Minimum Wage Increase: They Never Talks About the SALES

[LOki]

If I was a governor of a state with a legislature stupid enough to pass a $30/hr minimum wage, I would totally sign it into law. Just to shut you morons up once and for all.

Hey if someone can get $30, good for them. America's all about gettin that paper. That's what America's all about.

The reason I know that even you don't believe the bullshit your spinning is that you will never answer a very simple question: If minimum wage mandates have no negative repercussions, why stop at $30/hr? Why not just legislate a $100/hr minimum wage? If you think that is ridiculous, please explain why.

Well obviously there has to be some reasonable contemplation involved. But again i ask, show us all the examples of businesses going under due to the Minimum Wage. Because i've never observed even one example of that happening. If you can't afford to pay Minimum Wage, you need to shut things down. It wasn't meant to be for you.

What is your exact objection to basing a worker's wage solely upon the value of that worker's work?

What is 'Value?' I may value a human being more than you do. So i have no problem with them making $15 an hr. I'm not angry or frightened over it. I'm at peace with it.

What is your exact objection to basing a worker's wage solely upon the value of that worker's work?

 

[paulitician]

Seriously, don't be so frightened that the fat cats are gonna have to pay struggling workers more. They don't need your sympathy. The Walmart and McDonalds top brass will always be Multimillionaires. They're gonna make it. I promise.

Why do you hate middle class stock holders? Why do you hate teachers unions and teachers who's pension plans are heavily invested in the very corporations you hate?

Again, i don't hate anyone. But i do hate their silly whining. Minimum Wage does not cause businesses to go under. There is no proof of it happening. It's all just greedy assholes bitching & moaning about having to pay workers a decent wage. Nothing more, nothing less.

Well then go complain to Democrats who are invested in these corporations, get Democrats to give up their profits and give the money to workers, lead by example.

If a business can't afford to pay Minimum Wage, then it's time to shut it down. I've never seen a business yet that went out of business because of paying Minimum Wage. If you or someone else has an example, i'm willing to check it out.

Guess how many NY State job pay grades start below $15 an hour...wait for it...a bunch of them. OH SNAP!!

Why does that make you happy? You should want fellow Americans to do well. Don't allow hate & greed to consume you. Could come back to bite you.

 

[2aguy]

Well...who is going out of business...well....Hollywood....they don't like the minimum wage either...considering how many of their drones probably pushed for it....saw this at breitbart...they linked to a Variety article....

Entertainment Industry Wonders How Minimum Wage Hike Will Affect Biz Variety

“Costs are going to go up,” says Stuart Waldman, president of the San Fernando Valley-based Valley Industry & Commerce Assn. “It just makes L.A. a little less film friendly, a little more difficult. If someone can get catering for cheaper in Louisiana, do they make that decision to shoot there? ” Julie Jackson of Jackson Shrub Supply, which has provided greenery to the industry for almost 80 years, echoed those sentiments. “We just started getting production to come back to California, and now could face them leaving us yet again, and perhaps permanently this time,” she wrote in an email.

Christopher Thornberg, founding partner of Beacon Economics, which did a study of the minimum wage increase commissioned by the L.A. Area Chamber of Commerce, says merchant flight is a likely concern for the city. A prop house, for instance, could move to a neighboring municipality, like Burbank or Culver City, which has not yet set higher minimum wages. “You end up hurting city competitiveness and city tax revenues,” he says.

so...unions want to be exempt and Hollywood is going to move....yeah..they want 15 dollars an hour for everyone else....

 

[2aguy]

Why do you hate middle class stock holders? Why do you hate teachers unions and teachers who's pension plans are heavily invested in the very corporations you hate?

Again, i don't hate anyone. But i do hate their silly whining. Minimum Wage does not cause businesses to go under. There is no proof of it happening. It's all just greedy assholes bitching & moaning about having to pay workers a decent wage. Nothing more, nothing less.

Well then go complain to Democrats who are invested in these corporations, get Democrats to give up their profits and give the money to workers, lead by example.

If a business can't afford to pay Minimum Wage, then it's time to shut it down. I've never seen a business yet that went out of business because of paying Minimum Wage. If you or someone else has an example, i'm willing to check it out.

Guess how many NY State job pay grades start below $15 an hour...wait for it...a bunch of them. OH SNAP!!

Why does that make you happy? You should want fellow Americans to do well. Don't allow hate & greed to consume you. Could come back to bite you.

we are the ones who want people to do well...what you advocate is stealing.....when you order at gun point businesses to pay a certain amount they don't want to pay...that is stealing....and it is wrong and immoral.......

 

[BluesLegend]

Why do you hate middle class stock holders? Why do you hate teachers unions and teachers who's pension plans are heavily invested in the very corporations you hate?

Again, i don't hate anyone. But i do hate their silly whining. Minimum Wage does not cause businesses to go under. There is no proof of it happening. It's all just greedy assholes bitching & moaning about having to pay workers a decent wage. Nothing more, nothing less.

Well then go complain to Democrats who are invested in these corporations, get Democrats to give up their profits and give the money to workers, lead by example.

If a business can't afford to pay Minimum Wage, then it's time to shut it down. I've never seen a business yet that went out of business because of paying Minimum Wage. If you or someone else has an example, i'm willing to check it out.

Guess how many NY State job pay grades start below $15 an hour...wait for it...a bunch of them. OH SNAP!!

Why does that make you happy? You should want fellow Americans to do well. Don't allow hate & greed to consume you. Could come back to bite you.

I openly and proudly hate liberals, that's just not going to change.

 

[BluesLegend]

Again, i don't hate anyone. But i do hate their silly whining. Minimum Wage does not cause businesses to go under. There is no proof of it happening. It's all just greedy assholes bitching & moaning about having to pay workers a decent wage. Nothing more, nothing less.

Well then go complain to Democrats who are invested in these corporations, get Democrats to give up their profits and give the money to workers, lead by example.

If a business can't afford to pay Minimum Wage, then it's time to shut it down. I've never seen a business yet that went out of business because of paying Minimum Wage. If you or someone else has an example, i'm willing to check it out.

Guess how many NY State job pay grades start below $15 an hour...wait for it...a bunch of them. OH SNAP!!

Why does that make you happy? You should want fellow Americans to do well. Don't allow hate & greed to consume you. Could come back to bite you.

we are the ones who want people to do well...what you advocate is stealing.....when you order at gun point businesses to pay a certain amount they don't want to pay...that is stealing....and it is wrong and immoral.......

When was the last time you heard Obama or any of these $15 an hour minimum wage frauds calling out state governments in liberal states for not paying their workers $15 an hour?

 

[Dragonlady]

Employers can't reduce staff? Really? I was working at a car wash when the minimum wage took a big jump in the 1970s. The car wash laid off about 1/4 to 1/3 of the workers because they simply could not afford to pay the same amount of people at the new wage.

One problem with liberalism is that it repeatedly must ignore reality. Why, why, why not use the Earned Income Tax Credit to help low-income folks who are supporting families and/or who are over 25, rather than raise the minimum wage and destroy tons of jobs?

Earned income credits are nothing more than wage subsidies for big corporations, paid for by middle income workers. Conservatives are against redistribution of wealth unless it benefits corporations.

Furthermore, the government spends money taxing the public, and then more money to conduct the means tests to determine who qualifies for the credits, and then more money paying the money back out.

Added to which, conservatives then call people getting government assistance takers and leeches.

It would cost a whole lot less for the corporations to simply pay their workers a fair wage, instead of having the government subsidize their operations. It would also save money in administration of the program.

And last but not least, with decent wages the lower income workers would become tax payers, increasing government revenues, instead of being a drain on the public purse.

 

[dblack]

If I was a governor of a state with a legislature stupid enough to pass a $30/hr minimum wage, I would totally sign it into law. Just to shut you morons up once and for all.

Hey if someone can get $30, good for them. America's all about gettin that paper. That's what America's all about.

The reason I know that even you don't believe the bullshit your spinning is that you will never answer a very simple question: If minimum wage mandates have no negative repercussions, why stop at $30/hr? Why not just legislate a $100/hr minimum wage? If you think that is ridiculous, please explain why.

Well obviously there has to be some reasonable contemplation involved. But again i ask, show us all the examples of businesses going under due to the Minimum Wage. Because i've never observed even one example of that happening. If you can't afford to pay Minimum Wage, you need to shut things down. It wasn't meant to be for you.

What is your exact objection to basing a worker's wage solely upon the value of that worker's work?

What is 'Value?' I may value a human being more than you do. So i have no problem with them making $15 an hr. I'm not angry or frightened over it. I'm at peace with it.

Exactly. We all value different things in different amounts. If you value someone's work enough to pay the $15/hr, you should.

 

[dblack]

If I was a governor of a state with a legislature stupid enough to pass a $30/hr minimum wage, I would totally sign it into law. Just to shut you morons up once and for all.

Hey if someone can get $30, good for them. America's all about gettin that paper. That's what America's all about.

The reason I know that even you don't believe the bullshit your spinning is that you will never answer a very simple question: If minimum wage mandates have no negative repercussions, why stop at $30/hr? Why not just legislate a $100/hr minimum wage? If you think that is ridiculous, please explain why.

Well obviously there has to be some reasonable contemplation involved.

Why?

But again i ask, show us all the examples of businesses going under due to the Minimum Wage. Because i've never observed even one example of that happening. If you can't afford to pay Minimum Wage, you need to shut things down. It wasn't meant to be for you.

In terms of real value, relative to inflation, minimum wage has been going down. So if anything, they've been getting relief over the last twenty or thirty years. There's no evidence that minimum wage increases will have negative consequences because they've been carefully, and deliberately, kept lagging behind the rate of inflation.

And again, the other point you keep ignoring, what do you say to workers who want to do work that isn't worth $30/hr? I'm not that really concerned about the fate of the businesses in question. They can, and will, find a workaround for dumbass regulations. They always do. It's the workers who are told they can no longer work who will suffer.

But what is a human being worth?

I wouldn't try to put a dollar value on someone's life. But any given work they do is another story. How much it's worth to me depends on how much I need what they have to offer. You don't really get that, do you?

 

[dblack]

If I was a governor of a state with a legislature stupid enough to pass a $30/hr minimum wage, I would totally sign it into law. Just to shut you morons up once and for all.

Hey if someone can get $30, good for them. America's all about gettin that paper. That's what America's all about.

The reason I know that even you don't believe the bullshit your spinning is that you will never answer a very simple question: If minimum wage mandates have no negative repercussions, why stop at $30/hr? Why not just legislate a $100/hr minimum wage? If you think that is ridiculous, please explain why.

What is your exact objection to basing a worker's wage solely upon the value of that worker's work?

Are you asking me? I have no objection to that at all. Why would you suggest I do?

 

[dblack]

Yes, yes, yes. I understand. You never saw a cat turn into a dog, so evolution never happened. You never saw a man on the moon, so it never happened. And you never saw a businesses go under because of minimum wage, so it never happened.

There's literally no arguing with that kind of obtuse denial of reality.

So instead tell me... what is your exact objection to basing a worker's wage solely upon the value of that worker's work?

Well, still haven't seen anyone show even one business going out of business because of Minimum Wage. I mean if it happens so often, surely you or someone can show at least one example.

The reality is, Minimum Wage doesn't cause businesses to go under. It never has and never will. The sky won't fall. That's just fact.

Yes, yes, yes. I understand. You never saw a cat turn into a dog, so evolution never happened. You never saw a man on the moon, so it never happened. And you never saw a businesses go under because of minimum wage, so it never happened.

There's literally no arguing with that kind of obtuse denial of reality.

So instead tell me... what is your exact objection to basing a worker's wage solely upon the value of that worker's work?

If you can't afford to pay Minimum Wage, you don't belong in business. Period, end of story.

What is your exact objection to basing a worker's wage solely upon the value of that worker's work?

What does 'value' really mean? I'm ok with an American making $15 an hr. I don't fear the sky falling as a result. Life will go on.

I you understood what value really meant, you wouldn't be spewing all this nonsense.

 

[Care4all]

Well then go complain to Democrats who are invested in these corporations, get Democrats to give up their profits and give the money to workers, lead by example.

If a business can't afford to pay Minimum Wage, then it's time to shut it down. I've never seen a business yet that went out of business because of paying Minimum Wage. If you or someone else has an example, i'm willing to check it out.

Guess how many NY State job pay grades start below $15 an hour...wait for it...a bunch of them. OH SNAP!!

Why does that make you happy? You should want fellow Americans to do well. Don't allow hate & greed to consume you. Could come back to bite you.

we are the ones who want people to do well...what you advocate is stealing.....when you order at gun point businesses to pay a certain amount they don't want to pay...that is stealing....and it is wrong and immoral.......

When was the last time you heard Obama or any of these $15 an hour minimum wage frauds calling out state governments in liberal states for not paying their workers $15 an hour?

FYI-
President Obama is wanting the minimum wage to go to $10.10 NOT $15.

 

[dblack]

Employers can't reduce staff? Really? I was working at a car wash when the minimum wage took a big jump in the 1970s. The car wash laid off about 1/4 to 1/3 of the workers because they simply could not afford to pay the same amount of people at the new wage.

One problem with liberalism is that it repeatedly must ignore reality. Why, why, why not use the Earned Income Tax Credit to help low-income folks who are supporting families and/or who are over 25, rather than raise the minimum wage and destroy tons of jobs?

Earned income credits are nothing more than wage subsidies for big corporations, paid for by middle income workers. Conservatives are against redistribution of wealth unless it benefits corporations.

Furthermore, the government spends money taxing the public, and then more money to conduct the means tests to determine who qualifies for the credits, and then more money paying the money back out.

Added to which, conservatives then call people getting government assistance takers and leeches.

It would cost a whole lot less for the corporations to simply pay their workers a fair wage, instead of having the government subsidize their operations. It would also save money in administration of the program.

And last but not least, with decent wages the lower income workers would become tax payers, increasing government revenues, instead of being a drain on the public purse.

Only those who could get jobs earning higher wages. If they can increase the value of their work, and make the labor they have to offer worth the higher wages, they'll be out of work. Minimum wage is essentially mandated unemployment, telling everyone who can't get a job making more than someone's idea of a 'minimum' that they aren't allowed to work.

 

[BluesLegend]

If a business can't afford to pay Minimum Wage, then it's time to shut it down. I've never seen a business yet that went out of business because of paying Minimum Wage. If you or someone else has an example, i'm willing to check it out.

Guess how many NY State job pay grades start below $15 an hour...wait for it...a bunch of them. OH SNAP!!

Why does that make you happy? You should want fellow Americans to do well. Don't allow hate & greed to consume you. Could come back to bite you.

we are the ones who want people to do well...what you advocate is stealing.....when you order at gun point businesses to pay a certain amount they don't want to pay...that is stealing....and it is wrong and immoral.......

When was the last time you heard Obama or any of these $15 an hour minimum wage frauds calling out state governments in liberal states for not paying their workers $15 an hour?

FYI-
President Obama is wanting the minimum wage to go to $10.10 NOT $15.

Fair enough. Speaking of Maine, great lobster but Maine's taxes are insane.

 

[dblack]

If a business can't afford to pay Minimum Wage, then it's time to shut it down. I've never seen a business yet that went out of business because of paying Minimum Wage. If you or someone else has an example, i'm willing to check it out.

Guess how many NY State job pay grades start below $15 an hour...wait for it...a bunch of them. OH SNAP!!

Why does that make you happy? You should want fellow Americans to do well. Don't allow hate & greed to consume you. Could come back to bite you.

we are the ones who want people to do well...what you advocate is stealing.....when you order at gun point businesses to pay a certain amount they don't want to pay...that is stealing....and it is wrong and immoral.......

When was the last time you heard Obama or any of these $15 an hour minimum wage frauds calling out state governments in liberal states for not paying their workers $15 an hour?

FYI-
President Obama is wanting the minimum wage to go to $10.10 NOT $15.

Of course. The corporatists are evil, but they're not idiots. They're never going to raise the minimum wage to the level that it will damage economic output.

 

[Care4all]

Guess how many NY State job pay grades start below $15 an hour...wait for it...a bunch of them. OH SNAP!!

Why does that make you happy? You should want fellow Americans to do well. Don't allow hate & greed to consume you. Could come back to bite you.

we are the ones who want people to do well...what you advocate is stealing.....when you order at gun point businesses to pay a certain amount they don't want to pay...that is stealing....and it is wrong and immoral.......

When was the last time you heard Obama or any of these $15 an hour minimum wage frauds calling out state governments in liberal states for not paying their workers $15 an hour?

FYI-
President Obama is wanting the minimum wage to go to $10.10 NOT $15.

Of course. The corporatists are evil, but they're not idiots. They're never going to raise the minimum wage to the level that it will damage economic output.

You are right, they won't raise it enough to damage the economic output.

 

[Dirk the Daring]

Every cost associated with the making and selling of burgers had increased over the past 20 years except the minimum wage. Burger chains are recording record profits and yet somehow, the work for the people who make and sell the burgers is not worth more. That's some twisted logic you conservatives have got going there.

Is burger flipping, as a skill, *worth* more than it was 20 years ago? I'd argue with the rise of automation, it's probably worth less.

 

[LOki]

If I was a governor of a state with a legislature stupid enough to pass a $30/hr minimum wage, I would totally sign it into law. Just to shut you morons up once and for all.

Hey if someone can get $30, good for them. America's all about gettin that paper. That's what America's all about.

The reason I know that even you don't believe the bullshit your spinning is that you will never answer a very simple question: If minimum wage mandates have no negative repercussions, why stop at $30/hr? Why not just legislate a $100/hr minimum wage? If you think that is ridiculous, please explain why.

What is your exact objection to basing a worker's wage solely upon the value of that worker's work?

Are you asking me? I have no objection to that at all. Why would you suggest I do?

Nope. My bad. Touchscreen typing with man sized fingers is always good for wrong response box shenanigans.

 

[Dirk the Daring]

I see you never refuted my two tier MW is a great idea and I ripped it off from the liberals

If your up on your news the teen un employment is off the charts ridiculous high, but liberals don't care

16 to 17 years old can't vote

For that matter neither do republicans

Why do you think teen unemployment is so high?

 

[Dirk the Daring]

Just now, I saw another report about the topic of minimum wage increase. This one was on CNN, hosted by Julie Banderas. She was talking to Scott Gamm, of HelpSaveMyDollars.com, a financial website focused on helping consumers save and learn about money. They were talking about the recent 14-1 vote by the city of Los Angeles to raise the minimum wage to $15 by 2020.

Scott might be well versed on various aspects pertaining to consumer finances but, on the minimum wage raise, he is waaay off the mark. He said three things about the minimum wage raise topic. And he was WRONG on all three. Gamm merely recited the 3 most commonly heard (and programmed) descriptions about minimum wage raises.

1. He said it would cause jobs to be lost. FALSE! Employers function with a number of employees that bring them the most income/profit. They CANNOT reduce staff. Any more or less employees results in SALES and income reduction. Layoffs result in losses, not gains.

2. He (and Banderas too) said prices would be raised (or fees created) to compensate for the wage losses, and these losses would just be "passed on" to the customers. More FALSE! scare talk. Businesses CANNOT raise prices because they are already fixed at a market price, related to maximization of sales/income. Any change in price (up or down) results in reduction of SALES and income.

3. He said businesses will move away from LA. FALSE! (in most cases). Does Gamm think that closing down a business and moving to another location can be done scott (no pun intended) free ? Depending on the business, moving costs can vary from just barely economical, to completely UNeconomical, and the latter is much more often the case. Imagine a machine shop with over 100 large production machines, having to pack then all up and move miles away. Some businesses could do it. Not many.

So here's the real crux of all this. As in 1000 other media reports I've seen on minimum wage increases, the most important aspect of this is NEVER MENTIONED. Not a word. That is the increase in DISPOSABLE INCOME resulting in INCREASES SALES$$$. All businesses get this, and generally it far outweighs labor increases, since the number of wage raised consumers (not just those at the minimum wage) by far outnumbers any one employer's workers who are getting wage increases.

Then there's also the fact that many business, while receiving this big SALES boost, do NOT have any wage loss at all. These are businesses who are mom & pop and have no employees, those whose workers are all working just on sales commission (car lots, furniture, real estate, insurance, etc), and third, those with skilled workers (ex. machine shops) whose workers all already get well over $15 hour, or whatever the MW would be raised to.

I think back to when I owned a business. I paid my commission salespeople $350/hour (in 2015 dollars), and they still were only receiving 15% of the sale. In all, I made fine profits and expanded the business. Biggest downer ? All the people who called in and said > "Sorry. I can't afford it." Of course they can't. Not one somebody out there is paying them a low minimum wage. To be successful in business, you have a lot fo things to do. But you can't do anything, if the public around you doesn't have money in their pockets to buy what you're trying to sell.

This is why Conservatives who support raising the MW nationwide, outnumber Conservatives who don't, 54% to 44%.

Minimum wage laws cannot create jobs, they can ONLY outlaw them. Minimum wage laws demand that workers willing to accept wages less than the minimum wage are barred from such contracts. It is compulsory unemployment.

There is no escape from the objective fact of economic reality that minimum wage laws devalue wages. You simply cannot avoid devaluing wages when you make $1/hr work cost the same as $15/hr work.

Adding new dollars to the economy by increasing the minimum wage beyond what the work is worth is not the same thing as creating new wealth. Minimum wage laws always result in inflation. They necessarily must.

These realities are inescapable, and it is why minimum wage ponzi schemes ALWAYS fail.

Agreed. If I walk into a business and demand they give me $100 from their register, then spend that $100 in the store, has the store created a profit? No. Not only did they not gain any financial ground, but now that business is out $100 worth of their product. This is essentially the argument being made by the libtards in this thread.