CDZ I don't know whether Hodgkinson actually sought to kill someone.

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by Xelor, Jun 14, 2017.

  1. Xelor
    Offline

    Xelor Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2017
    Messages:
    8,095
    Thanks Received:
    1,188
    Trophy Points:
    255
    Location:
    D.C.
    Ratings:
    +4,193
    Preface:
    • If you are a professional who has credible insights to share on how one might obtain and ascertain the answers to the central or explicit inquiries I've below expressed, please keep reading. I'm interested in what you can offer that might militate for one's soundly (given the information available) concluding or "leaning" one way or another. That is to say, what behaviors or statements would in your professional opinion indicate/suggest the man meant to do "X" rather than "Y," and what in your professional opinion do you consider "X" and "Y" be?
    • If you're not a professional who has legitimately expert insights to offer, well, I'm not interested in what you think was in the man's mind or why you think it. I can speculate arbitrarily just as well as the next person having no expertise on the matter, i.e., people in the "peanut gallery," which, for this topic, I'm part of the "peanut gallery."

    Thread Topic Content:
    I'm wondering whether James Hodgkinson intended to kill people or whether he, by some machinations of mental midgetry, sought more, without fatal effect, to make a point more so than to assassinate people. I'm wondering that because I hear the man used an "M4-like" rifle, and he didn't kill anyone, yet managed to hit five people. In addition to using an M4-like rifle, I hear the guy had with him "a lot" of ammunition.

    So far, I know three of the five injured people did not sustain life-threatening injuries. I don't know the status of the other two.

    I'm just wondering how one who hits five people -- I don't know how many shots were in total fired -- using a rifle, has plenty of ammo, and kills none, while at the same time having been of a mind to kill someone.
    • Did the guy hit five while trying for someone or some few in particular?
    • Did the guy intend to hurt but not kill?
    • Did the guy seek to hit as many targets as possible without regard to whether his shots were fatal?
    • Did the guy start out desiring one objective and upon being "in place" change his mind?
    • Did the guy seek to commit suicide by cop?
    • Did the guy view himself as a slayer? An assassin? A murderer? A mere killer? None of those things?
    I don't know the answers to those questions. I just know that in other widely publicized shooting incidents, shooters using weapons like the one Hodgkinson used seemingly had little or no difficulty actually killing people.


    Note:
    • Before some nitwit here asks, of course, I would not have preferred the guy killed someone. I don't know WTF it takes for someone to conjure such a question, but I do know it's the misanthropic type of thought that occurs to some of the twisted people who post on here.
     
    • Informative Informative x 2
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2017
  2. JoeMoma
    Offline

    JoeMoma Gold Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2014
    Messages:
    7,879
    Thanks Received:
    1,032
    Trophy Points:
    290
    Ratings:
    +5,918
    Perhaps he was a terrible shot when it came to using the riffle.
     
  3. Compost
    Offline

    Compost Gold Member

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2015
    Messages:
    5,540
    Thanks Received:
    1,222
    Trophy Points:
    290
    Location:
    USA
    Ratings:
    +6,004
    A professional in common sense observes that when somebody fires some 50 rounds at a bunch of people, he is looking to do harm. If he only wanted to get attention, he could have tossed crab apples, ya know?
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Funny and Agree!! Funny and Agree!! x 1
  4. task0778
    Offline

    task0778 Silver Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2017
    Messages:
    1,848
    Thanks Received:
    401
    Trophy Points:
    90
    Location:
    Texas hill country
    Ratings:
    +1,690
    Not a pro, ok? But when a guy shows up and fires that many shots and wounds only 5 you gotta think this guy can't shoot for shit. To think the guy wasn't trying to kill as many as he could is IMHO nonsense. This was a guy who hated Trump and the GOP, and he specifically asked if the men out there were repubs or dems. Since he's now dead we may never know his state of mind, maybe the guy was mentally ill. (Undiagnosed?) I've heard no mention of that possibility though.
     
  5. Meathead
    Offline

    Meathead Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2012
    Messages:
    20,994
    Thanks Received:
    2,920
    Trophy Points:
    280
    Location:
    Prague, Czech Republic
    Ratings:
    +14,023
    He was just trying to make them dance, like in the old cowboy movies.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  6. TNHarley
    Online

    TNHarley Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2012
    Messages:
    45,944
    Thanks Received:
    6,841
    Trophy Points:
    1,830
    Ratings:
    +44,086
    Sorry, but it seems extremely naive, if not down right moronic, to think someone that shot fiftyish rounds at a crowd of people didn't want to hurt anyone.
    why try to downplay it? We have no idea what the motivation was. All we know for sure is that it was terrorism.
    Frankly, I am upset you put this malarkey in the CDZ :thup:
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Winner Winner x 1
  7. Xelor
    Offline

    Xelor Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2017
    Messages:
    8,095
    Thanks Received:
    1,188
    Trophy Points:
    255
    Location:
    D.C.
    Ratings:
    +4,193
    Right....That the man was a poor shot crossed my mind. Ten bullets fired per person injured and no fatalities suggests that may be so. Be that as it may, the central question I'm asking here is did the guy merely aim to harm people, thereby making a/his point (Lord knows what it'd be, but still....), or did he truly intend to kill someone and was just "that" ill suited to doing so, and whichever it be, what information/behavior militates strongly for one or the other of the options being most likely the accurate inference about the nature of Hodgkinson's intentions.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  8. JoeMoma
    Offline

    JoeMoma Gold Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2014
    Messages:
    7,879
    Thanks Received:
    1,032
    Trophy Points:
    290
    Ratings:
    +5,918
    Since the shooter is dead, we may never know.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. Meathead
    Offline

    Meathead Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2012
    Messages:
    20,994
    Thanks Received:
    2,920
    Trophy Points:
    280
    Location:
    Prague, Czech Republic
    Ratings:
    +14,023
    You're point would be ludicrous even if this were a more stable kinda guy. These were not random people.
     
  10. Xelor
    Offline

    Xelor Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2017
    Messages:
    8,095
    Thanks Received:
    1,188
    Trophy Points:
    255
    Location:
    D.C.
    Ratings:
    +4,193
    There is no doubt in my mind the man wanted to hurt someone. My questions have to do with whether he intended to fatally hurt people. That distinction went over your head, it appears.

    It's not naive or moronic to not recognize and apply the difference between "hurt" and "kill," but I'm going to leave it to you to figure out just what be the right term for describing what it is. The rest of us already know.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2017

Share This Page