How 5 Capitalist Democracies Do Health Care

[Procrustes Stretched]

Because our government is corrupt and totally incapable of running a social program that successfully and efficiently provides for those it intends to help.

Immie

Our government is NOT currupt. It is reflective of the voting public. The GOP has done what terrorists and rebels do when trying to destabilize nations they cannot win over with ideas....disruption, destruction, deceit, deception, all intended to make dupes like you say it is the government that is at fault.

Well I choose to blame people for their actions and not follow the words of partisan communication experts.

The Social Security program is run very well. The funding is at issue as it has always been...but ALL the millions of checks go out on time and all the people signing up get what they should. Medicare works too. When was the last time you heard of a patient insured by medicare being denied treatment for the things private insurers routinely deny paying customers for?

Take the profit out of health insurance and you will cut the costs of health care to managed able levels.

Another problem with Social Security, is that people have to put so much money into the system and get jack shit in return... if they live long enough. If they don't live long enough, they and their family lose everything.

A third problem with Social Security is the poor investment management of the funds. T-Bills (government IOUs) are simply not realistic by themselves to provide a return on the funds especially when T-Bills don't even keep up with inflation.

Immie

you are confusing SS with the sole retirement plan which it was never designed to be.

If we don't do things together and for each other as a society and not as individuals we will ssurely sow the seeds that destroy the republic.

This selfish self centered jibbersih that is common today is based on false assumptions, false models, false ideology, false premises, false ideals and a false understanding of how this gre

 

[GWV5903]

.....

Hey shit talker...I voted twice.....against Obama.

call me when you put down the koolaid and get out of detox

So Dev your wonderful alternative is to pick and choose from the universal plans that suck in the Uk, Germany, Japan, Taiwan & Switzerland? And you think I am drinking Kool Aid?

Hell move to any one of them, we already have enough idiots on the taxpayers backs, just admit it you want a free ride.....

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

.....

Hey shit talker...I voted twice.....against Obama.

call me when you put down the koolaid and get out of detox

So Dev your wonderful alternative is to pick and choose from the universal plans that suck in the Uk, Germany, Japan, Taiwan & Switzerland? And you think I am drinking Kool Aid?

Hell move to any one of them, we already have enough idiots on the taxpayers backs, just admit it you want a free ride.....

Why can't you just keep your own money and pay for soldiers of fortune to protect you from the Boogie man?
Taxes and programs they pay for ......It's societal agreements. You want to go your own way? Join a cult. I hear the Randian Objectovist Nitwit Society is holding a recruitment seminar nearby.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

For example, I'm able to remove a maximum $2,500 from my paycheck, pretax, to pay for health costs. Why am I limited to only $2,500? Why not allow me $10,000? Why not simply let me keep my money and find my own goddamn insurance?

because you don't live in a vacuum. You already pay taxes. Maybe a few dollars at most pay for the health care of others uninsured.

How much was your fwd tax bill? Divide that up with the cost of war, etc and fed grants to small biz etc, and divide some more.... get the drift?

Stop whining about responsibilies and obligatulions. Freedom isn't free, so STfU and pay your bill.
:jO

 

[saveliberty]

What about those responsibilities? Doesn't the government have them as well? A responsibility to accurately reflect the costs of these programs for one. Medicare was projected to cost $9b. a year by 2009, back in 1969. Those lovely folks at the CBO were only off by $58b. Missed it by a factor of seven.

They had a repsponsibility to set the money for social security aside for that purpose alone. Then they raided it and never put it back. Seems like a level of responsibility as breached there.

Another one will be providing these people who don't have coverage a plan. At this point the government has none of the advantages it said it would to control costs. We as the public will get to pay higher premiums to cover some of hte high risk people's coverages. That is how insurance works, a shared burden. Then in ADDITION to higher premiums, we will be taxed to pay for those who can't pay a second time.

The worst part is the government has cost shifted the bulk of these costs to people not even born yet. That is the ultimate in NOT BEING RESPONSIBLE. When you understand what responsibility is DevNell we can have a talk about this subject. Until then, you and the Democrats can STFU.

 

[Samson]

For example, I'm able to remove a maximum $2,500 from my paycheck, pretax, to pay for health costs. Why am I limited to only $2,500? Why not allow me $10,000? Why not simply let me keep my money and find my own goddamn insurance?

because you don't live in a vacuum. You already pay taxes. Maybe a few dollars at most pay for the health care of others uninsured.

How much was your fwd tax bill? Divide that up with the cost of war, etc and fed grants to small biz etc, and divide some more.... get the drift?

Stop whining about responsibilies and obligatulions. Freedom isn't free, so STfU and pay your bill.
:jO

Amazing.

I actually hate the pithy "Drinking Cool-aid Response" that seems to have become lexicon, but I can imagine Jim Jones uttering the same words:

"Stop whining about responsibilies and obligatulions. Freedom isn't free, so STfU and pay your bill."

You think Freedom is bought with Higher taxes? Have you heard of the American Revolutionary War? DevNell, I'm begining to believe you must be a Hannity-Shill, Representing the most idiotic of his heated imagination in a effort to paint all liberalism with a broad brush.

This line also gives credence to all the "slippery-slope," Limbaughesque hysterians that believe that if the Feds are given ANY power then they will take ALL power. You actually believe that if I allow the waste of my contribution our treasury on any number of foolhardy reasons, then I should be willing to allow MORE waste on ADDITIONAL foolhardy expenditures?

Perhaps those that suspect everything the Feds do are not hysterians......

 

[GWV5903]

Hey shit talker...I voted twice.....against Obama.

call me when you put down the koolaid and get out of detox

So Dev your wonderful alternative is to pick and choose from the universal plans that suck in the Uk, Germany, Japan, Taiwan & Switzerland? And you think I am drinking Kool Aid?

Hell move to any one of them, we already have enough idiots on the taxpayers backs, just admit it you want a free ride.....

Why can't you just keep your own money and pay for soldiers of fortune to protect you from the Boogie man?
Taxes and programs they pay for ......It's societal agreements. You want to go your own way? Join a cult. I hear the Randian Objectovist Nitwit Society is holding a recruitment seminar nearby.

Now your stuck in that 8th grade mentality again, try doing this a couple of times, there is a slight chance you'll get that peanut to quit bouncing around in that vacuum of space on your shoulders......

Blahblahblah.......maybe, just maybe someday you will grasp what your missing in all of this......until then just

 

[Samson]

So Dev your wonderful alternative is to pick and choose from the universal plans that suck in the Uk, Germany, Japan, Taiwan & Switzerland? And you think I am drinking Kool Aid?

Hell move to any one of them, we already have enough idiots on the taxpayers backs, just admit it you want a free ride.....

Why can't you just keep your own money and pay for soldiers of fortune to protect you from the Boogie man?
Taxes and programs they pay for ......It's societal agreements. You want to go your own way? Join a cult. I hear the Randian Objectovist Nitwit Society is holding a recruitment seminar nearby.

Now your stuck in that 8th grade mentality again, try doing this a couple of times, there is a slight chance you'll get that peanut to quit bouncing around in that vacuum of space on your shoulders......

Blahblahblah.......maybe, just maybe someday you will grasp what your missing in all of this......until then just

Devnell's in the 8th grade?

This might explain why he's not familiar with REASONS For the American Revolutionary War: Taxation without Representation.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

What about those responsibilities? Doesn't the government have them as well? A responsibility to accurately reflect the costs of these programs for one.

Medicare was projected to cost $9b. a year by 2009, back in 1969. Those lovely folks at the CBO were only off by $58b. Missed it by a factor of seven.

I wonder what role the Carter Inflation and the Reagan Deficits that followed, had to play in things. How one accurately predicts the future costs of anything is beyond me, but as with life...
...not being able to accurately predict the future is no reason to cease living.

They had a repsponsibility to set the money for social security aside for that purpose alone. Then they raided it and never put it back. Seems like a level of responsibility as breached there.

Who had a responsibility...the CBO?
How is borrowing money a breach and what part of that borrowing happened under Republican Admins and control? Or does shared responsibilties go the way of your common sense?

Another one will be providing these people who don't have coverage a plan. At this point the government has none of the advantages it said it would to control costs. We as the public will get to pay higher premiums to cover some of hte high risk people's coverages. That is how insurance works, a shared burden.

That is how society works. Your dystopian world view is profoundly disturbing. All honest and civil men must poitest your inanities.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Then in ADDITION to higher premiums, we will be taxed to pay for those who can't pay a second time.

your assumptions are to be taken as the word of god, yet the CBO is to be ignored?

You're all over the place here. Your false premises are as thick as a part of the Amazon Jungle.[/quote]

The worst part is the government has cost shifted the bulk of these costs to people not even born yet. That is the ultimate in NOT BEING RESPONSIBLE. When you understand what responsibility is DevNell we can have a talk about this subject. Until then, you and the Democrats can STFU.

The worst part is the government has cost shifted the bulk of these costs to people not even born yet. That is the ultimate in NOT BEING RESPONSIBLE. When you understand what responsibility is DevNell we can have a talk about this subject. Until then, you and the Democrats can STFU.[/QUOTE]

Social Security payments always came out of funds payed for by others? Who the fuck do you think paid for the very first recipients of SS? That's right....their children and grandchildren. Or so that is how I understand it. Tell me where I err.

but your selfish, self centeredness is made more disgusting by yiur hiding behind 'future' generations. You remind me of the populist nitwits who alwyas hind behind things saying 'but it's about the children'

fuck off asswipe

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Amazing.
I actually hate the pithy "Drinking Cool-aid Response" that seems to have become lexicon, but I can imagine Jim Jones uttering the same words:

Devnell's words: "Stop whining about responsibilies and obligatulions. Freedom isn't free, so STfU and pay your bill."

You think Freedom is bought with Higher taxes?

Yes I do. Taxes are what paid for the American Revolution and it's many advances. Taxes (loosely defined) are not the root of all evil. Well meaning, yet disturbed men like you are. Taxes (loosely defined) paid to fund the westward expansion of the USA , AND the railroads...and the progress from an agrarian society to the great industrialization that was built upon great accumulation of wealth and abject poverty... I could go on but I suspec you are rigidly ignorant of reality. I like capitalism...tempered and regulated. Captalism has bothe enslaved and freed mankind. Without balance (regulation) most things in excess are cancers. Cancer is nothing but unregulated growth.

 

[saveliberty]

What about those responsibilities? Doesn't the government have them as well? A responsibility to accurately reflect the costs of these programs for one.

Medicare was projected to cost $9b. a year by 2009, back in 1969. Those lovely folks at the CBO were only off by $58b. Missed it by a factor of seven.

I wonder what role the Carter Inflation and the Reagan Deficits that followed, had to play in things. How one accurately predicts the future costs of anything is beyond me, but as with life...
...not being able to accurately predict the future is no reason to cease living.

They had a repsponsibility to set the money for social security aside for that purpose alone. Then they raided it and never put it back. Seems like a level of responsibility as breached there.

Who had a responsibility...the CBO?
How is borrowing money a breach and what part of that borrowing happened under Republican Admins and control? Or does shared responsibilties go the way of your common sense?

Another one will be providing these people who don't have coverage a plan. At this point the government has none of the advantages it said it would to control costs. We as the public will get to pay higher premiums to cover some of hte high risk people's coverages. That is how insurance works, a shared burden.

That is how society works. Your dystopian world view is profoundly disturbing. All honest and civil men must poitest your inanities.

..and your view that the US and for that matter, the world is your piggy bank is as profoundly stupid as it is self-centered. How absolutely juvenile to make excuses from the past, instead of taking responsibility for the present and future by only commiting to things you can pay for. Anyone who has pulled out a credit card for every little emergency and didn't pay it back right away has done bankrupt. The country will be no different.

 

[saveliberty]

Amazing.
I actually hate the pithy "Drinking Cool-aid Response" that seems to have become lexicon, but I can imagine Jim Jones uttering the same words:

Devnell's words: "Stop whining about responsibilies and obligatulions. Freedom isn't free, so STfU and pay your bill."

You think Freedom is bought with Higher taxes?

Yes I do. Taxes are what paid for the American Revolution and it's many advances. Taxes (loosely defined) are not the root of all evil. Well meaning, yet disturbed men like you are. Taxes (loosely defined) paid to fund the westward expansion of the USA , AND the railroads...and the progress from an agrarian society to the great industrialization that was built upon great accumulation of wealth and abject poverty... I could go on but I suspec you are rigidly ignorant of reality. I like capitalism...tempered and regulated. Captalism has bothe enslaved and freed mankind. Without balance (regulation) most things in excess are cancers. Cancer is nothing but unregulated growth.

Statements like this make me realize that I am arguing with a fool. I always like how people like this show hate and disdain for what the wealth builders of the past made, yet freely revel in the benefits.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Why have the Dems in Congress exempted themselves from this wonderful new plan?

 

[rightwinger]

Why have the Dems in Congress exempted themselves from this wonderful new plan?

They haven't

Only FoxNews has exempted them from the plan

 

[Colin]

Anyone who has half a brain in Britain goes private... they don't use the NHS unless they can't afford insurance... because it's crap.

Really? It has worked fine for everyone I know. When my father had cancer he received the finest care and treatment that private treatment would not surpass. I myself have recieved NHS treatment for crash injuries and one abdominal op and my treatment was superb. In fact, the same consultants who work the private sector, also work in the public sector.

Incidentally, only around 11% of people in the UK bother with healthcare insurance.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

What about those responsibilities? Doesn't the government have them as well? A responsibility to accurately reflect the costs of these programs for one.

Medicare was projected to cost $9b. a year by 2009, back in 1969. Those lovely folks at the CBO were only off by $58b. Missed it by a factor of seven.

I wonder what role the Carter Inflation and the Reagan Deficits that followed, had to play in things. How one accurately predicts the future costs of anything is beyond me, but as with life...
...not being able to accurately predict the future is no reason to cease living.
Who had a responsibility...the CBO?
How is borrowing money a breach and what part of that borrowing happened under Republican Admins and control? Or does shared responsibilties go the way of your common sense?

Another one will be providing these people who don't have coverage a plan. At this point the government has none of the advantages it said it would to control costs. We as the public will get to pay higher premiums to cover some of hte high risk people's coverages. That is how insurance works, a shared burden.

That is how society works. Your dystopian world view is profoundly disturbing. All honest and civil men must poitest your inanities.

..and your view that the US and for that matter, the world is your piggy bank is as profoundly stupid as it is self-centered. How absolutely juvenile to make excuses from the past, instead of taking responsibility for the present and future by only commiting to things you can pay for. Anyone who has pulled out a credit card for every little emergency and didn't pay it back right away has done bankrupt. The country will be no different.

NEver said the world is MY piggy bank. If I thought it were I'd pay to put you on the next space shuttle for a trip to nowhere

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

So Dev your wonderful alternative is to pick and choose from the universal plans that suck in the Uk, Germany, Japan, Taiwan & Switzerland? And you think I am drinking Kool Aid?

Hell move to any one of them, we already have enough idiots on the taxpayers backs, just admit it you want a free ride.....

Why can't you just keep your own money and pay for soldiers of fortune to protect you from the Boogie man?
Taxes and programs they pay for ......It's societal agreements. You want to go your own way? Join a cult. I hear the Randian Objectovist Nitwit Society is holding a recruitment seminar nearby.

Now your stuck in that 8th grade mentality again, try doing this a couple of times, there is a slight chance you'll get that peanut to quit bouncing around in that vacuum of space on your shoulders......

Blahblahblah.......maybe, just maybe someday you will grasp what your missing in all of this......until then just

You're as impressive as a pimple on the ass of a pregnant whore posting at USMB

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Amazing.
I actually hate the pithy "Drinking Cool-aid Response" that seems to have become lexicon, but I can imagine Jim Jones uttering the same words:
You think Freedom is bought with Higher taxes?

Yes I do. Taxes are what paid for the American Revolution and it's many advances. Taxes (loosely defined) are not the root of all evil. Well meaning, yet disturbed men like you are. Taxes (loosely defined) paid to fund the westward expansion of the USA , AND the railroads...and the progress from an agrarian society to the great industrialization that was built upon great accumulation of wealth and abject poverty... I could go on but I suspec you are rigidly ignorant of reality. I like capitalism...tempered and regulated. Captalism has bothe enslaved and freed mankind. Without balance (regulation) most things in excess are cancers. Cancer is nothing but unregulated growth.

Statements like this make me realize that I am arguing with a fool. I always like how people like this show hate and disdain for what the wealth builders of the past made, yet freely revel in the benefits.

Builders of the past. Many were parasites. Some were not. I have no disdain for many of the great buildres, but unlike you I do not have disdain for the naked truth.

Progress is often ugly...just ask any Luddite.

You're trapped in a mind of unlimted potential which is beinfg strangled by ideology.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Why have the Dems in Congress exempted themselves from this wonderful new plan?

more bs spin from the spineless crusader otherwise known as Cranky Old Frank?

go figure