Hey leftists, please give me ONE reason to trust the government to do ANYTHING...

[Liberty]

I just believe in article 1 section 8, federalist 41, which describes what general welfare means (It means in guidance with the enumerated powers), and the 10th amendment, which is described in federalist 45 as being exactly what it says, which is, in case you forgot, if the federal government wants to act on something that is not an enumerated power, then they have no authority, because that authority is reserved to the people and the states.

Why is it hard for people to understand?

 

[rightwinger]

I trust the government because we have the greatest government
In the history of mankind...bar none

Well, thank you for being honest. I can't understand why a human being would choose bondage to liberty, but hell, whatever makes you feel good. Unfortunately, this is not a reason for someone like me, who believes in natural rights to trust a federal government to do things for me that I can do myself, and thus relinquishing said natural rights.

So, thanks again, but I need more reason.

Nice rightwing rhetoric..Bondage?

Care to name a government on earth that you prefer?

 

[Truthmatters]

...that is not an enumerated power. I'll wait.

You either like the government our founders left us or not.

The fact that YOU PRETEND the constitution says one thing while the arbitors of the constitution the founders left us says another is merely a product of your fantasies.


I dont trust them to do anything the constitution doesnt allow them to do.

You are jsut so full of piss and lies you dont know what is enumerated or not.

That's a false choice and you know it.

the government we have today is NOT the government the founders left us.

So tell me do you think our first president hated our country because he said this about government:

“Government is not reason, it is not eloquence, it is force; like fire, a troublesome servant and a fearful master. Never for a moment should it be left to irresponsible action.”

That doesn't sound like a man who likes the government the founders created does it?

I agree with George.

No you dont, you agree with glenn Beck.

George never said the government they created was EASY he did think it was teh best government in the world though.


You hate it beacuse it doent do YOUR bidding.

You are not the final arbitor of what the contitution says.

You are merely ONE of its citizens jsut like me.

I still love it even though it does not always do my bidding.

You seem to ONLY love it when it does YOUR bidding.

 

[Skull Pilot]

You either like the government our founders left us or not.

The fact that YOU PRETEND the constitution says one thing while the arbitors of the constitution the founders left us says another is merely a product of your fantasies.


I dont trust them to do anything the constitution doesnt allow them to do.

You are jsut so full of piss and lies you dont know what is enumerated or not.

That's a false choice and you know it.

the government we have today is NOT the government the founders left us.

So tell me do you think our first president hated our country because he said this about government:

“Government is not reason, it is not eloquence, it is force; like fire, a troublesome servant and a fearful master. Never for a moment should it be left to irresponsible action.”

That doesn't sound like a man who likes the government the founders created does it?

I agree with George.

No you dont, you agree with glenn Beck.

George never said the government they created was EASY he did think it was teh best government in the world though.


You hate it beacuse it doent do YOUR bidding.

You are not the final arbitor of what the contitution says.

You are merely ONE of its citizens jsut like me.

I still love it even though it does not always do my bidding.

You seem to ONLY love it when it does YOUR bidding.

I don't want the fucking government to do anything for me. i want it to leave me the fuck alone.

And BTW you have watched and listened to Beck more than I because I have not once tuned into his show. I don't need to be spoon fed my opinions like you.

That Washington quote was from a man who obviously distrusted government. How do you reconcile that when you say one must love our government?

 

[Liberty]

I trust the government because we have the greatest government
In the history of mankind...bar none

Well, thank you for being honest. I can't understand why a human being would choose bondage to liberty, but hell, whatever makes you feel good. Unfortunately, this is not a reason for someone like me, who believes in natural rights to trust a federal government to do things for me that I can do myself, and thus relinquishing said natural rights.

So, thanks again, but I need more reason.

Nice rightwing rhetoric..Bondage?

Care to name a government on earth that you prefer?

I'd prefer a constitutional republic based on law instead of an oligarchy based on tyranny any day.

 

[LordBrownTrout]

Because our government loves all of us and will do anything for us. They would never lie to us because they have always been so honest and devoid of corruption.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Well, thank you for being honest. I can't understand why a human being would choose bondage to liberty, but hell, whatever makes you feel good. Unfortunately, this is not a reason for someone like me, who believes in natural rights to trust a federal government to do things for me that I can do myself, and thus relinquishing said natural rights.

So, thanks again, but I need more reason.

Nice rightwing rhetoric..Bondage?

Care to name a government on earth that you prefer?

I'd prefer a constitutional republic based on law instead of an oligarchy based on tyranny any day.

Preferring and blindly trusting are two completely different things.

 

[WillowTree]

Why is it the right hates the government the founders left us?

Does it irritate you?

Good morning willow, hope you slept well.


I really love the government my founders left me.

I wish you people did too.

Its really sad that the right doesnt.

You see they left us the ability to drive this country into the future, the right seem to think they didnt.

I dont know why they hate this part of the constitution that our founders designed but it really has saved democracy several times.

Long live democracy and long live our government.

The founders would have been proud of their design to see it survive so long.

I really think they would be insulted by how much the right hates the government they created for us.

I asked you if it irritated you?

 

[Liberty]

Good point, SP.

 

[Liberty]

I just believe in article 1 section 8, federalist 41, which describes what general welfare means (It means in guidance with the enumerated powers), and the 10th amendment, which is described in federalist 45 as being exactly what it says, which is, in case you forgot, if the federal government wants to act on something that is not an enumerated power, then they have no authority, because that authority is reserved to the people and the states.

Why is it hard for people to understand?

Can I get an intelligent response to this? Or are you lefties just going to ignore being destroyed on the subject?

 

[rdean]

Wow, you must really live under a rock...what do you call these people:

Afghanistan-Pakistan (Af-Pak) czar, Richard Holbrooke
AIDS czar, Jeffrey Crowley [openly gay white man]
Auto recovery czar, Ed Montgomery
Behavioral science czar, position not yet filled
Bailout czar, Herbert Allison Jr., [replaced Bush bailout czar Neel Kashkari, Assistant Secretary of the Treasury for Financial Stability confirmed by Senate]
Border czar, Alan Bersin
Car czar, Ron Bloom [Counselor to the Secretary of the Treasury , under Senate oversight]
Climate change czar, Todd Stern
Copyright czar, not appointed yet
Counterterrorism czar, John Brennan
Cybersecurity czar, position will be vacant on August 21st [upon the departure of Melissa Hathaway]
Disinformation czar, Linda Douglass [This is a new media buzz since our earlier list, a response by pundits to the White House request for informants: see Glenn Beck and Lew Rockwell]
Domestic violence czar, Lynn Rosenthal
Drug czar, Gil Kerlikowske
Economic czar, Larry Summers
Economic czar number two, Paul Volcker
Education czar, Arne Duncan
Energy czar, Carol Browner
Food czar, Michael Taylor [a former Monsanto executive, or, the fox in charge of the henhouse]
Government performance czar, Jeffrey Zients
Great Lakes czar, Cameron Davis
Green jobs czar, Van Jones [who has a communist background]
Guantanamo closure czar, Daniel Fried
Health czar, Nancy-Ann DeParle
Infotech czar, Vivek Kundra [Shoplifted four shirts, worth $33.50 each, from J.C. Penney in 1996 (source). His last day in DC government was March 4 but on March 12 the FBI raided his office and arrested two staffers.]
Intelligence czar, Dennis Blair [Director of National Intelligence, a Senate confirmed position. He is a retired United States Navy four-star admiral]
Latin-American czar, Arturo Valenzuela (nominee) [although this post is referred to as a czar, he is nominatied to be Assistant Secretary of State for Western Hemisphere Affairs and so is subject to Senate confirmation. Voting on his confirmation was delayed to clarify his position on Honduras. Watch WaPo's Head Count to track status of confirmation.]
Mideast peace czar, George Mitchell
Mideast policy czar, Dennis Ross
Pay czar, Kenneth Feinberg
Regulatory czar, Cass Sunstein
Religion czar, aka God czar Joshua DuBois
Safe schools czar, Kevin Jennings [appointed to be Assistant Deputy Secretary of the Office of Safe and Drug-Free Schools, a newly created post (that does not require Senate confirmation); openly gay founder of an organization dedicated to promoting pro-homosexual clubs and curricula in public schools]
Science czar, John Holdren
Stimulus oversight czar, Earl Devaney
Sudan czar, J. Scott Gration
TARP czar, Elizabeth Warren [chair of the [Congressional Oversight Panel for the Trouble Assets Relief Program; note that Herb Allison is frequently called the TARP czar]
Technology czar, Aneesh Chopra
Trade czar, Ron Kirk
Urban affairs czar, Adolfo Carrion
War czar, Douglas Lute [retained from Bush administration, married to Jane Holl Lute, currently a Deputy Secretary of Homeland Security]
Water czar, David J. Hayes [a Deputy Interior Secretary and therefore subject to Senate oversight]
Weapons czar, Ashton Carter [actually Under Secretary of Defense for Acquisition, Technology, and Logistics and so subject to Senate confirmation]
Weapons of mass destruction czar, Gary Samore

If your doctor send you to a "brain specialist", would you refuse to go? After all, it's a "czar".

Oh wait, YOUR doctor is "Granny".

Isn’t “czar” just a nickname the media uses? | Politics, Economics, Religion and People

The media uses the word czar to describe any high-level position with a long title. For example, the "Drug Czar" is the Director of the Office of National Drug Control Policy, the "Health Czar" is a real job called the Secretary of Health and Human Services, the "Cyber Czar" is a position called Department of Homeland SecurityÂ’s cyber-security chief, etcetera. Most of the positions the media calls "czars" were invented by G. W. Bush or others by previous Presidents.

G. W. Bush himself had an untold number of high-level "czars." Yet, there was no out-cry from the Right. Cheney had something called a "Policy Czar," but I never heard a peep about it from the Right. Never mind the other unpopular things the Bush White House did…

I know it’s useless arguing with people who are wrong on the internet, but I just wanted to point out that the White House isn’t appointing 16th century Russian Monarchs. It’s just a nickname used by the media. The job "Czar" doesn’t exist, you are talking about normal White House appointments. This is like the Left complaining about Bush’s signing statements. Yeah signing statements are probably an abuse of power, but he was within his power to use them.

You're confusing office management with "real" power.

 

[Truthmatters]

Because our government loves all of us and will do anything for us. They would never lie to us because they have always been so honest and devoid of corruption.

where did anyone but you say this?


The government the founders left us left US in control of the government.

Why do you support issues that would hand its power to the corporations?

 

[Truthmatters]

There is no title of czar in the US government

 

[Big Fitz]

...that is not an enumerated power. I'll wait.

Enumerated power is a matter of interpretation... Power to tax, provide defense, and general welfare cover most of what they do.

I'd ask what specifically you think we're doing that's unconstitutional, but I know how that conversation goes...

Laughable. The General Welfare clause is still limited by the enumerated powers clause. If it is not an enumerated power, it cannot be done by the feds, but may POSSIBLY be done by your state.

If the General Welfare clause and the Interstate Commerce Clause have no limitatiions, then we have a tyranny from washington because nothing could stop the feds from doing anything and the states are nothing more than demarcations of territorial administration, not unique and sovereign states as they were pre-civil war. None of the original 13 colonies would have signed on for 1000 kings 10 miles away as compared to a single king 10000 miles away. There is just no way.

Now, as to the question of "common good" it is an action or service of the government that serves ALL Americans equally. Military defense, the court system, weights and measures, roads... all these are open access to every single American and are used equally by them all depending on their desire in which to use them. A football stadium benefits a small group. Welfare STEALS from those better off to give to a select group of poor to make their poverty tolerable, but not overcome it. Foodstamps, available to the poor against the will of the rich, otherwise it would be paid for in donations by those who could. Social Security, same thing, the richest don't get it or have limited access while the poor and very old are subsidized.

Yes it feels nice but if you read back in the papers and debates of our founding fathers and even up until the age of Jackson the government was forbidden to be a Charity. Even Colonel Davy Crockett, senator from Tennessee gave a blistering speech on congress trying to pervert the intentions of the institution to redistribute money that was entrusted to them, but was NOT theirs to do as they will.

Government and the power to tax is not a valid OR ethical tonic for your guilty conscience which most libs seem to be ruled by. There is nothing wrong for living for yourself and making the most and doing the best you can as long as you do not do it at the expense of preventing another person from doing the same. That is what government is to protect us from. Tyranny from ALL fronts. Even fellow citizens who have forgotten they need to extend the same courtesy they recieved in building their empire to others.

 

[Liberty]

Because our government loves all of us and will do anything for us. They would never lie to us because they have always been so honest and devoid of corruption.

where did anyone but you say this?


The government the founders left us left US in control of the government.

Why do you support issues that would hand its power to the corporations?

Why do you ignore points instead of addressing them?

 

[Truthmatters]

I addressed them , you just dont like what I said

 

[Liberty]

Thanks, BF. Well said.

 

[Liberty]

I addressed them , you just dont like what I said

Actually you didn't.

And it isn't a matter of liking something. I am trying to wrap my head around the idea that someone would trust some tool in a robe in interpreting a document, instead of trusting the people that wrote the document themselves. Seems like broken logic, doesn't it?

 

[LordBrownTrout]

Because our government loves all of us and will do anything for us. They would never lie to us because they have always been so honest and devoid of corruption.

where did anyone but you say this?


The government the founders left us left US in control of the government.

Why do you support issues that would hand its power to the corporations?

My apologies, TM. For future reference, I'll avoid such commentary that flies over your head.

 

[Truthmatters]

You are not the final arbitor of what the constitution means.


There is a method in our government to decide this.

Why do you hate your own government?