob rule would demand irrefuteable proof, too.
You gotta be kidding me. I was giving you the benefit of the doubt using "HOUSING" market, in my reply to your attempt to derail this thread. I think you've gone completely nutz if your trying to imply that the financial markets are responsibile for the subject matter of this thread.0OMG, the HOUSING MARKET is responsibile for domestic violence, false accusations of domestic violence, and divorce in America! I should have known.
It is?
News to me, NO.
Why do you think the housing market is responsible for domestic violence, false accusations of domestic violence, and divorce in America?
I think you're wrong about that.
The fact that NY homeless centers are charging rent from the working homeless is but a secondary concern to me. The real concern to ME is that men are FALSELY being accused of domestic violence by their estranged spouse so they can get a FREE RIDE at a DV shelter.
How would you like to be falsely accused of domestic violence, Ed? In the family court system all a woman has to do is make the allegation of domestic violence, disproving that allegation is on the accused. Thats how our unconstitutional family court system works, Ed.
You gotta be kidding me. I was giving you the benefit of the doubt using "HOUSING" market, in my reply to your attempt to derail this thread.0
It is?
News to me, NO.
Why do you think the housing market is responsible for domestic violence, false accusations of domestic violence, and divorce in America?
I think you're wrong about that.I wasn't trying to derail the thread, NO.
I was merely augmenting it.
How many millionaires women do youy suppose are accusing their men of domestic violence so they can get a bed at a shelter, do you suppose, NO?
Yeah I can see why that would bother you.
Domestic violence shelters are well aware that some women are trying to scam the system by telling them that they're victims of DV.
Did you know that?
Already happened once, sport. It's infuriating but the event didn't go anywhere due to the fact that there was no evidence to support the false accusation.
And that happened in Massacusetts, too...a place KNOWN for getting it wrong when it comes to DV.
I think you're misinformed about that.
Not that I'm a big fan of family courts, but it takes more than a mere allegation to get charged with DV.
If there's absolutely no evidence to support the charge, and the cops arrest somebody anyway, something's definitely not right.
And in that case it's probably not the law, but the application of that law by the cops.
Like I already said, family courts face nearly impossible odds of getting it right.
I've known men who were screwed in DV and custody cases AND women who were totally screwed by them, too.
Were it up to me, I'd forego all the police and court systems by simply gathering a posse of men and pounding the ever loving crap out of any man who beats his women.
But of course such a drastic short circuiting of the legal process by mob rule would demand irrefuteable proof, too.
If you think domestic violence charges are limited to the poor, youre sorely mistaken, Sport. Domestic Violence allegations know no social bounds. You can prove it to yourself by spending a day or two in any family courtroom, Sport.
Misinformed, eh? It takes more than a mere allegation to get charged with DV, eh? Youre full of shit, it happens OFTEN, to this day. I know because I talk to guys who get charged with it because Im a family court reform activist, not to mention that I was charged with DV some 20 years ago and my ex DID go to a DV shelter even though she didnt need to, financially. That little stunt however, based solely on her word, made her story more believable in the eyes of the social worker assigned to the case. It cost me a lot of money to get cleared of that charge. What nailed her in the end was that she couldnt prove her allegation that I choked her and the pictures taken by the cop who interviewed her revealed no marks whatsoever on her neck AND, she refused medical treatment BECAUSE, IT SIMPLY DIDNT HAPPEN.
That was just the tip of the iceberg with this bitch. She accused me of everything from stalking her to stealing her car. All of which caused me to spend a small fortune on lawyers to invalidate her BS. It wasnt until a judge finally ruled that one of her charges against me was frivolous and made her pay 10% my attorney fees that she took a different tact (which is way outside the context of this thread). Yeah, she got CAUGHT REDHANDED IN HER LIE and only had to pay 10% of my attorneys fee. NO OTHER CONSEQUENCES. I had to pay the other 90%. Nice huh?
Why don't you try reading the article since that's what the thread is about.You gotta be kidding me. I was giving you the benefit of the doubt using "HOUSING" market, in my reply to your attempt to derail this thread. I think you've gone completely nutz if your trying to imply that the financial markets are responsibile for the subject matter of this thread.0
It is?
News to me, NO.
Why do you think the housing market is responsible for domestic violence, false accusations of domestic violence, and divorce in America?
I think you're wrong about that.
The fact that NY homeless centers are charging rent from the working homeless is but a secondary concern to me. The real concern to ME is that men are FALSELY being accused of domestic violence by their estranged spouse so they can get a FREE RIDE at a DV shelter.
How would you like to be falsely accused of domestic violence, Ed? In the family court system all a woman has to do is make the allegation of domestic violence, disproving that allegation is on the accused. Thats how our unconstitutional family court system works, Ed.
Care to provide some evidence thats how housing court works?
The Bloomberg administration has quietly begun charging rent to homeless families who live in publicly run shelters but have income from jobs.
The new policy is based on a 1997 state law that was not enforced until last week, when shelter operators across the city began requiring residents to pay a certain portion of their income. The amount varies based on factors that include family size and what shelter is being used, but should not exceed 50 percent of a familys income, a state official said.
Vanessa Dacosta, who earns $8.40 an hour as a cashier at Sbarro, received a notice under her door several weeks ago informing her that she had to give $336 of her approximately $800 per month in wages to the Clinton Family Inn, a shelter in Hells Kitchen where she has lived since March.
Its not right, said Ms. Dacosta, a single mother of a 2-year-old who said she spends nearly $100 a week on child care. I pay my baby sitter, I buy diapers, and Im trying to save money so I can get out of here. I dont want to be in the shelter forever.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/09/nyregion/09shelters.html?_r=1
As a result (allegedly), women from low income families that are breaking-up are filing false accusations of domestic violence charges. Notably, domestic violence shelters DO NOT charge rent.
This is a real problem, not only for the domestic violence shelters, but for the men being falsely accused of domestic violence.
DOMESTIC VIOLENCE EMERGENCY SHELTER* [FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]There are 2,084 domestic violence emergency shelter beds citywide, a 35% increase since January 2002. [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]*Statistics provided by the Human Resources Administration [/FONT][/FONT]DOMESTIC VIOLENCE CALLS FOR ASSISTANCE*
[FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]Police responded to 234,988 domestic violence incidents in 2008; this averages to over 600 incidents per day. In addition, NYPDs Domestic Violence Unit conducted 72,463 home visits in 2008, a 93% increase since 2002. [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]As of 12/31/2008, the Citys Domestic Violence Hotline advocates answered 134,903 calls in 2008, averaging 370 calls per day; 123,409 calls were answered in 2007, averaging 338 calls per day.[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]* Statistics provided by NYPD and Safe Horizon[/FONT][/FONT]
http://www.nyc.gov/html/ocdv/downloads/pdf/2008_Fact Sheet_updated.pdf
Did you even bother to read the article?The Bloomberg administration has quietly begun charging rent to homeless families who live in publicly run shelters but have income from jobs.
The new policy is based on a 1997 state law that was not enforced until last week, when shelter operators across the city began requiring residents to pay a certain portion of their income. The amount varies based on factors that include family size and what shelter is being used, but should not exceed 50 percent of a familys income, a state official said.
Vanessa Dacosta, who earns $8.40 an hour as a cashier at Sbarro, received a notice under her door several weeks ago informing her that she had to give $336 of her approximately $800 per month in wages to the Clinton Family Inn, a shelter in Hells Kitchen where she has lived since March.
Its not right, said Ms. Dacosta, a single mother of a 2-year-old who said she spends nearly $100 a week on child care. I pay my baby sitter, I buy diapers, and Im trying to save money so I can get out of here. I dont want to be in the shelter forever.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/09/nyregion/09shelters.html?_r=1
As a result (allegedly), women from low income families that are breaking-up are filing false accusations of domestic violence charges. Notably, domestic violence shelters DO NOT charge rent.
This is a real problem, not only for the domestic violence shelters, but for the men being falsely accused of domestic violence.
DOMESTIC VIOLENCE EMERGENCY SHELTER* [FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]There are 2,084 domestic violence emergency shelter beds citywide, a 35% increase since January 2002. [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]*Statistics provided by the Human Resources Administration [/FONT][/FONT]DOMESTIC VIOLENCE CALLS FOR ASSISTANCE*
[FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]Police responded to 234,988 domestic violence incidents in 2008; this averages to over 600 incidents per day. In addition, NYPDs Domestic Violence Unit conducted 72,463 home visits in 2008, a 93% increase since 2002. [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]As of 12/31/2008, the Citys Domestic Violence Hotline advocates answered 134,903 calls in 2008, averaging 370 calls per day; 123,409 calls were answered in 2007, averaging 338 calls per day.[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Garamond,Garamond][FONT=Garamond,Garamond]* Statistics provided by NYPD and Safe Horizon[/FONT][/FONT]
... and? ...
Many of our shelters charge rent, 5 bucks a week for one hot and a cot, to offset their expenses so they can remain open. It costs money to house and feed people.
Did you even bother to read the article?As a result (allegedly), women from low income families that are breaking-up are filing false accusations of domestic violence charges. Notably, domestic violence shelters DO NOT charge rent.
This is a real problem, not only for the domestic violence shelters, but for the men being falsely accused of domestic violence.
... and? ...
Many of our shelters charge rent, 5 bucks a week for one hot and a cot, to offset their expenses so they can remain open. It costs money to house and feed people.
Vanessa Dacosta, who earns $8.40 an hour as a cashier at Sbarro, received a notice under her door several weeks ago informing her that she had to give $336 of her approximately $800 per month in wages to the Clinton Family Inn, a shelter in Hells Kitchen where she has lived since March.
5 dollars a week is a joke compared to taking over 40% of somebody's pay, especially somebody with a kid, who's making less than a living wage.
That was just the tip of the iceberg with this bitch. She accused me of everything from stalking her to stealing her car. All of which caused me to spend a small fortune on lawyers to invalidate her BS. It wasnt until a judge finally ruled that one of her charges against me was frivolous and made her pay 10% my attorney fees that she took a different tact (which is way outside the context of this thread). Yeah, she got CAUGHT REDHANDED IN HER LIE and only had to pay 10% of my attorneys fee. NO OTHER CONSEQUENCES. I had to pay the other 90%. Nice huh?
That was just the tip of the iceberg with this bitch. She accused me of everything from stalking her to stealing her car. All of which caused me to spend a small fortune on lawyers to invalidate her BS. It wasnt until a judge finally ruled that one of her charges against me was frivolous and made her pay 10% my attorney fees that she took a different tact (which is way outside the context of this thread). Yeah, she got CAUGHT REDHANDED IN HER LIE and only had to pay 10% of my attorneys fee. NO OTHER CONSEQUENCES. I had to pay the other 90%. Nice huh?
Well, I'll be damned, son. Hell, seems that none of us are fans of fraudulent allegations of improprieties, especially in the world of human pairbonding, is that right?
And I'm content to maintain my opposition of all forms of usury. That was a standard position for the individualists who supported legitimately competitive market enterprise and such (Tucker, Warren, Spooner, Stirner), and realized that such was better facilitated by socialism rather than capitalism.
Do you promise not to tell any more lies?
