If I'm proud of what I am, that's a problem for many people...

[Blues Man]

Yes and if you belong to a group you have control over what that group does to some extent

Tell me are you going to be proud of being a White Supremacist simply because you have whit skin?

I for one do not belong to any groups.

I have no sense of pride regarding my skin or eye color and I really have no sense of pride about where I happened to be born.

I am an American by chance not by choice so why be proud of something random like that?

White supremacists are not defined by white skin. The vast majority of white people are not white supremacists.


White supremacy is an ideology.


Funny you got that confused. Funny, like, it was racist of you.


ACTUAL racism. Just saying.




You are indeed part of numerous groups. Your denial is either dishonest or delusional.



Your lack of pride in being American, is very much a problem for America.


A group requires that it's members have a sense of loyalty and responsibility to the group and the other members, in order to function properly, or long term, survive.



That you and people like you, do not feel this feeling, and indeed, actively attack the idea of that feelings, is a process of the group becoming more and more unhealthy.

Of course they are defined by white skin as you absolutely cannot be a white supremacist if you are not white.
And don't play the racist card with me. My mother was half Black.

And no I am not a member of any group as I have not joined any group. I do not agree with you that I am a member of a group by default or by some random occurrence.

The location of the accident of my birth is irrelevant.

1. The fact that the vast majority of white people are not White Supremacists proves by itself that White Supremacy is not defined by white skin.

2. YOur mother being half black, does not mean you cannot be racist. You said something racist. If you hold to it, and it is indicative of your overall belief system, then you are racist.

3. Have you renounced your citizenship?

White skin is the number one requirement to be a white supremacist I never said it was the only requirement.

I never said ALL white people were white supremacists did I? No I did not.

And I didn't say anything racist I am merely trying to point out to you what happens when you take "pride" in things like skin color, eye color or what sex organs are between your legs.

Why should I renounce anything?

I see nothing wrong with not having pride in being an American citizen. I happen to be thankful I was born here and not any one of a million other places but that is not pride.

So instead of pride which I think is a negative trait I instead choose to be thankful that the random events that led to my birth put me here.

1. Your semantic games are dismissed.

2. You did say something racists, and your defense, was ironically also racist.

3. My point about your lack of healthy connection and loyalty to your group(s) and what it means for America, stands.

Can't hang in huh?

 

[Correll]

If I'm proud to be a man, that makes me a misogynist.

If I'm proud to be white, that makes me a racist.

If I'm proud to be straight, that makes me a homophobe.

And even if I don't have pride in being a straight white man, I am privileged.

The classic no-win situation for me.

Why are you proud to be how you were born, things for which you have no control, as opposed to what you’ve accomplished in life, which you can control?

Since when is it an either or choice?

 

[Correll]

No it's not.

Why be proud that you have blue eyes unless it's because you think you're better than people with brown eyes?

And you do realize that the fact that you were born on this particular patch of dirt doesn't make you any different from any other person born on a different patch of dirt?

It is not about the dirt. It is about the people who are part of your group. It is normal and healthy to be proud of the group you are a member of.


It is part of the social dynamics of a healthy group, that allows it to work together, for the good of it's members.


The failure of that, is a group becoming unhealthy, perhaps even dying.

So I should be proud of people not for what they have done but because they belong to some arbitrary group?

Basing your identity and self worth on arbitrary things is unhealthy and delusional

And it certainly smacks of desperation and a lack of earned self-worth.

And liberals wonder why we question their patriotism.

Liberals wonder why you do lots of crazy shit.

I was responding to a post, where a liberal attacked the very idea of being proud of, among other things, place of birth.


That would include the concept of Patriotism.


THus, my point, that liberals, quite often, and consistently attack the very idea of Patriotism, and then act like WE conservatives are being unfair when we reference or question their lack of patriotism.



That is a valid point.


What you posted was shit.

 

[Blues Man]

It is not about the dirt. It is about the people who are part of your group. It is normal and healthy to be proud of the group you are a member of.


It is part of the social dynamics of a healthy group, that allows it to work together, for the good of it's members.


The failure of that, is a group becoming unhealthy, perhaps even dying.

So I should be proud of people not for what they have done but because they belong to some arbitrary group?

Basing your identity and self worth on arbitrary things is unhealthy and delusional

And it certainly smacks of desperation and a lack of earned self-worth.

And liberals wonder why we question their patriotism.

Liberals wonder why you do lots of crazy shit.

I was responding to a post, where a liberal attacked the very idea of being proud of, among other things, place of birth.


That would include the concept of Patriotism.


THus, my point, that liberals, quite often, and consistently attack the very idea of Patriotism, and then act like WE conservatives are being unfair when we reference or question their lack of patriotism.



That is a valid point.


What you posted was shit.

How do you know I'm a liberal?

And it is silly to be proud of where you were born.

I mean why not take this to the next step and say you are proud of the hospital you were born in or the gurney your mother was on when you were born?

 

[Correll]

White supremacists are not defined by white skin. The vast majority of white people are not white supremacists.


White supremacy is an ideology.


Funny you got that confused. Funny, like, it was racist of you.


ACTUAL racism. Just saying.




You are indeed part of numerous groups. Your denial is either dishonest or delusional.



Your lack of pride in being American, is very much a problem for America.


A group requires that it's members have a sense of loyalty and responsibility to the group and the other members, in order to function properly, or long term, survive.



That you and people like you, do not feel this feeling, and indeed, actively attack the idea of that feelings, is a process of the group becoming more and more unhealthy.

Of course they are defined by white skin as you absolutely cannot be a white supremacist if you are not white.
And don't play the racist card with me. My mother was half Black.

And no I am not a member of any group as I have not joined any group. I do not agree with you that I am a member of a group by default or by some random occurrence.

The location of the accident of my birth is irrelevant.

1. The fact that the vast majority of white people are not White Supremacists proves by itself that White Supremacy is not defined by white skin.

2. YOur mother being half black, does not mean you cannot be racist. You said something racist. If you hold to it, and it is indicative of your overall belief system, then you are racist.

3. Have you renounced your citizenship?

White skin is the number one requirement to be a white supremacist I never said it was the only requirement.

I never said ALL white people were white supremacists did I? No I did not.

And I didn't say anything racist I am merely trying to point out to you what happens when you take "pride" in things like skin color, eye color or what sex organs are between your legs.

Why should I renounce anything?

I see nothing wrong with not having pride in being an American citizen. I happen to be thankful I was born here and not any one of a million other places but that is not pride.

So instead of pride which I think is a negative trait I instead choose to be thankful that the random events that led to my birth put me here.

1. Your semantic games are dismissed.

2. You did say something racists, and your defense, was ironically also racist.

3. My point about your lack of healthy connection and loyalty to your group(s) and what it means for America, stands.

Can't hang in huh?

Just dismissed your filler. Most of what you said boiled down to nothing.


Point 3 is my full response to the only real point you made, ie that you don't have any feeling of connection or loyalty to your fellow citizens.


And that is not good. It is not healthy for our society.


That is my point. Would you like to address it, or play more silly games?

 

[Correll]

So I should be proud of people not for what they have done but because they belong to some arbitrary group?

Basing your identity and self worth on arbitrary things is unhealthy and delusional

And it certainly smacks of desperation and a lack of earned self-worth.

And liberals wonder why we question their patriotism.

Liberals wonder why you do lots of crazy shit.

I was responding to a post, where a liberal attacked the very idea of being proud of, among other things, place of birth.


That would include the concept of Patriotism.


THus, my point, that liberals, quite often, and consistently attack the very idea of Patriotism, and then act like WE conservatives are being unfair when we reference or question their lack of patriotism.



That is a valid point.


What you posted was shit.

How do you know I'm a liberal?

And it is silly to be proud of where you were born.

I mean why not take this to the next step and say you are proud of the hospital you were born in or the gurney your mother was on when you were born?

1. It is not silly to be proud of where you were born. It is part of a healthy self image.

2. It is not silly to be proud of where you were born. It is part of a healthy society for people to have pride in it.

3. Do you feel a sense of loyalty to your fellow citizens?

 

[Blues Man]

Of course they are defined by white skin as you absolutely cannot be a white supremacist if you are not white.
And don't play the racist card with me. My mother was half Black.

And no I am not a member of any group as I have not joined any group. I do not agree with you that I am a member of a group by default or by some random occurrence.

The location of the accident of my birth is irrelevant.

1. The fact that the vast majority of white people are not White Supremacists proves by itself that White Supremacy is not defined by white skin.

2. YOur mother being half black, does not mean you cannot be racist. You said something racist. If you hold to it, and it is indicative of your overall belief system, then you are racist.

3. Have you renounced your citizenship?

White skin is the number one requirement to be a white supremacist I never said it was the only requirement.

I never said ALL white people were white supremacists did I? No I did not.

And I didn't say anything racist I am merely trying to point out to you what happens when you take "pride" in things like skin color, eye color or what sex organs are between your legs.

Why should I renounce anything?

I see nothing wrong with not having pride in being an American citizen. I happen to be thankful I was born here and not any one of a million other places but that is not pride.

So instead of pride which I think is a negative trait I instead choose to be thankful that the random events that led to my birth put me here.

1. Your semantic games are dismissed.

2. You did say something racists, and your defense, was ironically also racist.

3. My point about your lack of healthy connection and loyalty to your group(s) and what it means for America, stands.

Can't hang in huh?

Just dismissed your filler. Most of what you said boiled down to nothing.


Point 3 is my full response to the only real point you made, ie that you don't have any feeling of connection or loyalty to your fellow citizens.


And that is not good. It is not healthy for our society.


That is my point. Would you like to address it, or play more silly games?

No I don't feel loyal to people just because they happened to be born here.
My loyalty has to be earned.

I will not defend the indefensible simply because of an arbitrary concept of shred citizenship.

As I said I don't say I'm proud that I was born here. I say I am thankful that I was fortunate enough to be born here

It is a subtle but very real difference that you cannot grasp

 

[Blues Man]

And it certainly smacks of desperation and a lack of earned self-worth.

And liberals wonder why we question their patriotism.

Liberals wonder why you do lots of crazy shit.

I was responding to a post, where a liberal attacked the very idea of being proud of, among other things, place of birth.


That would include the concept of Patriotism.


THus, my point, that liberals, quite often, and consistently attack the very idea of Patriotism, and then act like WE conservatives are being unfair when we reference or question their lack of patriotism.



That is a valid point.


What you posted was shit.

How do you know I'm a liberal?

And it is silly to be proud of where you were born.

I mean why not take this to the next step and say you are proud of the hospital you were born in or the gurney your mother was on when you were born?

1. It is not silly to be proud of where you were born. It is part of a healthy self image.

2. It is not silly to be proud of where you were born. It is part of a healthy society for people to have pride in it.

3. Do you feel a sense of loyalty to your fellow citizens?

Pinning your self image on where you were born is not healthy.

Telling yourself you are better than others because the uncountable random events in the lives of millions of other people ended up worth you being born on a particular patch of dirt is not what to base your self worth on.

And my loyalty needs to be earned by others I don't care what country they come from my standards apply to everyone equally

 

[Correll]

1. The fact that the vast majority of white people are not White Supremacists proves by itself that White Supremacy is not defined by white skin.

2. YOur mother being half black, does not mean you cannot be racist. You said something racist. If you hold to it, and it is indicative of your overall belief system, then you are racist.

3. Have you renounced your citizenship?

White skin is the number one requirement to be a white supremacist I never said it was the only requirement.

I never said ALL white people were white supremacists did I? No I did not.

And I didn't say anything racist I am merely trying to point out to you what happens when you take "pride" in things like skin color, eye color or what sex organs are between your legs.

Why should I renounce anything?

I see nothing wrong with not having pride in being an American citizen. I happen to be thankful I was born here and not any one of a million other places but that is not pride.

So instead of pride which I think is a negative trait I instead choose to be thankful that the random events that led to my birth put me here.

1. Your semantic games are dismissed.

2. You did say something racists, and your defense, was ironically also racist.

3. My point about your lack of healthy connection and loyalty to your group(s) and what it means for America, stands.

Can't hang in huh?

Just dismissed your filler. Most of what you said boiled down to nothing.


Point 3 is my full response to the only real point you made, ie that you don't have any feeling of connection or loyalty to your fellow citizens.


And that is not good. It is not healthy for our society.


That is my point. Would you like to address it, or play more silly games?

No I don't feel loyal to people just because they happened to be born here.
My loyalty has to be earned.

I will not defend the indefensible simply because of an arbitrary concept of shred citizenship.

As I said I don't say I'm proud that I was born here. I say I am thankful that I was fortunate enough to be born here

It is a subtle but very real difference that you cannot grasp

1. I grasp it quite well, thank you. Save your spin for someone that cares. Please dont' waste my time.

2. Got it. Thank you for your honesty on not feeling any loyalty to your fellow citizens.

3. If you feel no loyalty to your fellow citizens, what are your motivations when it comes to which policies you support?

 

[Correll]

And liberals wonder why we question their patriotism.

Liberals wonder why you do lots of crazy shit.

I was responding to a post, where a liberal attacked the very idea of being proud of, among other things, place of birth.


That would include the concept of Patriotism.


THus, my point, that liberals, quite often, and consistently attack the very idea of Patriotism, and then act like WE conservatives are being unfair when we reference or question their lack of patriotism.



That is a valid point.


What you posted was shit.

How do you know I'm a liberal?

And it is silly to be proud of where you were born.

I mean why not take this to the next step and say you are proud of the hospital you were born in or the gurney your mother was on when you were born?

1. It is not silly to be proud of where you were born. It is part of a healthy self image.

2. It is not silly to be proud of where you were born. It is part of a healthy society for people to have pride in it.

3. Do you feel a sense of loyalty to your fellow citizens?

Pinning your self image on where you were born is not healthy.

Telling yourself you are better than others because the uncountable random events in the lives of millions of other people ended up worth you being born on a particular patch of dirt is not what to base your self worth on.

And my loyalty needs to be earned by others I don't care what country they come from my standards apply to everyone equally

1. Please don't move the goal posts on me. Nothing I said, implied that such pride was ALL that a person has or should have.


2. "Better than"? Where did that come from?

3. Got it. You feel no loyalty to your fellow citizens. Thanks for being honest. Most liberals lie about that.

 

[Blues Man]

Liberals wonder why you do lots of crazy shit.

I was responding to a post, where a liberal attacked the very idea of being proud of, among other things, place of birth.


That would include the concept of Patriotism.


THus, my point, that liberals, quite often, and consistently attack the very idea of Patriotism, and then act like WE conservatives are being unfair when we reference or question their lack of patriotism.



That is a valid point.


What you posted was shit.

How do you know I'm a liberal?

And it is silly to be proud of where you were born.

I mean why not take this to the next step and say you are proud of the hospital you were born in or the gurney your mother was on when you were born?

1. It is not silly to be proud of where you were born. It is part of a healthy self image.

2. It is not silly to be proud of where you were born. It is part of a healthy society for people to have pride in it.

3. Do you feel a sense of loyalty to your fellow citizens?

Pinning your self image on where you were born is not healthy.

Telling yourself you are better than others because the uncountable random events in the lives of millions of other people ended up worth you being born on a particular patch of dirt is not what to base your self worth on.

And my loyalty needs to be earned by others I don't care what country they come from my standards apply to everyone equally

1. Please don't move the goal posts on me. Nothing I said, implied that such pride was ALL that a person has or should have.


2. "Better than"? Where did that come from?

3. Got it. You feel no loyalty to your fellow citizens. Thanks for being honest. Most liberals lie about that.

There you go again calling me a liberal. You have no ides what my political stance is.

And if a citizen ( of any country) earns my loyalty then he gets it.

Pride in itself leads to the "I'm better than you because I am ( fill in the blank)

As I said I am not a prideful man. I would rather strive to be humble and thankful than prideful

Like I said yo don't get that

 

[Correll]

I was responding to a post, where a liberal attacked the very idea of being proud of, among other things, place of birth.


That would include the concept of Patriotism.


THus, my point, that liberals, quite often, and consistently attack the very idea of Patriotism, and then act like WE conservatives are being unfair when we reference or question their lack of patriotism.



That is a valid point.


What you posted was shit.

How do you know I'm a liberal?

And it is silly to be proud of where you were born.

I mean why not take this to the next step and say you are proud of the hospital you were born in or the gurney your mother was on when you were born?

1. It is not silly to be proud of where you were born. It is part of a healthy self image.

2. It is not silly to be proud of where you were born. It is part of a healthy society for people to have pride in it.

3. Do you feel a sense of loyalty to your fellow citizens?

Pinning your self image on where you were born is not healthy.

Telling yourself you are better than others because the uncountable random events in the lives of millions of other people ended up worth you being born on a particular patch of dirt is not what to base your self worth on.

And my loyalty needs to be earned by others I don't care what country they come from my standards apply to everyone equally

1. Please don't move the goal posts on me. Nothing I said, implied that such pride was ALL that a person has or should have.


2. "Better than"? Where did that come from?

3. Got it. You feel no loyalty to your fellow citizens. Thanks for being honest. Most liberals lie about that.

There you go again calling me a liberal. You have no ides what my political stance is.

And if a citizen ( of any country) earns my loyalty then he gets it.

Pride in itself leads to the "I'm better than you because I am ( fill in the blank)

As I said I am not a prideful man. I would rather strive to be humble and thankful than prideful

Like I said yo don't get that

There is nothing about saying "I am proud to be an American" that puts anyone else down.

 

[Blues Man]

How do you know I'm a liberal?

And it is silly to be proud of where you were born.

I mean why not take this to the next step and say you are proud of the hospital you were born in or the gurney your mother was on when you were born?

1. It is not silly to be proud of where you were born. It is part of a healthy self image.

2. It is not silly to be proud of where you were born. It is part of a healthy society for people to have pride in it.

3. Do you feel a sense of loyalty to your fellow citizens?

Pinning your self image on where you were born is not healthy.

Telling yourself you are better than others because the uncountable random events in the lives of millions of other people ended up worth you being born on a particular patch of dirt is not what to base your self worth on.

And my loyalty needs to be earned by others I don't care what country they come from my standards apply to everyone equally

1. Please don't move the goal posts on me. Nothing I said, implied that such pride was ALL that a person has or should have.


2. "Better than"? Where did that come from?

3. Got it. You feel no loyalty to your fellow citizens. Thanks for being honest. Most liberals lie about that.

There you go again calling me a liberal. You have no ides what my political stance is.

And if a citizen ( of any country) earns my loyalty then he gets it.

Pride in itself leads to the "I'm better than you because I am ( fill in the blank)

As I said I am not a prideful man. I would rather strive to be humble and thankful than prideful

Like I said yo don't get that

There is nothing about saying "I am proud to be an American" that puts anyone else down.

Pride leads to jingoism and arrogance.

And Americans are very arrogant

 

[Correll]

1. It is not silly to be proud of where you were born. It is part of a healthy self image.

2. It is not silly to be proud of where you were born. It is part of a healthy society for people to have pride in it.

3. Do you feel a sense of loyalty to your fellow citizens?

Pinning your self image on where you were born is not healthy.

Telling yourself you are better than others because the uncountable random events in the lives of millions of other people ended up worth you being born on a particular patch of dirt is not what to base your self worth on.

And my loyalty needs to be earned by others I don't care what country they come from my standards apply to everyone equally

1. Please don't move the goal posts on me. Nothing I said, implied that such pride was ALL that a person has or should have.


2. "Better than"? Where did that come from?

3. Got it. You feel no loyalty to your fellow citizens. Thanks for being honest. Most liberals lie about that.

There you go again calling me a liberal. You have no ides what my political stance is.

And if a citizen ( of any country) earns my loyalty then he gets it.

Pride in itself leads to the "I'm better than you because I am ( fill in the blank)

As I said I am not a prideful man. I would rather strive to be humble and thankful than prideful

Like I said yo don't get that

There is nothing about saying "I am proud to be an American" that puts anyone else down.

Pride leads to jingoism and arrogance.

And Americans are very arrogant

Pride CAN lead to arrogance.


My point stands.


There is nothing about saying "I am proud to be an American" that puts anyone else down.

 

[Blues Man]

Pinning your self image on where you were born is not healthy.

Telling yourself you are better than others because the uncountable random events in the lives of millions of other people ended up worth you being born on a particular patch of dirt is not what to base your self worth on.

And my loyalty needs to be earned by others I don't care what country they come from my standards apply to everyone equally

1. Please don't move the goal posts on me. Nothing I said, implied that such pride was ALL that a person has or should have.


2. "Better than"? Where did that come from?

3. Got it. You feel no loyalty to your fellow citizens. Thanks for being honest. Most liberals lie about that.

There you go again calling me a liberal. You have no ides what my political stance is.

And if a citizen ( of any country) earns my loyalty then he gets it.

Pride in itself leads to the "I'm better than you because I am ( fill in the blank)

As I said I am not a prideful man. I would rather strive to be humble and thankful than prideful

Like I said yo don't get that

There is nothing about saying "I am proud to be an American" that puts anyone else down.

Pride leads to jingoism and arrogance.

And Americans are very arrogant

Pride CAN lead to arrogance.


My point stands.


There is nothing about saying "I am proud to be an American" that puts anyone else down.

So then you're a person who would be proud to be a citizen of any country as long as you were born there.

 

[Correll]

1. Please don't move the goal posts on me. Nothing I said, implied that such pride was ALL that a person has or should have.


2. "Better than"? Where did that come from?

3. Got it. You feel no loyalty to your fellow citizens. Thanks for being honest. Most liberals lie about that.

There you go again calling me a liberal. You have no ides what my political stance is.

And if a citizen ( of any country) earns my loyalty then he gets it.

Pride in itself leads to the "I'm better than you because I am ( fill in the blank)

As I said I am not a prideful man. I would rather strive to be humble and thankful than prideful

Like I said yo don't get that

There is nothing about saying "I am proud to be an American" that puts anyone else down.

Pride leads to jingoism and arrogance.

And Americans are very arrogant

Pride CAN lead to arrogance.


My point stands.


There is nothing about saying "I am proud to be an American" that puts anyone else down.

So then you're a person who would be proud to be a citizen of any country as long as you were born there.

I would at least try to find something to be proud of, and imo, most nations, have SOMETHING positive in their history, for a good citizen to look at and find pride in.


I've talked to many people from many nations. Most of them have had something to proud of. Some have been ashamed of their nations. That struck me as sad. And unhealthy.


I never felt as an American, that some one else expressing pride in their nation, was a put down aimed at me or mine.

 

[Blues Man]

There you go again calling me a liberal. You have no ides what my political stance is.

And if a citizen ( of any country) earns my loyalty then he gets it.

Pride in itself leads to the "I'm better than you because I am ( fill in the blank)

As I said I am not a prideful man. I would rather strive to be humble and thankful than prideful

Like I said yo don't get that

There is nothing about saying "I am proud to be an American" that puts anyone else down.

Pride leads to jingoism and arrogance.

And Americans are very arrogant

Pride CAN lead to arrogance.


My point stands.


There is nothing about saying "I am proud to be an American" that puts anyone else down.

So then you're a person who would be proud to be a citizen of any country as long as you were born there.

I would at least try to find something to be proud of, and imo, most nations, have SOMETHING positive in their history, for a good citizen to look at and find pride in.


I've talked to many people from many nations. Most of them have had something to proud of. Some have been ashamed of their nations. That struck me as sad. And unhealthy.


I never felt as an American, that some one else expressing pride in their nation, was a put down aimed at me or mine.

I never said it was a put down so stop implying that I did.

I said pride leads to a feeling of superiority over others who do not have what it is you are proud of,

I'm proud to be white implies that you think you are somehow better than people who are not white. Whether or not people who are not white take that as a put down is irrelevant

 

[Toro]

If I'm proud to be a man, that makes me a misogynist.

If I'm proud to be white, that makes me a racist.

If I'm proud to be straight, that makes me a homophobe.

And even if I don't have pride in being a straight white man, I am privileged.

The classic no-win situation for me.

Why are you proud to be how you were born, things for which you have no control, as opposed to what you’ve accomplished in life, which you can control?

Since when is it an either or choice?

97% of males are straight. Being proud that you’re straight is like being proud that you were born on earth.

“Gay Pride” and other expressions of identity pride are due to the discrimination, recrimination, hostility, rejection and outright violence that many gay people have experienced. Very, very few straight people have had their head kicked in because they were straight. But fear of violence because of their orientation is common in the gay community.

 

[Correll]

There is nothing about saying "I am proud to be an American" that puts anyone else down.

Pride leads to jingoism and arrogance.

And Americans are very arrogant

Pride CAN lead to arrogance.


My point stands.


There is nothing about saying "I am proud to be an American" that puts anyone else down.

So then you're a person who would be proud to be a citizen of any country as long as you were born there.

I would at least try to find something to be proud of, and imo, most nations, have SOMETHING positive in their history, for a good citizen to look at and find pride in.


I've talked to many people from many nations. Most of them have had something to proud of. Some have been ashamed of their nations. That struck me as sad. And unhealthy.


I never felt as an American, that some one else expressing pride in their nation, was a put down aimed at me or mine.

I never said it was a put down so stop implying that I did.

I said pride leads to a feeling of superiority over others who do not have what it is you are proud of,

I'm proud to be white implies that you think you are somehow better than people who are not white. Whether or not people who are not white take that as a put down is irrelevant

I disagree. Having pride in something, is not, by itself a comment on anyone or anything else.

 

[Correll]

If I'm proud to be a man, that makes me a misogynist.

If I'm proud to be white, that makes me a racist.

If I'm proud to be straight, that makes me a homophobe.

And even if I don't have pride in being a straight white man, I am privileged.

The classic no-win situation for me.

Why are you proud to be how you were born, things for which you have no control, as opposed to what you’ve accomplished in life, which you can control?

Since when is it an either or choice?

97% of males are straight. Being proud that you’re straight is like being proud that you were born on earth.

“Gay Pride” and other expressions of identity pride are due to the discrimination, recrimination, hostility, rejection and outright violence that many gay people have experienced. Very, very few straight people have had their head kicked in because they were straight. But fear of violence because of their orientation is common in the gay community.

I think you are wrong, and more so with each passing day.


I see the Gay Pride of today, as more of a bully pack, enjoying it's power and privilege.


Some little Johnny in school calls little Bobbie a fag, and he is likely to be sent to the Principle's office for reeducation and punishment than celebrated.