Has our Government become Dysfunctional?

[Wry Catcher]

So two believe they have better ideas to end gridlock and what seems to be a dysfunctional federal government but can't or won't share ideas.

Now that we are into prime time, maybe there are others who can and will share ideas?

 

[lynn63]

We need a smaller government and this could be done very easily by setting up another entity that manages our social security and health benefits, pension plans, etc. where the government cannot touch any of those funds.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Three things need to be accomplished in my opinion to restore sanity to our government:

1. A COTUS Amendment giving the POTUS the Line-Item Veto and also allowing for every such veto to be overridden by a 2/3 vote in both the Senate and H. of Rep.;

2. A COTUS Amendment wherein the POTUS serves only a single six-year term of office;

3. A COTUS Amendment which requires each member of the Supreme Court to serve no more than three Ten year terms, and be returned to the court for 10 years only upon receiving at least 50% plus one vote in a nation-wide referendum, with mandatory retirement at age 75th Birthday notwithstanding the date of their third successful ratification by the people.

Poll to follow

Agree with one and two but not three, as I don't want lefties or reactionaries skewing constitutional decisions. Constitution interpretation is not a democratic procedure.

 

[Trajan]

So the usual suspects on the right post criticisms but no solutions, no ideas, no nothing but for Red Herrings & ad hominem attacks. They then cut and run.

I and asked questions and provided my thoughts, your problem is you cannot calmly & minus acrimony, discuss anything without getting snarky if folks don't agree with you.....



you seem to be in 'fractured ego' mode, seek help...oh and I cut and run to enjoy my pool and the sun for several hours, sorry I didn't check in....


well, not really

 

[Wry Catcher]

We need a smaller government and this could be done very easily by setting up another entity that manages our social security and health benefits, pension plans, etc. where the government cannot touch any of those funds.

Would that "another entity" be Wall Street?

 

[Wry Catcher]

Three things need to be accomplished in my opinion to restore sanity to our government:

1. A COTUS Amendment giving the POTUS the Line-Item Veto and also allowing for every such veto to be overridden by a 2/3 vote in both the Senate and H. of Rep.;

2. A COTUS Amendment wherein the POTUS serves only a single six-year term of office;

3. A COTUS Amendment which requires each member of the Supreme Court to serve no more than three Ten year terms, and be returned to the court for 10 years only upon receiving at least 50% plus one vote in a nation-wide referendum, with mandatory retirement at age 75th Birthday notwithstanding the date of their third successful ratification by the people.

Poll to follow

Agree with one and two but not three, as I don't want lefties or reactionaries skewing constitutional decisions. Constitution interpretation is not a democratic procedure.

I agree. It is not a populist decision, but, it is not exactly a science either. Given the number of 5-4 critical decision holding Justices accountable which is what I suggested seems to be both a sufficient and necessary solution, given the partisan divide on the court today.

 

[Wry Catcher]

So the usual suspects on the right post criticisms but no solutions, no ideas, no nothing but for Red Herrings & ad hominem attacks. They then cut and run.

I and asked questions and provided my thoughts, your problem is you cannot calmly & minus acrimony, discuss anything without getting snarky if folks don't agree with you.....



you seem to be in 'fractured ego' mode, seek help...oh and I cut and run to enjoy my pool and the sun for several hours, sorry I didn't check in....


well, not really

Thank you for sharing your pop psychological evaluation of my motives. The fact that you're still stuck on partisan politics notwithstanding. My ego is fine, I know I don't have the answers, I also know you aren't capable of even understanding the issues.

 

[Pop23]

Three things need to be accomplished in my opinion to restore sanity to our government:

1. A COTUS Amendment giving the POTUS the Line-Item Veto and also allowing for every such veto to be overridden by a 2/3 vote in both the Senate and H. of Rep.;

2. A COTUS Amendment wherein the POTUS serves only a single six-year term of office;

3. A COTUS Amendment which requires each member of the Supreme Court to serve no more than three Ten year terms, and be returned to the court for 10 years only upon receiving at least 50% plus one vote in a nation-wide referendum, with mandatory retirement at age 75th Birthday notwithstanding the date of their third successful ratification by the people.

Poll to follow

I agree with #1 there is no question it is reasonable.

#2 and #3 makes the assumption that we are stupid. There should be no term limits except as outlined in the original constitution.

Term limits only makes a lazy population lazier.

2 cents

 

[Wry Catcher]

Three things need to be accomplished in my opinion to restore sanity to our government:

1. A COTUS Amendment giving the POTUS the Line-Item Veto and also allowing for every such veto to be overridden by a 2/3 vote in both the Senate and H. of Rep.;

2. A COTUS Amendment wherein the POTUS serves only a single six-year term of office;

3. A COTUS Amendment which requires each member of the Supreme Court to serve no more than three Ten year terms, and be returned to the court for 10 years only upon receiving at least 50% plus one vote in a nation-wide referendum, with mandatory retirement at age 75th Birthday notwithstanding the date of their third successful ratification by the people.

Poll to follow

I agree with #1 there is no question it is reasonable.

#2 and #3 makes the assumption that we are stupid. There should be no term limits except as outlined in the original constitution.

Term limits only makes a lazy population lazier.

2 cents

Your 2 cents beats the rest of the table. #2 has, IMO, nothing to do with the voter. As someone who understands leadership I see one six year term as potentially more productive than two four year terms for reasons I pointed out above.

#3 takes into account the age and length of service of members of the court; reasons I also offered an opinion upon above.

 

[Pop23]

Three things need to be accomplished in my opinion to restore sanity to our government:

1. A COTUS Amendment giving the POTUS the Line-Item Veto and also allowing for every such veto to be overridden by a 2/3 vote in both the Senate and H. of Rep.;

2. A COTUS Amendment wherein the POTUS serves only a single six-year term of office;

3. A COTUS Amendment which requires each member of the Supreme Court to serve no more than three Ten year terms, and be returned to the court for 10 years only upon receiving at least 50% plus one vote in a nation-wide referendum, with mandatory retirement at age 75th Birthday notwithstanding the date of their third successful ratification by the people.

Poll to follow

I agree with #1 there is no question it is reasonable.

#2 and #3 makes the assumption that we are stupid. There should be no term limits except as outlined in the original constitution.

Term limits only makes a lazy population lazier.

2 cents

Your 2 cents beats the rest of the table. #2 has, IMO, nothing to do with the voter. As someone who understands leadership I see one six year term as potentially more productive than two four year terms for reasons I pointed out above.

#3 takes into account the age and length of service of members of the court; reasons I also offered an opinion upon above.

I will stand with my original statement

The public needs to be more involved. Term limits simply make the public less responsible for their own decisions.

Guess I'm in for 4 cents now

 

[Trajan]

So the usual suspects on the right post criticisms but no solutions, no ideas, no nothing but for Red Herrings & ad hominem attacks. They then cut and run.

I and asked questions and provided my thoughts, your problem is you cannot calmly & minus acrimony, discuss anything without getting snarky if folks don't agree with you.....



you seem to be in 'fractured ego' mode, seek help...oh and I cut and run to enjoy my pool and the sun for several hours, sorry I didn't check in....


well, not really

Thank you for sharing your pop psychological evaluation of my motives. The fact that you're still stuck on partisan politics notwithstanding. My ego is fine, I know I don't have the answers, I also know you aren't capable of even understanding the issues.

hey dopey, you're the one that had to got 'ideological', I never said a word that could be misconstrued as partisan until you decided to engage in your usual passive aggressive bullshit........


what, your memory going too? put down the bong, this thread is a perfect example of the way you back and forth, a lot of forth and not much back but juvenile, hostile remarks as you cannot conjure the intellect to discuss anything with folks who may not share your view etc. ....

 

[Trajan]

For further reading on efforts to control the budget and the battle between The Congress and the Executive read:

1974 Budget and Impoundment Control Act - Timeline - Slaying the Dragon of Debt - Regional Oral History Office - University of California, Berkeley

maybe you should try reading that for yourself, since; obama has been not been attentive ( and Reid's Senate to and Pelosi' s house too) in performing these duties as prescribed.

Maybe you ought to get your head out of 'Limbaugh's' ass and forget who is POTUS. My post was non partisan and the issue (as I pointed out in response to CrusaderFrank, above) is long standing and in need of solutions.

You and the other 'Limbaugh' sycophant can't put partisanship aside for one moment, nor answer a simple set of questions rationally. Asking "why, why, why" is little more than a weak Red Herring (unless you're too dumb to understand the problems and see a non partisan effort at a solution as an attack on you).

wow, I missed this brilliant blurb of yours.....what a dunce, the Limbaugh card, last refuge of a nitwit with nothing....


whoever thought "why..." would trip up someone who started a thread ostensibly to discuss what he posted?

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

A COTUS Amendment giving the POTUS the Line-Item Veto and also allowing for every such veto to be overridden by a 2/3 vote in both the Senate and H. of Rep.;

Disagree.

A line-item veto would give the CE legislative authority undermining separation of powers doctrine and the Framers’ intent for a republican form of government. Such an amendment would give too much power to single person, as well as license to ignore the will of the people as expressed through their elected representatives.

A COTUS Amendment wherein the POTUS serves only a single six-year term of office;

Agree.

Although not a panacea for the many problems facing a government in gridlock, it would allow a president to do what’s best for the country, not what’s best for his reelection bid; and compel the opposition to work with the president, understanding he’s not going anywhere for a relatively long time.

A COTUS Amendment which requires each member of the Supreme Court to serve no more than three Ten year terms, and be returned to the court for 10 years only upon receiving at least 50% plus one vote in a nation-wide referendum, with mandatory retirement at age 75th Birthday notwithstanding the date of their third successful ratification by the people.

Disagree.

The independence of the judiciary is the cornerstone of the doctrines of judicial review, the interpretive authority of the courts, and the rule of law. Although the judiciary will forever be contaminated with the bane of politics, subjecting judges and justices to referenda and the pitfalls of partisan campaigning will irrevocably erode the authority of the judiciary and the trust of the people in our legal system.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Three things need to be accomplished in my opinion to restore sanity to our government:

1. A COTUS Amendment giving the POTUS the Line-Item Veto and also allowing for every such veto to be overridden by a 2/3 vote in both the Senate and H. of Rep.;

2. A COTUS Amendment wherein the POTUS serves only a single six-year term of office;

3. A COTUS Amendment which requires each member of the Supreme Court to serve no more than three Ten year terms, and be returned to the court for 10 years only upon receiving at least 50% plus one vote in a nation-wide referendum, with mandatory retirement at age 75th Birthday notwithstanding the date of their third successful ratification by the people.

Poll to follow

Agree with one and two but not three, as I don't want lefties or reactionaries skewing constitutional decisions. Constitution interpretation is not a democratic procedure.

I agree. It is not a populist decision, but, it is not exactly a science either. Given the number of 5-4 critical decision holding Justices accountable which is what I suggested seems to be both a sufficient and necessary solution, given the partisan divide on the court today.

I would rather have lifetime appointments to insulate the Court members from the vagaries of the electorate.

 

[dblack]

In my view our government has become dysfunctional primarily due to the erosion of dependable limits on the scope of its power. What makes democracy viable is the promise that the majority can't inflict its will capriciously on the minority. In order to agree to the concept of majority rule, we need to know that when we are not in the majority we won't be victimized.

The steady removal of Constitutional limits on government power have created an untenable political situation. As the government's power to dictate how we live our lives has grown, so has the threat of letting someone you disagree with run the government. That's why our elections are so bitterly contested and why the 'sides' (even when they really don't disagree all that much) are so mutually distrusting. When losing an election can mean sweeping changes to the foundations of our society (e.g. socializing health care), elections become less about choosing leaders and more like civil wars.

 

[JakeStarkey]

A reminder: losing elections is not victimization. We don't want folks on either side adopting victimization mode as an effort to avoid that choices have consequences. An example: when SCOTUS has opined and two elections have passed without revoking ACA and when the government agrees to give Small Business another year to adapt to it without fines and with less paper work, one is not witnessing the socialization of health care.

 

[Wry Catcher]

A COTUS Amendment giving the POTUS the Line-Item Veto and also allowing for every such veto to be overridden by a 2/3 vote in both the Senate and H. of Rep.;

Disagree.

A line-item veto would give the CE legislative authority undermining separation of powers doctrine and the Framers’ intent for a republican form of government. Such an amendment would give too much power to single person, as well as license to ignore the will of the people as expressed through their elected representatives.

A COTUS Amendment wherein the POTUS serves only a single six-year term of office;

Agree.

Although not a panacea for the many problems facing a government in gridlock, it would allow a president to do what’s best for the country, not what’s best for his reelection bid; and compel the opposition to work with the president, understanding he’s not going anywhere for a relatively long time.

A COTUS Amendment which requires each member of the Supreme Court to serve no more than three Ten year terms, and be returned to the court for 10 years only upon receiving at least 50% plus one vote in a nation-wide referendum, with mandatory retirement at age 75th Birthday notwithstanding the date of their third successful ratification by the people.

Disagree.

The independence of the judiciary is the cornerstone of the doctrines of judicial review, the interpretive authority of the courts, and the rule of law. Although the judiciary will forever be contaminated with the bane of politics, subjecting judges and justices to referenda and the pitfalls of partisan campaigning will irrevocably erode the authority of the judiciary and the trust of the people in our legal system.

As usual a thoughtful comment, thanks.

The line-item veto would (or could) have an effect on runaway spending; it could also be abused by a president who wanted to punish his enemies. I know it's not a panacea, but it works well in many states. We can't continue to deficit spend annually, something most Americans want to see fixed, but not at their own expense.

Tying in the six-year term of office would allow a president to make choices not framed by his or her need to position for the next election. It would allow a Congress to override each veto allowing for the Republic which the founders created.

I have lost confidence in the independence of the Supreme Court.

 

[Immanuel]

Three things need to be accomplished in my opinion to restore sanity to our government:

1. A COTUS Amendment giving the POTUS the Line-Item Veto and also allowing for every such veto to be overridden by a 2/3 vote in both the Senate and H. of Rep.;

2. A COTUS Amendment wherein the POTUS serves only a single six-year term of office;

3. A COTUS Amendment which requires each member of the Supreme Court to serve no more than three Ten year terms, and be returned to the court for 10 years only upon receiving at least 50% plus one vote in a nation-wide referendum, with mandatory retirement at age 75th Birthday notwithstanding the date of their third successful ratification by the people.

Poll to follow

I agree with #1 there is no question it is reasonable.

#2 and #3 makes the assumption that we are stupid. There should be no term limits except as outlined in the original constitution.

Term limits only makes a lazy population lazier.

2 cents

I would have to say that as a people we are stupid. Look at the "leaders" we keep sending back to Washington election after election. Yeah, I would say stupid fits the bill.

Immie

 

[Meister]

So the usual suspects on the right post criticisms but no solutions, no ideas, no nothing but for Red Herrings & ad hominem attacks. They then cut and run.

I and asked questions and provided my thoughts, your problem is you cannot calmly & minus acrimony, discuss anything without getting snarky if folks don't agree with you.....



you seem to be in 'fractured ego' mode, seek help...oh and I cut and run to enjoy my pool and the sun for several hours, sorry I didn't check in....


well, not really

Thank you for sharing your pop psychological evaluation of my motives. The fact that you're still stuck on partisan politics notwithstanding. My ego is fine, I know I don't have the answers, I also know you aren't capable of even understanding the issues.

wry, you make me laugh.
Irony runs as thick as your head is.
There is not many, if any, that are more partisan on this board than you are. just an observation

 

[dblack]

A reminder: losing elections is not victimization.

So what?

It's swell of you to offer helpful reminders, but no one here has claimed that losing an election IS victimization so I guess that's just what, a "rhetorical" observation?

Assuming you were trying to respond to my post, my claim is something different. My point is that constitutional limits on government power amount to an assurance that losing election will not lead to victimization. As those assurances are minimized or done away with, the threat of victimization increases.