Immigration Reform - Catz v. Uncensored

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by Uncensored2008, Nov 2, 2012.

  1. Uncensored2008
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    Uncensored2008 Libertarian Radical Supporting Member

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    The first step is to define the parameters of the debate.

    The conservative position traditionally holds for border control, including a border fence. Opposition to amnesty, including amnesty through the Dream Act. Opposition to drivers licenses for illegal aliens, and enforcement of I9 verification.

    The leftist position traditionally holds for a more lax border, opposition to the border fence, opposition to border patrol pursuing border crossings. Support for the Dream Act and general amnesty. Support for drivers licenses for illegals. I9 verification is termed "racist" and profiling.

    Personalities have little to do with the positions. The first TEA parties were held in opposition to the efforts of John McCain and George W. Bush to float an amnesty for illegal aliens in 2006. Bush and McCain were motivated by the desire to pander to Hispanic voters. That these were/are Republicans, does not make support of amnesty a "conservative" position. To claim it does is simply ignorant.

    I will argue either the leftist side or the conservative side; your choice. I will not argue "pot luck.'
     
  2. catzmeow
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    catzmeow BANNED

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    I don't believe that these positions are either conservative or liberal, per se. The dream act is widely supported by political leaders in border/western states of the U.S. who are dealing with the practical ramifications of having large numbers of immigrants.

    Why don't we debate the merits of the dream act itself, both pro and con? I'll take the pro side, you can take the con side.

    Are you up to that?
     
  3. spectrumc01
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    spectrumc01 I give you....the TRUTH

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    How is the winner decided?
     
  4. Uncensored2008
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    Uncensored2008 Libertarian Radical Supporting Member

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    Sure.
     
  5. Uncensored2008
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    Uncensored2008 Libertarian Radical Supporting Member

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    Does it matter?
     
  6. Liability
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    Liability Locked Account. Supporting Member

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    First things first. We need a large ROUND table.
     
  7. Ravi
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    Ravi Diamond Member

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    You've misrepresented the "leftist" side. Probably the "conservative" side as well.
     
  8. spectrumc01
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    spectrumc01 I give you....the TRUTH

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    A debate without a winner is just an arguement.
     
  9. Si modo
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    Si modo Diamond Member

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    I guess I would like to know if pragmatism is a lefty or righty concept? Just a ground rule on definitions.
     
  10. Liability
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    Liability Locked Account. Supporting Member

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    XXXXXXX It is probably fair to say that the "sides" have arguments that are more subtle and honestly nuanced than the positions ascribed to them in the OP.

    So, not only have we not decided on the basic points to be argued, it doesn't even seem to be settled what the larger debate topic will be overall.

    I still say we need that Round Table.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 2, 2012

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