Moses was a murder-er multiple times.,.,.,.

[surada]

And you conclude it makes it likely less historically correct?

Who knows.. The Story of Sinuhe is older.

 

[rylah]

Who knows.. The Story of Sinuhe is older.

And how does this help your conclusion
that it makes it less historically evident?

Instead of say, point to a common Egyptian practice.

Follow me through, schientist.

 

[hobelim]

Moses was a murder-er multiple times.,.,.,.

So what.

The command to not murder has nothing to do with modern legalistic conclusions about homicide.

The subject is about deliberately misleading others to defy divine instruction knowing that the consequense is a curse, the death.

When Jesus said that "Satan was a murderer from the beginning" he was referring to the fairy tale where the talking serpent beguiled Adam and Eve to defy the command of God which resulted in their death and expulsion from paradise which was not a biological death in nature since they continued to live physical lives.


Someone like ding is a serial killer in the eyes of God (so to speak) as is any evangelical who tries to win converts by beguiling them into defying Divine instruction and worship a froward pissed off first century Jewish man who liked to party with sinners and prostitutes and stick it to the man.

Even if the truth is that Jesus is the messiah, he is not and never was God.

 

[surada]

Jesus SOMEHOW failed to write anything. The only evidence available suggest that
he was literate----but SOMEHOW failed to write anything. Matthew---if one wishes to
believe that he authored the Book of Matthew-----wrote his stuff decades after Jesus
died and there is no real evidence that either he or his close collaborators-----like LUKE
ever REALLY met Jesus. Matthew was a Roman employee------aka SHILL

The Book of Matthew was written by someone about 50 years after the crucifixion. The Pentateuch was written 850 years after the death of Moses.

 

[watchingfromafar]

And he looked this way and that way, and when he saw that there was no man, he slew the Egyptian, and hid him in the sand. And when he went out the second day, behold, two men of the Hebrews strove together: and he said to him that did the wrong, Why smite you your fellow?

Now when Pharaoh heard this thing, he sought to slay Moses. But Moses fled from the face of Pharaoh, and dwelled in the land of Midian: and he sat down by a well. Moses and all the others flee Egypt and are scattered throughout the land.

rylah, why did you post "disagree" without something to support your view?
-

 

[watchingfromafar]

The command to not murder has nothing to do with modern legalistic conclusions about homicide.

So said the spider to the fly

-

 

[hobelim]

The New Testament is a replacement covenant of the Old Testament as explained by the Apostle of Christ, "Therefore my brethren, you have become dead to THE LAW (the law of Moses) through the body of Christ;

The Body of Christ is the teaching (flesh) of Jesus that the words used in the Law are figurative, the subjects hidden.

The only thing about the law that became obsolete after that revelation of Jesus was the wrong way to interpret and comply with the law's demands according to the instruction in the talmud, what Jesus called "the traditions of men", not the law itself which he said would remain in effect and in full force for as long as heaven and earth endure.

 

[hobelim]

So said the spider to the fly
View attachment 514919
-

"Behold! I will send for many fishermen, says the Lord, and they will fish for them; and after that I will send for many hunters, and they shall hunt them from every mountain, and from every hill, and every crevice in the rocks."

 

[ding]

After performing the miracle to feed the masses. Jesus tells them that he came down from heaven and is the bread of life. They grumble about this. He then proceeds to tell them that he was sent by God and reinforces that he is the bread of life. Jesus then shocks the crowd by telling them that the bread is his flesh. The Jews argue over this. They give Jesus every opportunity to soften his statement; to make his statement more symbolic. What does Jesus do? He doubles down. He tells them in very explicit terms that unless they eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood they won't have life in them. So what do many of them do? They leave because they found it offensive. Just like you do. And he let them leave, just as he has let you leave.

In 1 Corinthians 10:16-17 Paul is reminding the early Christians that they aren't just symbolically drinking and eating the blood and body of Christ.

16 The cup of blessing which we bless, is it not the communion of the blood of Christ? The bread which we break, is it not the communion of the body of Christ? 17 For we, though many, are one bread and one body; for we all partake of that one bread.

Partaking of the blood and body of Christ makes many different people into one body. It is how we participate in Christ's life and death. It is magical. There is nothing like it on the face of the earth. There is no experience that is more joyous. Participating in His suffering and death humbles the soul. Participating in His love for us makes the soul burst at its seams.

 

[ding]

So what.

The command to not murder has nothing to do with modern legalistic conclusions about homicide.

The subject is about deliberately misleading others to defy divine instruction knowing that the consequense is a curse, the death.

When Jesus said that "Satan was a murderer from the beginning" he was referring to the fairy tale where the talking serpent beguiled Adam and Eve to defy the command of God which resulted in their death and expulsion from paradise which was not a biological death in nature since they continued to live physical lives.


Someone like ding is a serial killer in the eyes of God (so to speak) as is any evangelical who tries to win converts by beguiling them into defying Divine instruction and worship a froward pissed off first century Jewish man who liked to party with sinners and prostitutes and stick it to the man.

Even if the truth is that Jesus is the messiah, he is not and never was God.

What you intended for evil, God is using for good.

 

[ding]

The Body of Christ is the teaching (flesh) of Jesus that the words used in the Law are figurative, the subjects hidden.

Again... Jesus said, " Do not labor for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to everlasting life, which the Son of Man will give you, because God the Father has set His seal on Him. This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent. Most assuredly, I say to you, Moses did not give you the bread from heaven, but My Father gives you the true bread from heaven. For the bread of God is He who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world. I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst. I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Whoever eats of this bread will live forever; and the bread that I will give for the life of the world is my flesh. Very truly, I tell you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. Those who eat my flesh and drink my blood have eternal life, and I will raise them up on the last day; for my flesh is true food and my blood is true drink. Those who eat my flesh and drink my blood abide in me, and I in them. Just as the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father, so whoever eats me will live because of me.”

 

[hobelim]

Partaking of the blood and body of Christ makes many different people into one body. It is how we participate in Christ's life and death. It is magical. There is nothing like it on the face of the earth. There is no experience that is more joyous. Participating in His suffering and death humbles the soul. Participating in His love for us makes the soul burst at its seams.

We? Us? "Its magical"? "No experience more joyous"? What a crock! How many of you are there?

"He who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment upon himself."

"I have not come to bring peace but a sword"

"Take from my hand this cup of fiery wine and make all the nations to whom I send you drink it. When they have drunk it they will vomit and go mad; such is the sword that I am sending among them."

"From his mouth there went a sharp sword with which to smite the nations."

"Take this cup of wine and drink it, all of you. This is my blood, the blood of the covenant."

"Just art thou in these thy judgments, thou Holy One who art and wast; for they shed the blood of thy people and of thy prophets and thou hast given them blood to drink"



The soul bursting at the seams, dying-dīiNG, and being assimilated by a self negating multiplicity sounds awesome but no thanks, I'll pass. I prefer to keep my soul intact and separate from y'all.

But since 'we' and 'us' enjoy munching on your own personal imaginary Jesus so much as y'all slowly disintegrate into nothingness, then, by all means...



Bottoms up!

 

[ding]

We? Us? "Its magical"? "No experience more joyous"? What a crock! How many of you are there?

"He who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment upon himself."

"I have not come to bring peace but a sword"

"Take from my hand this cup of fiery wine and make all the nations to whom I send you drink it. When they have drunk it they will vomit and go mad; such is the sword that I am sending among them."

"From his mouth there went a sharp sword with which to smite the nations."

"Take this cup of wine and drink it, all of you. This is my blood, the blood of the covenant."

"Just art thou in these thy judgments, thou Holy One who art and wast; for they shed the blood of thy people and of thy prophets and thou hast given them blood to drink"



The soul bursting at the seams, dying-dīiNG, and being assimilated by a self negating multiplicity sounds awesome but no thanks, I'll pass. I prefer to keep my soul intact and separate from y'all.

But since 'we' and 'us' enjoy munching on your own personal imaginary Jesus so much as y'all slowly disintegrate into nothingness, then, by all means...



Bottoms up!

That'some mishmash of quotes you took out of context.

Is there anyone else besides you in your church of deception?

 

[ding]

The real presence of Jesus in the Eucharist. Amen

 

[ding]

We? Us? "Its magical"? "No experience more joyous"? What a crock! How many of you are there?

"He who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment upon himself."

"I have not come to bring peace but a sword"

"Take from my hand this cup of fiery wine and make all the nations to whom I send you drink it. When they have drunk it they will vomit and go mad; such is the sword that I am sending among them."

"From his mouth there went a sharp sword with which to smite the nations."

"Take this cup of wine and drink it, all of you. This is my blood, the blood of the covenant."

"Just art thou in these thy judgments, thou Holy One who art and wast; for they shed the blood of thy people and of thy prophets and thou hast given them blood to drink"



The soul bursting at the seams, dying-dīiNG, and being assimilated by a self negating multiplicity sounds awesome but no thanks, I'll pass. I prefer to keep my soul intact and separate from y'all.

But since 'we' and 'us' enjoy munching on your own personal imaginary Jesus so much as y'all slowly disintegrate into nothingness, then, by all means...



Bottoms up!

60Then many of his disciples who were listening said, “This saying is hard; who can accept it?”
61Since Jesus knew that his disciples were murmuring about this, he said to them, “Does this shock you?
62What if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before?*
63It is the spirit that gives life, while the flesh* is of no avail. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and life.
64But there are some of you who do not believe.” Jesus knew from the beginning the ones who would not believe and the one who would betray him.c
65And he said, “For this reason I have told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by my Father.”
66As a result of this, many [of] his disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him.
67Jesus then said to the Twelve, “Do you also want to leave?”
68Simon Peter answered him, “Master, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life.
69We have come to believe and are convinced that you are the Holy One of God.”d

 

[hobelim]

It is the spirit that gives life, while the flesh* is of no avail. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and life.
64But there are some of you who do not believe.” Jesus knew from the beginning the ones who would not believe and the one who would betray him.c
65And he said, “For this reason I have told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by my Father.”
66As a result of this, many [of] his disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him.
67Jesus then said to the Twelve, “Do you also want to leave?”
68Simon Peter answered him, “Master, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life.
69We have come to believe and are convinced that you are the Holy One of God.

Thanks for posting the scriptural proof that it is the words that Jesus spoke that are what give life not a matzo made by human hands that can neither see, hear, or speak.

 

[Clyde 154]

After performing the miracle to feed the masses. Jesus tells them that he came down from heaven and is the bread of life. They grumble about this. He then proceeds to tell them that he was sent by God and reinforces that he is the bread of life. Jesus then shocks the crowd by telling them that the bread is his flesh. The Jews argue over this. They give Jesus every opportunity to soften his statement; to make his statement more symbolic. What does Jesus do? He doubles down. He tells them in very explicit terms that unless they eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood they won't have life in them. So what do many of them do? They leave because they found it offensive. Just like you do. And he let them leave, just as he has let you leave.

In 1 Corinthians 10:16-17 Paul is reminding the early Christians that they aren't just symbolically drinking and eating the blood and body of Christ.

16 The cup of blessing which we bless, is it not the communion of the blood of Christ? The bread which we break, is it not the communion of the body of Christ? 17 For we, though many, are one bread and one body; for we all partake of that one bread.

Partaking of the blood and body of Christ makes many different people into one body. It is how we participate in Christ's life and death. It is magical. There is nothing like it on the face of the earth. There is no experience that is more joyous. Participating in His suffering and death humbles the soul. Participating in His love for us makes the soul burst at its seams.

No.......that's hardly the correct context of the passage you mispresented. The reason the masses left is not because of the things you stated........it was because they were following Jesus because HE FEED THEM, he feed their flesh and they wanted more. You can't read one passage and take it away from the context of the entire chapter.......if you read everything in the correct context.........Jesus explained why they continued to follow Him.........they were Greedy and wanting to fill their physical bodies instead of threating their spiritual body that is in danger of everlasting damnation due to sin......as defined under the Law of Moses. He was to offer them a better way of defeating sin..........the sacrifice of His Body and Blood on the cross.

Jesus SENT THEM AWAY....yet they persisted wanting to be fed again, they were not in fear of the symbolism being delivered by the Christ..........Jesus sent them away because they were seeking after the wrong thing. Physical need.

The passage in question self defines the reason that the masses stopped following Jesus (John 6:26-27). When people followed Him because He feed the 5000, Jesus TURNED THEM AWAY.......after they continually followed Him wanting more food for the body.

"MOST ASSUREDLY......I say to you, you seek Me, not because you saw the signs (the miracle of the loaves and fish), but because you ate of the loaves and were filled. (Jesus explains what is meant by eating My flesh and drinking My blood) Do not labor for food which perishes, but for the food which endures to everlasting life, which the Son of Man will give you, because God the Father has set His seal upon Me." -- John 6:26-27

This statement by Jesus did not stop them from following Him demanding to be fed again. In response to their continued following looking for food for the body Jesus stated they are looking for the wrong thing......food to fill their bodies which will ultimately perish like everything physical. They should be looking for spiritual food which will give them (their spirit) eternal life. "Then they (the masses who were fed by the miracle) said to Him, "GIVE US THIS BREAD (What bread.......the bread of the miracles) ALWAYS." and Jesus said, "I am the bread of life, He who comes to Me shall never hunger (spiritually), and he who believes in Me shall never thirst. BUT I SAY TO YOU WHO HAVE SEEN ME AND YET DO NOT BELIEVE.....and this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise Him up on the last day". John 6:34-36, 40.

Then and only then after Jesus self defines what His body and blood represents.........the passage concerning the partaking of His Body (Flesh) and drinking of His (Blood). -- John 6:51-58.

The Apostle Paul explains with no ambiguity whatsoever. You have to die to become free of the Law of Moses and be BORN AGAIN, of the water and the spirit. Then the Old Law would no longer apply. "Or do you not know that as many of us that were Baptized into Christ were baptized unto HIS DEATH..............that just as the Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. (Born again, of the water and the spirit)..............He died for Sin once for all (under the law of Moses there was no forgiveness of sin........sin was carried over annually...year to year via sacrificing lambs without blemish)........Likewise you also (the believer)reckon yourself to be dead to indeed to sin................." -- Romans 6:3-11.

Likewise the blood Jesus is addressing is the Communion cup that memorizes the death of Jesus for our sins, "The cup of blessing which we bless, IS IT NOT THE COMMUNION OF THE BLOOD OF CHRIST? The Bread which we break, IS IT NOT THE COMMUNIOON OF THE BODY OF CHRIST? For we, though many, are ONE bread and ONE body, for we all partake of that One bread." -- 1 Cor. 10:16-17

Baptism is not a physical death but a symbolic death, a representation of spiritual death to sin. You can be baptized until you know every fish by name..........but unless you have faith as to what that baptism represents.....the work is useless. As James said, Faith without works is dead and faith alone will not save as even the demons believe with fear and trembling.

Just as water baptism is symbolic yet important as a sign of faith........so is the eating of the Body and Flesh and Drinking of His Blood a symbolism that demonstrates faith in MEMORY of the Christ's great sacrifice where His body and Flesh and Blood were literally sacrificed for the sins of the world.

 

[ding]

Thanks for posting the scriptural proof that it is the words that Jesus spoke that are what give life not a matzo made by human hands that can neither see, hear, or speak.

You actually have to read the whole thing to understand context, dummy.

 

[ding]

No.......that's hardly the correct context of the passage you mispresented. The reason the masses left is not because of the things you stated........it was because they were following Jesus because HE FEED THEM, he feed their flesh and they wanted more. You can't read one passage and take it away from the context of the entire chapter.......if you read everything in the correct context.........Jesus explained why they continued to follow Him.........they were Greedy and wanting to fill their physical bodies instead of threating their spiritual body that is in danger of everlasting damnation due to sin......as defined under the Law of Moses. He was to offer them a better way of defeating sin..........the sacrifice of His Body and Blood on the cross.

The passage in question self defines the reason that the masses stopped following Jesus (John 6:26-27). When people followed Him because He feed the 5000, Jesus TURNED THEM AWAY.......after they continually followed Him wanting more food for the body.

"MOST ASSUREDLY......I say to you, you seek Me, not because you saw the signs (the miracle of the loaves and fish), but because you ate of the loaves and were filled. (Jesus explains what is meant by eating My flesh and drinking My blood) Do not labor for food which perishes, but for the food which endures to everlasting life, which the Son of Man will give you, because God the Father has set His seal upon Me." -- John 6:26-27

This statement by Jesus did not stop them from following Him demanding to be fed again. In response to their continued following looking for food for the body Jesus stated they are looking for the wrong thing......food to fill their bodies which will ultimately perish like everything physical. They should be looking for spiritual food which will give them (their spirit) eternal life. "Then they (the masses who were feed by the miracle) said to Him, "GIVE US THIS BREAD (What bread.......the bread of the miracles) ALWAYS." and Jesus said, "I am the bread of life, He who comes to Me shall never hunger (spiritually), and he who believes in Me shall never thirst. BUT I SAY TO YOU WHO HAVE SEEN ME AND YET DO NOT BELIEVE.....and this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise Him up on the last day". John 6:34-36, 40.

Then and only then after Jesus self defines what His body and blood represents.........the passage concerning the partaking of His Body (Flesh) and drinking of His (Blood). -- John 6:51-58.

The Apostle Paul explains with no ambiguity whatsoever. You have to die to become free of the Law of Moses and be BORN AGAIN, of the water and the spirit. Then the Old Law would no longer apply. "Or do you not know that as many of us that were Baptized into Christ were baptized unto HIS DEATH..............that just as the Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. (Born again, of the water and the spirit)..............He died for Sin once for all (under the law of Moses there was no forgiveness of sin........sin was carried over annually...year to year via sacrificing lambs without blemish)........Likewise you also (the believer)reckon yourself to be dead to indeed to sin................." -- Romans 6:3-11.

Likewise the blood Jesus is addressing is the Communion cup that memorizes the death of Jesus for our sins, "The cup of blessing which we bless, IS IT NOT THE COMMUNION OF THE BLOOD OF CHRIST? The Bread which we break, IS IT NOT THE COMMUNIOON OF THE BODY OF CHRIST? For we, though many, are ONE bread and ONE body, for we all partake of that One bread." -- 1 Cor. 10:16-17

Baptism is not a physical death but a symbolic death, a representation of spiritual death to sin. You can be baptized until you know every fish by name..........but unless you have faith as to what that baptism represents.....the work is useless. As James said, Faith without works is dead and faith alone will not save as even the demons believe with fear and trembling.

I guess you weren't chosen by God then since it shocks you and you don't accept it.


60Then many of his disciples who were listening said, “This saying is hard; who can accept it?”
61Since Jesus knew that his disciples were murmuring about this, he said to them, “Does this shock you?
62What if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before?*
63It is the spirit that gives life, while the flesh* is of no avail. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and life.
64But there are some of you who do not believe.” Jesus knew from the beginning the ones who would not believe and the one who would betray him.c
65And he said, “For this reason I have told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by my Father.”
66As a result of this, many [of] his disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him.
67Jesus then said to the Twelve, “Do you also want to leave?”
68Simon Peter answered him, “Master, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life.
69We have come to believe and are convinced that you are the Holy One of God.”d

 

[ding]

On the night before He suffered and died on the cross, Jesus shared a last meal with His disciples and instituted the sacrament of the Holy Eucharist.

While they were eating, Jesus took bread, said the blessing, broke it, and giving it to his disciples said, ‘Take and eat; this is my body.’ Then he took a cup, gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, ‘Drink from it, all of you, for this is my blood of the covenant, which will be shed on behalf of many for the forgiveness of sins.’ (Matthew 26:26-28)