Is Israel an independent state?

[Roudy]

For the same reasons Muslim animals walk around US campuses braying and waving their anti semitic banners, Jews can put ads on buses to make the American public aware of the evil of Islamism.

I think we should put ads on Buses form the Talmud, you know Jew think Gentiles are lower than dogs, Jesus was a bas....d and Mary was a wh....re. What do you think. How about Zionist did 9-11.

We? You must be talking about those voices in your head again, crazy woman. But since it's a free country, you're more than welcome to try to put any of that garbage up in buses.

Really, I really doubt Muslims could do that, the Jews would take them to court and win. Only jews can get away with hate speech. Jews want anti Semitism to be a crime internationally. But hey we know how "special" yous think you are with your tribal war god yahweh.

Yeah really. Muslims have already penetrated US campuses and are disrupting daily campus life with their daily barrage of antisemitism. The special yous are the Islamic animals who are slaughtering everybody in the name of their violent, intolerant, barbaric faith. Keep up, moron.

 

[Roudy]

For the same reasons Muslim animals walk around US campuses braying and waving their anti semitic banners, Jews can put ads on buses to make the American public aware of the evil of Islamism.

I think we should put ads on Buses form the Talmud, you know Jew think Gentiles are lower than dogs, Jesus was a bas....d and Mary was a wh....re. What do you think. How about Zionist did 9-11.

We should all give our appreciation to Penelope for showing us that she uses hates sites to get fake Talmud quotes. I wonder if she uses the same sites that a Muslim woman from India always used to get her fake Talmud quote.

The asylum escapee wants these animals to be able to spread their message:

 

[Humanity]

If the US was under constant attack from say Russian terrorists firing rockets into the heart of New York, Washington and Chicago how do you think the US government and people would react.

If Russia were occupied by the US and the US started settling and building illegal homes on Russian soil what would Russia do?

 

[Phoenall]

For the same reasons Muslim animals walk around US campuses braying and waving their anti semitic banners, Jews can put ads on buses to make the American public aware of the evil of Islamism.

I think we should put ads on Buses form the Talmud, you know Jew think Gentiles are lower than dogs, Jesus was a bas....d and Mary was a wh....re. What do you think. How about Zionist did 9-11.

Only if you can prove these allegations, and you are prepared to stand up and accept liability. But don't forget the Talmud is not the Koran so full chapters are needed to get the proper context.

 

[Phoenall]

For the same reasons Muslim animals walk around US campuses braying and waving their anti semitic banners, Jews can put ads on buses to make the American public aware of the evil of Islamism.

I think we should put ads on Buses form the Talmud, you know Jew think Gentiles are lower than dogs, Jesus was a bas....d and Mary was a wh....re. What do you think. How about Zionist did 9-11.

We? You must be talking about those voices in your head again, crazy woman. But since it's a free country, you're more than welcome to try to put any of that garbage up in buses.

Really, I really doubt Muslims could do that, the Jews would take them to court and win. Only jews can get away with hate speech. Jews want anti Semitism to be a crime internationally. But hey we know how "special" yous think you are with your tribal war god yahweh.

They could, and as you say the Jews would win the court cases because the muslims would rely on propaganda to justify their RACISM. News for you anti Semitism is already an international crime, and the muslims feel left out and tried to force blasphemy laws into being in every nation.

None of my Jewish friends think they are special that is just sour grapes from the muslims because they came last again.

 

[Phoenall]

TheOldSchool, Phoenall, CharleneG, Daniyel, Penelope, Roudy, Correll, et al,

First, there is no question that Israel (The State of) is its own sovereignty and nation. It has its own foreign policy and national security programs. It has an active Internal Defense and Development (IDAD) Program and it has its own prioritized national interest list. But NO nation in the world, or in its immediate region, operates in isolation. When the Israelis do something, the risk inducing negative repercussions on America as one of their allies. So when Israel takes action, it is not unusual for someone like Senior Hamas Official, like Dr 'Issam 'Adwan, to incite The Islamic Resistance Movement (its assets and resources) to Attack Israel's Embassies, Interests, And Officials Worldwide – And The Interests Of Its Allies. This requires the US and Israel (most any nation) to perform a "Risk Assessment" on what might be more acceptable and less dangerous as one of the alternatives to a armed response or countermeasure. When the US made the conscience choice to help protect and preserve the Jewish National Home (AKA: Israel) from radicalist and extremist opponents (whatever the source), America openly assumed a certain level of risk from a variety of hostile elements. No nation, but most especially a Super Powers capable of shaping world events, operations in isolation. And the inverse of that is, it is not reasonable to assume that a close ally can take independent action of a controversial nature without splashing its allies that support them.

In November 2002, Osama bin Laden (ObL) of al-Qaeda fame, wrote an open letter to all Americans, which was heavily publicized all over the world. In this letter, ObL very first point was:

As for the first question: Why are we fighting and opposing you? The answer is very simple:

(1) Because you attacked us and continue to attack us.

a) You attacked us in Palestine:

(i) Palestine, which has sunk under military occupation for more than 80 years. The British handed over Palestine, with your help and your support, to the Jews, who have occupied it for more than 50 years; years overflowing with oppression, tyranny, crimes, killing, expulsion, destruction and devastation. The creation and continuation of Israel is one of the greatest crimes, and you are the leaders of its criminals. And of course there is no need to explain and prove the degree of American support for Israel. The creation of Israel is a crime which must be erased. Each and every person whose hands have become polluted in the contribution towards this crime must pay its*price, and pay for it heavily. SOURCE: Observer Worldview : Sunday November 24, 2002 ​

​

“In self-defense and in defense of the innocent, cowardice is the only sin.”
― Dean Koontz​

Whenever I read or hear criticism about something Israel has done, it's justified as a response, or a preemptive action, to something that Palestinians, or Iranians, or Syrians, or Americans (Obama, mainly) have done. It's as though Israel's foreign policies and activities are entirely controlled by outsiders.

I know much less about Israeli domestic affairs, so perhaps they follow some sort of self-established national agenda (not including anti-Arab actions, which would be more of the above).

But Israel's foreign affairs seem to be entirely reactive. Are there any examples of Israel acting internationally simply to advance its own peaceful, even idealistic, goals, without in any way justifying them in terms of what someone else has done or will do?

If the US was under constant attack from say Russian terrorists firing rockets into the heart of New York, Washington and Chicago how do you think the US government and people would react.
The muslim president is to blame for everything that comes his way, and he has made America the laughing stock of the world. Since he lost control of both houses he has been a president in name only and his wings have been clipped.

Looks like we have another islamomoron spouting islamomoron propaganda and RACIST LIES.

The US has a foreign policy where no one is firing rockets at us. So damn, I guess it's a waaaay better foreign policy than Israel has.

(REFERENCES)

Relative to the concept of proportionality in conflict.

Rule 14 --- Proportionality in Attack: Launching an attack which may be expected to cause incidental loss of civilian life, injury to civilians, damage to civilian objects, or a combination thereof, which would be excessive in relation to the concrete and direct military advantage anticipated, is prohibited. Source: Customary IHL

Protocol Additional to the Geneva Conventions of 12 August 1949, (Protocol I), 8 June 1977.

Article 51(5b)

5. Among others, the following types of attacks are to be considered as indiscriminate:

(b) an attack which may be expected to cause incidental loss of civilian life, injury to civilians, damage to civilian objects, or a combination thereof, which would be excessive in relation to the concrete and direct military advantage anticipated.​

Article 57(2a)(iii)

2. With respect to attacks, the following precautions shall be taken:

• 
  (a) those who plan or decide upon an attack shall:

(iii) refrain from deciding to launch any attack which may be expected to cause incidental loss of civilian life, injury to civilians, damage to civilian objects, or a combination thereof, which would be excessive in relation to the concrete and direct military advantage anticipated;

​

(COMMENT)

There are several conflicting concepts that affect the how any nation balances the idea of proportionality and response in respect to the 1970 Declaration on Principles of International Law concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation among States.

• Every State has the duty to refrain from the threat or use of force to violate the existing international boundaries of another State or as a means of solving international disputes, including territorial disputes and problems concerning frontiers of States.
• Every State has the duty to refrain from any forcible action which deprives peoples referred to in the elaboration of the principle of equal rights and self-determination of their right to self-determination and freedom and independence.
• Every State has the duty to refrain from organizing or encouraging the organization of irregular forces or armed bands including mercenaries, for incursion into the territory of another State.
• Every State has the duty to refrain from organizing, instigating, assisting or participating in acts of civil strife or terrorist acts in another State or acquiescing in organized activities within its territory directed towards the commission of such acts, when the acts referred to in the present paragraph involve a threat or use of force.
• Every State likewise has the duty to refrain from the threat or use of force to violate international lines of demarcation, such as armistice lines, established by or pursuant to an international agreement to which it is a party or which it is otherwise bound to respect. Nothing in the foregoing shall be construed as prejudicing the positions of the parties concerned with regard to the status and effects of such lines under their special regimes or as affecting their temporary character.

There are some serious questions here pertaining to:

• What is "excessive" relative to an attack in response?
• What is a "concrete and direct military advantage?"
• Is "Launching an attack" different from "responding to an attack?"
• Is there a difference between an "attack launched to achieve a "direct military advantage" and that of an attack to achieve a "political outcome?"

These conflicting concepts were all developed and agreed upon after the 1970 Declaration on Principles of International Law concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation among States.

• (1970) Affirms the legitimacy of the struggle of peoples under colonial and alien domination recognized as being entitled to the right of self-determination to restore to themselves that right by any means at their disposal;
• (1974) Reaffirms the legitimacy of the peoples' struggle for liberation form colonial and foreign domination and alien subjugation by all available means, including armed struggle;
• (1978) Reaffirms the legitimacy of the struggle of peoples for independence, territorial integrity, national unity and liberation from colonial and foreign domination and foreign occupation by all available means, particularly armed struggle;

When all these elements are entered into the diplomatic equation, on finds that there is no such thing as a "Proportional Response" to a hostile opponent that claims the "right to use any and all means" or "all available means" authorized by the same General Assembly as the Partition Plan that was followed by three major conflicts and was not supported by the UN to maintain regional peace and security.

(THE FINAL QUESTION)

What is the "proportional response" to an opponent the is "entitled" to use "all available means?"

Most Respectfully,
R



Most Respectfully,
R

Retaliation using all available means to put down the attacks, maybe some nations ambassador to the UN should spell this out in an open session so that the world understands that a terrorist attack could trigger a nuclear response.

 

[Phoenall]

If the US was under constant attack from say Russian terrorists firing rockets into the heart of New York, Washington and Chicago how do you think the US government and people would react.

If Russia were occupied by the US and the US started settling and building illegal homes on Russian soil what would Russia do?

Depends on how badly beaten the Russian leaders were. But if Jordan was occupied by hamas what would the Jordanian response be the second time round

 

[Roudy]

If the US was under constant attack from say Russian terrorists firing rockets into the heart of New York, Washington and Chicago how do you think the US government and people would react.

If Russia were occupied by the US and the US started settling and building illegal homes on Russian soil what would Russia do?

 

[Humanity]

If the US was under constant attack from say Russian terrorists firing rockets into the heart of New York, Washington and Chicago how do you think the US government and people would react.

If Russia were occupied by the US and the US started settling and building illegal homes on Russian soil what would Russia do?

Great response to a question you have ZERO answer to...

Well done roodboy

 

[Roudy]

If the US was under constant attack from say Russian terrorists firing rockets into the heart of New York, Washington and Chicago how do you think the US government and people would react.

If Russia were occupied by the US and the US started settling and building illegal homes on Russian soil what would Russia do?

Great response to a question you have ZERO answer to...

Well done roodboy

 

[Penelope]

If the US was under constant attack from say Russian terrorists firing rockets into the heart of New York, Washington and Chicago how do you think the US government and people would react.

If Russia were occupied by the US and the US started settling and building illegal homes on Russian soil what would Russia do?

Russia would fight back of course, same as we would do if Russia came here. The Pals are in the right, as the Chazars there have no right to be except for their money and weapons, which gives them the power.

 

[Penelope]

For the same reasons Muslim animals walk around US campuses braying and waving their anti semitic banners, Jews can put ads on buses to make the American public aware of the evil of Islamism.

I think we should put ads on Buses form the Talmud, you know Jew think Gentiles are lower than dogs, Jesus was a bas....d and Mary was a wh....re. What do you think. How about Zionist did 9-11.

We should all give our appreciation to Penelope for showing us that she uses hates sites to get fake Talmud quotes. I wonder if she uses the same sites that a Muslim woman from India always used to get her fake Talmud quote.

The asylum escapee wants these animals to be able to spread their message:

all fake pics, Hollywood style.

 

[Phoenall]

If the US was under constant attack from say Russian terrorists firing rockets into the heart of New York, Washington and Chicago how do you think the US government and people would react.

If Russia were occupied by the US and the US started settling and building illegal homes on Russian soil what would Russia do?

Russia would fight back of course, same as we would do if Russia came here. The Pals are in the right, as the Chazars there have no right to be except for their money and weapons, which gives them the power.

You forget INTERNATIONAL LAW of 1923 that is still in force, this gives every Jew in the world the legal right to live anywhere in the 22% of Palestine left after trans Jordan was created.

 

[Phoenall]

For the same reasons Muslim animals walk around US campuses braying and waving their anti semitic banners, Jews can put ads on buses to make the American public aware of the evil of Islamism.

I think we should put ads on Buses form the Talmud, you know Jew think Gentiles are lower than dogs, Jesus was a bas....d and Mary was a wh....re. What do you think. How about Zionist did 9-11.

We should all give our appreciation to Penelope for showing us that she uses hates sites to get fake Talmud quotes. I wonder if she uses the same sites that a Muslim woman from India always used to get her fake Talmud quote.

The asylum escapee wants these animals to be able to spread their message:

all fake pics, Hollywood style.

No they are real as I have seen these same scum with the same placards in the UK.

The Horrific Muslim Infiltration Of Britain - Luton 2012 - YouTube

Violent Muslim Protest in London - YouTube

Video Muslims protest outside Google London HQ - Telegraph

The Real Islam Muslims supporting terror in London Protest - YouTube

Are these all fake as well, along with the 1.5 million pages of such videos on Google

 

[Roudy]

For the same reasons Muslim animals walk around US campuses braying and waving their anti semitic banners, Jews can put ads on buses to make the American public aware of the evil of Islamism.

I think we should put ads on Buses form the Talmud, you know Jew think Gentiles are lower than dogs, Jesus was a bas....d and Mary was a wh....re. What do you think. How about Zionist did 9-11.

We should all give our appreciation to Penelope for showing us that she uses hates sites to get fake Talmud quotes. I wonder if she uses the same sites that a Muslim woman from India always used to get her fake Talmud quote.

The asylum escapee wants these animals to be able to spread their message:

all fake pics, Hollywood style.

The pictures are true. There's thousands of pics like these available by valid news organizations.

 

[Penelope]

For the same reasons Muslim animals walk around US campuses braying and waving their anti semitic banners, Jews can put ads on buses to make the American public aware of the evil of Islamism.

I think we should put ads on Buses form the Talmud, you know Jew think Gentiles are lower than dogs, Jesus was a bas....d and Mary was a wh....re. What do you think. How about Zionist did 9-11.

We should all give our appreciation to Penelope for showing us that she uses hates sites to get fake Talmud quotes. I wonder if she uses the same sites that a Muslim woman from India always used to get her fake Talmud quote.

The asylum escapee wants these animals to be able to spread their message:

all fake pics, Hollywood style.

The pictures are true. There's thousands of pics like these available by valid news organizations.

Yes ok if you say so.

 

[toastman]

I think we should put ads on Buses form the Talmud, you know Jew think Gentiles are lower than dogs, Jesus was a bas....d and Mary was a wh....re. What do you think. How about Zionist did 9-11.

We should all give our appreciation to Penelope for showing us that she uses hates sites to get fake Talmud quotes. I wonder if she uses the same sites that a Muslim woman from India always used to get her fake Talmud quote.

The asylum escapee wants these animals to be able to spread their message:

all fake pics, Hollywood style.

The pictures are true. There's thousands of pics like these available by valid news organizations.

Yes ok if you say so.

Whenever someone posts something you don't like, you claim it's fake or a lie. IT shows just how much you really hate the truth.

 

[Phoenall]

I think we should put ads on Buses form the Talmud, you know Jew think Gentiles are lower than dogs, Jesus was a bas....d and Mary was a wh....re. What do you think. How about Zionist did 9-11.

We should all give our appreciation to Penelope for showing us that she uses hates sites to get fake Talmud quotes. I wonder if she uses the same sites that a Muslim woman from India always used to get her fake Talmud quote.

The asylum escapee wants these animals to be able to spread their message:

all fake pics, Hollywood style.

The pictures are true. There's thousands of pics like these available by valid news organizations.

Yes ok if you say so.

See my post above

 

[Penelope]

We should all give our appreciation to Penelope for showing us that she uses hates sites to get fake Talmud quotes. I wonder if she uses the same sites that a Muslim woman from India always used to get her fake Talmud quote.

The asylum escapee wants these animals to be able to spread their message:

all fake pics, Hollywood style.

The pictures are true. There's thousands of pics like these available by valid news organizations.

Yes ok if you say so.

Whenever someone posts something you don't like, you claim it's fake or a lie. IT shows just how much you really hate the truth.

Here is the truth

New settlement in east Jerusalem ,as Bibi says he wants peace with the Pals, the last part was a lie.

 

[Roudy]

I think we should put ads on Buses form the Talmud, you know Jew think Gentiles are lower than dogs, Jesus was a bas....d and Mary was a wh....re. What do you think. How about Zionist did 9-11.

We should all give our appreciation to Penelope for showing us that she uses hates sites to get fake Talmud quotes. I wonder if she uses the same sites that a Muslim woman from India always used to get her fake Talmud quote.

The asylum escapee wants these animals to be able to spread their message:

all fake pics, Hollywood style.

The pictures are true. There's thousands of pics like these available by valid news organizations.

Yes ok if you say so.

There ya go, Muslim savagery verified by snopes, now take your meds:

Claim: Photographs show sign-bearing Muslim protesters at a "Religion of Peace' demonstration in London.

TRUE

"Below I have enclosed pictures of Moslems who marched throughout the streets of London during their recent Religion of Peace Demonstration.

These pictures have never been shown in any of our American newspapers or television news programs because we should never appear to offend anyone!

image: http://www.snopes.com/photos/politics/graphics/protest1.jpg

image: http://www.snopes.com/photos/politics/graphics/protest2.jpg

image: http://www.snopes.com/photos/politics/graphics/protest3.jpg

image: http://www.snopes.com/photos/politics/graphics/protest5.jpg

image: http://www.snopes.com/photos/politics/graphics/protest6.jpg

image: http://www.snopes.com/photos/politics/graphics/protest7.jpg

image: http://www.snopes.com/photos/politics/graphics/protest8.jpg

image: http://www.snopes.com/photos/politics/graphics/protest9.jpg

Why would anyone think that we should be at war with such nice, peaceful Moslems?!


Origins: The series of photographs of sign-bearing Muslim protesters displayed above were taken during a 3 February 2006 protest staged in London by Muslims angry over the publication in Scandinavian periodicals of cartoons depicting the prophet Muhammad (not as a demonstation of Islam as a "religion of peace"):
The trigger for the latest clash of cultures was the publication by the Danish newspaper Jyllends-Posten on September 30 [2005] of 12 cartoons of Muhammad. A biographer of the prophet had complained that no one would dare to illustrate his book, and the newspaper challenged cartoonists to draw pictures of the prophet in a self-declared battle for freedom of speech.

One submission showed Muhammad wearing a bomb-shaped turban; in another he tells dead suicide bombers that he has run out of virgins with which to reward them. Any portrayal of Muhammad is blasphemous in Islam, lest it encourages idolatry.

In October [2005] ambassadors from ten Muslim countries complained to Anders Fogh Rasmussen, the Danish Prime Minister, who refused to interfere with the press’s freedom.

But the issue began to boil [in January 2006] after the cartoons appeared in Magazinet, a Christian newspaper in Norway, and on the website of the Norwegian newspaper
image: http://choices.truste.com/get?name=admarker-icon-tl.png

Dagbladet. An estimated 500 to 700 demonstrators marched from Regent's Park Mosque to the Danish embassy in Knightsbridge during the protest. MP David Davis, the shadow home secretary, condemned messages displayed on some of the protesters' placards as an "incitement to murder":
Clearly, some of these placards are incitement to violence, and indeed incitement to murder — an extremely serious offence which the police must deal with and deal with quickly.

Whatever your view on these cartoons, we have a tradition of freedom of speech in this country which has to be protected. Certainly there can be no tolerance of incitement to murder.
MP David Winnick, a member of the House of Commons Home Affairs Committee, called for the prosecution and deportation of some of the demonstrators:
Mr Winnick said: "The cartoons were deeply offensive to hundreds of millions of Muslims. But it is totally unacceptable that, on British soil, there should be thugs demonstrating for people to be beheaded and actually glorifying the atrocities of July 7.

"It is to be hoped that prosecutions will follow very quickly indeed."

He said those responsible who were temporarily in Britain should be deported, even it meant stripping them of permission previously given to remain in the country.

The Walsall North MP added that the overwhelming majority of Muslims in Britain "have the same distaste as the rest of us about these thugs".

"I hope it will be the last time we ever see such a demonstration, totally unacceptable to the Muslim community," he said.
Other Muslims maintained the protesters were extremists not representative of mainstream British Muslims:
Asghar Bukhari, chairman of the Muslim Public Affairs Committee, said the demonstration in London should have been stopped by police because the group had been advocating violence.

He said the protesters "did not represent British Muslims".

Mr Bukhari told the BBC News website: "The placards and chants were disgraceful and disgusting, Muslims do not feel that way.

"I condemn them without reservation, these people are less representative of Muslims than the BNP are of the British people."

He said that Muslims were angry over satirical cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad published in European papers but it was "outrageous" for anyone to advocate extreme action or violence.

"We believe it [the protest] should have been banned and the march stopped.

"It's irrelevant whether it's Muslims causing hatred or anyone else — freedom of speech has to be responsible."
No arrests were made at the time, according to police, due to the danger posed by the size and nature of the crowd:
As the clamour for action grew, police sources said there were no arrests because of fears of a riot. A senior Scotland Yard officer said: "We have to take the overall nature of the protesters into account. If they are overheated and emotional we don't go in.

"It's like a risk assessment; you have to look at the crowd you are dealing with. If we went in to arrest one person with a banner the crowd would turn on us and people would get hurt."
Although it has been circulated with the set of images displayed above, the following photograph likely comes from a completely different protest held in Luton a couple of years earlier:

image: http://www.snopes.com/photos/politics/graphics/protest4.jpg

Read more at snopes.com Muslim Religion of Peace Demonstration